If you were in charge of immigration...

[NoshowJones]

3 hours ago, yellowboat said:

The Thai perspective on immigration is complete nonsense compared just about every other country in Asia.  Other countries do not complain about foreigners the way Thailand does.  They just seem to be able to carry on. 

I think you have something there, but I don't know enough about other Asian countries immigration rules. I just think that Thailands immigration laws are very unfair, except perhaps for the very well off.

[seancbk]

4 minutes ago, Chip Allen said:

The "overstay problem".....is no problem. It is trumped up imperial hubris crap by tin-pot despots who are desperate to appear to be doing something constructive. Those who overstay are merely spending more money in Thailand. They are doing NO harm. They BENEFIT the economy.

Whilst I understand why you think that way and agree partly with that logic, people who overstay are avoiding the visa fees and although they are putting money into the economy they are not putting money into the immigration system.   Money which should go to increasing immigration officers salaries and improving the service for tourists and long term residents.

 

[NoshowJones]

2 hours ago, Naam said:

in which way does "Thailand" complain about foreigners? 

I agree with Yellowboats post, but I have to say that is a good question.

 

[NoshowJones]

2 hours ago, meatboy said:

why not start with the ones that are already here,the disabled and the over 70's.who are being treated no different than thai criminals.

in fact do they have to report where they are every 90days,and with who and where they are if away for a few days.

Great post Meatboy, I could not agree more.

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, Chip Allen said:

Flat yearly fee to retire here, no ninety-day reports. Felony convictions out, all others IN. Keep it simple.

Yes, I agree, but the word simple is not in the Thai mindset.

[Khon Kaen Dave]

YeahSiam

Ok,but the topic was about what sort of people would you allow in and those you would not.

And what type of people could Thailand with less of.

Eeermm a bit confused how 90 day reporting got into this.

 

[Peterw42]

14 minutes ago, Chip Allen said:

The "overstay problem".....is no problem. It is trumped up imperial hubris crap by tin-pot despots who are desperate to appear to be doing something constructive. Those who overstay are merely spending more money in Thailand. They are doing NO harm. They BENEFIT the economy.

 

That may be the case, but all the overstayers I have met have been pretty sad cases. Ran out of money years ago, living like a poor thai person, begging stealing etc. Not many people are overstaying at the hilton and spending up big. If they had funds, they can pay an agent to renew there stay, or buy an elite visa etc.

[YeahSiam]

3 hours ago, yellowboat said:

The Thai perspective on immigration is complete nonsense compared just about every other country in Asia.  Other countries do not complain about foreigners the way Thailand does.  They just seem to be able to carry on. 

 

Other Asian countries "carry on" because they tend to have a higher grade of foreigner.

They have a far lower percentage of sexpats, barely-qualified TEFLers and criminals than Thailand does.

 

We don't hear of foreigners committing suicide or engaged in dodgy activities in Singapore or Hong Kong at the same rate as we do in Thailand, do we?

Expats in HK or Singapore don't move there to bang hookers or make a fixed income stretch further, do they?

 

 

 

[Deepinthailand]

What would I do if in charge of immigration!! Standardise all offices to work from the same hymn sheet.

Scrap all the yearly extensions as they are now and introduce 1 standard covers all extension for retirement and marriage alike say 500000bht only needs to be  in bank on the day not festering for 3 months. All applicants must supply a criminal records check no older than 2 months aplying for extensions cold be done 45 days before due date.  Scrap 90 day reports in favour of  a 180 day report which could be done by phone or internet  or post,with the correct checks and balances put in place ie random house checks. I would scrap all 60 day extension of non o based on marriage to encourage extensions of stay as outlined above.

I would scrap the reporting on re entry unless you have moved address. 

No 30 day extensions to visa exempt unless for health reasons.

Any overstay up to 30 days 500bht a day no overstay stamp no ban.

Any overstay over 30 days unless (medical) no fine banned for life from re entry.

I would make all offices on an appointment only basis. Made on line or by telephone with your regional office. No shows on the day unless (Medical or other emergency situations supported by medical or police letters) Would result in a fine of 1000bht  payable on your next appointment.  With a central telephone hotline for extreme emergency situations only.

 

[NoshowJones]

52 minutes ago, ThaiWai said:

"Good guys in Bad guys out".  I am pretty sure that is the standard job of I/O's worldwide.  Why is it confusing?

It is confusing because what is a "bad guy"? Different people have different interpretations of them. ie if someone pays a visa company so much for a retirement visa because he does not want to leave 800.000Bt in his bank account, does that make him a bad guy?

