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U.S. Navy destroyer, Philippines merchant vessel collide off Japan


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Posted

 

Another navy report states that key position on the Fitz had not been filled since two years before the crash.

 

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/01/24/report-lack-of-a-senior-quartermaster-contributed-to-fitz-disaster/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NT 1-24-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

Navy says that this is relevant re the situation leading to the crash.

 

  • 1 month later...
Posted (edited)

 

This is quite an interesting read;

 

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/02/28/heres-what-big-navy-says-its-doing-to-fix-the-surface-fleet/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Navy Times 2-28-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

The US Navy explains measures that have been taken and that will be taken in order to

avoid similar mishaps in the future.

 

They have experienced three crashes with Arleigh Burke destroyers so far,

several years ago in the strait of Hormuz (Gulf of Persia/Arab Sea), no fatalities

a couple of years ago the crashes just off the Japanese coast and off Singapore, several fatalities.

 

 

Edited by melvinmelvin
typo
Posted

A very long article on this incident, fascinating read...graphics are amazing.

 

This quote from the article pretty much sums things up:

 

"Helmsman-in-training Simona Nelson had taken the wheel of a destroyer at sea for the first time in her life 25 minutes earlier. Nelson froze, unsure of how to respond."

 

 

FIGHT THE SHIP


Death and valor on a warship doomed by its own Navy.

 

https://features.propublica.org/navy-accidents/uss-fitzgerald-destroyer-crash-crystal/

  • Thanks 1
Posted
29 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

A very long article on this incident, fascinating read...graphics are amazing.

 

This quote from the article pretty much sums things up:

 

"Helmsman-in-training Simona Nelson had taken the wheel of a destroyer at sea for the first time in her life 25 minutes earlier. Nelson froze, unsure of how to respond."

 

 

FIGHT THE SHIP


Death and valor on a warship doomed by its own Navy.

 

https://features.propublica.org/navy-accidents/uss-fitzgerald-destroyer-crash-crystal/

 

a good read, indeed

 

  • Like 2
Posted
3 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

A very long article on this incident, fascinating read...graphics are amazing.

This quote from the article pretty much sums things up:

"Helmsman-in-training Simona Nelson had taken the wheel of a destroyer at sea for the first time in her life 25 minutes earlier. Nelson froze, unsure of how to respond."

FIGHT THE SHIP

Death and valor on a warship doomed by its own Navy.

https://features.propublica.org/navy-accidents/uss-fitzgerald-destroyer-crash-crystal/

Yes, thanks for posting this, saved it to my bookmarks library.  

 

A whole lot of things went wrong here, but the origins trace back to the Navy's push for these "Smart Ships".  

https://fcw.com/articles/1997/10/05/navys-smart-ship-passes-tests.aspx

 

The Bean Counters were cheer leading from the sidelines in order to reduce active duty manpower, which also reduced downstream financial demands (retirees and their families with life-long medical and other benefits).  I remember the mantra, we should strive to emulate the private/corporate sector.  Leaner and more efficient.

 

Fair enough.  When it comes to routine navigation, massive civilian cargo ships traverse the world with a virtual skeleton crew and no topside watches (for routine steaming), compared to a manpower intensive Navy ship, or even its mostly civilian staffed supply ships (Military Sealift Command).  

 

So one of the easy cuts made on these new "Smart Ships" was old school topside watches. Not to say they are the end all be all.  They aren't.  They can and did fail, just as tech can, and does.  Despite my first (old) ship having radar and other sensors and 24 hour topside watches at sea, she still got T-Boned (at night) by a Panamanian-flagged cargo ship near the Philippines in 1980.

 

The tragic irony here is despite the tech on Smart Ship Fitzgerald, which wasn't functioning properly or consistently..... and the Skipper damn well knew and didn't compensate for.......  it was the LT OOD's Mark 1 Mod 0 human eye balls that saw the Crystal approaching.   You can what if this to death but seems reasonable to say had there been underway topside watches posted, and they were awake and paying attention, I have no doubt they would have made multiple reports to the bridge and CIC via sound powered phone, which would have triggered both bridge and CIC watch teams into realizing their situational awareness was hosed, and action would have been taken much earlier.

Posted

Even with the desire to save manpower,

as far as I understand it, the minimum watch is

navigator + assistant navigator + helmsman + 2 lookouts

should suffice for all situations

 

as a contrast, my experience from commercial shipping is

navigator alone daytime, from sunset to sunrise navigator + lookout

(daytime in very heavy rain, haze or fog, navigator + lookout)

 

(exception, coastal express in Norway, passenger ships running up and down the coast.

 always two navigators in the wheelhouse, shitty conditions also helmsman and lookout

 helmsman needed in certain passages when conditions are crappy, navigators don't

 take their eyes off the radar screens even for a split second, hence - can't operate the autopilot

 but can bark to the helmsman)

 

The message I get from the looooong post above is,

lack of focus on seamanship, lack of training in everyday navigation and ordinary ship handling,

lack of understanding of the importance of thinking safety

 

Posted

On the plus side, at least the crew were able to communicate intra-ship via GMail.

