Court confirms armed ‘men in black’ fought in 2010 riots

[rooster59]

Court confirms armed ‘men in black’ fought in 2010 riots

By NATION NEWS AGENCY

 

 

THE recent court verdict against two men accused of possessing unregistered guns during a deadly anti-government rally in Bangkok in April 2010 has confirmed claims that armed “men in black” were among the red-shirt protesters.

 

On January 31, the Criminal Court sentenced Kittisak Sumsri and Preecha Yooyen each to 10 years in jail for possessing illegal firearms and carrying weapons in public without permission.

 

The pair had been charged along with fellow demonstrators Ronnarit Saricha, Chamnan Pakeerat and Panika Chusri. But the other three defendants were acquitted by the court due to a lack of evidence. 

 

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/30305703

 

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-02-05

[craigt3365]

Wonder where all those members are who said these people never existed.  Hmmmm....

[smutcakes]

14 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Wonder where all those members are who said these people never existed.  Hmmmm....

I don't think people ever said they did not exist. I believe people questioned the veracity of how many there were, who they were, who organised them and the skills they had. None of which has been answered. 

 

 

[craigt3365]

9 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

I don't think people ever said they did not exist. I believe people questioned the veracity of how many there were, who they were, who organised them and the skills they had. None of which has been answered. 

 

 

With respect, I saw many members saying they did not exist.  Fake photos, disinformation, etc.  But they did say they didn't exist.  I guess it's been proven now they did exist.  And were armed.

[smutcakes]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

With respect, I saw many members saying they did not exist.  Fake photos, disinformation, etc.  But they did say they didn't exist.  I guess it's been proven now they did exist.  And were armed.

 

Okay, i would be interested to see those posts. The questions of who they are, who paid them etc still remain unanswered. And do this motley crew excuse the army of killing 90 civilians? As far as  I am aware the black shirts were largely ineffective if they were employed to actually attack people.

[chainarong]

35 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Wonder where all those members are who said these people never existed.  Hmmmm....

I think at the time nobody could figure out who the men in black were or stood for, there was even speculation they were military,  now we know,  so some senior red shit would also know.

[craigt3365]

4 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

 

Okay, i would be interested to see those posts. The questions of who they are, who paid them etc still remain unanswered. And do this motley crew excuse the army of killing 90 civilians? As far as  I am aware the black shirts were largely ineffective if they were employed to actually attack people.

I think with the new forum software, it's hard to find posts from back then.  This isn't about the killing of 90 people.  Worth reading:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/LE29Ae02.html

[smutcakes]

2 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

I think with the new forum software, it's hard to find posts from back then.  This isn't about the killing of 90 people.  Worth reading:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/LE29Ae02.html

I don't need to read articles. I was living and saw it with my own eyes and and passed through there everyday, as well as following the news everyday.

[craigt3365]

5 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

I don't need to read articles. I was living and saw it with my own eyes and and passed through there everyday, as well as following the news everyday.

I saw it also.  Here's another article.  If you don't read it, then you're missing out on some important facts.  Can't see everything with your own eyes.

 

https://www.hrw.org/sites/default/files/reports/thailand0511webwcover_0.pdf

Quote

 

The extensive casualties also resulted from deliberate attacks by militant armed elements of the UDD, whose leaders contributed to the violence with inflammatory speeches to demonstrators, including urging their supporters to carry out riots, arson attacks, and looting. The heavily armed “Black Shirt” militants, apparently connected to the UDD and operating in tandem with it, were responsible for deadly attacks on soldiers, police, and civilians.

 

 

[smutcakes]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

I saw it also.  Here's another article.  If you don't read it, then you're missing out on some important facts.  Can't see everything with your own eyes.

 

https://www.hrw.org/sites/default/files/reports/thailand0511webwcover_0.pdf

 

 

I am not missing out on anything. The articles you post have been read and posted here millions of times. As you do with posts in the World news sections, you just pic and choose articles that fit your view point and repost them as fact.

 

Were there armed men in black shirts, yes there were. For what purpose and for whom they were there is another issue.

