TroubleandGrumpy

I think it was about the amounts involved in total probably - each one was well under 1M Baht. I only transfer to BKK - one in my name and one in wife's name.

Posted this is another thread about Thailand taxing even if not remitted - so am posting this here again as it applies to remitted income. An update to those who are genuinely interested in knowing what is happening - especially if DTAs are required to be used - which it looks like they will be. It seems many people are thinking like in the West - the rules are this, so that happens - it does not work like that here. I strongly suggest reading @Dogmatix last post - this is a clusterphar....... There is no online TRD process or document that allows an Expat to easily lodge a tax return using their country's DTA to exempt anything already taxed, or to claim any exemption or allowances included in their DTA with Thailand. I have had it confirmed by 2 tax accountant organisations that if I want to lodge a tax return using any part of a DTA for exclusions or allowances or just plain exemptions, I will need to provide detailed techncial and legal information that will be almost impossible for a layman to do in Thailand - they said I will need to use their services and I believed them. They both currently use DTAs in the tax returns that they do for overseas companies, and they have absolutely convinced me it will not be an easy thing to do for an 'ordinary' Expat. I gave them the details of the financial situation for myself and my Thai wife, and they advised me that their probable costs to do a tax return using the Australian DTA would be - 70-80K and 80-90K. I have that in writing if anyone wants to PM for a copy. It will NOT be a simple matter if Expats are forced to lodge a tax return by TRD/Thai Govt, if they need to use the DTA to either exempt or reduce their taxation liability to Thailand. IMO TRD will not be creating an online DTA tax lodgment process/document according to both the tax experts. IMO as soon as TRD realised how hard it would be, given that there are 61 separate DTAs and all of them are different in some way, they threw up their hands and shut their mouths. The tax experts showed me what I did not know - TRD are caught in a very hard place - they are being pushed by the Thai Govt to start making Thais and Expats pay more income taxes. Their new Boss (Ms.Kulaya Tantitemit) is being very compliant to the new Govt, and like all Thai bosses she has the 'Picard Syndrome' and thinks if she says 'make it so' - it will just happen.

An update to those who are genuinely interested in knowing what is happening - especially if DTAs are required to be used - which it looks like they will be. It seems many people are thinking like in the West - the rules are this, so that happens - it does not work like that here. I strongly suggest reading @Dogmatix last post - this is a clusterphar....... There is no online TRD process or document that allows an Expat to easily lodge a tax return using their country's DTA to exempt anything already taxed, or to claim any exemption or allowances included in their DTA with Thailand. I have had it confirmed by 2 tax accountant organisations that if I want to lodge a tax return using any part of a DTA for exclusions or allowances or just plain exemptions, I will need to provide detailed techncial and legal information that will be almost impossible for a layman to do in Thailand - they said I will need to use their services and I believed them. They both currently use DTAs in the tax returns that they do for overseas companies, and they have absolutely convinced me it will not be an easy thing to do for an 'ordinary' Expat. I gave them the details of the financial situation for myself and my Thai wife, and they advised me that their probable costs to do a tax return using the Australian DTA would be - 70-80K and 80-90K. I have that in writing if anyone wants to PM for a copy. It will NOT be a simple matter if Expats are forced to lodge a tax return by TRD/Thai Govt, if they need to use the DTA to either exempt or reduce their taxation liability to Thailand. IMO TRD will not be creating an online DTA tax lodgment process/document according to both the tax experts. IMO as soon as TRD realised how hard it would be, given that there are 61 separate DTAs and all of them are different in some way, they threw up their hands and shut their mouths. The tax experts showed me what I did not know - TRD are caught in a very hard place - they are being pushed by the Thai Govt to start making Thais and Expats pay more income taxes. Their new Boss (Ms.Kulaya Tantitemit) is being very compliant to the new Govt, and like all Thai bosses she has the 'Picard Syndrome' and thinks if she says 'make it so' - it will just happen.

I did the transfers many months ago - 4 over a period of 3 months - last one was in April - they all went through no problems. I move the money from my investment funds into a local Aust bank and same day transfer to Wise and then same or next day transfer to Thailand.

