harris campaign, clean up on aisle Electoral College

[snoop1130]

Exclusive - Japan plans to send largest warship to South China Sea, sources say

By Tim Kelly and Nobuhiro Kubo

 

A helicopter lands on the Izumo, Japan Maritime Self Defense Force's (JMSDF) helicopter carrier, at JMSDF Yokosuka base in Yokosuka, south of Tokyo, Japan, December 6, 2016. REUTERS/Kim Kyung-Hoon/File Photo

 

TOKYO (Reuters) - Japan plans to dispatch its largest warship on a three-month tour through the South China Sea beginning in May, three sources said, in its biggest show of naval force in the region since World War Two.

 

China claims almost all the disputed waters and its growing military presence has fuelled concern in Japan and the West, with the United States holding regular air and naval patrols to ensure freedom of navigation.

 

The Izumo helicopter carrier, commissioned only two years ago, will make stops in Singapore, Indonesia, the Philippines, Indonesia and Sri Lanka before joining the Malabar joint naval exercise with Indian and U.S. naval vessels in the Indian Ocean in July.

 

It will return to Japan in August, the sources said.

 

"The aim is to test the capability of the Izumo by sending it out on an extended mission," said one of the sources who have knowledge of the plan. "It will train with the U.S. Navy in the South China Sea," he added, asking not to be identified because he is not authorized to talk to the media.

 

A spokesman for Japan's Maritime Self Defence Force declined to comment.

 

Taiwan, Malaysia, Vietnam, the Philippines and Brunei also claim parts of the sea which has rich fishing grounds, oil and gas deposits and through which around $5 trillion of global sea-borne trade passes each year.

 

Japan does not have any claim to the waters, but has a separate maritime dispute with China in the East China Sea.

 

Japan wants to invite Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte, who has pushed ties with China in recent months as he has criticised the old alliance with the United States, to visit the Izumo when it visits Subic Bay, about 100 km (62 miles) west of Manila, another of the sources said.

 

Japan's flag-flying operation comes as the United States under President Donald Trump appears to be taking a tougher line with China. Washington has criticized China's construction of man-made islands and a build-up of military facilities that it worries could be used to restrict free movement.

 

Beijing in January said it had "irrefutable" sovereignty over the disputed islands after the White House vowed to defend "international territories".

 

The 249 metre-long (816.93 ft) Izumo is as large as Japan's World War Two-era carriers and can operate up to nine helicopters. It resembles the amphibious assault carriers used by U.S. Marines, but lacks their well deck for launching landing craft and other vessels.

 

Japan in recent years, particularly under Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, has been stretching the limits of its post-war, pacifist constitution. It has designated the Izumo as a destroyer because the constitution forbids the acquisition of offensive weapons. The vessel, nonetheless, allows Japan to project military power well beyond its territory.

 

Based in Yokosuka, near to Tokyo, which is also home to the U.S. Seventh Fleet's carrier, the Ronald Reagan, the Izumo's primary mission is anti-submarine warfare.

 

(Reporting by Tim Kelly; Editing by Nick Macfie)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-3-13

[Basil B]

10 minutes ago, snoop1130 said:

Japan wants to invite Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte, who has pushed ties with China in recent months as he has criticised the old alliance with the United States, to visit the Izumo when it visits Subic Bay, about 100 km (62 miles) west of Manila, another of the sources said.

Has not Japan already got a couple of Aircraft Carriers already in the Philippines?

 

sunk by the Yanks in Layte Gulf...

[Scott]

Off-topic posts removed.   Please stay on topic.  

[whatawonderfulday]

Its good the Japanese have organised this good will visit far in advance rather just turning up by surprise

[spidermike007]

Wonderful. Beautiful. Outstanding. Anything the nations of the world can do, to reign in the Chicom despots is a good thing. The world must show them there are limits to their behavior. Otherwise, their eventual goal may just be world domination, as the communist ideal is one of an expansionist agenda. Slow them down. Gum up their works. Give them grief. Make them pay for their continued support of the dictator in N. Korea, by sanctioning their banking system. and let us all stand up to them in the SCS. Kudos to Japan for this.

