You are Going to Die – Are You Ready

[marko kok prong]

Having recently had an op,and having a fair part of my colon removed as well as an appendix that was just ready to burst and still recoverinng has made me think i am 53,and getting married soon,i will make a will in Bangkok at an English /Thai law firm,sso we both have copies in both languages,i have already made moves to ensure my uk investment fund has her as a beneficiary,and will do so with my super annuation fund in Australia i also thought the previous post of making a death manual a good idea,my Partner is an intelligent girl speaks and reads and write's good english. It's just that when i was in hospital she stayed every day with me and i thought how awful it would be if i did not make sure she was provided for in the event of my demise, so this is my mission when i am recovered,then at least i can shuffle off not worrying about that.

[greenchair]

On 11/19/2017 at 8:32 PM, sirineou said:

A Difficult subject at best. 

First mistake was marrying someone younger than me

.My wife is a lovely person (we do have our moments) we depend on each other a lot.

The thought that one day I will leave her alone disturbs me greatly. My daughter is a much stronger person and will be fine, but I worry about my wife. I wish we were closer in age and getting to that stage in life together.

 If I had to do it again I would marry someone closer to my age. It was a very selfish thing to do in my part.

 When I retire in two years I will be taking a reduced pension so that she also gets to keep it for life . Also I have bought a house in Florida on her name, She owns her parents home (was signed over to her when Dad died and we are now taking care of Mom) and we are in the process of building another house that will be finished in a couple of months in Thailand  ,  also I made sure she became a US citizen and send her to school so she has her a cosmetology and nail tech licence so if things get rough in Thailand she can always return to the US and work. so I think she will be ok  but who knows.

  But , nonetheless the thought of leaving her disturbs me greatly and I need to find a way to come to terms with it. 

once you get that thought in your mind hard to get it out.

I will be 61 in June   both parents died mid 80s

 

Her being younger is not the issue. My husband is 55 and I am 51. I am not so worried about my death as what will become of him when I'm dead. His 2 children  (1st marriage ) give him nothing took his house away from him and claimed it as their own. They have told him point blank he cannot live there in old age. I have bought a house for him and he has a retirement savings of 3 million of which he has signed over to me. If I died they would move on in and have his money spent in a month then leave him to fend for himself. He is diabetic and we have an 12 year family adopted son. I am wondering how to protect his money for him and have him recieve a weekly payment from it. 

If anyone has any ideas do tell. 

Like you, I worry endlessly what will become of them in the event of my death ?????

[Tippaporn]

On 11/21/2017 at 11:30 AM, bazza73 said:

If you can explain to me how someone discusses the death experience intelligently and seriously without actually experiencing death and coming back to tell us about it, I'm all ears.

The closest I've come to death is regular checkups employing anaesthesia. There's nothing there when I'm under, so I suspect there will be nothing there when I die.

Perhaps the Buddhist concept of nirvana - a state of nothingness - is the closest to the truth. And perhaps mankind is in denial with its various religions. The stark thought of becoming nothing when you die is too much for many people, so the promises of eternal life are more attractive.

Sometime in the next few days I'll fill your ears, bazza.  It needs to be a lengthy post since we're dealing with a complex subject.  Not only is there no quick, one-two-or-three sentence explanation but since all things are connected it's inevitable that other things get tied into the discussion as well.  As of now, though, I have too much work on my plate that I need to do.  The U.S. Thanksgiving holiday is neigh so I'll have a breather (when the cat is out the mice will play).

 

BTW, I will mention that I'm all up for an intelligent, serious discussion.  If any discussion gets out of hand, e.g. it simply degenerates into a chorus of derisiveness and inane blather and becomes devoid of quality input and genuine posts, then I'll be outta here in a New York minute.

