Senior Citizen - 82. Impossible to Get Insurance Moving Here Permanently?

[freedomnow]

Will no insurer touch someone at age 82 moving here to settle ?

Or will the exclusions and cost be so prohibitive that they may just have to rely on cash payment for anything to arises...?

(Yes, I know Thai medical costs are "quite high".)

[KittenKong]

Topic covered here: https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1004624-medical-travel-insurance-age-70-and-beyond/

 

[DGS1244]

Once you reach 70 it is almost impossible to get medical insurance in Thailand, unless you are willing to pay 500 USD a month minimum. Then you have exclusions and existing conditions so you virtually have no cover anyway.

 

[glasswort]

When I was working in HK I had BUPA cover and fortunately I was able to extend the cover to Thailand when I moved here fifteen years back. When I was 65 I did inquire whether, already being a BUPA client in HK I could get BUPA cover in Thailand. Needless to say the answer was a firm no. I am now 72 and have guaranteed cover for the rest of my life.

[JamesH]

But why would you need Medical Insurance. OK, if you use the private hospitals then they are probably expensive and costs may be hard to cover depending on your condition, from your living expenses/savings. What is is wrong with the Government hospitals? I had reason to visit my local hospital today, albeit I only spent about 10 minutes with a doctor but my bill amounted to the grand sum of Baht 50. Never had a problem with a Government hospital.

[hobobo]

11 minutes ago, JamesH said:

But why would you need Medical Insurance. OK, if you use the private hospitals then they are probably expensive and costs may be hard to cover depending on your condition, from your living expenses/savings. What is is wrong with the Government hospitals? I had reason to visit my local hospital today, albeit I only spent about 10 minutes with a doctor but my bill amounted to the grand sum of Baht 50. Never had a problem with a Government hospital.

I would go to a Government Hospital with an ingrown toenail, even a cracked rib. But I wouldn't trust them with managing my atherosclerosis...

[1FinickyOne]

As in most things, you get what you pay for... but for the OP - I think anyone running a business understands the risks of insuring someone your age. The premiums are going to be high to outrageous and likely not be of much use. They are trying to make a profit... many of us will face these issues as we age and medical gets more expensive... 

[thailand49]

32 minutes ago, glasswort said:

When I was working in HK I had BUPA cover and fortunately I was able to extend the cover to Thailand when I moved here fifteen years back. When I was 65 I did inquire whether, already being a BUPA client in HK I could get BUPA cover in Thailand. Needless to say the answer was a firm no. I am now 72 and have guaranteed cover for the rest of my life.

What I think you actually mean is " for the rest of my life " but not in Thailand because quoting "  the answer was a  firm no ".

Edited October 19, 2017 by thailand49

[glasswort]

7 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

What I think you actually mean is " for the rest of my life " but not in Thailand because quoting "  the answer was a  firm no ".

In Thailand but through BUPA HK

[Jonmarleesco]

I don't know of any, and I'm in the business. Upper limit tends to be 70 for life, possibly 74, or so, for health.

[Jonmarleesco]

3 hours ago, DGS1244 said:

Once you reach 70 it is almost impossible to get medical insurance in Thailand, unless you are willing to pay 500 USD a month minimum. Then you have exclusions and existing conditions so you virtually have no cover anyway.

 

The cost has nothing to do with the age at which you enter; it's the same for all members in the same age group, new or existing. Obviously pre-existing conditions would present a problem.

[tryasimight]

2 hours ago, hobobo said:

I would go to a Government Hospital with an ingrown toenail, even a cracked rib. But I wouldn't trust them with managing my atherosclerosis...

Then you pay, pretty simple isn't it?

They don't manage your atherosclerosis...you do.

So you pay....or not...same as in  most countries if you want priority treatment.

