ATM fees on the rise

[rickudon]

Hi Tallguy, sorry to take so long getting back to you, have been away. I use a Halifax bank Clarity credit card. It allows free withdrawals and purchases when abroad, only pay the MC currency conversion fee (which is less than 1%) and if a cash withdrawal interest from when you take the money out. I usually pay it off quickly so interest is only a pound or so. Purchases usual pay by date on the monthly bill. I get online statements and pay online from my Halifax bank account so easy to manage in Thailand.

 

Still have to pay the Thai ATM fee, but usually use Aeon. Although last 6 months have had an issue with some Aeon ATMs not accepting my card. Aeon works for me as usually take out 40,000 baht a month in 2 x 20,000 baht withdrawals. If you need more maybe other bank ATM's would work as well. My experience is that MC give slightly better exchange rates than Visa, when i have used both on the same day. Also by my calculations slightly cheaper than doing a SWIFT transfer unless you transfer over £2,000 pounds at a time (the Thai bank exchange rate is lower than MC, and only marginally better than the rate you get when you include the ATM fee; include the SWIFT fee and you have to transfer at least £2,000 to be better off). Also use the credit card for purchases from tesco, Global house etc.

 

OK, only save a few pounds, but why make Bankers rich?

[bandito]

20 hours ago, Salerno said:

Using the ATM you are getting hit with (using your numbers as example) 150 Bht ATM fee + your own bank's 250 Bht (6 Euro) fee so 400 Bht in fees instead of just the 250 Bht fee your own bank charges for forex.

 

No, you misunderstand me.

ATM Baht 150-

Over the counter Euro 6, not while using the ATM.

Aw, I forgot the bank hits me also with a fee for using the ATM, which is a percentage of the money withdrawing.

So I think you are right, gives me a headache these banks.

[Joebuzz]

Bottom line?  Thailand is a rippoff!

[Laza 45]

7 hours ago, Salerno said:

 

If you use ATMs a lot, worth looking into a CitiBank Plus Debit card, no fees other than local ATM (and even that "may" not be charged depending on country).

 

-----

 

Just had a look at a statement for an example:

• 25,000 Bht withdrawal 30/12/16
• ended up with a debit of $976.45 from my account
• interbank exchange rate that day shows 25,000 Bht = $972.95
• so $3.50 difference = approx 90 Bht "fee" on the day.

I don't normally use ATMs to withdraw cash unless I am caught short..  a  CitiBank  debit card looks like a very good option.. thanks for the tip..  I use a People's Choice credit union debit card and the fees are good compared to banks  but CitiBank looks like it could be better.. 

[elgenon]

On 4/26/2017 at 5:01 PM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Regarding their credit cards, Capital One actually has changed their policy on travel notices in the past year, apparently since they started issuing new chip-enabled credit cards.

 

They used to be very fussy about demanding cardholders file travel notices anytime they planned on using the card outside the U.S. or face getting their transactions blocked as potential fraud. Now lately, C1 confirmed to me that for their credit card holders with chipped cards, they don't need to file travel notices at all any more. But they do advise providing a reachable phone number so their fraud department can contact you in case of any issues. I've tested their advice and thus far found it to work as promised.

 

As for BofA, yes, although their debit cards are HORRIBLE in terms of fees for using outside the U.S.,, they do have at least two credit cards that some time back switched to having no foreign currency conversion fees, namely their Cash Rewards and Travel Rewards VISA credit cards. Both of those are perfectly fine for use in Thailand, along with C1 cards. Now even the Chase issued Amazon Rewards VISA card has no FCF. Same with Wyndham Rewards VISA from Barclay's.

 

Thanks TG. Sounds like Cap 1 has improved but credit limit still low. Will call to get chip card. BofA still rocks my boat with large limit.

[elgenon]

1 minute ago, elgenon said:

Thanks TG. Sounds like Cap 1 has improved but credit limit still low. Will call to get chip card. BofA still rocks my boat with large limit.

Just looked at my card and it is a CHIP card. Will check to see if they extended Travel Alert.

 

They also require you call them within 7 days of travel. BofA has a bigger window.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, elgenon said:

Just looked at my card and it is a CHIP card. Will check to see if they extended Travel Alert.

 

They also require you call them within 7 days of travel. BofA has a bigger window.

As noted above, if you have a chipped Cap 1 credit card, you NO LONGER need to file travel advisories at all, even when using the card outside the U.S.  Just make sure C1 has up to date phone and email contact info for you.

