TroubleandGrumpy

I understand what it meant - all good.

Yes that is a serious problem as far as I see it - the costsd and problems of lodging a tax return to prove that the money I remit into Thailand is not taxable - and then WTF do I do if the Thai RD decides I do have to pay iincome taxes. And therein lies the 'rub' - as things stand right now (no clarifications or execemptions) until I lodge a tax return and get the Thai RD decision, I dont know if I will have to pay income taxes on the money I remitted into Thailand during the previous Thai tax year. Only after March 2025 I will know if the money I brought into Thailand in 2024 will be taxed. Uncertainty at its extreme - hope at its utmost. Plus of course - if I do pay income taxes - what do/will I get for that?? Answer = ZERO.

So you think that when someone agrees with you they are 'right' and that is the way things really are? Interesting. Yes - go back to doing things like riding a bike without a helmet, and not thinking or planning ahead. No - because other people take things seriously and plan ahead just in case everything is not fine, does not mean they are wrong. Enjoy your life - but please leave me and the others here out of it.

Just looking at those last few posts - I must admit I have no idea why I talk to dheads that in a pub/club I would never go anywhere near. Problem solved through the use of the blocking service. Some people just cannot agree to disagree.

They did tighten things up - not quite as much as that, but definitely tighter. However, you are right - this is the 'danger' of living overseas in another country - and ait is lso why it is wise not to buy a property but to rent.

If you are not worried about this new rule, then perhaps you should be. The reality is that for many years the Thai RD did not want Expats to lodge tax returns because under the previous rules they were probably tax exempt and they (like all Thai bureacrats) did not want all the extra work. However, there has been a few (very few) retired/married Expats lodging tax returns -= if you believe their posts in this thread. However even with all that, the new rules, and current lack of clarification regarding where long-term retired Expats stand, means that all Expats who bring money into Thailand will be required to either pay income taxes, or prove that the money was earned before 1 Jan 2024. Not lodging a tax return in the past was OK, because that was the Thai RD decision, but under this new rule that may not be the case after 1 Jan 2024 - we do not know. But I do know this, you do not screw with the Tax Dept in any country. If all Expats are supposed to lodge a tax return if we remit money into Thailand and we dont, that in itself is finable offence. Then there is the 2% interrest per month on any money we should have paid in income taxes, plus whatever other penalties the Thai RD may throw at us. And the Tax Dept could go back in time many years (to 1 Jan 2024) if they wanted to - so in 2030 will we be 'caught' and nailed to the cross? Who knows what will happen, because the Thai RD has not yet stated whether retired/married Expats are required to pay income taxes on the money they remiot into Thailand (or do we have to prove it is not taxable). Not saying it will definitely be a problem - but as it stands today - it very well could be and remaining across the issue would be wise.

Indonesia has been making changes recently and they dont tax the 'imported' income of retirees - as it stands they dont require retired expats to lodge a tax return and although they technically could impose taxes on Retired Expats - they do not. Indonesia plans sweeping tax reforms for 'expatriate' income, dividends, penalties - Business - The Jakarta Post Income Tax For Foreign Retirees ? - Living In Indonesia Expat Forum (livinginindonesiaforum.org) One thing to keep in mind when researching all this stuff is that a search for Expats Tax - even Retired Expats Tax - will give most responses targetted at Working Expats (either employed or in a business) because those companies pay Google. Retired Expats are a completely different kettle of fish - their Visa prohibits working or running a business so they dont earn money in any country and are therefore 'excluded' from having to lodge a tax return. But most websites offering advice and services refer to 'Expats' when in fact they are only talking about those who work or have a business - who do obviously have to pay income taxes.

Malaysia did it a few years ago - they delayed implementation for a few years for personal income taxes (not businesses) and they made an exemption for many people, including retired Expats living in the country. I previously posted in this thread all about that a long time ago (last month?) - sorry aint going on another hunt to find all that again (should have kept links I know).

Another troll - mate of lou or same bloke - either way, go troll someone else - and get a life. If both of you are reading this - look up cognitive bias - you both (or one and same) dont listen - you think what you think is correct and nothing will 'correct' that - like a woke teenage girl.

Wrong - but I have said all I will say in last reply - go troll someone else - and get a life MATE.

Obnviously I was referring to residential banks - like ther banks in Thailand I/we use - which is what the OP was talking about. Go away and troll someone else - and get a life mate - try marrying a Thai girl - far less frustrating than buying it.

