Sub deal details still below the surface

[webfact]

Sub deal details still below the surface
By THE NATION

 

 

BANGKOK: -- DESPITE THE Cabinet’s green light to buy a submarine, the Royal Thai Navy cannot yet reveal all details of the Bt13.5-billion deal, the Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces said yesterday.

 

“This is a very detailed matter. The Navy needs time to proceed with the information so as to provide a holistic explanation,” Supreme Commander General Surapong Suwana-adth said. 

 

“This kind of information isn’t usually made public. If we reveal what kind of instruments we’re going to equip it with, other [countries] might use more advanced technology against us,” he said. “But I insist that they are essential to create a military balance [in the region].”

 

Little is known about the Navy’s procurement of the three S26T Yuan-class submarines from China, worth a total of Bt36 billion. Authorities have offered some explanations about their security and economic reasoning as well as broad procurement timelines, but have yet to provide documented details to the public.

 

Recent speculation was that the hardware would be brought to the Cabinet after the official launch of a submarine port in Chon Buri last month. The junta-backed government, however, said nothing until a week after they had already approved the multi-billion deal in secret. Meanwhile, activist Srisuwan Janya plans to file a petition with the Office of the Auditor-General today to investigate whether the submarine purchase violated the Constitution and relevant laws.

 

Srisuwan said the procurement could violate the 2017 Constitution, which requires the government to strictly maintain financial and fiscal discipline for public benefit.

 

He expressed doubts as to whether it was necessary to buy a submarine – not only because of the amount of money it entailed amid the country’s economic downturn, but also its practicality. 

 

“The Gulf of Thailand has an average depth of 25 to 60 metres,” he said. “We’re also not in conflict with any neighbouring countries. There is no reason to accumulate such hardware.”

 

The procurement process was also far from transparent, Srisuwan said, adding the government had not revealed additional costs such as dock construction, hiring of personnel, supplementary hardware and annual maintenance. 

 

In a related development, most respondents to a Twitter poll conducted by the Nation News Agency (NNA) disagreed with the government’s approval of the submarine procurement. Of the 1,705 respondents, 81 per cent said they disagreed, compared to 9 per cent who backed the green light for the submarine purchase.

 

Opponents of the plan pointed to the country’s still-weak economy while supporters said the country needed submarines for security reasons.

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/30313450

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-04-27

[fruitman]

The deal was buy 2 get 3 of them right?

 

So how can they speak about buying only 1 now then? Did i miss something? To get the free one they will have to buy 2 first i would think.

 

 

[wakeupplease]

If we reveal what kind of instruments we’re going to equip it with, other [countries] might use more advanced technology against us

 

That is not going to be very hard is it, I expect it to be a close friend of the wonderful aircraft carrier and just for the ego use

[yellowboat]

2 hours ago, webfact said:

Srisuwan said the procurement could violate the 2017 Constitution, which requires the government to strictly maintain financial and fiscal discipline for public benefit.

Thai law is written in pencil and there is always some "special" reason for circumventing it.

[metisdead]

An off topic post about Australia's submarine project has been removed. 

[ChrisY1]

IMO, people want to know whether middlemen were used in the purchase and whether commissions will be forthcoming.

The armament and instrumentation is irrelevant to most of us.....and in all likelyhood will be already outdated at delivery .

It would also seem that these, and many other military purchases, don't proceed via the MoD...but by each military discipline......which of course creates a massive opportunities for corruption.

 

Edited April 27, 2017 by ChrisY1

[AGareth2]

Why the secrecy,

is this on a scale with Rolls Royce?

[fish monger]

“This kind of information isn’t usually made public. If we reveal what kind of instruments we’re going to equip it with, other [countries] might use more advanced technology against us," General Surapong Suwana-adth said.

   Trust me when I say this General.....other countries have such advanced technology, it would make your head spin. If some country wants your outdated tin cans, they will take them....

[darksidedog]

The thing I find most laughable is that the Gulf isn't deep enough in many places for the bloody thing to submerge. At which point it is a boat, not a sub.

The majority of Thais apparently also see this as a bad idea and waste of money, though are Junta are unlikely to listen to the populace, as they never have before.

[RichardColeman]

I think they worry that another country will trump their order for outfitting the subs from Lazda and Aliexpress.

[sanukjim]

4 hours ago, fruitman said:

The deal was buy 2 get 3 of them right?

 

So how can they speak about buying only 1 now then? Did i miss something? To get the free one they will have to buy 2 first i would think.

 

 

As most of the military "deals" here if the public are told of 3.5 billion baht then the actual price is about one fourth of that (875 million) with a dummy company (normally registered in The Caymen Islands and belonging to a LOS government cronnie) buying the units and LOS buying them from the dummy company with the company kicking back about one eighth to the seller (43.7 million) after the buying price of 87.5 million.The leaders now have a profit of 2.188 billion.the rest is absorbed in cost and hand outs for the participants silence.Hello new Ferraris!.