 

Under the new scheme, lately, I used my card and the transaction did go thru. But a bit later, I got a phone call from C1 just checking to make sure it was a valid charge. Easy peasy.  Their new system is light years preferable to the old one with annoying, short term travel advisories being required.

 

[Wandr]

14 hours ago, SunsetT said:

What interest rate can one get on savings in Thailand these days please on say the 800000k for the reirement visa? And is tax payable on it?

1.5 % can be had pretty easily on a savings account .

But banks will deduct Thai income tax . CIMB website talks about NOT taking tax. You will need to follow up with them and maybe some other banks

.

[SunsetT]

2 hours ago, Wandr said:

1.5 % can be had pretty easily on a savings account .

But banks will deduct Thai income tax . CIMB website talks about NOT taking tax. You will need to follow up with them and maybe some other banks

.

Thanks.

[finy]

Don't know why people don't use Western Union to send money directly to Thai bank.

 

£2.90 versus 200bht (roughly £4.50)

 

Plus with foreign transaction fee and currency exchange fee at banks the lower exchange rate on Western Union still saves you money on anything less than £1500-2000.

[robin33]

Because the fx. Rate is so terrible

There are better options

 

 

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[theguyfromanotherforum]

I was reading somewhere (Facebook?) that aeon has the worst exchange rate out of all bank ATMs because it's not the actual bank. Is this true?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[finy]

1 hour ago, robin33 said:

Because the fx. Rate is so terrible

There are better options

 

 

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Maybe you can't read, but I said it's still cheaper when fees from bank are taken into account.

[robin33]

Yes pls read. (And check your figures). Who is talking about (traditional) banks.


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[finy]

5 hours ago, robin33 said:

Yes pls read. (And check your figures). Who is talking about (traditional) banks.


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Well it would help if you didn't keep secrets.

 

How do you do it?

 

lets say I wanted to transfer £1000

 

1- withdrawals from cash machine = huge amount of money

2- Bank transfer = £30ish

3- Western Union (paying by card to bank) = around £12 with fee plus low fx

[robin33]

Did the same with xendpay and revolut and western union

 

If i put in 1500 euro (can put in what you want in transaction fees with xendpay

So ..

Western union gave me 55176 bht (fx of 1 euro =36.784) for 1502.9

Xendpay 56684 (fx 37.789 ) for 1502.9

Then revolut i can only put in bht. So put in the higher xendpay 56684 in . they say that would cost me 1492 euro

 

And that all to the same bkk bank account. So those cost are the same.

Then wu is the least of them.

 

 

 

But a bank transfer of 30 is not normal,,, if i use the old fashioned bank way..

I do not no the fx my normaal bank uses but 30 .... my bank charges me 7 euro

 

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[Sparkles]

On ‎5‎/‎3‎/‎2017 at 3:06 PM, Wandr said:

1.5 % can be had pretty easily on a savings account .

But banks will deduct Thai income tax . CIMB website talks about NOT taking tax. You will need to follow up with them and maybe some other banks

.

Get a tax card from tax revenue office at CM City Hall and you can claim all the the tax deduction back the following year,not that its much based on 1.5%, the going rate, but better in your pocket.

My Bangkok Bank branch provide a statement and then off to the local Amphur Office.It used to take a week to get a cheque but last time more like 45 days

[grin]

Just got an email from my Citi Premier card which has no foreign transaction fees:

 

Based on your airline ticket purchase(s) on your Citi® card, it appears that you're travelling soon. To make things easier for you there's no need to contact us regarding your upcoming trip.

[Langsuan Man]

3 hours ago, grin said:

Just got an email from my Citi Premier card which has no foreign transaction fees:

 

Based on your airline ticket purchase(s) on your Citi® card, it appears that you're travelling soon. To make things easier for you there's no need to contact us regarding your upcoming trip.

Sorry,  but I would not be that thrilled that my credit card company was keeping such a detailed watch on my spending

 

Will they send me a congratulatory  email if I buy a vibrator sex toy !

[thailand49]

On 5/2/2017 at 0:08 PM, rickudon said:

Hi Tallguy, sorry to take so long getting back to you, have been away. I use a Halifax bank Clarity credit card. It allows free withdrawals and purchases when abroad, only pay the MC currency conversion fee (which is less than 1%) and if a cash withdrawal interest from when you take the money out. I usually pay it off quickly so interest is only a pound or so. Purchases usual pay by date on the monthly bill. I get online statements and pay online from my Halifax bank account so easy to manage in Thailand.