 

If you want to wait 12-18 months then it is much  cheaper.....,maybe even 'free'

Edited October 19, 2017 by tryasimight

[tryasimight]

2 hours ago, kenk24 said:

As in most things, you get what you pay for... but for the OP - I think anyone running a business understands the risks of insuring someone your age. The premiums are going to be high to outrageous and likely not be of much use. They are trying to make a profit... many of us will face these issues as we age and medical gets more expensive... 

I read recently that 80% of the country's health budget (Australia) is spent on patients in the last 3 months of their life.

 

I expect that would be similar for a lot of countries.

 

Nobody wants to see their loved ones die...but it will happen, it's inevitable .....perhaps the health budget would be better spent elsewhere?

[Enoon]

3 hours ago, tryasimight said:

I read recently that 80% of the country's health budget (Australia) is spent on patients in the last 3 months of their life.

 

I expect that would be similar for a lot of countries.

 

Nobody wants to see their loved ones die...but it will happen, it's inevitable .....perhaps the health budget would be better spent elsewhere?

 

"last 3 months of their life" usually means the last 3 months of a bag of wrinkled skin, incontinence and misery, because the greatest percentage of health budgets in developed countries is spent on the over 70's.

 

Time for a radical rethink on mortality and dealing with it (worldwide), because maintaining and keeping the unhealthy elderly alive is rapidly sucking whats left of the blood out of Western economies, and will do so to the developing world.

 

Let 'em die.

 

And make it easy for those who want to go before they become that wreck in a hospital bed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 19, 2017 by Enoon

[1FinickyOne]

7 hours ago, tryasimight said:

I read recently that 80% of the country's health budget (Australia) is spent on patients in the last 3 months of their life.

 

I expect that would be similar for a lot of countries.

 

Nobody wants to see their loved ones die...but it will happen, it's inevitable .....perhaps the health budget would be better spent elsewhere?

It is an interesting and difficult subject... For USA, I have read that $500,000 per person is spent in the last 6 months of their life...

 

Now, what if that same money were given when you were 21 or something like that... How might it have impacted your life. Pay for education, travel, starting a business, writing your novel,.. I would have to think that most people would have prefered the money when it might have benefitted in a different way than keeping them alive when they are in pain w/few prospects... and no recovery in sight... 

[jgarbo]

10 hours ago, JamesH said:

But why would you need Medical Insurance. OK, if you use the private hospitals then they are probably expensive and costs may be hard to cover depending on your condition, from your living expenses/savings. What is is wrong with the Government hospitals? I had reason to visit my local hospital today, albeit I only spent about 10 minutes with a doctor but my bill amounted to the grand sum of Baht 50. Never had a problem with a Government hospital.

Thai govt hospitals are excellent. Charge only for materials. And polite farang tend to get better treatment than locals. Private hospitals are a rip off, especially if you have insurance. Chula, my closest, gets crowded but Sirirat or Ramathibodi are very good. Had cataract surgery at Mahidol (on father-in-law's advice). Bt 36,000 total. Eyesight  better than when I was a teenager. London trained  doctor, very professional, double checked ID, procedure, explain risks before operating. In Australia, even with Medicare, would cost double.

Dental at Chula Special Clinic is excellent. Maybe 20 min wait. No complaints after 20 yrs.

Edited October 20, 2017 by jgarbo

[Mansell]

I am 73, and fortunately in extremely good health. My 41 year old girlfriend, not bragging just a fact, is in the insurance business. She has told me she will get me health insurance.....I am not sure it is possible, but she has been right about most things. I will post on here when I get the info from her probably in the next few weeks.

[MyFriend You]

10 hours ago, thailand49 said:

What I think you actually mean is " for the rest of my life " but not in Thailand because quoting "  the answer was a  firm no ".

No, he said  "fortunately I was able to extend the cover to Thailand when I moved here fifteen years back"  and is now 72 and has insurance 'in Thailand' for life...........at least thats how I read it.

