The correct pronunciation of this city

[chicowoodduck]

Say it LOUD and say it PROUD!!! ?

[ThaiBob]

First let's cut the native English speakers, visitors, tourists some slack. When they see signs using romanized characters they think these are English signs and will pronounce accordingly. The truth is what they see is a transliteration of Thai which has it own pronunciation rules which are similar but not necessarily the same as a native English speaker.  The first syllable, Pat-ta-ya, is not pronounced like cat, bat, sat, mat, etc., so right off the start everything you usually here on radio and TV is wrong. The second syllable is not tay or tee or tie but simply ta. I suppose if we are going to live here we should make some effort to get it right. 

 

 

[pattjock]

Pattaya is a place name and as such can be pronounced in a number of different ways depending on where you come from. Paris is Paree to the French, London is Londres, New York is Nueva York to the Spanish, Cologne is Köln to the Germans. All these pronunciations are correct in their own languages, so are the many different pronunciations of Pattaya.

Even the Thais pronounce Pattaya slightly different depending on where they come from.

The correct pronunciation is any pronunciation that can be understood by the one you are talking to.

There are some place names in Thailand that are pronounced incorrect mainly because English speakers interpret ‘Ph’ as the ‘F’ sound. Phuket pronounced Fucket is clearly incorrect no matter where you come from.

[SaintLouisBlues]

2 minutes ago, pattjock said:

 Paris is Paree to the French, London is Londres, New York is Nueva York to the Spanish, Cologne is Köln to the Germans.

Up to a point. Paris is Paree to a French speaker speaking French but Paris to a French speaker speaking English in my experience (ie. sample size > 1). It's the sort of thing that makes me laugh hearing farang English speakers earnestly referring to Krung Thep instead of Bangkok. You almost never hear a Thai speaking in English saying Krung Thep, they always say Bangkok. A good example of this is the arrival announcement on board a Thai Airways flight. The announcement in Thai says Krung Thep; the announcement in English says Bangkok

[pattjock]

6 minutes ago, SaintLouisBlues said:

Up to a point. Paris is Paree to a French speaker speaking French but Paris to a French speaker speaking English in my experience (ie. sample size > 1). It's the sort of thing that makes me laugh hearing farang English speakers earnestly referring to Krung Thep instead of Bangkok. You almost never hear a Thai speaking in English saying Krung Thep, they always say Bangkok. A good example of this is the arrival announcement on board a Thai Airways flight. The announcement in Thai says Krung Thep; the announcement in English says Bangkok

Up to a point. I think this discussion is mainly about foreigners pronouncing Pattaya when speaking English or their native language not when they are speaking Thai.

[pattjock]

2 minutes ago, SaintLouisBlues said:

I pronounce Pattaya "seaside brothel". Does that help?

Like I said if the one you speak with can understand what you mean the pronunciation is correct, and I can understand you

[SaintLouisBlues]

2 minutes ago, pattjock said:

Like I said if the one you speak with can understand what you mean the pronunciation is correct, and I can understand you

That's a non-sequitur

[Rimmer]

A couple of off topic troll posts have been removed

[hugh2121]

On 04/01/2017 at 0:05 PM, pegman said:

Thais pronounce it Pat-ti-yah

Yes, they do. With emphasis on the last syllable.

[hugh2121]

17 hours ago, Centrum said:

Nah, you're all wrong.

I've heard it on Australian TV.  It's pronounced  "p - Tie - yar". Just ask any Australian, they're born linguists, I'll have you know!

 

 

:)

And ask an American and he'll tell you it's Pad ear. That's how the American announcers on 103 FM pronounce it.

[swoods58]

On 05/01/2017 at 10:07 AM, Pdaz said:

พัทยา = Put + Yar 

Simple enough... Still people calling in Pat-Tai-Ah though... 

 

The ท (t sound) is pronounced twice, once as a final consonant and again as an initial consonant with a hidden short a vowel .  so Pat-ta-yaa

[smotherb]

Well, let's go to the experts on pronunciation; those expats who live in Hooa Hen.

[swoods58]

Well, let's go to the experts on pronunciation; those expats who live in Hooa Hen.

That's Hooa Hin

[smotherb]

1 minute ago, swoods58 said:

That's Hooa Hin

No, it is pronounced Wah Hin

[jonw8uk]

58 minutes ago, smotherb said:

Well, let's go to the experts on pronunciation; those expats who live in Hooa Hen.

 

you're welcome :)

[Pdaz]

5 hours ago, swoods58 said:

The ท (t sound) is pronounced twice, once as a final consonant and again as an initial consonant with a hidden short a vowel .  so Pat-ta-yaa

 

Yep. Exactly. I was trying to simplify the concept for non thai readers. The (tor) ท is hardly enunciated as an initial consonant so the word is often heard as two syllables rather than three distinct ones. 

