U.S. Republicans unveil plan to dismantle Obamacare, critics pounce

[webfact]

U.S. Republicans unveil plan to dismantle Obamacare, critics pounce

By Susan Cornwell and Yasmeen Abutaleb

REUTERS

 

FILE PHOTO - The federal government forms for applying for health coverage are seen at a rally held by supporters of the Affordable Care Act, widely referred to as "Obamacare", outside the Jackson-Hinds Comprehensive Health Center in Jackson, Mississippi, U.S. on October 4, 2013. REUTERS/Jonathan Bachman/File Photo

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Long-awaited legislation to dismantle Obamacare was unwrapped on Monday by U.S. Republicans, who called for ending health insurance mandates and rolling back extra healthcare funding for the poor in a package that drew immediate fire from Democrats.

 

In a battle waged since the 2010 passage of the Affordable Care Act, Democratic President Barack Obama's signature domestic policy achievement, Republicans including President Donald Trump have long vowed to repeal and replace the law. But they failed for years to coalesce around an alternative.

 

With a proposal now on the table, the fate of the plan is uncertain even with Republican majorities in both chambers. Also unclear is where Trump stands on many of the details.

 

"Today marks an important step towards restoring healthcare choices and affordability back to the American people," the White House said in a statement, adding Trump looked forward to working with Congress on replacing Obamacare.

 

Republicans condemn Obamacare as government overreach, and Trump has called it a "disaster."

 

Critics complained about the penalty the law charged those who refused to buy insurance. The Republican proposal would repeal that penalty immediately.

 

Congressional Democrats denounced the Republican plan, saying it would hurt Americans by requiring them to pay more for healthcare, to the benefit of insurers.

 

Obamacare is popular in many states, even some controlled by Republicans. It has brought health insurance coverage to about 20 million previously uninsured Americans, although premium increases have angered some.

 

About half those people gained coverage through an expansion of the Medicaid programme for the poor. The Republican proposal would end the Medicaid expansion on Jan. 1, 2020, and cap Medicaid funding after that date.

 

Just before the plan was unveiled, four moderate Senate Republicans jointly expressed concern that an earlier draft would not adequately protect those who got coverage under Medicaid, raising doubts about the legislation's future in the Senate.   

 

Several Senate and House conservatives have already expressed doubt about another aspect of the plan, the offering of tax credits for the purchase of health insurance. The proposal seeks to encourage people to buy insurance with the age-based credits, which would be capped at upper-income levels.

 

The legislation would abolish the current income-based subsidies for purchasing insurance under Obamacare.

 

The proposal would protect two of the most popular provisions of Obamacare. It would prohibit insurers from denying coverage or charging more to those with pre-existing conditions, and it would allow adults up to age 26 to remain on their parents' health plans. Trump has long supported by both ideas.

 

The measure would also provide states with $100 billion to create programs for patient populations, possibly including high-risk pools to provide insurance to the sickest patients.

 

'FRANKLY NOT ENOUGH'

 

The overall cost of the Republican plan, a key issue in a time of high federal deficits, was not yet known, Republican aides said. Two House committees will next review the plan.

 

Craig Garthwaite of Northwestern University said the proposed tax credits, which would range from $2,000 to $4,000, were "frankly not enough for a low-income person to afford insurance."

 

Republicans said the legislation would give Americans the flexibility to make their own healthcare choices, free of Obamacare's mandate that people buy health insurance and the law's taxes, including a surtax on investment income earned by upper-income Americans.

 

"Our legislation transfers power from Washington back to the American people," House Ways and Means Chairman Kevin Brady said in a statement.

 

Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer said in a statement, however, that "Trumpcare doesn’t replace the Affordable Care Act, it forces millions of Americans to pay more for less care."

 

"Paying for all this is going to be a big issue," said Joe Antos of the American Enterprise Institute think tank.

 

"It's possible that CBO (the Congressional Budget Office) is going to say the Medicaid reductions aren't enough to offset the revenue losses from repealing all the taxes."

 

A hospital group voiced disappointment that lawmakers were willing to consider the measure without knowing how much it cost or how it might affect healthcare coverage.

 

The proposal "could place a heavy burden on the safety net by reducing federal support for Medicaid expansion over time and imposing per-capita caps on the programme," said America's Essential Hospitals, which represents hospitals that provide care to low-income and uninsured individuals.

