After Las Vegas massacre, Democrats urge gun laws; Republicans silent

[johnmcc6]

38 minutes ago, robblok said:

Your right, but i think gun ownership in the US is much higher as in the other countries. Too many guns around to take them away its not a realistic scenario i think. 

Many people I knew in Australia put their weapons in plastic drain pipes and buried them. One cannot compare a country as small as Australia with some 24 million people to size of the U S. There are still many shootings in Australia. The old drive by is a favorite.

[WaywardWind]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

You have no understanding of what the second amendment say or does not say based on what you stated in the above quote.  If you outlawed automatic weapons, and semi-automatic weapons in the USA tomorrow mass shooting would still occur. Gun ownership is extremely restricted in Europe but mass shootings  still occur (as evidenced by numerous mass shootings in France and other EU countries). Murder has already been outlawed, but it still occurs. There is something wrong with people, and that is harder to fix.

 

I have been a lawyer for 40 years and have litigated several firearm ownership and possession cases in the past. I have read Heller and McDonald in their entirety, as well as a number of cases which challenged other aspects of firearms ownership and use, the overwhelming majority failed and none of which modified the Supreme Court holdings.

 

I would be willing to wager that you do not have anywhere near that experience level, relying rather on your own opinions as controlling. I hate to burst your bubble, but the word of the Supreme Court carries much more weight than your mistaken opinions.

 

 

Edited October 3, 2017 by WaywardWind
typo

[FritsSikkink]

7 hours ago, inThailand said:

Guns don't kill. People do the killing.

People with guns kill.

[Andaman Al]

49 minutes ago, Ahab said:

https://crimeresearch.org/2017/01/with-39-killed-in-tunisia-attack-the-top-three-mass-public-shootings-are-outside-the-united-states/

45 of the 50 worst mass shootings worldwide have occurred outside the USA.

 

So 10% of the worst mass shootings have occurred in the United States and the USA only has  4.3 % of the worlds population, so they are doing more than double the amount of damage they should be by my reckoning. Don't you just hate statistics when they go against you.

[FritsSikkink]

Sounds about right:

[Silurian]

38 minutes ago, impulse said:

  

You're not getting it.  They (we) don't think we're superior.  We're suspicious of the elites who would curtail the average Joe's right to protect our families- the elites who congratulate each other and then go home to their gated community with armed private patrols.

 

 

No, I understand the point of view of gun rights. I also understand when it is taken too far as can be done with any particular belief. It is the zealots that I fear. These particular folks that hold onto a no room for compromise as they see it as failure. I am not saying that all gun advocates are elitist. I am stating there are a number of gun advocates that will never ever compromise on "no limitations" for gun sales and gun ownership. As gun owners see the right to bear arms, there is also another subset of people that wish to take away all gun rights. I personally believe there needs to be some sort of middle ground here but the zealots on both sides of the argument almost make it impossible for this to ever happen in the USA. Both sides live in the USA and both sides should be able to understand there needs to be compromises made for all individuals. In a modern society there are reasons for laws and regulations. Also, in modern society there needs to be an understanding of individual rights but those rights should not infringe upon others.

 

[craigt3365]

24 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

People with guns kill.

Millions of people have guns and never kill anybody.

[Golgota]

4 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Millions of people have guns and never kill anybody.

 

-America has six times as many firearm homicides as Canada, and nearly 16 times as many as Germany

-America has 4.4 percent of the world’s population, but almost half of the civilian-owned guns around the world

-There have been more than 1,500 mass shootings in US since Sandy Hook

 On average, there is more than one mass shooting for each day in America

-States with more guns have more gun deaths

-Programs that limit access to guns have decreased suicides

-In states with more guns, more police officers are also killed on duty

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, Golgota said:

 

-America has six times as many firearm homicides as Canada, and nearly 16 times as many as Germany

-America has 4.4 percent of the world’s population, but almost half of the civilian-owned guns around the world

-There have been more than 1,500 mass shootings in US since Sandy Hook

 On average, there is more than one mass shooting for each day in America

-States with more guns have more gun deaths

-Programs that limit access to guns have decreased suicides

-In states with more guns, more police officers are also killed on duty

America is almost 10 times bigger than Canada.  Germany had a very different past.  Not really fair to compare.

 

I agree with the stats.  Not sure why you are going after me.