[whatawonderfulday]

2 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Wonderful. Beautiful. Outstanding. Anything the nations of the world can do, to reign in the Chicom despots is a good thing. The world must show them there are limits to their behavior. Otherwise, their eventual goal may just be world domination, as the communist ideal is one of an expansionist agenda. Slow them down. Gum up their works. Give them grief. Make them pay for their continued support of the dictator in N. Korea, by sanctioning their banking system. and let us all stand up to them in the SCS. Kudos to Japan for this.

oops what a minute there.  Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, whatawonderfulday said:

oops what a minute there.  Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?

Whoever it is, it's not the Chinese. Not even close. As of May 2016, China held about 7 percent of the U.S. national debt. And they've been selling Treasury notes since then so it's probably a lot less now.

[spidermike007]

4 minutes ago, whatawonderfulday said:

oops what a minute there.  Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?

 

Not correct. 

 

There's been a lot of attention in recent years over China rising to become one of the largest holders of U.S. debt. China's share of the debt is sizable -- about 7% -- but it's hardly the largest holder of U.S. government bonds. The top holder by far is U.S. citizens and American entities, such as state and local governments, pension funds, mutual funds, and the Federal Reserve. Together they own the vast majority -- 67.5% -- of the debt. Foreign nations only hold 32.5% of the total.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/05/10/news/economy/us-debt-ownership/

[whatawonderfulday]

1 minute ago, ilostmypassword said:

Whoever it is, it's not the Chinese. Not even close. As of May 2016, China held about 7 percent of the U.S. national debt. And they've been selling Treasury notes since then so it's probably a lot less now.

You seem unclear Please check facts first or is this supposed to be an ilusration of Trump's "Fake news".

Please read below from google.

 

US Economy. The U.S. debt to China is $1.058 trillion, as of December 2016. That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries. The rest of the $19.9 trillion national debt is owned by either the American people or by the U.S. government itself.

[whatawonderfulday]

4 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Not correct. 

 

There's been a lot of attention in recent years over China rising to become one of the largest holders of U.S. debt. China's share of the debt is sizable -- about 7% -- but it's hardly the largest holder of U.S. government bonds. The top holder by far is U.S. citizens and American entities, such as state and local governments, pension funds, mutual funds, and the Federal Reserve. Together they own the vast majority -- 67.5% -- of the debt. Foreign nations only hold 32.5% of the total.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/05/10/news/economy/us-debt-ownership/

See my other reply on the facts . As of Dec 216 China holds 27.8% of the US National Debt.  By far  , as a nation, the biggest single creditor. Also I never said they were the holders of the largest %.

 

Please read and understand fully, check facts before making incorrect statements.

Edited March 14, 2017 by whatawonderfulday

[ilostmypassword]

9 minutes ago, whatawonderfulday said:

oops what a minute there.  Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?

 

3 minutes ago, whatawonderfulday said:

You seem unclear Please check facts first or is this supposed to be an ilusration of Trump's "Fake news".

Please read below from google.

 

US Economy. The U.S. debt to China is $1.058 trillion, as of December 2016. That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries. The rest of the $19.9 trillion national debt is owned by either the American people or by the U.S. government itself.

No, you seem to be unclear. How does  "Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?" equal Who owns 30% of the US national debt held by foreign countries?

The fact is it doesn't.

And even if China did sell all of its US securities, why would that be a threat to the US economy?  It would tend to lower the value of the dollar and raise the value of the renminbi. In fact, since that CNN article was published, China has been selling off its US treasury notes. Japan is now the biggest foreign holder of US debt.

[whatawonderfulday]

3 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

 

No, you seem to be unclear. How does  "Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?" equal Who owns 30% of the US national debt held by foreign countries?

The fact is it doesn't.

And even if China did sell all of its US securities, why would that be a threat to the US economy?  It would tend to lower the value of the dollar and raise the value of the renminbi. In fact, since that CNN article was published, China has been selling off its US treasury notes. Japan is now the biggest foreign holder of US debt.

 

3 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

 

No, you seem to be unclear. How does  "Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?" equal Who owns 30% of the US national debt held by foreign countries?

The fact is it doesn't.

And even if China did sell all of its US securities, why would that be a threat to the US economy?  It would tend to lower the value of the dollar and raise the value of the renminbi. In fact, since that CNN article was published, China has been selling off its US treasury notes. Japan is now the biggest foreign holder of US debt.

