White House again rejects talks with North Korea on nuclear issue

[webfact]

White House again rejects talks with North Korea on nuclear issue

By Steve Holland

 

A combination photo shows U.S. President Donald Trump in New York, U.S. September 21, 2017 and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un in this undated photo released by North Korea's Korean Central News Agency (KCNA) in Pyongyang, September 4, 2017. REUTERS/Kevin Lamarque, KCNA/Handout via REUTERS/File Photos

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The White House on Monday ruled out talks with North Korea except to discuss the fate of Americans held there, again appearing to rebuke Secretary of State Rex Tillerson who said Washington was directly communicating with Pyongyang on its nuclear and missile programs.

 

"We've been clear that now is not the time to talk," White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders told reporters, reiterating a tweet from President Donald Trump at the weekend that was seen as undercutting Tillerson.

 

"The only conversations that have taken place were that ... would be on bringing back Americans who have been detained," Sanders said. "Beyond that, there will be no conversations with North Korea at this time."

 

Tillerson said on Saturday during a trip to China that the United States was directly communicating with North Korea on its nuclear and missile programs but that Pyongyang had shown no interest in dialogue.

 

Trump, who has traded insults and threats with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un in recent weeks, later dismissed any prospect of talks with North Korea as a waste of time.

 

"I told Rex Tillerson, our wonderful secretary of state, that he is wasting his time trying to negotiate with Little Rocket Man," Trump wrote on Twitter, using his sarcastic nickname for Kim.

 

"Save your energy, Rex, we'll do what has to be done!" Trump wrote.

 

It was not the first time the White House and State Department have seemed at odds on policy issues, but when asked if Trump still had confidence in Tillerson as secretary of state, Sanders said: “He does.”

 

A senior administration official said Tillerson misspoke.

 

“I think it was just him misspeaking. He was just acknowledging the fact that we do have channels and we might have reason to talk if North Korea’s behaviour changes sometime down the road,” the official said.

 

DIALOGUE WITH NORTH?

 

Tillerson said in Beijing that the United States had multiple direct channels of communication with Pyongyang and that it was probing North Korea to see if it was interested in dialogue.

 

The top U.S. diplomat expressed hope for reducing tensions with North Korea, which is fast advancing towards its goal of developing a nuclear-tipped missile capable of hitting the U.S. mainland.

 

"We are probing, so stay tuned," Tillerson told a small group of reporters. "We ask: 'Would you like to talk?'" He said the United States had "a couple of, three, channels, open to Pyongyang."

 

Another U.S. official said Tillerson may have overstated the status of U.S. lines of communication with North Korea for the benefit of his Chinese hosts, who have been pushing the Trump administration to do more to lure Pyongyang to the negotiating table.

 

Trump has vowed to halt North Korea's nuclear ambitions and tensions have escalated in recent months, with Pyongyang conducting its sixth and largest nuclear test on Sept. 3. It has also threatened to test a hydrogen bomb over the Pacific.

 

The fate of Americans held in North Korea is also a bone of contention. The Trump administration has demanded North Korea release three U.S. citizens it has detained: missionary Kim Dong Chul and academics Tony Kim and Kim Hak Song.

 

The Trump White House and State Department have taken to divergent stances on other foreign policy issues.

When a dispute over Qatar erupted this year, Trump strongly backed Gulf Arab leaders who accuse Qatar of supporting Iran as well as Islamist militants. Trump accused Qatar of being a "high-level" funder of terrorism even as the Pentagon and Tillerson cautioned against the military, commercial and humanitarian effects of a boycott imposed by Arab states.

 

Months into the dispute, Trump adopted a position more in line with that of the State Department.

 

(Reporting by Steve Holland in Washington; Additional reporting by David Alexander and Matt Spetalnick in Washington and Ben Blanchard in Beijing; Writing by Alistair Bell; Editing by James Dalgleish)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-10-03

[retarius]

We are forced into a military confrontation because we won't talk to you which means diplomacy and sanctions have failed. If thousands or millions die at the hands of our military strikes, it will be NK's fault because diplomacy failed. You cant make this stuff up. Get Trump out of the White House.

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, retarius said:

We are forced into a military confrontation because we won't talk to you which means diplomacy and sanctions have failed. If thousands or millions die at the hands of our military strikes, it will be NK's fault because diplomacy failed. You cant make this stuff up. Get Trump out of the White House.