 

Again, I have zero, and I mean zero interest in changing anyone's beliefs about anything.  That's a fool's task.  I'll offer what I know and I will leave it to others to consider the information, to think it through themselves, and to develop to their own conclusions.  I wouldn't want it any other way.  If anyone enters in then, by God, do bring your thinking mechanisms with you.  Sorry if this sounds a bit curt; it's not intended to be but I just want to get the point across that I am not interested in wasting my time or anybody else's.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Tippaporn

[Gruff]

On 11/20/2017 at 8:31 PM, Tippaporn said:

I'll keep it very simple for you, Gruff.  There are people in this world who are receptive to new information, new knowledge, new ideas.  And there are those who are not.  Which category do you fall into, Gruff?

 

Sure i have reassessed my life and the pre conditioning enforced upon me as a child. But re the after life i am with Giddyup and Bazza !

[Tippaporn]

7 hours ago, Gruff said:

Sure i have reassessed my life and the pre conditioning enforced upon me as a child. But re the after life i am with Giddyup and Bazza !

 

You make an extremely astute observation about the preconditioning we all experience from the cradle and on, Gruff.  If there be impediments to an understanding of this subject (and other subjects as well) then that preconditioning is certainly a prime barrier.  I would have much to say about that and other impediments that play in.

 

I'm going to try and post at least something initially today but I'll have to see how my day goes.  Besides work I currently have a friend from out of country in town who wants to meet up possibly today.   In bringing this subject up for a sane discussion there's more effort required on my part than anyone may realize.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎11‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 8:13 PM, canuckamuck said:

Being dead is going to be great but I will hang around a while yet. The second part is longer than the first.

Not if you believe in reincarnation.

Strange thing about that though, is if everybody that died comes back as another person, how come there are so many more of us now than before? Also, when the sun expands and consumes the earth, where will people be reincarnated to?

 

Anyway, interesting topic.

I hear death knocking on my door every day now, and I'll be happy enough to leave this body behind. It's definitely not a good edition and has way too many defects. However, seems that death doesn't want me yet, and given euthanasia isn't legal yet, and suicide isn't guaranteed to work ( leaving me worse off than now ), I'll just have to keep on keeping on, till the end finally comes along. I wonder if I'll get to meet up with my brother and mother again? I mean, no one knows, do they, regardless of near death experiences.

Anyway, it's all a bit scary- if I don't give money to that beggar will I burn forever with a demon sticking a red hot poker up my ass? I'd prefer nothing to that, as would we all, yet we want something like that for Mao and Stalin and Hitler, and maybe even the hag from hell that ruined my life. Like I say, no one knows.

I do know though, that I'd like to go out in a Viagra fuelled orgy with several lovely young ladies, after spending every last cent of my somewhat diminished nest egg ( I don't know anyone needs any of it and no children to take care of ). I would have left it to my wife if she hadn't turned out to be such a downer, but my remaining mission in life is to spend it all before she can get any of it.

What I don't want though, is to spend like there's no tomorrow, and then find out there an entire train load of tomorrows still waiting for me.

 

If Life is anything, it's been a big joke on me. That's for sure.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎11‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 11:30 AM, bazza73 said:

If you can explain to me how someone discusses the death experience intelligently and seriously without actually experiencing death and coming back to tell us about it, I'm all ears.

The closest I've come to death is regular checkups employing anaesthesia. There's nothing there when I'm under, so I suspect there will be nothing there when I die.

Perhaps the Buddhist concept of nirvana - a state of nothingness - is the closest to the truth. And perhaps mankind is in denial with its various religions. The stark thought of becoming nothing when you die is too much for many people, so the promises of eternal life are more attractive.

One of the side effects of anaesthetic is amnesia, so a lot might have happened, but you just don't remember it. I have amazing dreams, but rarely remember to think of them before they are gone, so unremembered.

Google say this about nirvana, which is hardly nothing.

a transcendent state in which there is neither suffering, desire, nor sense of self, and the subject is released from the effects of karma and the cycle of death and rebirth.

 

As for religion, that was merely a means for the men in funny hats to impose their will on the unfortunates, and to get money and food ( sacrifices ) from the minions. In my experience it has very little to do with mankind's soul.

Personally I'd rather be nothing than in hell, and there are too many things ( like not doing what they say ), according to the men in funny hats,  to send us there, that any of us would be able to escape it ( if it exists like they say ). 