 

 

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, little mary sunshine said:

Model all Immigration offices after Jomtien excellent!

 

All retirees would have to meet requirements for O-A,

no exceptions

 

Only qualified Ed Degreed teachers allowed to apply for

Ed. Visa

 

ALL overstays more than 30 days, except for being hospitalized

with a statement from Hospital. Deported, banned entry for

3'years.

 

ANY criminals, drug dealers, thieves, assaults, Drunk and Disorderly 

immediately  deported.  NO REENTRY. 

 

Charge B100 for each 90day report, in person or online or mail

annual B 1900 rIsed to B 2500. (Proceeds used to increase salary

of Immigration Staff.

 

We would have a much nicer Thailand!!!!

Everything OK right up until your last paragraph.

[NoshowJones]

34 minutes ago, Chip Allen said:

The "overstay problem".....is no problem. It is trumped up imperial hubris crap by tin-pot despots who are desperate to appear to be doing something constructive. Those who overstay are merely spending more money in Thailand. They are doing NO harm. They BENEFIT the economy.

Only one thing, those who are on overstay, are making it worse for the people who are here legally. Thai Immigration makes it harder for the legal people with more hoops to jump through as time goes on, and overstayers are one of the reasons for this.

[billd766]

6 minutes ago, Deepinthailand said:

What would I do if in charge of immigration!! Standardise all offices to work from the same hymn sheet.

Scrap all the yearly extensions as they are now and introduce 1 standard covers all extension for retirement and marriage alike say 500000bht only needs to be  in bank on the day not festering for 3 months. All applicants must supply a criminal records check no older than 2 months aplying for extensions cold be done 45 days before due date.  Scrap 90 day reports in favour of  a 180 day report which could be done by phone or internet  or post,with the correct checks and balances put in place ie random house checks. I would scrap all 60 day extension of non o based on marriage to encourage extensions of stay as outlined above.

I would scrap the reporting on re entry unless you have moved address. 

No 30 day extensions to visa exempt unless for health reasons.

Any overstay up to 30 days 500bht a day no overstay stamp no ban.

Any overstay over 30 days unless (medical) no fine banned for life from re entry.

I would make all offices on an appointment only basis. Made on line or by telephone with your regional office. No shows on the day unless (Medical or other emergency situations supported by medical or police letters) Would result in a fine of 1000bht  payable on your next appointment.  With a central telephone hotline for extreme emergency situations only.

 

 

I agree with most of what you say but I have a problem with the criminal records check. How could I provide one for example.

 

I started working offshore in 1991 and finally left the UK in 1999. During that time I have lived and worked in about 30 countries for periods of less than a month to nearly 4 years at a time. My last visit to the UK was in 2004.

 

I have been based in Thailand since 2001 and I finally retired here in 2009.

 

Which country should I apply to for a criminal records check?

 

There are probably many other people like me who were/are offshore workers and have not been back to their home countries for years but have been based in Thailand between FIFO trips.

[NoshowJones]

36 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

I would make every immigration office a separate entity, and authorise them to interpret the immigration law, any way they chose to. I would encourage inconsistencies between offices, even within the same office. I would have 3-4 databases, not linked. I would try to have many "open other end" procedures in place. 

 

Is that not similar to the way it is now.

[seancbk]

2 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

I agree with most of what you say but I have a problem with the criminal records check. How could I provide one for example.

 

I started working offshore in 1991 and finally left the UK in 1999. During that time I have lived and worked in about 30 countries for periods of less than a month to nearly 4 years at a time. My last visit to the UK was in 2004.

 

I have been based in Thailand since 2001 and I finally retired here in 2009.

 

Which country should I apply to for a criminal records check?

 

There are probably many other people like me who were/are offshore workers and have not been back to their home countries for years but have been based in Thailand between FIFO trips.

Just get one from your home country.   Most people don't have your history of working overseas.  

I've never lived in my home country, yet when I apply for Thai Permanent Residency in a few years I will have to provide a criminal record check.   I will get one from the UK because that is what they want to see (one from your home country), but I will also get one from Hong Kong where I spent most of my life.  

Guys like us often find ourselves falling through the cracks because the rules don't take into account lots of variations in work and living history.

 

 

[NoshowJones]

Have I missed something here? Where is the OP?

Come on Soi Biker, you have given us a great topic here.

I think the Thaivisa members would like to hear from you.

