Biden: 'Overwhelming frustration' with Israeli govt

[webfact]

Biden: 'Overwhelming frustration' with Israeli govt
By JOSH LEDERMAN

WASHINGTON (AP) — Vice President Joe Biden acknowledged "overwhelming frustration" with Israel's government on Monday and said Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's administration has led Israel in the wrong direction, in an unusually sharp rebuke of America's closest ally in the Middle East.

Biden, in a speech to the advocacy group J Street, offered a grim outlook for peace efforts, reflecting dim hopes for progress during the remainder of the Obama administration. Although he said Israelis and Palestinians shared blame for undermining trust and shirking responsibility, he was emphatic in his critique of Netanyahu's government, suggesting his approach raised "profound questions" about how Israel could remain both Jewish and democratic.

"I firmly believe that the actions that Israel's government has taken over the past several years — the steady and systematic expansion of settlements, the legalization of outposts, land seizures — they're moving us and more importantly they're moving Israel in the wrong direction," Biden said.

He said those policies were moving Israel toward a "one-state reality" — meaning a single state for Palestinians and Israelis in which, eventually, Israeli Jews will no longer be the majority.

"That reality is dangerous," Biden added.

Biden, who met in March with both Netanyahu and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, said he came away from that trip discouraged about prospects for peace anytime soon. Still, he said the U.S. is obliged to guarantee Israel's security and to "push them as hard as we can" toward a two-state solution despite "our sometimes overwhelming frustration with the Israeli government."

"There is at the moment no political will that I observed from either Israelis or Palestinians to go forward with serious negotiations," Biden said.

The vice president's remarks to J Street, a dovish Israel advocacy group that frequently criticizes Netanyahu, came at the height of a campaign season in which candidates have been scrutinized over their adherence to traditionally stalwart U.S. support for Israel. Ahead of Tuesday's primary in New York, Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders has sparked controversy by saying the U.S. should be even-handed and mustn't always say that Netanyahu is right.

Biden also singled out Palestinian leaders, including Abbas, for declining to condemn specific acts of terrorism carried out against Israelis, in a nod to the seven-month wave of Palestinian stabbings and other attacks. He said he didn't know whether Monday's bus explosion that wounded scores in Jerusalem was a terrorist attack, but added that the U.S. condemns "misguided cowards" who resort to violence.

"No matter what legitimate disagreements the Palestinian people have with Israel, there is never justification for terrorism," Biden said. "No leader should fail to condemn as terrorists those who commit such brutalities."

Biden's tough talk about a key U.S. partner reflected diminishing patience within the White House as President Barack Obama's term nears an end, compounded by deep disagreements over Iran and a strained relationship between leaders. In recent weeks, the Obama administration has left open the possibility that it could support or at least not block a U.N. resolution laying out parameters for a future peace deal, a possibility Israel has railed against.

In another dig at Netanyahu and his Likud party, Biden singled out for praise Stav Shaffir, a young member of Israel's parliament and a Netanyahu critic from the left wing of Israeli politics.

"May your views begin to once again become the majority opinion in the Knesset," Biden said.


-- (c) Associated Press 2016-04-19

[HLover]

Biden is still around?

[Pimay1]

Biden is still around?

Unfortunately.

[MZurf]

Well said, Biden.

[Inn Between]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

Edited April 19, 2016 by Inn Between

[Steely Dan]

J'street are a Soros funded bunch of barely concealed BDS supporters. It won't be long before any Jew who still desires an independent Israel will feel obliged to vote Republican.

http://www.jstreetexposed.com/j-street-s-anti-israel-positions.html

The fact Biden spoke to Jstreet is hugely revealing of the current U.S stance.

Edited April 19, 2016 by Steely Dan

[ezzra]

Don't you worry you pretty head Mr Biden, soon enough, you and your ilk will be gone and the stage will be

ready for new person and new thinking, you and your cohorts will retire to write your memoirs how you

and your boss have failed on many levels in foreign policies, I'm sure it will be a best seller.....