 

Still have to pay the Thai ATM fee, but usually use Aeon. Although last 6 months have had an issue with some Aeon ATMs not accepting my card. Aeon works for me as usually take out 40,000 baht a month in 2 x 20,000 baht withdrawals. If you need more maybe other bank ATM's would work as well. My experience is that MC give slightly better exchange rates than Visa, when i have used both on the same day. Also by my calculations slightly cheaper than doing a SWIFT transfer unless you transfer over £2,000 pounds at a time (the Thai bank exchange rate is lower than MC, and only marginally better than the rate you get when you include the ATM fee; include the SWIFT fee and you have to transfer at least £2,000 to be better off). Also use the credit card for purchases from tesco, Global house etc.

 

OK, only save a few pounds, but why make Bankers rich?

As a FYI, I noted near the beginning of this thread my experience with Aeon. Like you I've been using Aeon ATM for near 10 years, but noticed late 2016, I put in my cards,  nothing basically happen after a long period the card would be return, indication on screen "OffLine"  I check Online my account and noticed money requested was removed then place back. I contacted Aeon and this is what I got from their HQ in Bangkok. Their new machines no longer accept Visa/MC Debit Cards for large amounts, basically nothing over 8,000 baht. I try once, put in 10,000 nothing, then change the amount to 3,000 and no problem.

Noted, Aeon is not a Bank but a Financial Institution, their branches do not carry cash.  As noted by another poster, the reason people like us were emptying their machines, especially with the low fee they were charging.

[thailand49]

On 5/3/2017 at 10:55 PM, theguyfromanotherforum said:

I was reading somewhere (Facebook?) that aeon has the worst exchange rate out of all bank ATMs because it's not the actual bank. Is this true?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not true from my experience, prior to them putting in the new machines which now don't take foreign debit cards for large amounts. It must be 8000 baht or less. 

Prior I've found their rates high compare to the others plus their fee was the lowest.

[thailand49]

On 5/2/2017 at 10:48 PM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

As noted above, if you have a chipped Cap 1 credit card, you NO LONGER need to file travel advisories at all, even when using the card outside the U.S.  Just make sure C1 has up to date phone and email contact info for you.

 

Under the new scheme, lately, I used my card and the transaction did go thru. But a bit later, I got a phone call from C1 just checking to make sure it was a valid charge. Easy peasy.  Their new system is light years preferable to the old one with annoying, short term travel advisories being required.

 

Mr. TallGuyJohninBKK,

 

Just want to drop you a note for answering all my question regarding to my situation. You don't know how much you are saving me each time from using the ATM, since you provided me with the information.

Like today,  I put in my Debit card first with Bangkok Bank,  noted on the screen Conversion for the money I requested 31.72,  I cancelled the transaction.  Took my card stepped over to TMB,  and the Conversion on the screen 31.80,  16,000 baht they will remove $503.00 from my account, of course based on your recommendation I push " I do not want to use the Conversion "  and transaction proceed and I get my money.

After getting home I check my account Online, based on what they took out $468.00, 16000 baht the rate comes out to 34.13, you save me $35.00 on this withdraw.

This is just a example of today withdraw, and as noted I do lots of them!  So this is a BIG DAMN THANKS FOR YESTERDAY, TODAY AND DOWN THE ROAD!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 5/7/2017 at 4:24 PM, thailand49 said:

Mr. TallGuyJohninBKK,

 

After getting home I check my account Online, based on what they took out $468.00, 16000 baht the rate comes out to 34.13, you save me $35.00 on this withdraw.

 

Glad to be of assistance. No one should be needlessly ripped off by the banks' use of Dynamic Currency Conversion.

 

Simple rule: If the bank ATM in Thailand ever asks you on the screen if you want to see your withdrawal amount in your home country currency, JUST SAY NO!

 

It's as simple as that...

[rickudon]

I think the ATM conversion rate you get is that set by MC/Visa, not the ATM (assuming you do not let the ATM 'convert' for you), as the withdrawal amount is passed to MC/Visa and converted. Your own bank MAY also then take some off as well.

 

As for Aeon ATM's, the new (?) ones work up to the point when i put in the transaction amount, then wait 10 seconds and tell me it is an invalid transaction. I have never asked for a small amount as there is no point taking a  small amount with the 150 baht fee on top. If none of them work any longer, their loss, not really mine. I will just change to whatever method is best for me in future.