In a world where blowing innocents up leads one to paradise with a virtually unlimited supply of virgins ( though I don't see the attraction of sex with someone that knows nothing about it ), it's a bit hard to actually believe in it. However, that's what logic tells us and when all alone in the dark with Death knocking on the door, I doubt anyone is putting logic over absolute gibbering fear of the unknown.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎11‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 3:31 AM, Tippaporn said:

I'll keep it very simple for you, Gruff.  There are people in this world who are receptive to new information, new knowledge, new ideas.  And there are those who are not.  Which category do you fall into, Gruff?

You would have liked my mother. She apparently had a meeting with my dead brother and absolutely believed it happened, but without any proof other than blind faith.

I'm not saying she didn't, just that it's unknowable by the rest us.

What I do know is that if someone wants something enough, they can usually achieve it, even if it's just in their mind.

Everything that we think or "know" is just electricity arranged in a certain pattern in our brain, therefore it would be logical to believe that if we manipulate the electricity in our brain in a certain way we can see anything, even if we are the only ones to do so.

The real question perhaps is if what we see is real, or just our minds telling us what we want to believe? The Matrix...............................?

[Once Bitten]

This morning when I woke up a thought sprang into my mind , normally the first thing I think about is how happy I am that I actually woke up and I'm still around .  This occurred to me , here's me thinking and fretting about my age and whats possibly in store down the road . 

 

 Here's me worrying and trying to mentally get my self prepared for the grim reapers knock on my door . Then it struck me 

I am a very lucky person when I think of the countless  people I have known that are not around any more . They for varied reasons have all passed away. Some had their whole lives before them some met an untimely tragic end in their later years .  So here's me still around at 67 and in relatively good health,  when so many people Ive know in the past have all ready gone . So many who never reached the age of 67 . In stead of looking negatively at my situation I should really be overjoyed that ive got this far and consider my self very lucky . 
 

 

 

[Pilotman]

I decided long ago that I would do all the necessary  paperwork, wills etc, sort out the  money and titles and then forget about it.   I am 70 and try to live, eat, exercise and try to indulge  my predilections like a 45 year old.  So far it's working.  My attitude is fxxk death  in its various forms and  the Grim Reaper can pxxx off and leave me be. until I am good and ready    

[bazza73]

2 hours ago, Pilotman said:

I decided long ago that I would do all the necessary  paperwork, wills etc, sort out the  money and titles and then forget about it.   I am 70 and try to live, eat, exercise and try to indulge  my predilections like a 45 year old.  So far it's working.  My attitude is fxxk death  in its various forms and  the Grim Reaper can pxxx off and leave me be. until I am good and ready    

Predilections? You are raising the tone of this discussion.

[balo]

12 hours ago, Once Bitten said:

So many who never reached the age of 67 . In stead of looking negatively at my situation I should really be overjoyed that ive got this far and consider my self very lucky . 

 

Yes, and then make the most of it. Try to live a healthy life , you could live until you're 90 . Daily exercise is the key . I will catch up on you in about 18 years

So many questions ,  will I have terrible pain ? Will I die of cancer ? Will I avoid accidents ?  Too much to think about , no need to plan anything , just live day by day and hope you will get old. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ulysses G.]

On 11/19/2017 at 6:58 AM, Jip99 said:

 

Odd, isn't it, that ALL Thais believe that the next life is going to be better than this one.

 

 

What if it isn't ?

 

That is something I think about too. Much of this life has not been all that great. I guess I can't blame religious folks for using it to ignore those doubts.

[OneMoreFarang]

Until about a year ago there was an old guy who visited Soi Cowboy almost every afternoon. He played with all the young girls in three bars for a couple of hours and then from time to time he took some of them out. At the end of his life he did the same but at that time the girls helped him to carry his life support equipment from bar to bar.

 

RIP Robert, I think you enjoyed every day of your life as long as you could.