ROFLOL - Your are serious arent you?? Go use Google young man - all will be revealed. I aint your nurse or nanny. Look at the Bangkok Bank website in USA - or any anywhere else. Come back with proof if you find they have full unrestricted banking licences for residential banking business - offering accounts to US Citizens and all that. If you do I will accept that and stand corrected. Now - did you read those articles in Asean Now. Did you Google the other websites for similar stories. I bet not. Prove me wrong. Tomorrow anytime is fine.

I agree - the announcement 162/2023 was released probably to ensure that those who had investments that earned interest in 2023 would not have to pay taxes when the money was remitted in 2024. I hope it applies for all money before 2024, but maybe not. The Condo purchase was an example to show how uncertain the current situation is and unless that is corrected and clarified, what Expat would risk bringing in money after 1 Jan 2024 to make a large purchase. Yes - if I wanted to do it I would do it now and not later - but doing it in 2024 or any future year under the current uncertainty is unwise. And IMO not planning to be able to leave Thailand if/when it all goes to khrapp when they completely stuff thisd all up is also unwise. The Philippines Retired Expat Program guarantees that they will not tax any money you bring into the country - and you dont have to report to the Police every 3 months etc etc. Malaysia and Indonesia also have reasonable Retired Expat programs, but they aint for those living only on a Pension. Being close enough to be able to visit, but not long enough (<180 days) to have to pay income taxes on money remitted into Thailand, is definitely an option. The Philipppines also has very good air quality compared to other SEAsian countries. Bali in Indonesia and Penang in Malaysia are OK too. Cambodia has some Expat Visas now, and given how cheap that place is, spending 180+ days there and under 180 in Thailand in any calendar year, is an option for many of those on a Pension. Surely the Thai Govt will realise they risk losing a lot of money from Expats, both those here now and those not coming, unless they address this matter positively. Surely they see that it is stupid to offer Expat Visas to come live in Thailand, but then to tax the money that they bring into Thailand. But as the great man said - 'I have no idea, and dont call me Shirley'. A bloke in Aust said on one of the Aussie forums, that he asked the Embassy if the 800K he had to place in Thailand bank account would be taxed by the Thai RD in 2024 - he was advised they did not know and that he would have to ask the Thai RD. Surely or Shirley - no one knows what they will be doing.

Sounds like a great idea - good planning. I also see nothing wrong with being 'complicated' when it comes to planning finances. Unfortunately, most of my money is held in a Superannuation Fund in Australia, and it is impossible to quarantine it. Likewise, I get a small Pension payment each 2-4 weeks from the Aust Govt which is technically 'income' - but under the DTA should not be 'taxable'. But exactly how do I prove all that. Because of the uncertainty, I am planning ahead with Plan B and C (other countries). I have no intention of paying income taxes in a country that treats me like a parolee, and provides me with zero Govt services or benefits. Happy to pay another small 'fee' - but I pay heaps more in VAT than the vast majority of Thais pay in VAT and income tax together - and I am happy to accept that as my 'contribution'. The possibility that I will have to lodge an annual tax return and 'hope' that I am not financially punished for bringing money into Thailand, annoys me to the extreme. I am OK with complexity - it is uncertainty that causes me grief. There are lots of countries that will welcome me and my money as a retiree - and most of them do not require I report to the Police every 3 months, and pay/beg to stay another year, nor many other ridiculous impositions that Thailand imposes on Expats who live long term in the country.

Maybe. Maybe Not. I know many pundits are saying that is the case, and I certainly hope so, but I dont ever trust 100% when the 'experts' say when they say what they think a Government organisations meant. But as per my prvious post, the real definitive problem is how to prove it. So I transfer 5 million baht in 2028 to buy a propertry. What happens if the Thai RD does not accept what I have provided as 'proof' that the money was earned 10-20 years ago. What happens is that I have to eithr pay 1 million in taxes, or I can lodge an appeal. The Appeal must be 100% written in Thai (with translated 'approved' documents) and any 'hearing' will be conducted in Thai (meaning I will have to use a translator). That will be extremely expensive and the win rate of Expats in Thai Tribunals and Courts, is I believe about 1000+ for 1 or 2?

As far as I am aware they are all corporate banking - extremely restricted local licences to operate.