[Jingthing]

J'street are a Soros funded bunch of barely concealed BDS supporters. It won't be long before any Jew who still desires an independent Israel will feel obliged to vote Republican.

http://www.jstreetexposed.com/j-street-s-anti-israel-positions.html

The fact Biden spoke to Jstreet is hugely revealing of the current U.S stance.

It's very unfortunate that support for Israel has become more of a partisan issue. For that you can largely blame Netanyahu himself. He is a very flawed leader.

But in the short term, in this upcoming election, Hillary Clinton will be the overwhelming preference of both American Jews and also Israelis (who obviously don't have a vote but are interested).

American Jews are overwhelmingly liberal and Israel policy is one of many important issues. I think the only way American Jews might turn republican over the Israel policy issue is in the case of an explicitly hostile to Israel democratic candidate. No, that wasn't Obama as most Israelis think. Ironically, if "Jewish" Sanders is nominated, he has said some very STUPID and very WRONG stuff about Israel and it's clear that he is almost there with BDS (or secretly there). Sanders won't be nominated of course but if he was he would have a problem with American Jewish voters.

Biden's statements about Netanyahu are largely true except for the prediction of a one state where Jews become the minority. That's a scare tactic narrative of the left. Israelis won't let that happen.

Israel needs to make it's own policy decisions, even when unpopular. It would not be wise for them to listen to liberal American Jews like J street too seriously. American Jews live without the existential dangers that Israelis live with.

Edited April 19, 2016 by Jingthing

[Rancid]

You wonder why US keeps invading ME countries, presumably for Israel, must have a powerful lobby, as what other country would tolerate body bags coming home to implement another countries foreign policies?

[Jingthing]

You wonder why US keeps invading ME countries, presumably for Israel, must have a powerful lobby, as what other country would tolerate body bags coming home to implement another countries foreign policies?

That's the typical odious Israel demonization narrative ... that everything bad that happens in the Middle East is because of Jewish Israel. That's a load of CRAP.

[Jingthing]

Biden is still around?

Unfortunately.

There is a tiny, tiny chance that Biden might still be president.

In the very unlikely event that Hillary Clinton does get into serious legal problems, there could be a real contested democratic convention.

The party establishment does not want Sanders. They fear, correctly, that he will be buried with "red scare" propaganda and lose the white house.

In such a scenario, Biden could still step in.

Very unlikely of course.

Edited April 19, 2016 by Jingthing

[bitcoinforever]

the Israeli's have been so marginalized since Obama they are a non event that is why vice president is there. remember Netanyahu bet big on mitt politicians are a nasty bunch who never forget so that is why they have no power in the U.S. anymore if the did U.S. would have never made a deal with Iran

[stillbornagain]

J'street are a Soros funded bunch of barely concealed BDS supporters. It won't be long before any Jew who still desires an independent Israel will feel obliged to vote Republican.

http://www.jstreetexposed.com/j-street-s-anti-israel-positions.html

The fact Biden spoke to Jstreet is hugely revealing of the current U.S stance.

That prediction has been around for a long time now. And only about 31 percent of American Jews think the US isn't supportive enough of Israel. Which roughly corresponds to the percentage of Jews who call themselves Republicans.

http://www.pewforum.org/2016/03/08/comparisons-between-jews-in-israel-and-the-u-s/

[dexterm]

Hear, hear,Joe.

I could have written his speech for him. It's exactly what I said yesterday on another thread.

Israel is painting itself into a corner and a one state solution.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/910850-just-announced-state-of-palestine-passports/#entry10650806

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/910850-just-announced-state-of-palestine-passports/page-2#entry10651814

Maybe he reads TV. Maybe we just happen to concur because it's the truth about Israel that the whole world is becoming more aware of.

Edited April 19, 2016 by dexterm

[Ulic]

Finally a western politician calling a spade a spade. Israel has zero intention of ever allowing

a two state solution.

[Jingthing]

Finally a western politician calling a spade a spade. Israel has zero intention of ever allowing

a two state solution.