We are forced into a military confrontation because NK won't become a good member of our global community.  Ignores UN resolutions.  And commits a variety of international crimes.  Here's one that just came to light.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/a-north-korean-ship-was-seized-off-egypt-with-a-huge-cache-of-weapons-destined-for-a-surprising-buyer/2017/10/01/d9a4e06e-a46d-11e7-b14f-f41773cd5a14_story.html?utm_term=.08445f3ebefa

 

 

Quote

 

A North Korean ship was seized off Egypt with a huge cache of weapons destined for a surprising buyer

They swarmed the vessel and discovered, concealed under bins of iron ore, a cache of more than 30,000 rocket-propelled grenades. It was, as a United Nations report later concluded, the “largest seizure of ammunition in the history of sanctions against the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea.”

 

 

[Krataiboy]

1 hour ago, craigt3365 said:

We are forced into a military confrontation because NK won't become a good member of our global community.  Ignores UN resolutions.  And commits a variety of international crimes.  Here's one that just came to light.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/a-north-korean-ship-was-seized-off-egypt-with-a-huge-cache-of-weapons-destined-for-a-surprising-buyer/2017/10/01/d9a4e06e-a46d-11e7-b14f-f41773cd5a14_story.html?utm_term=.08445f3ebefa

 

 

 

 

Substitute the acronym "US" for "NK" and most of what you wrote would still apply.

 

Arguing who is the bad guy in this stand-off is pointless and a waste of time - and time is running out as this war of words takes us all to the brink.

 

The military hawks in Washington who, astonishing, actually believe their country could win a nuclear war, are clearly teeing North Korea up for the "shock and awe" treatment meted out to Iraq - or "devastating military action," to quote the latest incumbent of the White House.

 

Unless he has an ambition to go down in history as the President who destroyed not only his nation but the world as we know it, Trump must be persuaded to sink his pride and accept the invitation to talk. 

 

Jaw-jaw is always better than war - and never more so than right now.

[craigt3365]

24 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

 

Substitute the acronym "US" for "NK" and most of what you wrote would still apply.

 

Arguing who is the bad guy in this stand-off is pointless and a waste of time - and time is running out as this war of words takes us all to the brink.

 

The military hawks in Washington who, astonishing, actually believe their country could win a nuclear war, are clearly teeing North Korea up for the "shock and awe" treatment meted out to Iraq - or "devastating military action," to quote the latest incumbent of the White House.

 

Unless he has an ambition to go down in history as the President who destroyed not only his nation but the world as we know it, Trump must be persuaded to sink his pride and accept the invitation to talk. 

 

Jaw-jaw is always better than war - and never more so than right now.

Jaw-jaw is what got us here.  To the brink of war.  You keep blaming the US.  How about blaming Kim?  Easy for him to dial things back also.

[Krataiboy]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

Jaw-jaw is what got us here.  To the brink of war.  You keep blaming the US.  How about blaming Kim?  Easy for him to dial things back also.

 

I do wish you would at least read before you troll. Neither side is blameless, but North Korean wants to talk, Trump doesn't.

 

Geddit now?

[craigt3365]

8 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

 

I do wish you would at least read before you troll. Neither side is blameless, but North Korean wants to talk, Trump doesn't.

 

Geddit now?

Tiller is trying to talk, but NK has no interest.  Geddit now?

 

Ignore Trump.

[Krataiboy]

(Trump's) latest presidential Twitter outburst threatened not only to further escalate the North Korea crisis, but to undermine the nation’s top diplomat (Tillerson) at a highly sensitive moment. - Guardian

 

Kind of says it all.

[craigt3365]

14 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

(Trump's) latest presidential Twitter outburst threatened not only to further escalate the North Korea crisis, but to undermine the nation’s top diplomat (Tillerson) at a highly sensitive moment. - Guardian

 

Kind of says it all.

Kinda like Kim's outburst to sink Japan and turn the US to ashes and darkness? 

 

Again, going after only the US.  Here's Tokyo's response.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/14/north-korea-threat-sink-japan-us-ashes-darkness

 

Quote

 

We will sink Japan and turn US to 'ashes and darkness', says North Korea

Tokyo condemns ‘absolutely unacceptable’ provocation, as Pyongyang reacts to imposition of new UN sanctions following missile tests

 

 

P.S. you need to post a link to your sources.

[ilostmypassword]

43 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Tiller is trying to talk, but NK has no interest.  Geddit now?

 

Ignore Trump.

So Tillerson was lying?

 "We have a couple, three channels open to Pyongyang. We can talk to them, we do talk to them," Tillerson told reporters Saturday in Beijing, according to the pool report."

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/09/30/554727610/we-do-talk-to-them-u-s-and-north-korea-in-direct-contact

Geddit now?

 

Anyway, it's such a stupid move on Trump's part. It certainly doesn't help recruit the rest of the world to support the US.