Last reply mate - the bank refused to refund them becausae 'they did not do it' the employee did. Thai bank refuses to compensate foreigner - Thailand News - Thailand News, Travel & Forum - ASEAN NOW Bangkok Bank Will Not Payback Fraudulent Pos Transactions W/Stolen Atm Card - Jobs, Economy, Banking, Business, Investments - Thailand News, Travel & Forum - ASEAN NOW There are many more but AN deleted posts including links from others - not sure of the list details.

It USED to be that the guarantee was 10 Million Baht, then 5 Million Baht, and then 1 Million Baht. Look it up mate - do some research. In the 1st world all funds are Govt Guaranteed in the full-licence Banks.

That would certainly be great if it applied to ALL income earned before January 1 2024. However, before I answer that statement, I will add this statement made by a tax expert: Important Updates on New Tax Regulations for Foreign Income in Thailand - FRANK Legal & Tax (franklegaltax.com) A person is living in Thailand for more than 180 days a year but receives income outside of Thailand since the last 10 years and transfers this money into Thailand. Starting from 01. January 2024, this income will be subject to tax regardless of when it was earned. Due to the new clarification, the taxation does not apply to income he is transferring into Thailand, if he can prove that the income was earned before 2024. IF that is what the Thai RD statement meant (all income is not taxable if it was earned before 1 Jan 2024), then the issue then becomes one of compliance. Exactly HOW does an Expat 'prove' that the money they remitted into Thailand from 2024 onwards, was earned 5-10-20 years ago. Is it OK for an Expat to not lodge a tax return on that basis - or do they have to lodge an annual tax return and prove that every year going forward. Now - getting back to that Thai RD statement: ประกาศ (rd.go.th) The question is whether the Thai RD meant to exclude ALL income earned before 1 Jan 2024 and brought into Thailand in 2030 or 2040 etc etc, or was their meaning that any income earned in the 2023 year under the rules as they were in 2023, and then remitted into Thailand in the 2024 tax year, will be treated as per the previous rule and it is not taxable. Was the Thai RD statement meant to say that the old rule still applies in 2024 to income that was earned in the year 2023 (which would be fair). But was it also meant to say that ALL income earned before 1 Jan 2024 is not taxable. What is needed is a formal clarification from Thai RD that the Revenue Department Order No. 162/2023 released on 20 November 2023, did the Thai RD or did not the Thai RD mean that ALL income earned in any year before 1 Jan 2024 is not taxable income whenever it is remitted into Thailand in any year going forward.

I stumbles across this while researching something else - recalled this thread and decided to grab the link and send it. ATO ID 2003/154 | Legal database Note all the legal and legislative precedents. About the same thing applies to the Age Pension.

90% of 'refugees' and 'asylum seekers' are illegals claiming to be refugees or asylum seekers.

Exactly what I have said. Read again.

I certainly hope so - BUT I will bot bring a large amount into Thailand until after it is clarified/dropped or whatever else you said. IMO it would be unwise for anyone else to do so based on 'hope'. The facts as they currently stand, are that foreign money brought into Thailand after 1 Jan 2024 is potentially taxable income under this new 'rule' - and proving it is not taxable rests with the taxpayers as Thia RD have not provided any excemptions or clarifications - nor have they said how to claim excemptions or apply clarifications.

You dontr listen. When he went to court the bank was one of the parties 'against' him being given the property title back.

There was a press release from RD - but it only lead to more confusion. Did they mean ALL income earned before Jan 1 2024, or were they in fact only referring to income earned before Jan 1 2024 (but after the annoucement) still being not subject to income taxes IF seasoned for over 12 months before being returned before Jan 1 2024. Most tax 'experts' believe they means the latter, and not the former - as some 'pundits' have claimed. RD has made no follow up clarification - that I have seen. This is an example of how bad the Thai RD actually is - and yet another reason I believe that they will completely phark this all up - and more reasons for having a Plan B in 2024 and to hold back any large remittances into Thailand for at least a year or two. I have seen all the concerns and fears - everything from people who are running around like chicken little to those attacking anyone who even suggests that their money might be taxed. No one knows exactly what is going to happen - No one. The Thai RD should IMO hold back the implementation of this 'change' like Malaysia did for a few years. Hopefully soon they will release their clarifications and excemptions. Pensions are not taxable by Thailand from most countries that have a DTA. However, what is required by an Expat to 'claim' that excemption - will we all be automaticallt exempted or will we all have to lodge a tax return - no one knows. How must that pension money be remitted into Thailand - what happens when someone gets the pension paid not directly to a Thai bank account, but to their own bank account and they once a month/quarter transfer the money into Thailand (when exchange rates better). etc etc etc.