Health insurance vs non o visa

[webfact]

Trump administration sends conflicting signals on Russia sanctions

By Yeganeh Torbati

 

U.S. Vice President Mike Pence (L) arrives with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson (R) to attend a joint press conference held by U.S. President Donald Trump and Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos at the White House in Washington, U.S., May 18, 2017. REUTERS/Yuri Gripas

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump grudgingly accepted new congressional sanctions on Russia, the top U.S. diplomat said on Tuesday, remarks in contrast with those of Vice President Mike Pence, who said the bill showed Trump and Congress speaking "with a unified voice."

 

The U.S. Congress voted last week by overwhelming margins for sanctions to punish the Russian government over interference in the 2016 presidential election, annexation of Crimea and other perceived violations of international norms.

 

U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson told reporters that he and Trump did not believe the new sanctions would "be helpful to our efforts" on diplomacy with Russia.

 

Trump has been clear that he wants to improve relations with Russia, a desire that has been hamstrung by findings of U.S. intelligence agencies that Russia interfered to help the Republican against Democrat Hillary Clinton. U.S. congressional panels and a special counsel are investigating. Moscow denies any meddling and Trump denies any collusion by his campaign.

 

Tillerson, who did business in Russia when he was chief executive of Exxon Mobil, has said repeatedly that the world's two major nuclear powers cannot have such a bad relationship.

 

"The action by the Congress to put these sanctions in place and the way they did, neither the President nor I were very happy about that," Tillerson said. "We were clear that we didn't think it was going to be helpful to our efforts, but that's the decision they made, they made it in a very overwhelming way. I think the president accepts that."

 

Tillerson stopped short of saying definitively that Trump would sign the sanctions, saying only that "all indications are he will sign that bill."

 

Vice President Mike Pence, at a press conference in Georgia with Prime Minister Giorgi Kvirikashvili, said unequivocally that "President Trump will sign the Russia sanctions bill soon."

 

Pence acknowledged that the administration objected to earlier versions of the sanctions bill because it did not grant enough flexibility to the administration, but said it "improved significantly" in later versions.

 

"And let me say that in signing the sanction, our President and our Congress are speaking with a unified voice," Pence said.

 

White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said on Tuesday the sanctions bill was under review and would be signed.

 

"There's nothing holding him back," Sanders said at a news briefing. Trump has until Aug. 9 to sign the bill, or veto it, or it will automatically become law.

 

In retaliation for the sanctions, Russian President Vladimir Putin said on Sunday that the U.S. diplomatic mission in Russia must reduce its staff by 755 people. Russia is also seizing two properties near Moscow used by American diplomats.

 

Tillerson said Putin probably believes his response was a symmetrical action to Washington seizing two Russian properties in the United States and expelling 35 diplomats last December.

 

"Of course it makes our lives more difficult," he said.

 

Tillerson said he and Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov would meet in Manila on the margins of next weekend's meetings of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations.

 

(Reporting by Yeganeh Torbati; additional reporting by Ayesha Rascoe and Patricia Zengerle; editing by Grant McCool)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-08-02

[darksidedog]

While reigning in Donald was a good idea, I am not convinced that the new sanctions on Russia were. The wholly predictable retaliation sees the US Embassy losing many staff members in Russia and neither action is going to help matters. It strikes me that while both sides are at odds on a range of issues, neither seems interested in actually sitting down and having meaningful dialogue to address them. Instead they exchange tit for tat measures that just exacerbate bad feeling. I would rather see them resolve their differences than take meaningless actions that do little more than affect public opinion.

[craigt3365]

1 hour ago, darksidedog said:

While reigning in Donald was a good idea, I am not convinced that the new sanctions on Russia were. The wholly predictable retaliation sees the US Embassy losing many staff members in Russia and neither action is going to help matters. It strikes me that while both sides are at odds on a range of issues, neither seems interested in actually sitting down and having meaningful dialogue to address them. Instead they exchange tit for tat measures that just exacerbate bad feeling. I would rather see them resolve their differences than take meaningless actions that do little more than affect public opinion.

Understood and agreed!  But discussions have been going on for years regarding Ukraine with no success.  Even the Minsk accord is being ignored.  A great tactic is to just stall with BS talk.  At some point, it's got to stop.  Right?