[chuang]

Cannot reveal the details because of security reasons....cannot reveal CCTV footage of crimes committed by their proxies also because of security reasons....cannot reveal this or that also because of security reasons....cannot reveal  arh......enough..

[tigermoth]

I imagine the largest piece of information they don't want to make public is the attachementof a retractable undercarriage for use in the gulf.

[Eric Loh]

2 hours ago, darksidedog said:

The majority of Thais apparently also see this as a bad idea and waste of money, though are Junta are unlikely to listen to the populace, as they never have before.

They don't have to listen because they don't stand for election.

[mtls2005]

Unusually rich types just went up by a significant factor.

 

 

[elgordo38]

8 hours ago, webfact said:

“This kind of information isn’t usually made public. If we reveal what kind of instruments we’re going to equip it with, other [countries] might use more advanced technology against us,” he said. “But I insist that they are essential to create a military balance [in the region].”

 

<deleted> is this guy talking about???

[55Jay]

2 hours ago, chuang said:

Cannot reveal the details because of security reasons....cannot reveal CCTV footage of crimes committed by their proxies also because of security reasons....cannot reveal this or that also because of security reasons....cannot reveal  arh......enough..

I was not able to visit their aircraft carrier in Sattahip for security reasons.  I had a chuckle about that one.

[Srikcir]

8 hours ago, webfact said:

other [countries] might use more advanced technology against us,

Vietnam with its six Project 636M Kilo-class submarines from Russia is probably not too concerned. The Philippines is considering purchase of the same class. Thailand will essentially have a tuk-tuk compared to other nearby nation submarine fleet.

[55Jay]

9 hours ago, webfact said:

“The Gulf of Thailand has an average depth of 25 to 60 metres,” he said. “We’re also not in conflict with any neighbouring countries. There is no reason to accumulate such hardware.”

The voice of reason.

[eddie61]

Twas on the good ship Venus,
By God you should have seen us,
The figurehead was a whore in bed
And the mast the Captain’s penis.

 

The captain of this lugger,
He was a dirty bugger,
He wasn’t fit to shovel shit
From one ship to another.

 

The captain’s wife was Mabel.
Whenever she was able,
She’d fornicate with the second mate
Upon the galley table.

 

The cabin boy was Kipper,
A dirty little nipper,
We stuffed his arse with broken glass
To circumcise the skipper.

 

The captain had a daughter,
Who fell into the water,
We heard her squeal and knew an eel
Had found her sexual quarter.

 

The second mate’s name was Andy,
His balls were long and bandy,
We filled his arse with molten brass
For wanking in the brandy.

 

The captain’s name was Morgan,
By Christ he was a gorgon!
Ten times a day sweet tunes he’s play.
On his productive organ.

 

The captain’s daughter Mable,
They laid her on a table!
And all the crew would come and screw
As oft as they were able.

 

“Twas on a Chinese station,
We caused a great sensation.
We sunk a junk in a sea of spunk
By mutual masturbation.

 

Another cook was O’Malley,
He didn’t dilly dally.
He shot his bolt with such a jolt
He whitewashed half the galley.

[elgordo38]

4 hours ago, 55Jay said:

I was not able to visit their aircraft carrier in Sattahip for security reasons.  I had a chuckle about that one.

Security or a lose of face when you see the condition its in. Each time they open their mouth the hole just gets deeper. Maintenance is not their strong suit. 

Edited April 27, 2017 by elgordo38

[55Jay]

4 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

Security or a lose of face when you see the condition its in. Each time they open their mouth the hole just gets deeper. Maintenance is not their strong suit. 

Can still tour US Navy ships on weekends in San Diego.  They pull one up to Broadway pier for the public/tourists to come have a look.  Did it a few times when I was a teenager.

Edited April 27, 2017 by 55Jay

[elgordo38]

26 minutes ago, 55Jay said:

Can still tour US Navy ships on weekends in San Diego.  They pull one up to Broadway pier for the public/tourists to come have a look.  Did it a few times when I was a teenager.

Whenever I hear reminders of when I was a teenager a grin breaks out. Those were the days my friend I thought they would never end. STOP your getting to sentimental. 

[55Jay]

6 hours ago, elgordo38 said:

Whenever I hear reminders of when I was a teenager a grin breaks out. Those were the days my friend I thought they would never end. STOP your getting to sentimental. 

Indeed.  My teenage days are closer than yours are to you, but it seems a million miles away, like yesterday.  Funny thing is after all those ship tours I did on Broadway street pier in San Diego, I did wind up in the US Navy, for 20 odd years.  My first ship at 18 years old was already an old girl, commissioned in 1945.  She's now a museum in San Diego, 1 pier over from Broadway pier where I used to tour Navy ships as a teenager.  Funny old world.... 

[anotheruser]

If the water is that shallow they should make a campaign to make the water even murkier than it has become in the past ten years.