[thailand49]

36 minutes ago, jgarbo said:

Thai govt hospitals are excellent. Charge only for materials. And polite farang tend to get better treatment than locals. Private hospitals are a rip off, especially if you have insurance. Chula, my closest, gets crowded but Sirirat or Ramathibodi are very good. Had cataract surgery at Mahidol (on father-in-law's advice). Bt 36,000 total. Eyesight  better than when I was a teenager. London trained  doctor, very professional, double checked ID, procedure, explain risks before operating. In Australia, even with Medicare, would cost double.

Dental at Chula Special Clinic is excellent. Maybe 20 min wait. No complaints after 20 yrs.

I would agree somewhat only for the hospital listed.  Sure we are talking in general.  The government you listed I read recently from another article here raving about the hospital listed, it surely is refreshing to know but I heard getting register is the key?  Basically, can I guy like me come from Pattaya and go to Chula for a checkup to get register. 

Back to government aside from these hospital outside of Bangkok, I don't have lots of confidence if they had to do more than the basic like cataract, which is a common procedure. 

Nice to know..

[Old Croc]

5 hours ago, Enoon said:

"last 3 months of their life" usually means the last 3 months of a bag of wrinkled skin, incontinence and misery, because the greatest percentage of health budgets in developed countries is spent on the over 70's.

Time for a radical rethink on mortality and dealing with it (worldwide), because maintaining and keeping the unhealthy elderly alive is rapidly sucking whats left of the blood out of Western economies, and will do so to the developing world.

Let 'em die.

And make it easy for those who want to go before they become that wreck in a hospital bed.

I'm a strong believer in voluntary euthanasia.

However, if someone is not ready to give up the ghost (become a ghost) are you going to be one of the god-like members of the panel who decides someone has hit the 3 months left mark, and cut all medical aid?

Another possible way to save health care money would be to put down the terminally stupid early in their miserable lives.

[Mansell]

40 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

I'm a strong believer in voluntary euthanasia.

However, if someone is not ready to give up the ghost (become a ghost) are you going to be one of the god-like members of the panel who decides someone has hit the 3 months left mark, and cut all medical aid?

Another possible way to save health care money would be to put down the terminally stupid early in their miserable lives.

If your statement is not tongue in cheek, I wonder who you think you are......Hitler or God?

[Lucky mike]

Health insurers are just the bookmakers of life ?

[sawadee1947]

14 hours ago, DGS1244 said:

Once you reach 70 it is almost impossible to get medical insurance in Thailand, unless you are willing to pay 500 USD a month minimum. Then you have exclusions and existing conditions so you virtually have no cover anyway.

 

seems you better will die before 70 in Thailand. BTW many Thais die at that age

[Marc K]

The thing to remember is that (private) healthcare costs in Thailand are no longer "cheap". I've been watching the costs at Bangkok Pattaya Hospital spiral out of control. Yes, sure, they are still cheaper than in the USA for sure, but if you have to pay everything out of your own pocket, given you have no insurance, it is becoming more more a concern.

Case in point -- routine dental cleaning used to be B800, then it was B1000 for some years, and yesterday it was B1690. That's quite an increase! Same doctor. Same service. I asked the dentist about it (who I love dearly) and she replied "well the extra money is not going to staff!"

I think Thailand may quickly lose its "medical tourism" edge, in favor of India where services are still much cheaper and English is spoken as a more or less native language. This makes communicating about more complex and perhaps personal problems easier.

I have gone to government hospitals on a couple of occasions and yes they are cheaper but English can be a bit spotty (yes, I am studying Thai and perhaps in 15 years I will be fluent! Hehe. That is another story!) and they are pleasant (for the most part) and try their best, but for complex problems I don't have the greatest confidence that you can get competent advice and treatment.

One more thing, I end up throwing out most of the drugs which are given to me in Thailand hospitals. The practice of over-prescribing is really out of control (and yes that is yet another story!)

 

[tpinvest]

The old adage " Prevention is better than cure"  needs to be applied to your health very seriously.