I simplified by rounding up the 27.8 % to 30%.  later quoting the article with the exact 27.8% figure. Can you not read, are you mathematically challenged or something ?  And,  as I said in my other post I did not state China was the largest holder.  The mere fact that China holds such a large percentage should send alarm bells ringing to the moderately sane, before beating the war drums.

 

Anyway this post is about the Japanese carrier going on a tour of duty for goodwill and my initial post was a cautionary note in response to spidermikes post "to standard up to them" .  Clearly all that was way above your ahead. But have a nice day anyway.

[ilostmypassword]

10 minutes ago, whatawonderfulday said:

 

I simplified by rounding up the 27.8 % to 30%.  later quoting the article with the exact 27.8% figure. Can you not read, are you mathematically challenged or something ?  And,  as I said in my other post I did not state China was the largest holder.  The mere fact that China holds such a large percentage should send alarm bells ringing to the moderately sane, before beating the war drums.

 

Anyway this post is about the Japanese carrier going on a tour of duty for goodwill and my initial post was a cautionary note in response to spidermikes post "to standard up to them" .  Clearly all that was way above your ahead. But have a nice day anyway.

You originally wrote that China owns 30 percent of the national debt. When it actually owns about 30 percent of the foreign owned portion of the national debt. That equates to ownership of about 7 percent of the national debt.  No matter how you try to wriggle out of it, 30 percent does not equal 7 percent. And your use of a gratuitous insult in now bolsters your case.

Edited March 14, 2017 by ilostmypassword

[boomerangutang]

        I think the Japanese move is good.  China needs all the reminders possible - that it imperialism and militarization of the SCS will not be tolerated.  It remains to be seen what the US policy will be.  Trump is so invested in China (he buys nearly all building materials and appliances for his buildings, from Chinese businesses), and has large loans from Chinese banks, that he can't be objective.

[whatawonderfulday]

8 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

You originally wrote that China owns 30 percent of the national debt. When it actually owns about 30 percent of the foreign owned portion of the national debt. That equates to ownership of about 7 percent of the national debt.  No matter how you try to wriggle out of it, 30 percent does not equal 7 percent. And your use of a gratuitous insult in now bolsters your case.

Clearly you do have difficulty. It is becoming somewhat tiresome but here goes just for you those extracts again.

 

The U.S. debt to China is $1.058 trillion, as of December 2016. That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries. The rest of the $19.9 trillion national debt is owned

 

Is there something you don't understand about the statement" the rest of the national debt" which means just that the article is about the national debt of which, as it stated . That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries.

 

Now I'm sorry I can not illustrate that more clearly to you, so you can either believe the evidence in that google article, or else you may remain in your delusional state, but I will not be replying to further ill thought through statements on your part.

 

[ilostmypassword]

5 minutes ago, whatawonderfulday said:

Clearly you do have difficulty. It is becoming somewhat tiresome but here goes just for you those extracts again.

 

The U.S. debt to China is $1.058 trillion, as of December 2016. That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries. The rest of the $19.9 trillion national debt is owned

 

Is there something you don't understand about the statement" the rest of the national debt" which means just that the article is about the national debt of which, as it stated . That's 27.8 percent of the $3.8 trillion in Treasury bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries.

 

Now I'm sorry I can not illustrate that more clearly to you, so you can either believe the evidence in that google article, or else you may remain in your delusional state, but I will not be replying to further ill thought through statements on your part.

 

"oops what a minute there.  Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?"

So this was not a reference to the chinese? If not, why did you consider it germane?

[Johnnyngai]

Average Chinese citizens will have to work an extra 3 hours a day to pay for more military hardware.   President Xi said that he will guide China back to the glorious days of yesteryear when China was the superpower of Asia.    

[ilostmypassword]

3 minutes ago, Johnnyngai said:

Average Chinese citizens will have to work an extra 3 hours a day to pay for more military hardware.   President Xi said that he will guide China back to the glorious days of yesteryear when China was the superpower of Asia.    

How did you come up with that number?

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, whatawonderfulday said:

as a nation, the biggest single creditor.

