Red shirts reconciled to grim future

[Pridilives]

4 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

there's a lot of people that don't support the royal family in the UK or the whole system there. personally, i'm a royalist. was brought up in the Army. it's how you are brought up that generally makes your opinions. how is that relevant to here? think about it

Cannot comment

[anon789561]

1 minute ago, Pridilives said:

Have to vote where house book is. Mean come from north have to go bac vote north. If vote where live huge landslide for red 

but that doesn't mean there's not plenty of people in bkk that don't have houses in their names in bkk

[Pridilives]

21 minutes ago, than said:

 

Some contemporary thinkers, such as Cornelius Castoriadis or Jacques Rancière, consider that representative democracies are only pseudo-democratic, in which the people are effectively dispossessed of effective political power, which in their eyes is held by a small minority of individuals, call the Oligarchy, constituted by politicians (representatives), experts or the economic elite.

There is only one country that is really close to democracy, it is Switzerland.

All important decisions are made to citizens who accept or reject them. Contrary to the referedum which is only advisory (politicians may not accept the decision of the people, the case of France in 2005 on the referendum of the European construction reject by the French but after revised by the European authorities, french politics enforces the treaty).
The result of a vote is binding, since the authorities are obliged to apply the result of the vote regardless of the recommendations they may have made.

 

Do the contemporary thinkers think no democracy is better than pseudo democracy?

[anon789561]

in a country that is in the stage of transition that Thailand is. I think it needs control. do they need censorship. I think that we both know they do for now. no one is actually starving this place of democracy I think. they are just slowing down the transition so it doesn't get out of control. nothing wrong with that. it'll be all rosey again in a couple of years ; ) at least I hope haha

[Eric Loh]

7 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

in a country that is in the stage of transition that Thailand is. I think it needs control. do they need censorship. I think that we both know they do for now. no one is actually starving this place of democracy I think. they are just slowing down the transition so it doesn't get out of control. nothing wrong with that. it'll be all rosey again in a couple of years ; ) at least I hope haha

I too hope the same for Thailand. Just that 18 coups since 1932 and each time the military said the same thing about righting the country from their perceived imperfection; the pattern of not relinquishing power becomes overpowering and the future looks set to repeat again and it wouldn't be due to Thaksin.

[anon789561]

3 minutes ago, Pridilives said:

This start 1932. How long you give for transition. At what stage you start consider maybe have some obstruct

and you know exactly what that reason was I believe

[Pridilives]

Just now, Happy enough said:

nothing to do with that at all. like I said, i'm sure you know why.

I agree. Don't expect robblok to like this post same he did last one though. For some the obvious is just too elusive. The question is are they try to smooth transition or stop transition. I think here where we different. I believe they try stop and this mean pressure gonna build until blow and when blow gonna be bad for yellow and Thailand. Cannot hold back tide of history especially when lose ace card.

[metisdead]

Troll posts and replies have been removed. 

[anon789561]

Just now, Pridilives said:

I agree. Don't expect robblok to like this post same he did last one though. For some the obvious is just too elusive. The question is are they try to smooth transition or stop transition. I think here where we different. I believe they try stop and this mean pressure gonna build until blow and when blow gonna be bad for yellow and Thailand. Cannot hold back tide of history especially when lose ace card.

it will be fine. it will all calm down and back to business in a year or 2

[Pridilives]

1 minute ago, Happy enough said:

it will be fine. it will all calm down and back to business in a year or 2

We'll see. Foreign investment figure will be thing to watch. Crash under junta because every investor worry. Let's see confidence come back in a year or 2

[anon789561]

Just now, Pridilives said:

We'll see. Foreign investment figure will be thing to watch. Crash under junta because every investor worry. Let's see confidence come back in a year or 2

well its hardly left has it. all I can hear around me is building and commerce. let it carry on. let the junta keep things in control for now, like anyone has a choice 555. things will be fine in a year or 2. i'd imagine. the reds can go back to election at a later date. now is not the time.

[heybruce]

21 hours ago, InMyShadow said:

violent military? who did they kill?

 

21 hours ago, Pridilives said:

This link for 2010

https://www.hrw.org/report/2011/05/03/descent-chaos/thailands-2010-red-shirt-protests-and-government-crackdown

 

want more link for 1992 or 1976?