It's a two way street, J or otherwise.

For that to actually happen, there needs to be good faith direct negotiations between Israel and some kind of legitimate Palestinian leadership. "Palestine" lacks that. Abbas is very unpopular and Hamas are genocidal terrorists. It's so easy to blame only one side. The truth is much more complicated.

[dexterm]

J'street are a Soros funded bunch of barely concealed BDS supporters. It won't be long before any Jew who still desires an independent Israel will feel obliged to vote Republican.

http://www.jstreetexposed.com/j-street-s-anti-israel-positions.html

The fact Biden spoke to Jstreet is hugely revealing of the current U.S stance.

It's very unfortunate that support for Israel has become more of a partisan issue. For that you can largely blame Netanyahu himself. He is a very flawed leader.

But in the short term, in this upcoming election, Hillary Clinton will be the overwhelming preference of both American Jews and also Israelis (who obviously don't have a vote but are interested).

American Jews are overwhelmingly liberal and Israel policy is one of many important issues. I think the only way American Jews might turn republican over the Israel policy issue is in the case of an explicitly hostile to Israel democratic candidate. No, that wasn't Obama as most Israelis think. Ironically, if "Jewish" Sanders is nominated, he has said some very STUPID and very WRONG stuff about Israel and it's clear that he is almost there with BDS (or secretly there). Sanders won't be nominated of course but if he was he would have a problem with American Jewish voters.

Biden's statements about Netanyahu are largely true except for the prediction of a one state where Jews become the minority. That's a scare tactic narrative of the left. Israelis won't let that happen.

Israel needs to make it's own policy decisions, even when unpopular. It would not be wise for them to listen to liberal American Jews like J street too seriously. American Jews live without the existential dangers that Israelis live with.

I am very interested to know how Israel can make a one state solution not happen. Obviously, the only way is a two state solution, but if the conditions are not acceptable to Palestinians, they will simply say no.

I said about a year ago on TV that the day will come when Israel will be begging the Palestinians to make a 2 state deal with them.

Israel cannot be a Jewish state and remain democratic. They will lose their demographic supremacy if they give Palestinians equal voting rights, just as Joe Biden outlines above.

[Thorgal]

J'street are a Soros funded bunch of barely concealed BDS supporters. It won't be long before any Jew who still desires an independent Israel will feel obliged to vote Republican.

http://www.jstreetexposed.com/j-street-s-anti-israel-positions.html

The fact Biden spoke to Jstreet is hugely revealing of the current U.S stance.

Looks like a multimedia sock puppet to me in order to attract and promote a virtual political opposition which doesn't really exist.

These sock puppets are required to 'feed' the massive real pro-Israel media.

[GeorgesAbitbol]

Biden is still around?

Unfortunately.

There is a tiny, tiny chance that Biden might still be president.

In the very unlikely event that Hillary Clinton does get into serious legal problems, there could be a real contested democratic convention.

The party establishment does not want Sanders. They fear, correctly, that he will be buried with "red scare" propaganda and lose the white house.

In such a scenario, Biden could still step in.

Very unlikely of course.

A bit off topic but I think you underestimate Sanders : the party establishment wants to win the election. The legal issue for Clinton is a problem for them

Yet the only one who "crush" the trump and even more Cruz is Sanders and it seems they will be more enclined to choose Sanders than Clinton.

I can try to find the link of this study which was quite interesting.

Edit : the link : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/h-a-goodman/5-reasons-bernie-sanders-will-win-the-presidency-in-a-landslide_b_9086180.html

Edited April 19, 2016 by GeorgesAbitbol

[Steely Dan]

There was a U.S citizen murdered by a Palestinian terrorist very close to where Biden was speaking during his recent visit to Israel. The Palestinian authority praised the 'heroic operation' as per usual and Abbas did not condemn the attack. Yet it's the Israeli government that Biden is frustrated with, what a deluded clown.

[Greenhill]

Well said, Biden.