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

So Tillerson was lying?

 "We have a couple, three channels open to Pyongyang. We can talk to them, we do talk to them," Tillerson told reporters Saturday in Beijing, according to the pool report."

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/09/30/554727610/we-do-talk-to-them-u-s-and-north-korea-in-direct-contact

Geddit now?

 

Anyway, it's such a stupid move on Trump's part. It certainly doesn't help recruit the rest of the world to support the US.

I'll try to find the article I read, but it said Kim has no interest in talking with the US.  Especially about nuclear weapons.  So as I said, they are not communicating.  Perhaps at lower levels, but not at the top.

Geddit now?

 

Anyway, it's such a stupid move on Kim's part.  It certainly doesn't help recruit the rest of the world to support NK.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

I'll try to find the article I read, but it said Kim has no interest in talking with the US.  Especially about nuclear weapons.  So as I said, they are not communicating.  Perhaps at lower levels, but not at the top.

Geddit now?

 

Anyway, it's such a stupid move on Kim's part.  It certainly doesn't help recruit the rest of the world to support NK.

"So as I said, they are not communicating. "

Here you go again. Plain as day, the US Secretary of State says they are communicating and you say that they are not. The facts are against you twist them as much as you might try. And no, it's not quibbling or nitpicking to say white is white in reply to someone who says white is black. Sometimes you've got to man (or woman) up and just admit you were wrong.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, Krataiboy said:

 

Substitute the acronym "US" for "NK" and most of what you wrote would still apply.

 

Arguing who is the bad guy in this stand-off is pointless and a waste of time - and time is running out as this war of words takes us all to the brink.

 

The military hawks in Washington who, astonishing, actually believe their country could win a nuclear war, are clearly teeing North Korea up for the "shock and awe" treatment meted out to Iraq - or "devastating military action," to quote the latest incumbent of the White House.

 

Unless he has an ambition to go down in history as the President who destroyed not only his nation but the world as we know it, Trump must be persuaded to sink his pride and accept the invitation to talk. 

 

Jaw-jaw is always better than war - and never more so than right now.

 

You post this bit - "Arguing who is the bad guy in this stand-off is pointless and a waste of time - and time is running out as this war of words takes us all to the brink." - then go on to explain how the USA (or "military hawks in Washington") is to blame. By the way, so far them supposed "military hawks" are actually acting pretty sensibly - something that cannot be said of  their boss.

 

 

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, ilostmypassword said:

"So as I said, they are not communicating. "

Here you go again. Plain as day, the US Secretary of State says they are communicating and you say that they are not. The facts are against you twist them as much as you might try. And no, it's not quibbling or nitpicking to say white is white in reply to someone who says white is black. Sometimes you've got to man (or woman) up and just admit you were wrong.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/09/30/politics/tillerson-channels-to-pyongyang/index.html

Quote

"U.S. diplomats have several open channels in which we can communicate with officials within the North Korean regime," Nauert said. "Despite assurances that the United States is not interested in promoting the collapse of the current regime, pursuing regime change, accelerating reunification of the peninsula or mobilizing forces north of the DMZ, North Korean officials have shown no indication that they are interested in or are ready for talks regarding denuclearization."

 

That's what the talks are all about.  And yes, nitpicking again.

 

Be nice.  I didn't go after you and now you're calling me a woman?  Let's keep this civil or let the mods deal with it.

[Krataiboy]

1 hour ago, craigt3365 said:

Kinda like Kim's outburst to sink Japan and turn the US to ashes and darkness? 

 

Again, going after only the US.  Here's Tokyo's response.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/14/north-korea-threat-sink-japan-us-ashes-darkness

 

 

P.S. you need to post a link to your sources.

 

Again, going after only the US.

 

Again, simply not true. I specifically said: "Neither side is blameless". 

 

Oh, and if you want a link for the source of that quote, try scrolling the screen up a few inches. I took Guardian quote from Monday's piece on the US-Korean spat.

 

Good to see we have at least something in common!

[craigt3365]

Just now, Krataiboy said:

 

Again, going after only the US.

 

Again, simply not true. I specifically said: "Neither side is blameless". 

 

Oh, and if you want a link for the source of that quote, try scrolling the screen up a few inches. I took Guardian quote from Monday's piece on the US-Korean spat.

 

Good to see we have at least something in common!

You did say that.  But also went on to complain only about the US and their actions.  How about one post that's critical of NK's actions?  Just one. LOL.

[tonbridgebrit]

7 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You did say that.  But also went on to complain only about the US and their actions.  How about one post that's critical of NK's actions?  Just one. LOL.