 

21 hours ago, InMyShadow said:

pffft thats nothing compared to other military coups on the world stage.

 

a job well done and zero violence in the years later.

 

softest coup in history!!!

The military has gotten very good at staging coups with a lot of repression and not too much killing.  It's had a lot of practice.  Does that make coups ok?

[heybruce]

19 hours ago, InMyShadow said:

Try to think back to when you participated in your home countries election. Wen your party lost did you and tens of thousands march into the capitol city paralyzing it and then shut down the airport followed by the bombing and destruction of a major shopping mall and many innocents killed.

...yep didn't think so .

for thais democracy works great right up until there side loses and then its just another loss of face that must be rectified at any cost.

 

The junta took over "softly" eg tanks didn't run over a hundred protesters.

 

Hope they stay in power at least 10 years. The Thais got the government they deserved :-))

You are ignoring the fact that the side that consistently loses elections is the side that is supported by the military and consistently overthrows democratic government. 

 

What is preventing democracy in Thailand is the yellow minority that will not accept elections and elected government, and an above the law military that feels free to stage coups whenever it suits them.  People who support military rule don't help either.

[YetAnother]

On 7/23/2017 at 5:23 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

Until Thailand manages to allow those voices, concentrated in the north and north east, to have a legitimate opportunity to participate,

Precisely what the real powers here Do Not Want

[anon789561]

1 minute ago, heybruce said:

You are ignoring the fact that the side that consistently loses elections is the side that is supported by the military and consistently overthrows democratic government. 

 

What is preventing democracy in Thailand is the yellow minority that will not accept elections and elected government, and an above the law military that feels free to stage coups whenever it suits them.  People who support military rule don't help either.

i wish there was a military take over in the UK to stop brexit. so we don't have those uneducated masses ruining a good thing. I don't believe that. just thought i'd put it out there

[heybruce]

55 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

in a country that is in the stage of transition that Thailand is. I think it needs control. do they need censorship. I think that we both know they do for now. no one is actually starving this place of democracy I think. they are just slowing down the transition so it doesn't get out of control. nothing wrong with that. it'll be all rosey again in a couple of years ; ) at least I hope haha

"no one is actually starving this place of democracy".  Are you serious, or is that a joke?

29 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

it will be fine. it will all calm down and back to business in a year or 2

No it won't:

 

" The junta that seized power in Thailand three years ago promises an election next year. Even in the unlikely event that it is free and fair, the constitution—which the army wrote and the new king signed in May—creates a junta-led Senate, imposes the generals’ 20-year plan on the country and provides ample grounds to remove any elected leader whom the army finds lacking. All this is designed to prevent voters from electing the “wrong” leaders, in the army’s view, as they have done at every opportunity over the past 15 years. " https://www.economist.com/news/asia/21725168-democracy-losing-ground-even-region-grows-richer-south-east-asias-future-looks-prosperous  

 

The military has rammed through a constitution that will leave it in control for twenty years, if not longer.  There will be nothing more than a facade of democracy in Thailand while the military runs things.

Edited July 24, 2017 by heybruce

[Pridilives]

23 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

well its hardly left has it. all I can hear around me is building and commerce. let it carry on. let the junta keep things in control for now, like anyone has a choice 555. things will be fine in a year or 2. i'd imagine. the reds can go back to election at a later date. now is not the time.

Yes, it has left. It is the main reason Thai reserves have gone from 400 billion under yingluck to about 70 billion under junta.

turns out coups cost more than rice schemes.

 

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/foreign-investment-plummets-78-in-junta-ruled-thailand

Edited July 24, 2017 by Pridilives

[kannot]

On 7/23/2017 at 5:52 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Perhaps the red shirts organization would have a bit more credibility if they weren't led, and owe their unquestioning allegiance to, a fugitive from the law and a corruption sentence who used to be, and perhaps still is, one of the richest men (formerly) in Thailand. One who illegally used his former position of power to substantially increase his personal wealth and of those in his inner circle -- all the while his followers continued to be scrapping for table scraps.