What has he actually said?? Both sides are to blame!!!! But he's wrong, of course!!

Are the Israelis committing any terrorist attacks in the Palestinian areas?? Did the Israelis not forcibly evict their own settlers from Gaza about 10 year ago now, with nothing in return??

Are the Israelis building tunnels under Gaza in order to commit terrorist acts against Gazan civilians???

Israel always condemn terror attacks wherever they occur and the Palestinians celebrate them????

Have the Palestinians even recognized the Israeli right to a State, agreed by the UN in 1948? There charter still states that they want to push all the Israelis into the sea!!! Now, honestly, is this the way to peace??

[Greenhill]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

But no sanctions against Palestinians, of course!!!!!?? They've never committed a terrorist act, they've never sent '000's of rockets into Israel and they've always hankered after peace of course???!!! But you're not biased, of course?????

[Jingthing]

Yes, the very recent terrorist attack on the Jersulam bus celebrated by Hamas. Israel is supposed to negotiate with that?

[ggt]

As Christian influence declines in the US...so goes the desire to support Israel against the many Arab states that would destroy the nation and kill all its people...

The Palestinians have proven over the years that they are not negotiating in good faith...have no desire to make peace with Israel...and will not be satisfied until Israel is removed from the face to the earth...

This is nothing new...this war goes back to Biblical times...not going to end...anytime soon...

[sead]

Maybe time to get your as back to USA and let them handle this themselves

[Jingthing]

Let's have a little truthiness about this.

Biden was pandering to the J street audience, mouthing back at them what they say themselves.

He wouldn't say the same thing in the same way at Aipac.

[VillageIdiot]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

"Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel..."

You're joking, of course.

The question of Israel in US political life is not just about Israel. It is about power and influence.

By pandering to Israel, American politicians accept this reality and it is translated into their attitude to the banks, which are as Jewish as synagogues, or more so.

[rethaier]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

"Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel..."

You're joking, of course.

The question of Israel in US political life is not just about Israel. It is about power and influence.

By pandering to Israel, American politicians accept this reality and it is translated into their attitude to the banks, which are as Jewish as synagogues, or more so.

There it is again.

Any topic about Israel and out of woodwork comes the Jew hating tropes.

It's kind of a mental illness and they try to infect others with their SICKNESS.

Member name so very apt though ...

The Jews are not the problem in Israel, the Zionists are and they are not all Jews.

[Jingthing]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

"Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel..."

You're joking, of course.

The question of Israel in US political life is not just about Israel. It is about power and influence.

By pandering to Israel, American politicians accept this reality and it is translated into their attitude to the banks, which are as Jewish as synagogues, or more so.

There it is again.

Any topic about Israel and out of woodwork comes the Jew hating tropes.

It's kind of a mental illness and they try to infect others with their SICKNESS.

Member name so very apt though ...

The Jews are not the problem in Israel, the Zionists are and they are not all Jews.

Hilarious.

The old we don't hate Jews, we hate Zionists card.

That's a crock.

Every Israel topic here, the Jew hatred is revealed in a CRYSTAL CLEAR way.

Edited April 19, 2016 by Jingthing

[VillageIdiot]

The US says the same thing all the time but does nothing. The world knows enough about Israel's long and continuous trail of crimes against Palestine but nothing changes and nothing is done. Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel if you mean what you say. Another bunch of lip service. What are you afraid of? Do they really own you financially as is rumored in some circles?

"Hey USA, enact some sanctions against Israel..."

You're joking, of course.

The question of Israel in US political life is not just about Israel. It is about power and influence.

By pandering to Israel, American politicians accept this reality and it is translated into their attitude to the banks, which are as Jewish as synagogues, or more so.

There it is again.

Any topic about Israel and out of woodwork comes the Jew hating tropes.

It's kind of a mental illness and they try to infect others with their SICKNESS.

Member name so very apt though ...

The Jews are not the problem in Israel, the Zionists are and they are not all Jews.

That's true in the USA as well where Christian fundamentalists are looking forward to Armageddon in Israel.