Edited November 26, 2017 by OneMoreFarang

[OneMoreFarang]

Nightingale took another drag on his cigarette before continuing. ‘Say I live until I’m seventy-five without smoking. And say I die at seventy if I do smoke. I lose five years. But really, Jenny, what am I going to be doing during those five years? Sitting in a bedsit somewhere watching the football, assuming I’ve enough of a pension to be able to afford Sky Sport?’ from Stephen Leather's novel Nightmare.

[bannork]

15 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Nightingale took another drag on his cigarette before continuing. ‘Say I live until I’m seventy-five without smoking. And say I die at seventy if I do smoke. I lose five years. But really, Jenny, what am I going to be doing during those five years? Sitting in a bedsit somewhere watching the football, assuming I’ve enough of a pension to be able to afford Sky Sport?’ from Stephen Leather's novel Nightmare.

If he supported Hull City as I do,  Nightingale wouldnt have lived beyond 65.

[Tippaporn]

Throughout our known history it's apparent that no one has been able to provide physical proof of an afterlife.  Since no such proof has emerged to answer a question that most everyone has asked at one time or another in their lives then it's only natural that people's only other option for understanding would be to resort to rationalized, or not, conjecture, or from interpretations of tales of others who claim to have experienced the other side, or through their religion's version of what becomes of us after death.

 

For anyone wishing to gain an accurate understanding of death a good question to ask would be what impediments exist which may unknowingly upset such an endeavor.  Here I'm not referring to or insinuating outside forces which would bar us (as to my knowledge there are none) but rather those factors of obstruction which are certainly under our control . . . once we have an awareness of them.

 

As I mentioned, Gruff brought up an excellent one: preconditioning.  I think of it more as indoctrination.  From the cradle on we have had impressed upon us ideas which were to meant to explain and define the world.  Initially and predominately those ideas were given us by our parents, family, teachers and, for some, our religions.  Most children view their parents, and grownups in general, as infallible experts of reality and thus more or less blindly accept whatever ideas are presented.

 

But even as small children we are much wiser than anyone would give children credit for.  We don't really accept everything told us because we come into this world not as empty slates but rather with considerable knowledge.  So small children do question and compare what is being told them to what they know.  And we all well know what happens next.  Conformity.  If we oppose what is told us we are usually, and quite swiftly, encouraged to reconsider.

 

That encouragement may take various forms.  It may take the form of, say, our parents lovingly and gently explaining the idea to us so that we are sure to understand.  Or, it can be an admonishment.  It can be ridicule, or contempt, or mockery.  In the extreme punishment and abuse can be employed; physical, psychological or otherwise.

 

In summation what I'm trying to point out is that all of us have, to whatever extent, accepted ideas blindly, many of them false, and to this day accept many of those ideas as fact when, in truth, they are simply beliefs.  As Mark Twain famously quipped, “What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so.”  Misconceptions constitute a formidable barrier to uncovering the truth of this reality.

 

Samuel Clemens was, in my humble opinion, extremely gifted in has powers of observation.  His simple statement, while put humourously, has profound implications.  Every generation fancies itself to have reality more or less sussed out correctly.  So I would ask, if so, then why as a species do we still wage war?  Why is poverty as prevalent as it is?  How is it that abuses of power are the norm rather than sage governance?  If the current, in vogue, mass accepted set of ideas and beliefs we hold are, as we would like to believe, even fairly accurate then why does our world fall so short to the ideals which lay in most people's hearts?

 

Conformity's negative effects have not escaped us, either.  How willing would some be to disclose their privately held ideas to the world at large if those ideas are known to run counter to mass consensus?  Not likely, would be my guess.  Most would prefer not to expose themselves to the scorn, ridicule, contempt, or worse which would be heaped upon them by their fellows.

 

In truth we know little of ideas.  Where they come from and what their effects to our personal or mass reality may be, for instance.  From my understanding ideas are the paints which we use to create our private and mass realities; so that we may see their effects in our world and, if not pleased with the results, change them up.  Ideas were meant to be used by us playfully.  In order that we can learn and grow.  Instead we have turned them into guardians which act to prevent us from exploring new ideas.  The world changes very, very slowly, does it not?