 

(Reporting by Susan Cornwell and Yasmeen Abutaleb; Editing by Kevin Drawbaugh and Peter Cooney)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-03-07

[retarius]

American healthcare is the saddest in the universe. If you have great insurance which I did, I was able to get fantastic healthy care delivered immediately. And you don;t pay any tax on the benefit which the company you work for bestows on you….the biggest middle class tax break bar none (except perhaps mortgages).

If you are a minimum wage slave and get no benefits you pay the highest rates of all to visit the hospital ER. This is why in national surveys on health outcomes the US ranks so poorly, usually between 20th and 30th on health outcome like child mortality and lifespan, surviving heart attacks and the like; despite it being at least 2 times more expensive per capita than anywhere else in the developed world.

When I was there my healthcare cost probably 6 or 10 times per capita than the world average….the big problem is that 1/3 of the population get next to nothing spent on the,. It is an insurance racket. Get cancer, and need expensive drugs, they'll cut your insurance off.

Obamacare was supposed to sort these problems out, but after a year or two of slightly cheaper premiums, insurance rates have skyrocketed. Try to get health insurance for self spouse and two kids (even a crappy one with huge deductibles and low payouts) and you will find yourself paying $600 or $700 a month in most states. Who can afford that?

[craigt3365]

7 minutes ago, retarius said:

American healthcare is the saddest in the universe. If you have great insurance which I did, I was able to get fantastic healthy care delivered immediately. And you don;t pay any tax on the benefit which the company you work for bestows on you….the biggest middle class tax break bar none (except perhaps mortgages).

If you are a minimum wage slave and get no benefits you pay the highest rates of all to visit the hospital ER. This is why in national surveys on health outcomes the US ranks so poorly, usually between 20th and 30th on health outcome like child mortality and lifespan, surviving heart attacks and the like; despite it being at least 2 times more expensive per capita than anywhere else in the developed world.

When I was there my healthcare cost probably 6 or 10 times per capita than the world average….the big problem is that 1/3 of the population get next to nothing spent on the,. It is an insurance racket. Get cancer, and need expensive drugs, they'll cut your insurance off.

Obamacare was supposed to sort these problems out, but after a year or two of slightly cheaper premiums, insurance rates have skyrocketed. Try to get health insurance for self spouse and two kids (even a crappy one with huge deductibles and low payouts) and you will find yourself paying $600 or $700 a month in most states. Who can afford that?

You are wrong.  The health care system in the US isn't perfect, but it's OK.  I know several who are very low income earners who are now insured.  Because of Obamacare.  They have nothing but great things to say about it.

 

But yes, health care is expensive.  No matter where you are.  Even here in Thailand, if you want good care, you are going to pay for it.

[mamypoko]

46 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You are wrong.  The health care system in the US isn't perfect, but it's OK.  I know several who are very low income earners who are now insured.  Because of Obamacare.  They have nothing but great things to say about it.

 

But yes, health care is expensive.  No matter where you are.  Even here in Thailand, if you want good care, you are going to pay for it.

Can we all agree that healthcare is "complicated"? Actually, nobody ever knew just how complicated it is...Jeez

[Jingthing]

So we now (finally) at least have a rough idea of what the republicans have in mind for their repeal and replace ACA agenda.

 

This and other threads like it are great places for political debate.

 

Posting here to let people know that for expat Americans wanting to discuss (without political debate) details of how these changes will impact on them specifically as expats and potentially RETURNING expats, I have started this thread --- 

 

 

Edited March 7, 2017 by Jingthing

[rijb]

I don't think Trump cares about healthcare.  It's the Republicans in Congress who want to sink Obamacare.

[Ulic]

In the USA 33% of a hospitals costs are billing/accounting expenses . A single payer system is the most efficient. Of course health care is a racket in the US. Just look at how much hospitals and insurance companies make in profits. A single payer system while not perfect because healthcare is a bottomless pit (some people will insist the government should spend millions so a patient can live an extra month at age 85) it is the way to go. Shift some wasted military spending to public healthcare.

[ilostmypassword]

4 hours ago, mamypoko said:

Can we all agree that healthcare is "complicated"? Actually, nobody ever knew just how complicated it is...Jeez

Actually lots of people knew and know how complicated it is.  It's just that Donald Trump and most other Republican politicians don't..