[Golgota]

3 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

America is almost 10 times bigger than Canada.  Germany had a very different past.  Not really fair to compare.

 

I agree with the stats.  Not sure why you are going after me.

Sorry if you thought I was going after you, it was not my intention.

I just thought you pointed the "exception" of the USA and why any comparison with another country was useless so I compared with also states informations.

In my opinion and I think a majority of the world think this  : US has a problem with guns and they don't want to understand it

[craigt3365]

Just now, Golgota said:

Sorry if you thought I was going after you, it was not my intention.

I just thought you pointed the "exception" of the USA and why any comparison with another country was useless so I compared with also states informations.

In my opinion and I think a majority of the world think this  : US has a problem with guns and they don't want to understand it

The fact the US has a problem with guns is well known, well documented, and widely discussed.  I 100% agree it's a major problem.  And needs to be dealt with.

 

The citizens of the US understand it.  It's the politicians who are the problem.

[Golgota]

1 minute ago, craigt3365 said:

The fact the US has a problem with guns is well known, well documented, and widely discussed.  I 100% agree it's a major problem.  And needs to be dealt with.

 

The citizens of the US understand it.  It's the politicians who are the problem.

If you look at the reaction of the citizens, you can still see a huge gap between those in favor and those against., it is not like the government is working against the whole nation unfortunately.... You can read on this very thread how people still do not see the correlation between guns and deaths...making childish comparisons with cars for exemple, or the "people kill, not guns",...this is at best a troll reaction but I am thinking it is much more related to the fact that those ones do not have the intellectual capacities to see a simple fact : more guns = more death, deadlier weapons = even more deaths...

 

Jim Jefferies still has the best sketch to highlight  this problem 

[inThailand]

12 minutes ago, Golgota said:

If you look at the reaction of the citizens, you can still see a huge gap between those in favor and those against., it is not like the government is working against the whole nation unfortunately.... You can read on this very thread how people still do not see the correlation between guns and deaths...making childish comparisons with cars for exemple, or the "people kill, not guns",...this is at best a troll reaction but I am thinking it is much more related to the fact that those ones do not have the intellectual capacities to see a simple fact : more guns = more death, deadlier weapons = even more deaths...

 

Jim Jefferies still has the best sketch to highlight  this problem 

 

Using your logic killer Ferraris should be banned!

[Blue Muton]

8 hours ago, inThailand said:

Guns don't kill. People do the killing.

 

People with guns. I don't recall anyone going on a killing spree and killing 50+ people with anything else, apart from bombs, should those be allowed too?

[Blue Muton]

32 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

It's the politicians who are the problem.

 

And the arms industry that are allowed to line their pockets.

[Blue Muton]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

You have no understanding of what the second amendment say or does not say based on what you stated in the above quote.  If you outlawed automatic weapons, and semi-automatic weapons in the USA tomorrow mass shooting would still occur. Gun ownership is extremely restricted in Europe but mass shootings  still occur (as evidenced by numerous mass shootings in France and other EU countries). Murder has already been outlawed, but it still occurs. There is something wrong with people, and that is harder to fix.

 

It's even harder to fix when the government cuts $300 million of funding to fix them.

[Throatwobbler]

24 minutes ago, inThailand said:

 

Using your logic killer Ferraris should be banned!

A prime example of someone who just does not get. 

It seems on this thread that many people are scared that their shiny toys are going to be taken away and are throwing around all sorts of ridiculous arguments. Look we all get it, you want to play with your guns and you do not care how many people are slaughtered each year as long as you can have your gun. 

Edited October 3, 2017 by Throatwobbler

[oxo1947]

After the shootings in Las Vegas, Americans have a lot of questions they demand answers to.

.

Like who will play Stephen Paddock, and who will direct it...................

 

[Lupatria]

Nobody explained the US gun laws better than Homer Simpson:

 

“If we were Americans were not allowed to have any weapons, the King of England could at any time walk in here and push us around as he likes! Is that what you want?”

[sirineou]

I wonder how much pain it will take to convince the loonies on the right of the need for some reasonable regulation.

A National Database,  a background check, a reasonable waiting period,   No Gun show exclusions. 

[inThailand]

Most of us constitution lovers are not against banning assault rifes,  A bombs, tanks and my personal favorite... bazooks. But not the gum with the cartoons!

[Baerboxer]

7 hours ago, JAG said:

Automatic or even semi-automatic rifles are designed with one purpose and one purpose only, to kill people on a battlefield.