 

 

[craigt3365]

9 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

 

I am not missing out on anything. The articles you post have been read and posted here millions of times. As you do with posts in the World news sections, you just pic and choose articles that fit your view point and repost them as fact.

 

Were there armed men in black shirts, yes there were. For what purpose and for whom they were there is another issue.

 

 

HRW is a highly respected organization.  I do pick and choose what I post.  Credible sources only.  These two are some of them.  Sorry they don't match what you want to hear.

 

This court case proves what they were there for.  Easy. 

[smutcakes]

2 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

HRW is a highly respected organization.  I do pick and choose what I post.  Credible sources only.  These two are some of them.  Sorry they don't match what you want to hear.

 

This court case proves what they were there for.  Easy. 

haha stop it. I have seen you in the world news section! Courts in Thailand prove nothing. There are plenty of respected organisations that highlight that fact, do you trust them? 

 

 

[manarak]

35 minutes ago, chainarong said:

I think at the time nobody could figure out who the men in black were or stood for, there was even speculation they were military,  now we know,  so some senior red shit would also know.

Nobody brought any proof of it, but it was pretty clear to everyone that the "men in black" were Seh Daeng's men, and it was also pretty clear that someone presented him the bill for his crimes.

Edited February 5, 2017 by manarak

[craigt3365]

4 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

haha stop it. I have seen you in the world news section! Courts in Thailand prove nothing. There are plenty of respected organisations that highlight that fact, do you trust them?

I don't trust the Thai judicial system.  But I do respect HRW.  And saw enough to know what they were reporting was true.

[smutcakes]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

I don't trust the Thai judicial system.  But I do respect HRW.  And saw enough to know what they were reporting was true.

 

So you trust the judicial system when it suits you?

[craigt3365]

8 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

 

So you trust the judicial system when it suits you?

Sure.  When it's backed up with facts from independent agencies outside Thailand.

[sinbin]

Wasn't it claimed, by the government, back in 2010 that Thais would never take up arms against a fellow Thai. So therefore the shooters had to be Cambodians?  

Edited February 5, 2017 by sinbin

[craigt3365]

9 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

 

So you trust the judicial system when it suits you?

From The Nation article:

Quote

 

Witnesses reported seeing armed men in black, some wearing hoods to conceal their identity, who fired at military officers with assault rifles and grenade launchers.

.......

“That means the claim by some political group that the demonstration on April 10, 2010, was peaceful and unarmed proved to go against the truth. They seemed to distort the facts,” the spokesman said. 

 

“The court found that different kinds of weapons were used including grenade launchers, with the intent to cause harm to others, particularly military officers involved in the operation to reclaim public areas. Society should be well aware of this now,” he said.

 

 

[smutcakes]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

Sure.  When it's backed up with facts from independent agencies outside Thailand.

But independent agencies outside of Thailand say the courts are compromised? Whats to say this judgement is also compromised? Seems strange that 3 were acquitted for lack of evidence yet they were still detained. Is that not odd?

 

Your link to HRW does not work, it comes up blank.

[smutcakes]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

From The Nation article:

 

Why are you quoting that. I am not even arguing the presence of armed persons.

[bkkgooner]

Apologies, doesn't work past the first page. 

 

Here is a new link, quite interesting reading 

 

https://www.hrw.org/report/2011/05/03/descent-chaos/thailands-2010-red-shirt-protests-and-government-crackdown

 

 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2017 by bkkgooner

[craigt3365]

7 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

But independent agencies outside of Thailand say the courts are compromised? Whats to say this judgement is also compromised? Seems strange that 3 were acquitted for lack of evidence yet they were still detained. Is that not odd?

 

Your link to HRW does not work, it comes up blank.

Did you read my post?  If judicial proceedings jive with what's been reported by outside credible organizations, then I'll tend to believe what's going on.  I think we've beat this to death.

[robblok]

1 hour ago, smutcakes said:

I don't think people ever said they did not exist. I believe people questioned the veracity of how many there were, who they were, who organised them and the skills they had. None of which has been answered. 