 

theyd  lose  most of their sheep if they did  that though , all those  paid headmen in Issan would run around like headless chickens, both sides equally corrupt and crap

[Pridilives]

10 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

i wish there was a military take over in the UK to stop brexit. so we don't have those uneducated masses ruining a good thing. I don't believe that. just thought i'd put it out there

Uneducated masses? Why? Because they disagree with you? These masses are the results of decades of government policy. If they are unhappy, perhaps things need changing

Edited July 24, 2017 by Pridilives

[anon789561]

3 minutes ago, Pridilives said:

Yes, it has left. It is the main reason Thai reserves have gone from 400 billion under yingluck to about 70 billion under junta.

turns out coups cost more than rice schemes.

 

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se-asia/foreign-investment-plummets-78-in-junta-ruled-thailand

absolutely they cost more. but they stop people taking to the streets causing riots don't they? the money is well spent some might say

[Pridilives]

2 minutes ago, Happy enough said:

absolutely they cost more. but they stop people taking to the streets causing riots don't they? the money is well spent some might say

No. They cause people to go out into the streets in the hope have creating a coup. If those conducting coups were tried and punish for treason. Believe me. There be no more street riots. Your veneer is quickly fading and you being reveal. 

[anon789561]

Just now, Pridilives said:

Uneducated masses? Why? Because they disagree with you?

not me. just putting it up for discussion. ok. so heres a thought. let those that are educated run the country not those that haven't got a clue. did yingluck have a clue? an education sure but some might say not fit to run a country. even you agree with that?? surely you know that thaksins chosen kin was not fit to run a country. and neither will the next one be. i'm not baiting. just fishing for thoughts

[anon789561]

1 minute ago, Pridilives said:

No. They cause people to go out into the streets in the hope have creating a coup. If those conducting coups were tried and punish for treason. Believe me. There be no more street riots. Your veneer is quickly fading and you being reveal. 

how could they be tried and convicted of treason. I don't have a veneer and most of what I post isn't my personal opinion. it's a way of me learning from others. i can reveal now, I've nothing to hide.  i'm a royalist and I support the junta at this time. democracy can come at a later date when the country is ready for it.

[LannaGuy]

Just now, Happy enough said:

i didn't finish uni. I don't consider myself educated. yingluck did not do a good job. lets not make this a you versus I thing. the beautiful thing is there can be a difference in opinion. i'll have a coffee with you. will accept what you say. but I doubt very much you'll change my chain of thoughts on this matter. I didn't read yellow shirts called her dumb. I quite like her but I can see she's not that sharp

You are wrong. She might not be Einstein but I consider her brighter than Prayut.

[robblok]

1 minute ago, LannaGuy said:

You are wrong. She might not be Einstein but I consider her brighter than Prayut.

Brighter then Prayut.. not sure about that. Sure she is not an Einstein.

 

But she is easier on the eyes then Prayut and far smarter in handling the press. 

[anon789561]

Just now, LannaGuy said:

You are wrong. She might not be Einstein but I consider her brighter than Prayut.

you can't say wrong. you may consider and have an opinion but for you to call someone else wrong. well. that's undemocratic 555

[LannaGuy]

Just now, Happy enough said:

I don't decide anything. i'm not involved. democracy will be delivered soon enough. give it time

but it wont... please understand they are going to come up with a 'thai style democracy' (they will claim) which is nothing of the sort. It will all be veneer they are setting it up... surely you can observe that?

[LannaGuy]

Just now, Happy enough said:

you can't say wrong. you may consider and have an opinion but for you to call someone else wrong. well. that's undemocratic 555

She has an American education and degree and was Thailand's first woman PM. For you to say she's not that sharp is wrong.

'

[anon789561]

Just now, LannaGuy said:

She has an American education and degree and was Thailand's first woman PM. For you to say she's not that sharp is wrong.

'

dopey as hell. perhaps i'm wrong. so an American education makes you sharp now. let's get into that 5555

[anon789561]

Just now, Happy enough said:

dopey as hell. perhaps i'm wrong. so an American education makes you sharp now. let's get into that 5555

 

2 minutes ago, LannaGuy said:

She has an American education and degree and was Thailand's first woman PM. For you to say she's not that sharp is wrong.

'

her brother put her in that position. hardly born of merit was it. guys not even allowed in the country!