Craigt, are we still agreed on the following massive point ?

Okay, if Kim detonates another nuke in North Korea, well, let him. And if Kim fires a few more missiles above Japan's skies, well, let him. Kim detonating nukes and firing missiles above Japan is NOT a good enough reason for America to launch an attack on North Korea. The only reason that Washington has got, the reason to attack Kim, is IF Kim actually fires a missile at South Korea or Japan.

Do we still agree on this ?  A pre-emptive strike on North Korea is totally wrong, and will be a catastrophic move. I say again, do we agree ?

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

Craigt, are we still agreed on the following massive point ?

Okay, if Kim detonates another nuke in North Korea, well, let him. And if Kim fires a few more missiles above Japan's skies, well, let him. Kim detonating nukes and firing missiles above Japan is NOT a good enough reason for America to launch an attack on North Korea. The only reason that Washington has got, the reason to attack Kim, is IF Kim actually fires a missile at South Korea or Japan.

Do we still agree on this ?  A pre-emptive strike on North Korea is totally wrong, and will be a catastrophic move. I say again, do we agree ?

 

Why are  you pushing this nonsense again? Was there anything said in favor of a preemptive strike?

[Krataiboy]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

You did say that.  But also went on to complain only about the US and their actions.  How about one post that's critical of NK's actions?  Just one. LOL.

 

Failing to find a decent barber for their leader. 

 

(Jeez! That was like pulling teeth without anesthetic).

[tonbridgebrit]

Just now, Morch said:

 

Why are  you pushing this nonsense again? Was there anything said in favor of a preemptive strike?

You call this "nonsense" ??

Morch, I'm trying to see who are the people who actually reckon "yes, if North Korea carries on detonating nukes, if they carry on firing missiles above Japan's skies, yes, America should go ahead and attack North Korea".  Morch, are you a person who reckons it will be a good idea to attack North Korea even if they do NOT fire a missile at South Korea or Japan. Okay Morch, if you do think this, yes, a lot of people will call you a war-monger. But still, you can still say it, if this is how you feel.

I'm going to carry on saying "North Korea should only be attacked IF they fire the first missile". And if Donald Trump reckons the same thing, well, in that case, things are okay. There will be world peace. Kim's not going to give Washington a reason for nuking North Korea. Kim's not going to fire the first missile.

The biggest concern is, is that a bunch of war-mongers in Washington are going to tell Trump that it will be a good idea to attack Kim, attack Kim even though he hasn't attacked South Korea or Japan.

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

You call this "nonsense" ??

Morch, I'm trying to see who are the people who actually reckon "yes, if North Korea carries on detonating nukes, if they carry on firing missiles above Japan's skies, yes, America should go ahead and attack North Korea".  Morch, are you a person who reckons it will be a good idea to attack North Korea even if they do NOT fire a missile at South Korea or Japan. Okay Morch, if you do think this, yes, a lot of people will call you a war-monger. But still, you can still say it, if this is how you feel.

I'm going to carry on saying "North Korea should only be attacked IF they fire the first missile". And if Donald Trump reckons the same thing, well, in that case, things are okay. There will be world peace. Kim's not going to give Washington a reason for nuking North Korea. Kim's not going to fire the first missile.

The biggest concern is, is that a bunch of war-mongers in Washington are going to tell Trump that it will be a good idea to attack Kim, attack Kim even though he hasn't attacked South Korea or Japan.

 

I call your loaded questions nonsense, because that's what they are.

 

You're not trying to see anything, but push the same ideas and propaganda bits over and over again. You can't be ignorant of posters opinions and views regarding these issues, seeing as there were multiple topics dealing with this crisis.

 

The inane either/or formulas, labeling anyone failing to give a specified "correct" answer a "war monger" - well, yeah - just more of the same.

 

You have no idea what Kim will or will not do. You continually fail to address that Kim can miscalculate, or operate on a different set of assumptions and interpretations other than ascribed. You continually fail to specify which "war monger in Washington" are referred to, ignore all past North Korean aggression toward South Korea, and disregard their stance and statements.

 

As said, nonsense. And that's keeping it civil.

 

 

[craigt3365]

48 minutes ago, tonbridgebrit said:

Craigt, are we still agreed on the following massive point ?

Okay, if Kim detonates another nuke in North Korea, well, let him. And if Kim fires a few more missiles above Japan's skies, well, let him. Kim detonating nukes and firing missiles above Japan is NOT a good enough reason for America to launch an attack on North Korea. The only reason that Washington has got, the reason to attack Kim, is IF Kim actually fires a missile at South Korea or Japan.