The US as a nation is the biggest single creditor.

https://www.pri.org/stories/2011-07-20/who-owns-america-hint-its-not-china

 

[whatawonderfulday]

Just now, Srikcir said:

The US as a nation is the biggest single creditor.

https://www.pri.org/stories/2011-07-20/who-owns-america-hint-its-not-china

 

yes, exactly what the article I posted said. Who doubted it ?

[Scott]

I suggest you keep the discussion civil.

 

[ilostmypassword]

5 minutes ago, car720 said:

I have often wondered about expansionism.  When the Japanese overran S.E. Asia during the second war I don't know how they planned to administer their new found empire.  I believe it would be the same with the Chinese or even the USA for that matter.  Consider the predicament that Greece is currently in.  I am sure that if China made the right offer that they could take over the government without any battle whatsoever, but, what would they do with it?  Running the place would be a nightmare for them.  Everyone knows that controlling a conquered people on their own soil is next to impossible.  I believe that if China really wanted to expand then the first place they would take would be the Korean peninsula which would be strategically important in regards to taking on the only real people that they see as their enemy, the Japanese.  Things like the Nanjing massacre are never forgotten by the Chinese.  They have extremely long memories.

There's one big exception to that rule: colonization.  If you've got enough citizens and the force to back them up, you simply send in a sufficient amount to overwhelm the locals. Chinese has been doing this very successfully in Tibet and in Western China.  As did the UK and then the USA  in North American and Northern Ireland. As has Israel on the West Bank and in Jerusalem.  When you don't, as in the case of Rhodesia or South Africa, eventually the venture fails. 

[chilli42]

2 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

How did you come up with that number?

Aka:  an uncheckable fact, an alternative fact, fake news

[chilli42]

3 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

 

No, you seem to be unclear. How does  "Who "owns" 30% of the US national debt amounting to trillions ?" equal Who owns 30% of the US national debt held by foreign countries?

The fact is it doesn't.

And even if China did sell all of its US securities, why would that be a threat to the US economy?  It would tend to lower the value of the dollar and raise the value of the renminbi. In fact, since that CNN article was published, China has been selling off its US treasury notes. Japan is now the biggest foreign holder of US debt.

Agree, the fact that China holds a large amount of US T Bills is meaningless.  The Chinese did not buy US T Bills because they like Americans or American foreign policy.  Both countries hold what is effectively promisary notes ... it's just promises on paper.  Were China to seek to sell off, they have to find buyers.  Then the bigger issue ... trade and trade balance between US and China.  The Chinese are pragmatists, they are not going to shoot themselves in the foot.

[whatawonderfulday]

38 minutes ago, car720 said:

in all of the above cases there was no language barrier, unless you are referring to the near genocide of the American Indians.  The Spanish didn't last in South America, only their language did.  Westerners don't seem to hold to their history as adamantly as the Chinese do, for example, the Chinese navigators travelled far and wide in ancient times.  There have even been Chinese artifacts found in Australia that date back long before the first Europeans arrived.  As an aside, living in China myself I can tell you that the Party here are not so much admired and most of the populace would rather live elsewhere to escape the controls placed on them here.  I don't think they would want to toe the Party line if they managed to move elsewhere.

Actually the Spaniards colonised South America for 340 years which I would consider a long time. However way before the Chinese you had of course the Persians which managed to navigate around the world quite well too, well the world as they knew it at the time

Edited March 14, 2017 by whatawonderfulday

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, car720 said:

but in all of the above cases there was no language barrier, unless you are referring to the near genocide of the American Indians.  The Spanish didn't last in South America, only their language did.  Westerners don't seem to hold to their history as adamantly as the Chinese do, for example, the Chinese navigators travelled far and wide in ancient times.  There have even been Chinese artifacts found in Australia that date back long before the first Europeans arrived.  As an aside, living in China myself I can tell you that the Party here are not so much admired and most of the populace would rather live elsewhere to escape the controls placed on them here.  I don't think they would want to toe the Party line if they managed to move elsewhere.

What do you mean, no language barrier? Do you think that the Tibetan is a kind of Chinese? And the Tibetans write with an alphabet, not Chinese ideograms. And the Uighurs in Western China speak a variety of Turkic.