[tonray]

The Embassy staff cuts will be largely Russian nationals working there, and on the whole it will likely slow the Visa process to a crawl, which is maybe the result Putin wants, to begin minimizing legal transit to America but could not actually state that as it is tantamount to breaking diplomatic relations.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, tonray said:

The Embassy staff cuts will be largely Russian nationals working there, and on the whole it will likely slow the Visa process to a crawl, which is maybe the result Putin wants, to begin minimizing legal transit to America but could not actually state that as it is tantamount to breaking diplomatic relations.

The embassy staff also assist Russian businesses with visas and other support services.  The Russian economy is already in tough shape.  This won't help, though doesn't seem Putin cares.  He needs to maintain his image...

[HarrySeaman]

22 minutes ago, Rancid said:

Well according to Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity: " Forensic studies of “Russian hacking” into Democratic National Committee computers last year reveal that on July 5, 2016, data was leaked (not hacked) by a person with physical access to DNC computers, and then doctored to incriminate Russia."...and on it goes ripping into the whole meme.

 

The Clinton/Establishment/Media neocons apparently want a new cold war and as an additional benefit it also creates problems for Trump (not that he needed more). As such there is no proof, and never has been, seems it was all doctored. But why let truth get in the way of a good witch hunt where the rule is guilty until proven innocent, the gullible and illiterate lap it up on the evening news.

 

To quote our not very esteemed leader, "FAKE NEWS!".

[Andaman Al]

2 hours ago, webfact said:

U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson told reporters that he and Trump did not believe the new sanctions would "be helpful to our efforts" on diplomacy with Russia.

Hardly surprising that is what they both think with the prospect of the little matter of the Exxon deal hanging over their drooling bank managers.

[Scott]

Troll post and replies removed.  

[dunroaming]

8 hours ago, darksidedog said:

While reigning in Donald was a good idea, I am not convinced that the new sanctions on Russia were. The wholly predictable retaliation sees the US Embassy losing many staff members in Russia and neither action is going to help matters. It strikes me that while both sides are at odds on a range of issues, neither seems interested in actually sitting down and having meaningful dialogue to address them. Instead they exchange tit for tat measures that just exacerbate bad feeling. I would rather see them resolve their differences than take meaningless actions that do little more than affect public opinion.

I agree but in reality this comes under the usual tit for tat pouting that has happened many times before.  Eventually normal service will be resumed with no long term damage being done.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, dunroaming said:

I agree but in reality this comes under the usual tit for tat pouting that has happened many times before.  Eventually normal service will be resumed with no long term damage being done.

Agree.

 

But the headline sums it up very well - 'conflicting signals'.

 

The media is trying so very hard to insist that Trump/Putin are v close - so it sends them on a 'loop' when Putin reacts against the Trump administration .

[ilostmypassword]

2 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Agree.

 

But the headline sums it up very well - 'conflicting signals'.

 

The media is trying so very hard to insist that Trump/Putin are v close - so it sends them on a 'loop' when Putin reacts against the Trump administration .

Putin isn't reacting against the Trump administration. He's reacting against a bipartisan Congress which doesn't trust Trump to deal firmly with Putin.

[dick dasterdly]

7 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Putin isn't reacting against the Trump administration. He's reacting against a bipartisan Congress which doesn't trust Trump to deal firmly with Putin.

OK. So they're 'best friends with trump, and so reacting badly against Congress.

 

Its the best explanation I've read!

[ilostmypassword]

10 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

OK. So they're 'best friends with trump, and so reacting badly against Congress.

 

Its the best explanation I've read!

I can't take credit for it. It's nearly universally agreed upon. Except for a few outliers posting in thaivisa.com.

[stevenl]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

 

"And let me say that in signing the sanction, our President and our Congress are speaking with a unified voice," Pence said.

Does he really think anybody believes this?

[craigt3365]

4 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Does he really think anybody believes this?

Sadly, some do!

[hawker9000]

19 hours ago, darksidedog said:

While reigning in Donald was a good idea, I am not convinced that the new sanctions on Russia were. The wholly predictable retaliation sees the US Embassy losing many staff members in Russia and neither action is going to help matters. It strikes me that while both sides are at odds on a range of issues, neither seems interested in actually sitting down and having meaningful dialogue to address them. Instead they exchange tit for tat measures that just exacerbate bad feeling. I would rather see them resolve their differences than take meaningless actions that do little more than affect public opinion.

And if the U.S. would just be content with Putin rebuilding the old soviet empire and re-annex all the old parts & pieces, why I'm sure there could be plenty of "meaningful" dialog which would "help matters".  No problem.