 

 

The ones that were convicted were red shirts.. that is now confirmed. So we can now as a fact say that it was not a false flag operation but red shirts who as I have always stated were known for their violence. At least then they went up against soldiers, later they killed kids. 

 

We can now also state that the red shirts are at least partly responsible for the deaths because the army would not have fired live rounds if there were no black shirts. 

[craigt3365]

7 minutes ago, bkkgooner said:

Apologies, doesn't work past the first page. 

 

Here is a new link, quite interesting reading 

 

https://www.hrw.org/report/2011/05/03/descent-chaos/thailands-2010-red-shirt-protests-and-government-crackdown

I had problems getting it to open also.  Had to try 2 different browsers!

[smutcakes]

Just now, robblok said:

The ones that were convicted were red shirts.. that is now confirmed. So we can now as a fact say that it was not a false flag operation but red shirts who as I have always stated were known for their violence. At least then they went up against soldiers, later they killed kids. 

 

We can now also state that the red shirts are at least partly responsible for the deaths because the army would not have fired live rounds if there were no black shirts. 

 

And if he army and its backers respected the wishes of voters there would not have been any protesters to shoot and be shot at.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, smutcakes said:

 

And if he army and its backers respected the wishes of voters there would not have been any protesters to shoot and be shot at.

And if the protest leaders had not encouraged violence (i.e. bring empty bottles to Bangkok so we can fill them with petrol and burn Bangkok to the ground), then no protesters would have been shot.  Please place the blame properly.  IMHO, it's the protest leaders fault.  Same with the yellow shirt protests.  They are fully responsible.

[robblok]

1 minute ago, smutcakes said:

 

And if he army and its backers respected the wishes of voters there would not have been any protesters to shoot and be shot at.

No a new coalition goverment was formed.. nothing illegal about that at al. 

 

Charlem was protecting the blackshirts showing a clear link between the PTP and the red shirts, as I have always said the red shirts are the armed wing of the PTP. Just like the IRA was that of Sinn Fein. 

[smutcakes]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

No a new coalition goverment was formed.. nothing illegal about that at al. 

 

Charlem was protecting the blackshirts showing a clear link between the PTP and the red shirts, as I have always said the red shirts are the armed wing of the PTP. Just like the IRA was that of Sinn Fein. 

And the army is an armed wing of the democrats. The coalition was formed after a coup, when parties were bribed like our Buriram friends. Funny how that does not bother the anti corruption lot.

 

I won't even entertain your comparison to the IRA, as its clear you are completely ignorant to the history it to even make the analogy.

[smutcakes]

8 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

And if the protest leaders had not encouraged violence (i.e. bring empty bottles to Bangkok so we can fill them with petrol and burn Bangkok to the ground), then no protesters would have been shot.  Please place the blame properly.  IMHO, it's the protest leaders fault.  Same with the yellow shirt protests.  They are fully responsible.

 

And what punishment has been meted out to the PAD, PDRC for closing down the city, international airports?

 

The blame should be on the people who refuse to allow the Thai people to elect their leaders because they don't like it.

[robblok]

Just now, smutcakes said:

And the army is an armed wing of the democrats. The coalition was formed after a coup, when parties were bribed like our Buriram friends. Funny how that does not bother the anti corruption lot.

 

I won't even entertain your comparison to the IRA, as its clear you are completely ignorant to the history it to even make the analogy.

SO its ok for Thaksin to pay people to join.. but when others do it.. its wrong. Ok I get it.

 

It must be hard for you to finally have to accept that the red shirts were the men in black, also makes it far more likely that they were the ones that killed the 4 kids recently. Their track records speaks for itself. 

 

As for the IRA i just gave an example of how a political party can have an armed wing.. just like the PTP has.  Real democratic don't you think. Just imagine without the junta this fact of the red shirts being the black shirts would have remained buried no wonder all the supporters of the PTP hate the junta. It has taken away the image of the PTP as the victim while they have an armed wing that does their killing.