 

If you want a weapon to use for hunting a bolt-action rifle is fine ;  bears are hardly likely to attack you in massed waves now are they?

 

If you want a weapon for target shooting, a bolt-action rifle is fine for that.

 

If you feel a need for a weapon to "protect yourself" then a pistol seems more appropriate.

 

If you really must handle battlefield weapons then join your local Army Reserve unit, (although they may have reservations about taking you when they realise that is your motivation).

 

They have the National Guard in the US where people could experience battle grade weapons if they so wished. Of course it's a bit more than turning up as and when they get the urge!

 

Seriously, I agree with you. You don't need a GMPG or M-16 for home defense; and certainly not for hunting or target shooting. Single shot rifles, pistols and shot guns would seem adequate.

 

ps - be careful with bears. Upset one and they can come in force!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Quote

 

Ryan, when asked in an interview last month with the Associated Press about steps to diminish gun violence, said many mass shootings were at the hands of people with mental illnesses and said Congress needed to ensure that federal funds were available to address such illnesses.

 

 

Quote

The House, however, recently passed a massive funding bill for next year that would cut $306 million from the government's Substance Abuse and Mental Health Administration.

 

Typical double-talk, do-nothing BS...

Edited October 3, 2017 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Baerboxer]

3 minutes ago, inThailand said:

Most of us constitution lovers are not against banning assault rifes,  A bombs, tanks and my personal favorite... bazooks. But not the gum with the cartoons!

 

There's a big difference between having a shot-gun, pistol etc for home and personal carry defense than an assault rifle.

 

I wonder who'll be the first to arm his property with a nuclear device 555!  Do WalMart sell Claymores?

[rice555]

49 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I wonder how much pain it will take to convince the loonies on the right of the need for some reasonable regulation.

A National Database,  a background check, a reasonable waiting period,   No Gun show exclusions. 

I believe that Virginia and Texas are the only two $ & carry states, CA changed

that loophole over 27 years ago. Both the media and the uneducated keep

spreading untruths about facts.

The states make their own requirement/laws, not the fed's. 

rice555 

[Thaidream]

I have no  objection if a person wants to  have a revolver at home for protection or carries it with a properly authorized license but not open carry.  A person can be allowed a normal rifle or a shot gun for hunting.

 

This latest incident involved a man who had a total of 40 guns he purchased and at least 20 in his hotel room with a huge amount of ammunition.  A National database needs to be established putting limits on ownership of guns and ammunition. None of these limits violate the US Constitution. They are reasonable in a society that exists in the 21st century.  If one is a gun collector- then one can register as such and be exempted.

 

It is true that most of the mass shootings involve people who are mentally ill. More money must be put into this area of the healthcare system to identify these people and help them before they act out.  That is why it is so important to have a limit on gun ownership, a National database; and stop catering to organizations like the NRA who want to have everything from open carry to allowing people to own machine guns.  

 

It is also a fact that countries who have restricted gun ownership to their citizens such as the UK; Japan and Australia have less gun violence and murders than America. Guns do kill people and statics prove it. Lessen the number of people who own firearms and the difference is obvious.

[digger70]

10 hours ago, Phuket Man said:

Yep. With guns that are too easy to buy.

Stupid Statement ,,,,,So are cars /Knives/spearguns/Screw drivers /Broom handles/spades/Bamboo sticks.and Thousand more things one can Kill People.

[Blue Muton]

1 minute ago, digger70 said:

Stupid Statement ,,,,,So are cars /Knives/spearguns/Screw drivers /Broom handles/spades/Bamboo sticks.and Thousand more things one can Kill People.

 

 

Good Lord, the irony of you calling somebody else's (or indeed anybody else's) statement dumb, followed by your inane drivel.

[digger70]

2 minutes ago, Blue Muton said:

 

 

Good Lord, the irony of you calling somebody else's (or indeed anybody else's) statement dumb, followed by your inane drivel.

Drivel,My Arse,  No matter the good lord He hasn't got anything to do with this .You just can't handle the TRUTH.Get Real and own up to the TRUTH.

[Blue Muton]

1 minute ago, digger70 said:

Drivel,My Arse,  No matter the good lord He hasn't got anything to do with this .You just can't handle the TRUTH.Get Real and own up to the TRUTH.

 

Troll. Ignored from now on, more important things in life.