 

The above is not nearly as in depth as I'd like it to be but hopefully it does convey sense and clarity.  I guess I'll find out when, or if, responses start to trickle out.  Another important impediment I'd like to raise regards having enough of the puzzle pieces to be able to formulate a cohesive, comprehensive, and perhaps more accurate alternate view of life (and death, the two being inextricably intertwined).  For now I'm out of time.

[giddyup]

1 hour ago, Tippaporn said:

 The above is not nearly as in depth as I'd like it to be but hopefully it does convey sense and clarity.  I guess I'll find out when, or if, responses start to trickle out.  Another important impediment I'd like to raise regards having enough of the puzzle pieces to be able to formulate a cohesive, comprehensive, and perhaps more accurate alternate view of life (and death, the two being inextricably intertwined).  For now I'm out of time.

What a cop out! There I was hoping that you were going to give some definitive answers as to what happens when we die (as promised), but all I get is a lot of waffle that explains nothing, other than you don't know any more than the rest of us. 

 

Edit: Please don't bother with any kind of "in depth" follow- up if it's only going to be more of the same. Beware of false prophets!

Edited November 26, 2017 by giddyup

[Tippaporn]

1 hour ago, giddyup said:

What a cop out! There I was hoping that you were going to give some definitive answers as to what happens when we die (as promised), but all I get is a lot of waffle that explains nothing, other than you don't know any more than the rest of us. 

 

Edit: Please don't bother with any kind of "in depth" follow- up if it's only going to be more of the same. Beware of false prophets!

And here I thought you bid me farewell, giddyup.  LOL.  Welcome back and I'm happy to see you in good form.

 

I don't have much time today but I would be willing to respond if I can do so in short.  Since giddyup brought it up then I'll clarify.  I have information that I'm willing to offer.  Humans are complex beings and we deal with complex subject matter.  The subject of death, as I've mentioned before, is not to be explained in a sentence or two.  Sorry to disappoint.  From my experience any information would best be presented with some structure if the intent is to have it be understood at all.  Think in terms of any school classes.  Subject matter isn't presented ad lib or disjointed.  Same same.

[giddyup]

19 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

And here I thought you bid me farewell, giddyup.  LOL.  Welcome back and I'm happy to see you in good form.

 

I don't have much time today but I would be willing to respond if I can do so in short.  Since giddyup brought it up then I'll clarify.  I have information that I'm willing to offer.  Humans are complex beings and we deal with complex subject matter.  The subject of death, as I've mentioned before, is not to be explained in a sentence or two.  Sorry to disappoint.  From my experience any information would best be presented with some structure if the intent is to have it be understood at all.  Think in terms of any school classes.  Subject matter isn't presented ad lib or disjointed.  Same same.

More ducking and weaving.

[totally thaied up]

 

When I was 19 and then 25, I almost died on two occasions. Both times, I can not remember a damn thing. Just blanket nothing. Pain, no lights, just lots of pain but also nothing like before you are born. The parts leading up to it I can remember; the pain and just about everything that went with it, but those parts I feel got controlled by the ICU team of doctors and the drugs they used to bring me back.

 

I got gun whipped in the Philippines in a robbery in a cab. It did not kill me, but I was in a different form of unconsciousness compared to the other times and my mind was still awake, and it terrified me greatly. I was awake but asleep. I cannot tell you how disconcerting it was and I was close to death. When I returned back to work, I was never the same.

 

Something got rattled around in my brain.

 

I am now 48 and very ill. I have not got a long life it seems. Maybe another ten years if I am lucky. My body and my stomach are a real mess, but death now scares me in only one sense in a way. I do not want my brain and body to go through what my mind mentally did when I was gun whipped and have the horror and pain that went hand in hand with a close death call like that.

 

Death and its doorway is just now the end game to it all. I am scared yes more so only of the pain in the ending of the trip as I have been in the doorway three times now and always felt nothing is there. 