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Ulic said:

In the USA 33% of a hospitals costs are billing/accounting expenses . A single payer system is the most efficient. Of course health care is a racket in the US. Just look at how much hospitals and insurance companies make in profits. A single payer system while not perfect because healthcare is a bottomless pit (some people will insist the government should spend millions so a patient can live an extra month at age 85) it is the way to go. Shift some wasted military spending to public healthcare.

Well we were slowly headed in that rational direction before trump got elected. Now push that back for another 50 years or so while American life expediencies fall even further back than many more advanced nations. 

Edited March 7, 2017 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I don't like Obamacare much but it's still better than the status quo before Obamacare.

 

Now here comes trumpcare ... well, maybe.

 

Does this really sound better?

 

Can lawmakers do better?

 

Doesn't seem so.

Quote

The Republican Health Care Plan Is Kind of Like Obamacare, but Stingier and More Dysfunctional

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/03/07/the_republican_health_care_plan_is_just_obamacare_but_stingier_and_more.html

 

Another comment, the reason Obamacare is widely known as Obamacare rather than ACA is that republicans made a thing of insisting on calling it that because they hated it.

I would assume that trump doesn't really want this extremely messy "repeal and replace" to be called trumpcare. Ego issues notwithstanding, he's got to know that trumpcare is a not going to be popular. 

I can safely predict if trumpcare happens there will be a stream of news stories of dead Americans directly as a result of the transition from Obamacare to trumpcare. Who wants their name on that?

 

When was the last time that a president of the United States deliberately put so many Americans in harm’s way?

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2017/03/the_gop_s_health_care_replacement_will_seriously_harm_individuals_health.html

Which makes me wonder why they named it as they did.

American Health Care Act.

AHCA. 

People won't call it that.

It is so NOT catchy. 

They could have branded it differently with and hot a hot acronym.

But they didn't.

So people not dissing it calling it Obamacare Lite are ALREADY calling it trumpcare.

You break it, you own it. 

 

Edited March 7, 2017 by Jingthing

[simple1]

I heard in a news report today US health care costs now represents 18% of GDP,  a significantly higher percentage than Western countries with universal health care. e.g. comparison stats from 2014, when percentage for US GDP was 17.1 compared to the UK at 9.1% of GDP

 

http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.XPD.TOTL.ZS

[hawker9000]

13 hours ago, retarius said:

American healthcare is the saddest in the universe. If you have great insurance which I did, I was able to get fantastic healthy care delivered immediately. And you don;t pay any tax on the benefit which the company you work for bestows on you….the biggest middle class tax break bar none (except perhaps mortgages).

If you are a minimum wage slave and get no benefits you pay the highest rates of all to visit the hospital ER. This is why in national surveys on health outcomes the US ranks so poorly, usually between 20th and 30th on health outcome like child mortality and lifespan, surviving heart attacks and the like; despite it being at least 2 times more expensive per capita than anywhere else in the developed world.

When I was there my healthcare cost probably 6 or 10 times per capita than the world average….the big problem is that 1/3 of the population get next to nothing spent on the,. It is an insurance racket. Get cancer, and need expensive drugs, they'll cut your insurance off.

Obamacare was supposed to sort these problems out, but after a year or two of slightly cheaper premiums, insurance rates have skyrocketed. Try to get health insurance for self spouse and two kids (even a crappy one with huge deductibles and low payouts) and you will find yourself paying $600 or $700 a month in most states. Who can afford that?

You just don't get it.  Neither the democratic party nor anything they do is actually about the middle class.  Well, maybe the destruction of the middle class...  The Unaffordable Care Act canceled middle-class health care and handed it to the welfare class, with no impact on the upper class whatsoever. 

[kamahele]

So, their plan is to gradually deny the right to insurance to the poor,  defund Planned Parenthood which provides health care for women, offer tax cuts to pharmaceutical companies and insurance companies...  People will die but Republicans won't care as they are not campaign donors and the rich who are campaign donors will get even richer. This plan looks like it won't pass as the ultra conservative Republican "Tea Party" wants a complete repeal with NO replacement. They and the Democrats will vote "no".

[Jingthing]

Please, please, keep pouncing!

Something really smells bad about this new trumpcare thingamajig.

Drain the swamp, huh?

Kleptocracy on steroids more like.

 

Quote

 

The GOP’s Plan Is Basically a $600 Billion Tax Cut for Rich Americans

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/03/acha-tax-cut/518889/

 

[Jingthing]

Oops!