Do we still agree on this ?  A pre-emptive strike on North Korea is totally wrong, and will be a catastrophic move. I say again, do we agree ?

No.  The last detonation might have caused massive problems inside the test mountain.  China is worried radiation might start to escape.  Unacceptable for that to happen.  The tests need to stop.  Or we might have another Chernoybl/Fukushima style disaster.  Unacceptable.

 

Japan wants the missiles to stop going over their territory.  Fair request.  How would you feel if Russia started launching potentially nuclear missiles over the UK from their bases in Kaliningrad to points in the North Atlantic.  Right over your home.  Knowing their success rate for missiles is way below 100%.  I guarantee you'd change your tune.  Japan has a fair request.

 

This is not 100% about the US.  You guys keep missing that.  The UN is behind this.  Over 50 countries have voiced their opinions to have NK stop.  Yours included.  And for good reasons. 

 

I do agree a pre-emptive strike is totally wrong.  And always will be.  But NK must be stopped.  To not stop them would be a catastrophic mistake.  How to stop them is the big question.  With no easy answers.

[craigt3365]

48 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

 

Failing to find a decent barber for their leader. 

 

(Jeez! That was like pulling teeth without anesthetic).

[craigt3365]

14 minutes ago, car720 said:

I don't want to take either side in this but I do believe people have very long memories when they are aggrieved.  We must remember that there was allegedly as many bombs dropped on NK as all of Europe.  I don't think they have ever surrendered their spirit or will.  They have just been working on a way to return the hurt.  Not that I think their way is a good one.  Just being objective and looking at both sides of the coin.

Ok.  I'm a native American.  My father was born on the reservation.  My ancestors were on the Trail of Tears.  Look that one up.

 

Should I still be pissed about what happened back then?  No.  The hate would ruin your life.  Move on.  Which we have done.  And so have the North Koreans.  All except Kim and his predecessors.  They're dictators.  This is not the will of the people.

[ilostmypassword]

16 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Tiller is trying to talk, but NK has no interest.  Geddit now?

 

Ignore Trump.

Really? I guess you know better than these people, too.

"But they [EU nations] felt frustrated because the higher-level access that they had obtained in Pyongyang last year had fallen away, with only medium-ranking foreign ministry officials now attending the meetings, the diplomats said.

“There was a sense that we weren’t really getting anywhere because they sent these department heads,” said a Brussels-based diplomat who had been briefed on the meetings, which were described as “very serious” in atmosphere and tone.

“They want to talk to the United States.”

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-missiles-eu/eus-diplomatic-back-channel-in-pyongyang-goes-cold-idUSKCN1C81SM

[craigt3365]

I'm sure there are channels available that are never disclosed.  You know that.  Tillerson said he had a channel.  But not with whom.  As above, probably low level diplomats.  Which shows NK isn't really interested in having talks.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/03/asia/north-korea-talks-or-threats/index.html

Quote

But during a recent trip to Beijing he was uncharacteristically forthcoming, telling reporters that the US maintained "direct contact" with North Korea.

 

Here's why negotiations broke down last time.  Not the fault of the US, as so many here try to blame.  From the article above:

Quote

The framework broke down in late 2002 and talks stalled when US intelligence agencies said they'd discovered a covert nuclear program and found that North Korea had purchased technology and equipment overseas. There were secret deals with Pakistan.

 

 

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

I'm sure there are channels available that are never disclosed.  You know that.  Tillerson said he had a channel.  But not with whom.  As above, probably low level diplomats.  Which shows NK isn't really interested in having talks.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/10/03/asia/north-korea-talks-or-threats/index.html

 

Here's why negotiations broke down last time.  Not the fault of the US, as so many here try to blame.  From the article above:

 

 

It's clear from your comments that you haven't read the article.

[craigt3365]

8 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

It's clear from your comments that you haven't read the article.

Read it from top to bottom.

[ilostmypassword]

8 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Read it from top to bottom.

 

So what you're telling us is that your judgement of the situation is just as valid as that of seasoned EU diplomats who regularly deal with North Korea? Really?

And where do you get off making unsupported statements like "probably low level diplomats" You have produced zero evidence to support that surmise. What you've done here is generally known as "bloviating." You know, making things up to support your case.

[craigt3365]

16 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

 

So what you're telling us is that your judgement of the situation is just as valid as that of seasoned EU diplomats who regularly deal with North Korea? Really?

And where do you get off making unsupported statements like "probably low level diplomats" You have produced zero evidence to support that surmise. What you've done here is generally known as "bloviating." You know, making things up to support your case.

Quit nick picking everything I say.  Jeez.  Please, give it a rest.