[rkidlad]

A reward based system for long term stayers. If you're good, pay taxes and keep you nose clean for a certain period of time, you can have a 5 year visa, etc. Build it up like credit so one day you can have residency. We reward your valuable contributions to Thai society. 

 

As for tourists, I don't really see a problem. Tourists might be working here? It's not exactly hard to spot them. I really don't think it's an issue. They might be working from home? They could be. Might also have people on the elite visas and marriage extensions doing the same. They're not allowed to work either. 

 

You can only really screen someone's criminal history and make a judgement then. If you can't screen that, it's hard to know. Could give people the benefit of the doubt. 

[The Dark Lord]

4 minutes ago, rkidlad said:

A reward based system for long term stayers. If you're good, pay taxes and keep you nose clean for a certain period of time, you can have a 5 year visa, etc. Build it up like credit so one day you can have residency. We reward your valuable contributions to Thai society. 

 

As for tourists, I don't really see a problem. Tourists might be working here? It's not exactly hard to spot them. I really don't think it's an issue. They might be working from home? They could be. Might also have people on the elite visas and marriage extensions doing the same. They're not allowed to work either. 

 

You can only really screen someone's criminal history and make a judgement then. If you can't screen that, it's hard to know. Could give people the benefit of the doubt. 

What a cracking idea. The longer you stay crime free the longer you will be allowed to stay I.e. You are a model potential citizen. 

 

A ray ray of sunshine!

 

[MalandLee]

INSURANCE
 

Thailand adopt the minimum COMPULSORY Schengen “style” visa HEALTH insurance scheme AND FUND THEMSELVES – NO INSURANCE COMPANIES>

 

Calculations (From Euro to Baht)

 

TOURISTS

30 million tourists (2015 figures 29.8 million) each with a compulsory health policy @ approx 700 Baht each (19 Euro) SAME AS SCHENGEN POLICY

 

Approx income:- Twenty-one BILLION Baht. You would not want those that cannot afford 19 Euro anyhow?

 

READ THE SCHENGEN POLICY http://bit.ly/2g13Ip3 Europe can do it, so can Thailand.

 

EXPATS

Long Term visa holders must pay REGARDLESS OF AGE. About 1,100 Baht each and every month – For FULL access to Thai PUBLIC Hospital System. Pr-existing conditions, same as schengen policy.

 

This does NOT stop the filthy rich having their own policy, BUT, it does not mean they need not pay – see the word COMPULSORY on the first line.

 

[IMA_FARANG]

All foriegners under 30 years of age who travel to:

1. Pattaya
2. Phuket
3. or Koh Samui

would be chaged an extra 500 Baht for their visa.

Proceeds to be used to clean up those places of "undesirables' and drunks.

 

Just Joking

 

 

[Naam]

1 hour ago, seancbk said:

Whilst I understand why you think that way and agree partly with that logic, people who overstay are avoiding the visa fees and although they are putting money into the economy they are not putting money into the immigration system.   Money which should go to increasing immigration officers salaries and improving the service for tourists and long term residents.
 

reducing the immigration staff by 50% and provide them with constructive jobs which increases GDP would provide a god opportunity to increase the salaries and perks of the remaining officers. and that without increasing their workload. all it takes is a streamlined procedure of immigration rules and regulations. example: next week i submit for the umpteenth time our marriage certificate, sign silly forms, provide a "guarantee letter" for me and the Mrs. showing each having at least 800k Baht in our accounts as well as our bank books. just by dropping the *)*&& 90 day reporting nonsense would make a certain percentage of immigration staff redundant.

 

Quote

"avoiding visa fees"

 

= give me a break man! 

[seancbk]

8 minutes ago, Naam said:

Quote

"avoiding visa fees"

 

= give me a break man! 

That has to be one of the main reasons for people to overstay, they just want to avoid having to go somewhere and get another visa.   If I could avoid flying to Hong Kong or even taking the van to Vientiane to get a new visa every 90 days I definitely would.   Except I don't want to overstay.

Perhaps I should have said "avoid the costs incurred getting a new visa"  rather than just saying 'visa fees'.

 

[meatboy]

42 minutes ago, The Dark Lord said:

What a cracking idea. The longer you stay crime free the longer you will be allowed to stay I.e. You are a model potential citizen. 

 

A ray ray of sunshine!

 

i must qualify over 35 yrs.of NEVER,NEVER,NEVER BEEN or caused any trouble whatsoever in thailand.