Quote

An Important Insurer Says Paul Ryan’s Health Care Plan Fails at Its Only Goal: Making Coverage Cheaper

Aside from cutting taxes on the wealthy and choking off Medicaid, House Speaker Paul Ryan's health care plan pretty much had one job: make insurance cheaper. It wasn't supposed to expand coverage. It wasn't really supposed to add any new protections for consumers. It was just supposed to make it possible for insurers to sell bare-bones plans with lower premiums, which in turn might let Washington spend less money subsidizing coverage.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/03/08/insurer_says_the_gop_s_health_care_plan_would_raise_premiums_30_percent.html

 

I want to add here, even though personally I don't disguise my total disgust with trump as a man and president, my opposition to his trumpcare garbage plan is not because it's from trump, it's because it's bad. If trump had been a TRUE populist like Bernie Sanders, and really cared about the little guy, he could have made history and pushed what the U.S. desperately needs (it's a matter of life and death for so many) -- a CANADIAN style universal health system that addresses both COSTS and total access.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Jingthing

[hawker9000]

50 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Oops!

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/03/08/insurer_says_the_gop_s_health_care_plan_would_raise_premiums_30_percent.html

 

I want to add here, even though personally I don't disguise my total disgust with trump as a man and president, my opposition to his trumpcare garbage plan is not because it's from trump, it's because it's bad. If trump had been a TRUE populist like Bernie Sanders, and really cared about the little guy, he could have made history and pushed what the U.S. desperately needs (it's a matter of life and death for so many) -- a CANADIAN style universal health system that addresses both COSTS and total access.

Yes - let's by all means have a CANADIAN style universal health system...

 

https://www.city-journal.org/html/ugly-truth-about-canadian-health-care-13032.html

 

Yay...  Something to dream about alright...

 

 

[Credo]

2 hours ago, hawker9000 said:

Yes - let's by all means have a CANADIAN style universal health system...

 

https://www.city-journal.org/html/ugly-truth-about-canadian-health-care-13032.html

 

Yay...  Something to dream about alright...

 

 

But this topic isn't about the Canadian health system, is it?   It's about the US system and I think if members start posting anecdotal links about who has the most problems, the US system will come with many more than most countries.   

 

I have relatives, family and lots of friends living in Canada, there is the occasional grumble about the health care system, but a few spend their winters in the Southern US to escape the cold, and they are appalled at the problems facing many Americans.   They are completely satisfied with the care they receive in the US, but the insurance rates and problems which many people face is difficult for them to fathom.   

[ilostmypassword]

4 hours ago, hawker9000 said:

Yes - let's by all means have a CANADIAN style universal health system...

 

https://www.city-journal.org/html/ugly-truth-about-canadian-health-care-13032.html

 

Yay...  Something to dream about alright...

 

 

That article was published in 2007.  Couldn't you find anything older and less relevant to the situation today?

And what a cherry-picking load of rubbish it was. Never cited any statistics comparing outcomes of the Canadian health care system to the U.S. Healthcare system.

Didn't bother to point out that the Canadian system gave universal coverage.

Didn't point out that people with pre-existing conditions in the USA couldn't get coverage.

And since it was published 10 years ago we can't blame the author for not knowing how Obamacare has pushed the rise in health care expenses down. However, we can definitely blame somebody for citing a 10 year old article as relevant to the situation today.

[ilostmypassword]

An Important Insurer Says Paul Ryan’s Health Care Plan Fails at Its Only Goal: Making Coverage Cheaper

According to at least one important insurer, Ryancare, which is currently struggling to get traction in Congress, would fail miserably at that task. J. Mario Molina, CEO of Molina Healthcare Inc., told the Wall Street Journal that he believed the American Health Care Act “could help push individual-plan premiums up by 30% or more next year.”

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/03/08/insurer_says_the_gop_s_health_care_plan_would_raise_premiums_30_percent.html

[ilostmypassword]

On 3/8/2017 at 8:13 AM, hawker9000 said:

You just don't get it.  Neither the democratic party nor anything they do is actually about the middle class.  Well, maybe the destruction of the middle class...  The Unaffordable Care Act canceled middle-class health care and handed it to the welfare class, with no impact on the upper class whatsoever. 

Got any facts to back that up? 

And I guess you don't care much about working class whites:

Using census data, the Urban Institute recently calculated that from 2010 through 2015, more non-college-educated whites gained coverage than college-educated whites and minorities combined in all five of the key Rustbelt states that flipped from Obama in 2012 to Trump in 2016: Iowa, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania. Whites without a college degree also represented a majority of those gaining coverage under the law in core Trump states like Indiana, West Virginia, Kentucky, Arkansas, and Oklahoma.