 

In the midst of the frenzied training and repairs, the ship’s critical email system collapsed. Neither classified nor unclassified material could be sent. Officers were forced to set up Gmail addresses to continue working.

 

 

  • Haha 1
Posted

Another interesting read.

 

Court cases against Fitzgerald officers may go astray.

Lawyers claim, again, that high level officers inappropriately interfer with the matters

in such a way that a fair trial can not be  offered.

 

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/03/01/mystery-navy-tweeter-unmasked-in-court-filings-alleging-unlawful-command-influence/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NT 3-1-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

Posted

 

https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/03/05/say-it-aint-so-cno-more-unlawful-command-influence-claims-dog-fitz-cases/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NT 3-5-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

 

Navy lawyers (defence) complaining again.

High level navy officers dish out blame for destroyer crash before court case has run to conclusion.

 

 

  • 1 month later...
Posted

 

Will this be the end of legal proceedings in the wake of the Fitzgerald crash?

 

an interesting read   https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/04/11/in-the-aftermath-of-the-fitzgerald-collision-months-of-legal-fury-end-in-a-whimper/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NT 4-12-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

long since I have heard anything about the destroyer crash off Singapore

 

also, as far as I have seen the Accident investigator's reports have not been published yet 

  • 4 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...
  • 3 weeks later...
Posted

 

Some news re the repairs of the two destroyers,

the one that crashed off the coast of Japan and the one that crashed near Singapore

 

https://www.defensenews.com/naval/2019/07/17/a-new-issue-is-delaying-the-destroyer-john-s-mccains-return-to-the-fleet/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Navy DNR 07-17-19&utm_term=Editorial - Navy - Daily News Roundup

 

(about time accident investigation reports are released, me thinks)

 

  • 1 month later...
Posted

there do seem to be a few US ships hitting things recently i first thought hacking but then they arrested that guy for incompetance. . however the captain cant be on his bridge 24x7 maybe its a training issue for navigation or bridge crew .. im bemused.. in the uk its normally just ship commanders rogering sexy women on board or using the government cars illegally .. thats the way we do it. Not hitting other ships at sea .. still i guess we invented ship travel along with those pesky spanish

Posted
2 hours ago, jaffas21 said:

there do seem to be a few US ships hitting things recently i first thought hacking but then they arrested that guy for incompetance. . however the captain cant be on his bridge 24x7 maybe its a training issue for navigation or bridge crew .. im bemused.. in the uk its normally just ship commanders rogering sexy women on board or using the government cars illegally .. thats the way we do it. Not hitting other ships at sea .. still i guess we invented ship travel along with those pesky spanish

Does the UK even have a blue water navy?  I’m sure if they had 400+ ships and a high op tempo like the US navy they’d be making headlines good or bad. 

Posted
4 hours ago, nauseus said:

Blimey - you guys still on this one?

still waiting for the US Navy and the Japanese board to come up with their accident reports

 

 

  • Thanks 1
Posted
9 hours ago, We2Low said:

Does the UK even have a blue water navy?  I’m sure if they had 400+ ships and a high op tempo like the US navy they’d be making headlines good or bad. 

News says they got 3 in the Persian Gulf.

Posted
On 8/25/2019 at 12:29 PM, nauseus said:

Blimey - you guys still on this one?

 

btw,

come to think of it, The Brexit Referendum was in June 2016, this crash in June 2017,

so the US and Japanese authorities still have time to spend before they join imperial syrup.

 

 

 

 

  • 4 weeks later...
Posted
8 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

I thought accident happened in the Singapore Strait, east of the Malacca Strait. 

 

Unless you've had the Conn there at night with heavy rain, <deleted>ty visibility, your radar lit up like a Christmas tree with contacts that are anchored, fishing and in the middle of all that <deleted> you and your lookout misses this one guy crossing to port, you call out hard right, the Chief Mate who's supposed to be helping me missed seeing that ship as well. He was a waste of air he was. It's these near misses that makes you realize you can never get too comfortable, even with nothing on the radar you have to be vigilant

 

Good to see they're not destroying the Captain to make themselves feel better.

  • Like 2
Posted
On 6/17/2017 at 8:31 AM, quadperfect said:

Ais ,radar ,watch  command .

As a american i am truly embarrassed.

This should never happen ever. Remember the uss cole incident.

 

The Cole was anchored.  I fail to see the similarity.

Posted
1 hour ago, EVENKEEL said:

I thought accident happened in the Singapore Strait, east of the Malacca Strait. 

 

Unless you've had the Conn there at night with heavy rain, <deleted>ty visibility, your radar lit up like a Christmas tree with contacts that are anchored, fishing and in the middle of all that <deleted> you and your lookout misses this one guy crossing to port, you call out hard right, the Chief Mate who's supposed to be helping me missed seeing that ship as well. He was a waste of air he was. It's these near misses that makes you realize you can never get too comfortable, even with nothing on the radar you have to be vigilant

 

Good to see they're not destroying the Captain to make themselves feel better.

 

well yes,

I refer to the strait as off Singapore, maybe wrongly - dunno

 

anyway, that piece of water is more often than not extremely busy

with vessels moving around disorderly in all sorts of directions

 

I quite enjoy fish, can do without fishing vessels though

 

  • 1 month later...

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