 

[tonray]

23 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

The embassy staff also assist Russian businesses with visas and other support services.  The Russian economy is already in tough shape.  This won't help, though doesn't seem Putin cares.  He needs to maintain his image...

Yes...most people don't realize how bad off Russia really is. They have land, oil, and nukes....their economy is about 1/10 of the size of the US. That's right they have an economy smaller than the states of California or New York. It's all about nukes....they are weak and without the nukes are nothing.

[craigt3365]

4 minutes ago, tonray said:

Yes...most people don't realize how bad off Russia really is. They have land, oil, and nukes....their economy is about 1/10 of the size of the US. That's right they have an economy smaller than the states of California or New York. It's all about nukes....they are weak and without the nukes are nothing.

Not true!  Without nukes, Putin would still be (possibly) the richest man in the world! LOL  While the average Russian suffers....

[Rancid]

"any hopes of improving Russian relations with the new US administration are dead… the Trump administration demonstrated complete impotence, and in the most humiliating manner transferred executive powers to Congress." Russian PM Medvedev. Hmm, seems like them Rooskies have a better understanding of the US Constitution and the Separation of Powers than most Americans.

 

Essentially these sanctions are now now locked into law and will remain SOP probably for decades.

 

In other Russiagate news respected US investigative journalist Seymour Hersh says "RussiaGate Is A CIA-Planted Lie, Revenge Against Trump". But I suppose never under estimate the lengths to which people will go to believe exactly what they want to believe.

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, Rancid said:

"any hopes of improving Russian relations with the new US administration are dead… the Trump administration demonstrated complete impotence, and in the most humiliating manner transferred executive powers to Congress." Russian PM Medvedev. Hmm, seems like them Rooskies have a better understanding of the US Constitution and the Separation of Powers than most Americans.

 

Essentially these sanctions are now now locked into law and will remain SOP probably for decades.

 

In other Russiagate news respected US investigative journalist Seymour Hersh says "RussiaGate Is A CIA-Planted Lie, Revenge Against Trump". But I suppose never under estimate the lengths to which people will go to believe exactly what they want to believe.

You're quoting (and believing) Medvedev?  Wow.  What a stretch.  How about quoting (and believing) Trump? 

 

Easy to stop the sanctions.  Leave Ukraine.  Very simple.

[craigt3365]

5 minutes ago, Rancid said:

In other Russiagate news respected US investigative journalist Seymour Hersh says "RussiaGate Is A CIA-Planted Lie, Revenge Against Trump". But I suppose never under estimate the lengths to which people will go to believe exactly what they want to believe.

No conspiracy theories.  Please. It is against forum rules.

[tonray]

I propose a swap: we'll give you all the Trumpsters and you can send us the Russian intellectuals and reformists who want Putin gone . how about it...ok..even sweeten the deal...you can have Kelly Ann too.

[Andaman Al]

Well if what Medev is saying is the true thoughts of Russia, we should have the pee pee tapes released this weekend

[selftaopath]

Yep. No wonder this..... was elected:

 

[Thakkar]

End of a bromance. 

"Collude, screwed, thank you, dude"

 

 

[Thakkar]

A former FBI agent has created a website that tracks Russian misinformation attacks in real time. Not surprisingly, some of their favorite websites include True Pundit, The Daily Caller, Zero Hedge, and of course Fox News. Presumably they deem visitors to those sites as more gullible.

 

Here is the website he has created:

 

http://dashboard.securingdemocracy.org/

 

It's a little overwhelming. So if you want to save time but want to see what the latest Russian propaganda push is about, just follow Trump on twitter. ?

[Morch]

33 minutes ago, Thakkar said:

A former FBI agent has created a website that tracks Russian misinformation attacks in real time. Not surprisingly, some of their favorite websites include True Pundit, The Daily Caller, Zero Hedge, and of course Fox News. Presumably they deem visitors to those sites as more gullible.

 

Here is the website he has created:

 

http://dashboard.securingdemocracy.org/

 

It's a little overwhelming. So if you want to save time but want to see what the latest Russian propaganda push is about, just follow Trump on twitter. ?

 

Yep, quite funny checking some of that vs. social media and other virtual hangouts. One thing it conveys is how quickly and how wide these things spread. Very cost effective. Got to wonder, though - it is said that folks are turning away from traditional media outlets to "new media", "alternative" sources. But as their vulnerability to manipulation is continued to be exposed - where will people turn to next?

 

Also, there was a similar website linked a while back - a French-German effort, more official in nature. Showed pretty much the same picture.