These states often saw enormous reductions in the number of uninsured working-class whites: about 40 percent in Indiana, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin; roughly 50 percent in Ohio, Iowa, and Michigan; and 60 percent in West Virginia and Kentucky.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/01/blue-collar-whites-obamacare/512159/

[Jingthing]

New insult phrase to describe "trumpcare" --

REVERSE ROBIN HOOD.

Massive tax cuts for the super rich paid for by massively cutting health care for poorer, older, and sicker Americans.

Shame on republicans for pushing this moral outrage!

[rijb]

A Side-by-Side Comparison of Trumpcare and Obamacare

 

https://www.fool.com/investing/2016/11/14/a-side-by-side-comparison-of-trumpcare-and-obamaca.aspx

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, rijb said:

A Side-by-Side Comparison of Trumpcare and Obamacare

 

https://www.fool.com/investing/2016/11/14/a-side-by-side-comparison-of-trumpcare-and-obamaca.aspx

 

Aside from cutting taxes on the wealthy and choking off Medicaid, House Speaker Paul Ryan's health care plan pretty much had one job: make insurance cheaper...

According to at least one important insurer, Ryancare, which is currently struggling to get traction in Congress, would fail miserably at that task. J. Mario Molina, CEO of Molina Healthcare Inc., told the Wall Street Journal that he believed the American Health Care Act “could help push individual-plan premiums up by 30% or more next year.”

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/03/08/insurer_says_the_gop_s_health_care_plan_would_raise_premiums_30_percent.html

[Jingthing]

Comedy break --

 

 

Oy ...

•  

 

1.  

   Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump  3h3 hours ago

   More

   Despite what you hear in the press, healthcare is coming along great. We are talking to many groups and it will end in a beautiful picture!

 

Edited March 9, 2017 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Quote

 

More on the crapola trumpcare plan:

Republicans are now paying the price for a years-long campaign of Obamacare lies

They promised better insurance. They can’t deliver. Now the jig is up.
Donald Trump added his own signature dose of shamelessness to the Republicans’ shameless crusade against Obamacare.
 

 

http://www.vox.com/2017/3/8/14843762/ahca-republican-lies-obamacare

[attrayant]

Here's a doctor's analysis:

[Jingthing]

Good video.

From a comment on the video:

 

Quote

 

KnightRaymund2 days ago

The left hates it because it's crap. The right hates it because it's not crap enough.

 

 

[ilostmypassword]

The Republican health plan is a huge betrayal of Trump’s campaign promises

"Trump ran and won promising to cover everyone, avoid Medicaid cuts, and boost funding for opioid abuse treatment. He is now lobbying Congress to pass a bill that does none of those things. Instead, millions will lose insurance and Medicaid spending will be sacrificed on the altar of tax cuts for the rich."

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/3/10/14881200/trump-health-care-promises

[Jingthing]

trump voters will get hurt more by trumpcare.

Go figure!

When are trump voters going to wake up BIGLY and start turning on the CON MAN?

I recall here there were actually silly trump fans interpreting trump's campaign rhetoric (we're going to take care of everyone, you're gonna LOVE it!) to mean they actually thought trump might support universal single payer health care if elected.

It's wild to me that anyone thought that, but the jig is up!

 

Quote

 

Trump Supporters Have the Most to Lose in the G.O.P. Repeal Bill
...

The voters hit the hardest — eligible for at least $5,000 less in tax credits under the Republican plan — supported Mr. Trump by a margin of 59 percent to 36 percent.

 

 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/10/upshot/why-trump-supporters-have-the-most-to-lose-with-the-gop-repeal-bill.html?_r=0

Edited March 12, 2017 by Jingthing

[sirineou]

I said it before and I will say it again,

There is no such thing as a free lunch! If the government don't pay for it , and the insurance companies won take the hit, the consumer will have to pay for it. and if the cost is not shared by all, it will be concentrated to the few,

Simple enough.

There are a few things that are essential to the well being of a country,

 Defense, Management of its economy,education,and Health of it's citizens are a few that come to mind. They benefit everyone that lives in the country, either directly or indirectly and all should pay for it.

Who wants to be a citizen of a poor, stupid. sick country? conciser the results of such condition.

Can you spell President Trump?