If something was there, I now think I should have had some inkling of guidance but much like when your being put under for an Operation, next minute you're awake, then asleep into a deep space of nothingness, much so likely has been my experience of knocking on death's door.

 

Just a sense of nothingness. My sister who is deeply religious says that is correct; a nothingness until you will rise again but I just don't get it and will never get it as I do not have a religious bone in my body.

 

So I only live now and be happy and don't hurt others. That's all we can do.

[seancbk]

17 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

And here I thought you bid me farewell, giddyup.  LOL.  Welcome back and I'm happy to see you in good form.

 

I don't have much time today but I would be willing to respond if I can do so in short.  Since giddyup brought it up then I'll clarify.  I have information that I'm willing to offer.  Humans are complex beings and we deal with complex subject matter.  The subject of death, as I've mentioned before, is not to be explained in a sentence or two.  Sorry to disappoint.  From my experience any information would best be presented with some structure if the intent is to have it be understood at all.  Think in terms of any school classes.  Subject matter isn't presented ad lib or disjointed.  Same same.

 

How many drugs have you taken?

[Tippaporn]

2 minutes ago, seancbk said:

How many drugs have you taken?

Why would you say that, seancbk?  Can you explain?  Does nothing I've written so far have the slightest modicum of sense?  And if you disagree so far what would your ideas/theories/beliefs be?  What information or evidence, if any, do you have to substantiate those ideas/theories/beliefs?  If information or evidence is lacking then what is the rationale that leads you to conclude that your ideas are fact, or that your beliefs are accurate?

[Tippaporn]

2 minutes ago, seancbk said:

How many drugs have you taken?

Why would you say that, seancbk?  Can you explain?  Does nothing I've written so far have the slightest modicum of sense?  And if you disagree so far what would your ideas/theories/beliefs be?  What information or evidence, if any, do you have to substantiate those ideas/theories/beliefs?  If information or evidence is lacking then what is the rationale that leads you to conclude that your ideas are fact, or that your beliefs are accurate?

[Tippaporn]

This is the 2nd time now that I've posted early AM and as soon as I hit submit TV has a host error and I end up with a double post.  Now I have seancbk's quote text box that I can't get rid of.

32 minutes ago, seancbk said:

x

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 4:23 AM, balo said:

 

Yes, and then make the most of it. Try to live a healthy life , you could live until you're 90 . Daily exercise is the key . I will catch up on you in about 18 years

So many questions ,  will I have terrible pain ? Will I die of cancer ? Will I avoid accidents ?  Too much to think about , no need to plan anything , just live day by day and hope you will get old. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

hope you will get old.

 

LOL. I got old and wished I hadn't. I had the opportunity to spend all my money on wine women and song etc, and let the big C take me, but I was still quite young so I didn't, but I never knew how bad the side effects of the "cure" would be.

Never mind, one day I hope I never wake up, which would be a brilliant way to pass on.

 

Dylan Thomas, 1914 - 1953

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

 

Won't be much raging on my part when the fella with the scythe comes a knockin'.

Seriously, old age sucks, and not in a good way.

[seancbk]

7 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

8 hours ago, seancbk said:

How many drugs have you taken?

Why would you say that, seancbk?  Can you explain?  Does nothing I've written so far have the slightest modicum of sense?  And if you disagree so far what would your ideas/theories/beliefs be?  What information or evidence, if any, do you have to substantiate those ideas/theories/beliefs?  If information or evidence is lacking then what is the rationale that leads you to conclude that your ideas are fact, or that your beliefs are accurate?

 

I say it (jokingly) because you've not said anything concrete.  You claimed to have some deep insight yet instead of providing details or any proof you waffled on about ideas.

You know no more than anyone else about what happens when we die.

I will tell you what I believe.   The human brain operates on a mere 20 watts of electricity, barely enough to run a dim light bulb, yet with that low power we have a biological quantum computer that in many ways outperforms even the best supercomputers.  But what happens to the electricity coursing through a computer when you turn it off?  Does that electricity jump somewhere else?  No, it simply stops flowing and the computer stops working.   The same happens to our human computers (us), once the power stops we stop.  The electricity flowing through our brains is not "us" it doesn't contain anything it is merely the energy that makes our biological computers work.  Death is the end for us in the same way pulling the plug on a PC turns it off and it is no longer a functioning item.