Update. I went to a Ping demo day at a driving range near the Siam Country Club. They had all the new Ping clubs and a bag of interchangeable shafts - and one of them was the Japanese spec'd shaft that @scubascuba3 suggested (Thanks Mate). I tried my 3 wood with several of the lighter Ping standard shafts, and although better, they were not as good as I wanted or know I can hit. So I (wife) asked the main guy about 'that' club in the bag, and he said it was from Japan and was not available here - but I tried it anyway - and boom boom. The ball went high and far - the 3 wood went 200+ yards (190 carry). When I (wife) asked can I buy the new clubs with that shaft he said no - not an option in Thailand. So we asked him where to buy that shaft - he said 'no hab' but the wife convinced him to ask the others too. One younger Thai guy said we can order it through an approved Ping supplier - it will have to come from Japan so it will take a while - but he did not know where or which one (from Bangkok). So we went to that new Ping dealer I mentioned before on 3rd street - where @scubascuba3 said to go many months ago. Unbelievable but he had two of those shafts (3 and 5) in stock and he agreed to sell them to me, and we ordered the others - he said 6-8 weeks from Japan. I put those shafts on my 3/5 woods and although the grips aint the best - my 3 wood and 5 wood were great - we played at SCC (Old Course) as a 'payback' for the shafts - the wife absolutely loved it 🙂 and I shot 82 (social and preferred lies). The new Ping dealer is called Easy Golf and now has the shop fully set up (Titleist too) and has a lot of stock now - great friendly guy and girl and highly recommended (speak English too). Cannot paste the Google Maps link, but look up Easygolf 3rd road Pattaya - and they have a Facebook site too (also not able to paste in).

My read too - if APRA, which is the regulations authority in Australia, is asking questions, they would be asking them from me. Wise is stepping far over the mark - they are probably getting the info just in case they are asked. But as I said, at the time of the first transfer I advised them who is was to and what is was for (call and email). Wise are no longer my preferred option for exchange transfers.

To the Wife - but at the time I told them via phone call and sent them an email - I send 4 large transfers in the year. It was an email and it has been confirmed through login answers and by calling them to confirm.

I think it is a follow on from their recent data breach, but not only has Wise implemented upgraded login authentication processes, they are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months. Below is the list of things they are asking for and I have confirmed with Wise directly that it is them and it is not a scam. Firstly, I am not going to comply and I will only be sending them basic written answers - not detailed statements and 'proof'. Secondly, IMO this is a stupid thing to do because this will be copied by the scammers. My advice is to think carefully before responding to such a request. Never has a bank or any financial institution ever demanded from me such information. Is this related to the recent income tax changes introduced in Thailand? Maybe - who knows. I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on. Could you please send over the following information? Please include as much detail as possible. Let us know how you earned the money to pay for your transfers · A detailed explanation of how you earned the money — this could be your salary, the sale of a property, company, or shares or from inheritance Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX] · They must show transactions from the past 3 months · The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx · A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers · Let us know your relationship to the recipient Upload all your documents here (Wise website).

We all learn something every day. Did you watch Red Dwarf ?? It is always interesting how people reveal themselves to others.

Yes I agree - it may be not as 'trackable' as the bank transactions can be. But the records will be there - and you could be easily aught out if you go that path.

You are not listening Mike. He defined repatriated funds as reported to TRD in terms of money into a Thai bank account. He did not say there was no other ways to bring money into Thailand. He was saying that ATM withdrawals would not be reported to TRD. You are taking exact words and using them out of context. I know what questions he was answering and what he meant - but videos often make things interpretable many ways. Yes Chris should have asked clarifying questions - a lot of times I would have done so and asked him "Did you mean ..........."

Very simple - having a bank account in Thailand and remitting funds into your bank account in Thailand. What you do not realise (think) is that he did not say something like " There are no other ways to incur taxation liabilities in Thailand" (such as bringing in cash). What he is talking about is the remittances of money into Thailand (that are reported by the banks to TRD). Simple. Stop reading into what he said, what you think he means - listen.

IMO they would work out well - if you dont mind the extra charges. Wise is basically a bank with holding and exchange powers. I was also thinking of maybe using Western Union - who are not a bank - and who will pay you the cash at a branch. But when I think about it, the fact is that they will be keeping Passport details - and therefore the question is - will they be reporting to TRD all local payouts?

Tell me about it. Just look at all the rubbish being stated on the income tax threads. There are far too many that are either Thai haters or Thai apologists - the rational informed ones have obviously left. Regarding this sort of question Ubon Joe was great - RIP.

You wouldn't !!