[elgordo38]

5 hours ago, Naam said:

in which way does "Thailand" complain about foreigners? 

They have to much pension money. Envy I would say. It all boils down to which part of the world the spigot was that you dropped out of.

[elgordo38]

Not to sound biased but I would cater to the retired crowd. They are the ones with money not travelling on credit for a cheap holiday then leave and leave all your garbage and broken hearts behind. They are here 24/7/365 spend money on cars condo's cute girls bar and otherwise like a wife maybe and kids later his or hers by another Thai guy that said goodbye. The government fails to see what they add to the economy. I would work hand in hand to make their life here easier. Like a trustee in jail the longer your a good boy the easier it is for you to stay. The system would be fine tuned to maybe a swipe card at 7/11 every 120 days for 50 bahts with up to date info on address etc. Bring back the cue system to get a designated time for your annual visa extension. After your a good boy for 5 years this would be abolished. This biting the hand that feeds you is a poor approach with so many built in corruption steps that only in the end inflames us older farts who inflame easier as we age. 

[evadgib]

If they were to digetise, optimise and standardise procedure Thailand-wide instead of delegating to their lowest denominators their workload would reduce by 90%.

 

I'd also put a stop to what passes here as 'recycling'; Handing unredacted pers data to members of the public on the back of mickey mouse forms.

[Deepinthailand]

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

 

I agree with most of what you say but I have a problem with the criminal records check. How could I provide one for example.

 

I started working offshore in 1991 and finally left the UK in 1999. During that time I have lived and worked in about 30 countries for periods of less than a month to nearly 4 years at a time. My last visit to the UK was in 2004.

 

I have been based in Thailand since 2001 and I finally retired here in 2009.

 

Which country should I apply to for a criminal records check?

 

There are probably many other people like me who were/are offshore workers and have not been back to their home countries for years but have been based in Thailand between FIFO trips.

I can see that would be an issue so yes in those cases you should get a record check here in Thailand.  Again with a better working immigration these points could easily be addressed. It would be obvious that like yourself you have spent more time in Thailand than birth country in the last ten years so it would be appropriate for a criminal records check here. I could in fact be mandatory for anyone who has been here for say 3 years to get a check in thailand. But yes I see your point.

[YeahSiam]

1 hour ago, elgordo38 said:

Not to sound biased but I would cater to the retired crowd. They are the ones with money not travelling on credit for a cheap holiday then leave and leave all your garbage and broken hearts behind. They are here 24/7/365 spend money on cars condo's cute girls bar and otherwise like a wife maybe and kids later his or hers by another Thai guy that said goodbye.

 

This biting the hand that feeds you is a poor approach with so many built in corruption steps that only in the end inflames us older farts who inflame easier as we age. 

 

 

For every retiree buying a condo/building a McMansion in the wilds of Isaan and buying the obligatory Fortuner, there are 50 of his peers hanging on by their fingernails and chowing down on 30 baht meals at Tesco Lotus food halls and .

 

We're forever being told how these retirees are some sort of cornerstone of the economy but you only have to see them buying cheap guff at Big C and hear/read about them carping about the price of an English/American/Continental breakfast going up by 10 baht or the cost of a short time or a pint of draught to realise they're nothing of the kind.

 

If retirees actually were some sort of high-spending demographic, the Thai authorities would have cottoned on years ago.

Instead, they prefer to court short-stay tourists because they actually do spend money in Thailand while costing the country nothing; unlike the costs of administering the affairs of those who make nowhere near as much of an economic contribution as their collective egos would have everyone believe.

 

Frankly, the authorities would be better off catering to real expats who earn money and pay taxes here, rather than economic migrants most of whom stay here because, otherwise, they'd be on the bones of their asses back home.

[elgordo38]

3 minutes ago, YeahSiam said:

Frankly, the authorities would be better off catering to real expats who earn money and pay taxes here, rather than economic migrants most of whom stay here because, otherwise, they'd be on the bones of their asses back home.

Frankly, the authorities would be better off catering to real expats. stop here. Yes you got that right its what I was talking about. Actually the bones in my ass are just fine. You give quite a rendition real expats that earn money here taking jobs from whom? Pay taxes hmm. 

[YeahSiam]

Just now, elgordo38 said:

Frankly, the authorities would be better off catering to real expats. stop here. Yes you got that right its what I was talking about. Actually the bones in my ass are just fine. You give quite a rendition real expats that earn money here taking jobs from whom? Pay taxes hmm. 

 

We're not expats by the true definition; we're economic migrants.