dick dasterdly Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 26 minutes ago, AlexRich said: The sticking point is freedom of movement - and the mood music is changing. I doubt it. Why on earth would the poor or average Brit. be interested in freedom of movement, bearing in mind they've seen how the influx of EU workers from poorer countries have helped towards keeping their wages static for many years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexRich Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said: I doubt it. Why on earth would the poor or average Brit. be interested in freedom of movement, bearing in mind they've seen how the influx of EU workers from poorer countries have helped towards keeping their wages static for many years? Young people don't share your concerns about foreigners and freedom of movement. Bear in mind that many people enter the UK from outside the EU, so it is not just a "freedom of movement" issue. That flow of non-EU foreigners can be controlled with our own laws, nothing to do with the EU. I am personally not that concerned by it because the majority who come here are working and paying taxes that will help to reduce the country's debt load and provide the working population to fund the many challenges ahead - the NHS and social care issues as well as the changing demographic of a greater proportion of old people who are living longer. It gives the UK a good chance of powering ahead economically. Strange that the people most affected by freedom of movement aren't too worried about it. And the people who make most use of the NHS and social care are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said: Quite ! Seasonal workers - not OK, the poorer segment of society used to fill that role very well, and they appreciated the much-needed income. Allowing every EU economic migrant into wealthier countries is "in accordance with EU rules" - unless I've missed a fundamental point. The poor won't do farm labouring on a seasonal basis. Do you know any farmers? You missed the point. Various barriers are possible including minimum earnings. May lost control of our borders by losing so many Border Force people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewsterbudgen Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Alex, I don't really want to get bogged down discussing any topic with you, you never move an inch, I'm still having bad dreams and I have been advised to have councilling after our last debate on expats vs immigrants. I agree with you that the election might have been to strengthen Mrs Mays hand on Brexit, but what I am saying that in my opinion is what the electorate voted for, they were more focused on JCs give everyone everything manifesto and compared to Mays manic manifesto, it was a no contest especially among the young. They have never lived through a Lefty Labour government. So to put things into perspective, the conservatives had a stinker of a campaign, whilst Labour had a very good campaign, and they still lost, so really it does not say a lot for Labour. So hopefully the torys will get their act together and by the next election Corbyns Cowboys will fade into obscurity. If brexit ends up being a soft brexit, this is not what the majority of the UK want, we might as well have stayed in the EU, our position will be the same as not leaving.I don't remember being given a choice of hard or soft Brexit in the referendum. You've just made the case for a 2nd referendum, so that the people can decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 minute ago, brewsterbudgen said: I don't remember being given a choice of hard or soft Brexit in the referendum. You've just made the case for a 2nd referendum, so that the people can decide. Then when we've had that it could be argued we need another, as a free tub of lard wasn't mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewsterbudgen Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Then when we've had that it could be argued we need another, as a free tub of lard wasn't mentioned.I'd vote for that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yardrunner Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 25 minutes ago, vogie said: Then when we've had that it could be argued we need another, as a free tub of lard wasn't mentioned. and that wins the prize for the silliest post of the month Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, yardrunner said: and that wins the prize for the silliest post of the month Gone over your head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 4 hours ago, Grouse said: I don't think the 18.5k level is an issue. They've recently published U.K. Salaries and if you are not making 18.5k how can you support a wife? The immigration issues are our own fault. An EU migrant should have a job with a salary above a certain level or be a seasonal working. May slashed border force manpower so we don't keep track. The Thais do a better job! how can you support a wife? She should be working. All that "men support the little woman at home" stuff is dead and buried. The only requirement should be that he has enough money to support her if she doesn't find a job for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 50 minutes ago, Grouse said: The poor won't do farm labouring on a seasonal basis. Do you know any farmers? You missed the point. Various barriers are possible including minimum earnings. May lost control of our borders by losing so many Border Force people. I know farmers. Seasonal workers pick fruit, and where I'm from, they stop paying the dole while the picking season is on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 hour ago, AlexRich said: Young people don't share your concerns about foreigners and freedom of movement. Bear in mind that many people enter the UK from outside the EU, so it is not just a "freedom of movement" issue. That flow of non-EU foreigners can be controlled with our own laws, nothing to do with the EU. I am personally not that concerned by it because the majority who come here are working and paying taxes that will help to reduce the country's debt load and provide the working population to fund the many challenges ahead - the NHS and social care issues as well as the changing demographic of a greater proportion of old people who are living longer. It gives the UK a good chance of powering ahead economically. Strange that the people most affected by freedom of movement aren't too worried about it. And the people who make most use of the NHS and social care are? If there were less imported workers, and they had the balls to cut the dole for the able bodied, there would be less of those 3 generations of unemployed in one house farces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nontabury Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 25 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: how can you support a wife? She should be working. All that "men support the little woman at home" stuff is dead and buried. The only requirement should be that he has enough money to support her if she doesn't find a job for a while. Perhaps that's the reason there are so many latch-key children. Do you honestly think they are of benefit to society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 27 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: If there were less imported workers, and they had the balls to cut the dole for the able bodied, there would be less of those 3 generations of unemployed in one house farces. Or knock down that one house. Guaranteed to get them working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheungWan Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, nontabury said: Perhaps that's the reason there are so many latch-key children. Do you honestly think they are of benefit to society. No problem. Plenty of homely LGBT couples ready and willing to adopt them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nontabury Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, SheungWan said: No problem. Plenty of homely LGBT couples ready and willing to adopt them. This thread is not about the British Ambassador to Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citybiker Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 I don't remember being given a choice of hard or soft Brexit in the referendum. You've just made the case for a 2nd referendum, so that the people can decide.IIRC the choice was a simple, remain an EU member or not.The people have already decided, however I strongly believe and understand that the CBI will want the Government to focus on a business friendly Brexit, the DUP will ensure and have continually clearly stated the best interested of the UK is the primary aim.Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orac Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Interesting stat just come out regarding who bumped up Labour vote. "According to @LordAshcroft poll 35-44s voted LAB 50%-CON 30%. That’s not kids, thats mortgages, car-owning, kids at school, mid-career." Edit - source found here http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2017/06/result-happen-post-vote-survey/#more-15330 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwasaki Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 5 hours ago, dick dasterdly said: There's no doubt that Boris is intelligent, but similarly that he's only concerned with his own, personal interests. it would have made sense for him to 'run' for the PM post when Cameron resigned (bearing in mind he was one of the main leave campaigners) - but instead he suddenly became coy..... He recognised this as a 'poisoned chalice', bearing in mind the majority of tory MPs supported remain. Agree that is why l think he is clever for want of better words, l wouldn't want the job unless l could be a Dictator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, Orac said: Interesting stat just come out regarding who bumped up Labour vote. "According to @LordAshcroft poll 35-44s voted LAB 50%-CON 30%. That’s not kids, thats mortgages, car-owning, kids at school, mid-career." Edit - source found here http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2017/06/result-happen-post-vote-survey/#more-15330 18 - 24 year olds 67% voted Labour, thats pretty high is it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orac Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 18 - 24 year olds 67% voted Labour, thats pretty high is it not?Yes, but it is a smaller grouping and a not unexpected result for the age group.I would be very surprised if the Conservative bean counters aren't shocked at how poorly they did in that older segment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexRich Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: If there were less imported workers, and they had the balls to cut the dole for the able bodied, there would be less of those 3 generations of unemployed in one house farces. They are on benefits because they want to be ... and the reason that they wanted rid of immigrants is not because of jobs, it was because they didn't like them competing for free stuff ... the 16 year old pregnant mum can't get her council flat for bloody asylum seekers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Orac said: Yes, but it is a smaller grouping and a not unexpected result for the age group. I would be very surprised if the Conservative bean counters aren't shocked at how poorly they did in that older segment. Another fact for you, if the election was today, Labour would win. Todays polls Labour 45% Tories 39%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJP Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Another fact for you, if the election was today, Labour would win. Todays polls Labour 45% Tories 39%. A Marxist chancellor would definitely be good for a giggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, MJP said: A Marxist chancellor would definitely be good for a giggle. It's quite frightening how a bunch of misfits can be so popular, the Marxist Chancellor also wants to honour IRA bombers, the country is nakt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexRich Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, vogie said: It's quite frightening how a bunch of misfits can be so popular, the Marxist Chancellor also wants to honour IRA bombers, the country is nakt. Thats what happens when you put your support behind lunatics like UKIP and right wing EU sceptic Tories ... unintended consequences. This country works reasonably well from the centre ground, but when you get extreme right or extreme left you can be sure it will end badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evadgib Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 (edited) PR, Mandatory participation as per the Aussies and the ability to vote electronically from home regardless of geographic location must surely be the way ahead after this fiasco...? Edited June 12, 2017 by evadgib Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJP Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 It's quite frightening how a bunch of misfits can be so popular, the Marxist Chancellor also wants to honour IRA bombers, the country is nakt.I can't take Blighty in the least bit seriously anymore. I would suggest the markets feel the same.More decline until the next election when no doubt Corbyn will become PM, McDonnell chancellor, Thornberry foreign secretary and ABBOTT home secretary!Make sure you have no dependence or financial connection to the UK, sit back and laugh your nads off as the "tractor production report follows the shipping forecast." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brewsterbudgen Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 It's quite frightening how a bunch of misfits can be so popular, the Marxist Chancellor also wants to honour IRA bombers, the country is nakt.Most people these days are no longer influenced by the lies and distortion of the tabloid press. They went to town on the "terrorists' friend" right up to election day. To very little effect. And now May is cosying up to an extreme right party with a paramilitary arm. Oh, the irony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evadgib Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said: Most people these days are no longer influenced by the lies and distortion of the tabloid press. They went to town on the "terrorists' friend" right up to election day. To very little effect. And now May is cosying up to an extreme right party with a paramilitary arm. Oh, the irony. COR-Blimey was even asked by Andrew Marr to ask Adams & Co to take their seats in Westminster in order to cancel out DUP's support for the Tories yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vogie Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said: Most people these days are no longer influenced by the lies and distortion of the tabloid press. They went to town on the "terrorists' friend" right up to election day. To very little effect. And now May is cosying up to an extreme right party with a paramilitary arm. Oh, the irony. Look on the bright side, at least they were loyalists, we can all think of a worse coalition. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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