You are wrong - twice. ATM transactions are not reportable - because they do not involve a foreign transaction to a foreign bank account. When a foreign country receives transaction reports, they do not get advised every transaction of every person. They only get advised of foreign transfers to a bank account - not payments made using a credit/debit card. You could be in Australia paying for your holiday to Thailand - TRD does not get information. There is no transaction record of ATM withdrawals with the Thai bank to report to TRD. He did not state that at all regarding bringing cash into Thailand - which is definitely taxable. When you do so you are supposed to declare it - plus when you exchange it they will record your Passport. Yes the chances of being 'caught' are slim, but it is definitely not how to avoid income taxes. However, having said that I know of several Thais that regularly travel to Thailand with cash and give it to the family.

I do.

Another one - are you serious mate - sanctimonious statements like that just prove you are wrong IMO. Or at the least that you will not answer genuine questions - because you dont really know. OK - I will ignore your comments from here on out - please do the same.

George - there are two sides to the debate - both are valid. But the EV supporters are far far more evangelical than ICE supporters.

Ditto - my last post to you.

Check out my posted links. Or wait - are you a woke globalist? You will only believe something that is stated by the UN? You know the UN? An organisation that has corrupt totalitarian dictatorship countries on their Human Rights Committee. It was the UN that stated Covid19 was not transmissible from human to human - because China said so. My point being - what are your 'proof' courses? Because there aint none!! Like many things these days, they have become polar debates - this side versus that - and EVs versus ICE is the same. I dont take either side on this matter - I just take the truth - EVs are a false narrative - their downsides are being downplayed and their upsides are being overplayed. There are 3 groups of people on this issue (like so many issues). EV Supporters, ICE Supporters, and those like me that dont take either side. Sitting hgere on the fence I accasionaly drop down to one sidfe or the other, but mainly I sit on the fence. EV firs are real and are being downplayed. Example - EV supporters who dont say EVs do catch fire and uncontrollably burn with toxic smoke etc but that issue is being resolved and over time they will become extremely safe (probably) - they say 'more ICE vehicles burn'.

Not what I said in your quote - but I hear you and understand. Answer me this - if a USA citizen living in Thailand is a tax resident and sells their house in USA and makes a capital gain, will they be liable to pay income taxes on that capital gain to Thailand. Likewise, if a USA citizen living in Thailand receives a lump sum termination payment in USA, will they be liable to pay income taxes on that amount to Thailand. My understanding is that USA Citizens only pay income taxes to USA on money earned in USA - irrespective of where they are living in the world, and that the USA IRS will ensure they are the ones to receive the income taxes and not the 'other' country. Tax credits can be utilised for sure - but good luck with doing that here. That is not the case in a country like Australia which is a Residence based tax system - if I am a tax resident in Thailand and I sell a house or get a lump sum payment, I am liable to pay income taxes to Thailand - if I bring that money into Thailand anytime (now or future). But if Thailand does adopt a worldwide tax system, then I will be liable to pay income taxes to Thailand, whether I bring that money into Thailand or not. That is what is coming next, if they go ahead with it. If I knew about all this in 2012 I would not have decided to retire to Thailand. The Philippines, Malaysia and Indonesia do not tax the overseas money of retired foreigners living in their country. I would have gone there and visited Thailand - for under 180 days a year. We might end up doing that anyway.

My Thai family members all over Thailand have all said the same thing - the tax officers are not selected for speaking English (unlike Immigration Officers). I recall going into a Provincial Transport Office when needing to change Province for my Thai driving license (got in Chiang Mai where they did speak some English), and no one spoke English. When my wife stepped forward and explained it in Thai they understood. When I asked my Wife to ask them if they knew that the writing on both our Thai licenses was in Thai and English - she just laughed. When I asked her to tell them to take out their Thai ID cards and look at the English words - she laughed even louder. When I started to ask about the car license plates, she told me to 'sut up'.

I do believe that TRD can go back 7 years under the tax laws - but it certainly could be 10. Yes - TRD will be receiving data from the banks automatically - plus they can request more details when investigating someone/thing. Every bank that is required to report international transactions will be automatically sending a list of details to those approved countries that received international transfers from them (monthly, quarterly, 6 monthly, yearly - not sure). And yes - in the future TRD can use AI/Software to search through those lists and collate them according to names/etc. Likewise, banks in Thailand are required to provide similar reports to TRD - which can also be collated etc.

Confession noted. Delusions ignored.