[grin]

The dynamic currency conversion can get you in other places in addition to ATMs. If you are buying something online with a creidit card on a foreign website and they give you a choice of their currency or your home currency then you do not want to choose your home curency. As an example when buying an airline ticket online from a foreign airline like Tiger Air then choose SGD as the currency you will use to make the payment.

[Wandr]

To add a little more to the cautionary tales, you will not always get asked which currency you want to use.

Using a credit card here I have been charged using an exchange rate calculated by the local bank.

It is best to tell them beforehand "charge me in Thailand baht " or something similar.

That way the conversion rate is decided by your own bank.

 

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Only just saw the topic;  didn't read through it all, but did someone already smugly point out that they've had a Thai bank account since the early 1990s and have therefore never paid an ATM fee in their long blissful lives?

 

If not then let me know then I'll put it in.

Edited May 9, 2017 by WinnieTheKhwai

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 5/9/2017 at 8:21 AM, Wandr said:

To add a little more to the cautionary tales, you will not always get asked which currency you want to use.

Using a credit card here I have been charged using an exchange rate calculated by the local bank.

It is best to tell them beforehand "charge me in Thailand baht " or something similar.

That way the conversion rate is decided by your own bank.

 

 

I think you're talking about a different thing here.

 

The main part of this thread has been re ATM withdrawals, and it is correct that at least in Thailand, any Thai bank ATM that's trying to do Dynamic Currency Conversion when you're using a foreign card will ask on the ATM screen (in some vague kind of wording) if you want to see the transaction in your home country currency.  If you say NO, then the withdrawal will proceed as a normal Thai baht withdrawal using the normal MC network exchange rate for that day.

 

I believe, you're talking about a different thing involving making purchases with a foreign debit or credit card. And yes, for purchases, you're correct that some merchants here (though not most) will automatically ring up your purchase using a DCC rate. For those that do, they never ask first, they just do it. And then it's up to you the customer to decline/refuse, and ask them to re-ring the purchase in regular Thai baht.

 

Any time I'm dealing with a merchant where I know there's a history of them attempting DCC transactions, I'll specifically tell them before hand that I want it rung up in Thai baht, not (in my case) US$.  But most of the time, I don't have to say or do anything, and most merchants I deal with just ring up credit or debit card purchases as normal Thai baht transactions.

 

 

[oldhippy]

I think that DCC is fastly becoming the new standard banking scam - not only in Thailand.

It happened to me (being caught unaware) in Home Pro, Dubai Tax Free, and can you believe this: in Norway!

 

Oh, Johnny always tells the cashier "no DCC". I don't. I let them try to scam me. Next I tell them to start all over again. They don't seem to like that 555.

 

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Oh, Johnny always tells the cashier "no DCC". I don't. I let them try to scam me. Next I tell them to start all over again. They don't seem to like that 555.

 

I've gone that route too, and generally speaking, it's no fun at all.

 

Oftentimes, the lowly cash register clerk doesn't have permission or the knowledge to void an already completed transaction, so they often have to get/find a supervisor. Or, the clerk fiddles with the charge machine for 10 minutes trying to figure out how to do a void. Or in some cases, how to NOT do a DCC transaction, since that may be the only way they've been trained. And meanwhile, the queue of impatient customers is growing longer behind you in line.

 

I had one bad DCC episode a few weeks back at a small BKK hotel where the wife and I had stopped for breakfast one morning. They caught me by surprise with a DCC bill on our first visit there. Clerk claimed he either couldn't or didn't know how to do a void, so their only solution was to ring up the bill a second time in THB, and then promise to cancel the original U.S. $ bill/charge when the manager arrived later in the day.

 

Needless to say, 3-4 days passed and nothing had been canceled or credited back to the debit card I used to pay for our breakfast. So I went back to the same hotel, sat around a bit waiting for the manager, who finally showed up after 15 minutes or so.  Apologized for not having run the credit, but she claimed their payment system would take up to 30 days to process the refund. And she didn't think I'd be happy about that, so she did nothing, perhaps thinking I'd eventually come back, which I did. Whereupon, she handed me 500+ baht in cash as a refund for the first wrong DCC charge, and apologized again.  All in all, a lot of hassle and annoyance for a correcting 500+ baht breakfast bill.

 

Better to try to get it right, the first time.