 

If you read "How not to die" by an American Doctor Greger you will learn how to avoid the serios

illnesses that plague the " You are going to die anyway" brigade who wish early death on themselves

much to the delight of Government Pension Departments and Insurers alike.

Give them a run for their money and start reading!!!  Get the book from Amazon, be careful there are a number with this title    -  DOCTOR GREGER  - all available as a Kindle file

[Old Croc]

3 hours ago, Mansell said:

If your statement is not tongue in cheek, I wonder who you think you are......Hitler or God?

I'm presuming you are referring to my last sentence only.

You would be a possible candidate along with Enoon.

[Chip Allen]

TVF seems to be top-heavy with Tories today.

[Grumpy Duck]

6 hours ago, jgarbo said:

Thai govt hospitals are excellent. Charge only for materials. And polite farang tend to get better treatment than locals. Private hospitals are a rip off, especially if you have insurance. Chula, my closest, gets crowded but Sirirat or Ramathibodi are very good. Had cataract surgery at Mahidol (on father-in-law's advice). Bt 36,000 total. Eyesight  better than when I was a teenager. London trained  doctor, very professional, double checked ID, procedure, explain risks before operating. In Australia, even with Medicare, would cost double.

Dental at Chula Special Clinic is excellent. Maybe 20 min wait. No complaints after 20 yrs.

I had cataract surgery in the US several years ago. My union insurance even paid the extra for toric lenses which the doctor said was $1500.  As I recall the bill was something like $35,000 per eye. The cataracs were caused by UV radiation, working in the sun all my life without sunglasses. The only complaints I have is I need damn reading glasses now a constant on off on off, and forgetting where I left my damn glasses. 555 plus I have a real problem with depth perception only when going downstairs. 

[Grumpy Duck]

7 hours ago, jgarbo said:

Thai govt hospitals are excellent. Charge only for materials. And polite farang tend to get better treatment than locals. Private hospitals are a rip off, especially if you have insurance. Chula, my closest, gets crowded but Sirirat or Ramathibodi are very good. Had cataract surgery at Mahidol (on father-in-law's advice). Bt 36,000 total. Eyesight  better than when I was a teenager. London trained  doctor, very professional, double checked ID, procedure, explain risks before operating. In Australia, even with Medicare, would cost double.

Dental at Chula Special Clinic is excellent. Maybe 20 min wait. No complaints after 20 yrs.

I find this to be true, I had terrible pain from kidney stones went to Ladphrao General I was bumped to the head of the line waiting. The doctor fees, nursing fees, x rays, iv, drugs for pain even a prepaid return and the total was about ฿5300. Even with Medicare in California I would have been charged a minimum of $180 + 10% co pay with a wait of many many hours (8 hrs would be average). My doctor treated me for chronic back pain for years, I came to Thailand to discover the pain was kidney stones. 5555. I also went to Paolo Hospital in Chock Chai once for colon pain. (Felt like my colon was tied in a knot) I do not remember what the diagnosis was, I think something like diverticulitis. Soon after a nephew was hospitalized and underwent surgery and several days in the hospital for the same thing. He is a firefighter and has great insurance, I will guess his co pay was $5000. I paid cash (about ฿2500) for outpatient care, Dr visit, nursing care, and several injections. 

Edited October 20, 2017 by Grumpy Duck
Iksnay

[Babylon]

Get in touch with Pacific Cross Health Insurance PCL. No broker between them and you. Their slogan is "At Pacific Cross Health Insurance all applicants are considered, regardless of age or health status, ensuring that we are able to fully service client requirements. Our personal customer focus enables us to be competitive in terms of cost without compromising on the quality of coverage. Pacific Cross Health Insurance offer individual (with guaranteed renewability) and group medical cover." Myself will move to Thailand on a multi entry retirement visa soon, and I will definitely contact them beforehand. I am female and 73 years young.