[Oxx]

6 hours ago, swoods58 said:

The ท (t sound) is pronounced twice, once as a final consonant and again as an initial consonant with a hidden short a vowel .  so Pat-ta-yaa

 

Except you're wrong.  As a final consonant it's not aspirated, whilst as an initial consonant it is.  Two totally different sounds.

[TKDfella]

On 1/5/2017 at 4:41 PM, Oxx said:

 

I find it laughable that such "authoritative" sources get the tone of the middle syllable wrong.  It's unstressed, and so it's mid tone - not high.

 

To quote one authority:  "Only in artificial 'dictation' style ... do they bear the phonemic tone we would expect from their spelling."

 

Source:  Bee, Peter J. (1975) "Restricted Phonology in Thai Linker Syllables" in "Studies in Tai Linguistics in Honor of William J. Gedney", Bangkok: CIEL, pp. 13-42.

Yes, this is interesting. In my small 'library' I have found the two systems are in operation. David Smythe of London University uses the unstressed mid tone for the middle syllable and The Students Dictionary by Mary R Haas (often regarded as essential for non-Thai) does also. However the latter also gives the initial syllable, ทะ in ทะเบียน, ทะเล etc also as mid tone and the pocket Phrase book & Dictionary, Berlitz 1995 follows this convention. Other books I have by Thai writers follow the RTGS with the high tone.

But I assume most of us are aware the examples in Thai that don't follow general rules (เขา with the high tone being a common one) and I wonder if this is a case of syllable origin. Although I'm unable to find derivation of the syllable 'ทะ' the 'ละ' particle also can be found with a mid tone. The high tone 'ละ' is apparently a diminutive of 'แล้ว' although no indication of the mid tone derivation. So I wonder if 'ทะ' might also have its derivation with a longer mid tone Thai word. Does anyone know which system is actually taught presently in Thai schools...RGTS perhaps?

[Deepinthailand]

Well as a farang like the vast majority on here are it pronounced as seen Pattaya. How Thais pronounce it has no relevance on a English only forum surley.

[soc]

Who cares?

Like the place anyway. lol!

[rott]

On 1/4/2017 at 0:05 PM, pegman said:

Thais pronounce it Pat-ti-yah

Exactly. 

 

You will also hear "incorrect" pronunciations of Bangkok, Thailand, Cambodia, Hua Hin and Farang to name a few. Though you do hear the latter pronounced correctly when it is not pronounced as spelt. Should not really be a surprise, the French do not pronounce Paris the way the British do, or the Spanish Barcelona, or the Italians Rome.

 

For some reason Pat-tay-a and Pat-tie-a grate on me.

Edited January 8, 2017 by rott

[Deelectro]

Agreed. The way the euros and Brits pronounce it is dead wrong.

Sent from my ASUS_Z00LD using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[ThaiBob]

On 1/6/2017 at 9:44 PM, Oxx said:

 

Except you're wrong.  As a final consonant it's not aspirated, whilst as an initial consonant it is.  Two totally different sounds.

Listen to post #32.

[Mojomor]

On 1/18/2017 at 2:13 PM, Deelectro said:

Agreed. The way the euros and Brits pronounce it is dead wrong.

Sent from my ASUS_Z00LD using Thaivisa Connect mobile app
 

Interesting comment. I find the Euros Americans and Aussies are fairly close to being correct.

[rott]

There is no correct pronunciation.

 

Thai pronunciation is  patt-a -yar. There are several western pronuciations.

[puukao]

พัทยา

"Should" be PAT  TA   YAAAAAAA

 

PAT is SHORT and HIGH..  TA is, i think, SHORT and HIGH

 

YAAAAAA is MID TONE.

 

 

[tropo]

On 1/5/2017 at 4:14 PM, chrissables said:

Yes and no :) พัท-ท-ยา Pat ta ya  

 

The "T" is the end of a syllable and the start of the new syllable as i understand it, although i admit i am not  anywhere near perfect in the Thai language.

 

Just checked online.......

 

Thai language.com =  พัทยา  phatH thaH yaa

Thai 2 english.com  พัทยาpát-tá-yaa

 

 

It's easy enough to get the correct pronunciation from any Thai person, but the question is: Do foreigners have to pronounce the name exactly as Thai people pronounce it? Since when has it been compulsory to pronounce a place name exactly how locals do when we're speaking among ourselves.

 

For example, British pronounce it one way, Americans a different way again...

 

Another consideration is who you're speaking to. If you're speaking to a Thai person, there's more need to be precise, to ensure they can understand you. If you're talking among other foreigners, it's not so important.

 

Personally, I pronounce it 2 different ways. A farang way (American style) and the Thai way depending on who I'm addressing. Why? I prefer the way the American pronunciation rolls off the tongue when I'm speaking English.

 

The main point is that we all understand one another.

 

 

[swoods58]

On 07/01/2017 at 1:44 AM, Oxx said:

 

Except you're wrong.  As a final consonant it's not aspirated, whilst as an initial consonant it is.  Two totally different sounds.

Well, I'm not wrong. I just didn't provide as full an explanation as you have. Thanks for correcting my error.