The analogy between humans and computers can be taken much further, we are not actually networked so and data transfer has to be done by 'sneaker net'  (Google it).  Then again we have built a huge replacement brain that we can all access (the internet) and we are getting better and better devices for accessing that collective brain (smart phones).  Once we have implanted devices to access the internet (contact  lenses for HUD displays, better voice recognition for speech access, eye tracking for visual 'computer mouse input', then your 'interface' to our collective store of knowledge and media will be much more seamless.   

Now although I currently believe death is the final end and there is nothing once we die, I also believe that we are going to achieve the technological breakthroughs required for immortality within (hopefully) 30 years.  We will figure out how to download a human brain (wetware) into actual hardware, proving once and for all that the person is just the contents of the brain (no soul exists).   Once we achieve that, people will no longer die, they will merely transition into 'Second Life'  (a place incidentally that already exists).  A virtual reality world with no physical limitations.   People in the 'real world' will enter 'Second Life' to interact with those who've transitioned through the use of VR goggles.    The technological advancements in VR and CGI will mean that the Second Life environment will be indistinguishable from Real Life, except for it being vastly better (no restrictions on scale, physics, biology or anything.... you can do or be whatever you want in that virtual plane).

The move to this virtual, digital existence, will ultimately be what allows our species to travel the Universe.  Once we are digitally immortal timeframes of 100,000,000 years to travel across the galaxy will be possible.  So perhaps large groups of people (100's of millions may opt to head out on voyages of discovery.     This idea is sort of covered in the short stories at this link - http://localroger.com/

Ultimately, whilst I hope I'm around when humanity changes from biological to digital, chances are pretty slim and even if I am around the first people to get the opportunity will be the world's billionaires (trillionaires in 30 years most likely).    Start saving Bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies if you want to have a chance at being amongst the first billion people to become immortal.

 

[Kwasaki]

On 11/27/2017 at 5:51 AM, giddyup said:

but all I get is a lot of waffle that explains nothing, other than you don't know any more than the rest of us. 

What did you expect. 

[Tippaporn]

3 hours ago, seancbk said:

 

I say it (jokingly) because you've not said anything concrete.  You claimed to have some deep insight yet instead of providing details or any proof you waffled on about ideas.

You know no more than anyone else about what happens when we die.

I will tell you what I believe.   The human brain operates on a mere 20 watts of electricity, barely enough to run a dim light bulb, yet with that low power we have a biological quantum computer that in many ways outperforms even the best supercomputers.  But what happens to the electricity coursing through a computer when you turn it off?  Does that electricity jump somewhere else?  No, it simply stops flowing and the computer stops working.   The same happens to our human computers (us), once the power stops we stop.  The electricity flowing through our brains is not "us" it doesn't contain anything it is merely the energy that makes our biological computers work.  Death is the end for us in the same way pulling the plug on a PC turns it off and it is no longer a functioning item.

The analogy between humans and computers can be taken much further, we are not actually networked so and data transfer has to be done by 'sneaker net'  (Google it).  Then again we have built a huge replacement brain that we can all access (the internet) and we are getting better and better devices for accessing that collective brain (smart phones).  Once we have implanted devices to access the internet (contact  lenses for HUD displays, better voice recognition for speech access, eye tracking for visual 'computer mouse input', then your 'interface' to our collective store of knowledge and media will be much more seamless.   

Now although I currently believe death is the final end and there is nothing once we die, I also believe that we are going to achieve the technological breakthroughs required for immortality within (hopefully) 30 years.  We will figure out how to download a human brain (wetware) into actual hardware, proving once and for all that the person is just the contents of the brain (no soul exists).   Once we achieve that, people will no longer die, they will merely transition into 'Second Life'  (a place incidentally that already exists).  A virtual reality world with no physical limitations.   People in the 'real world' will enter 'Second Life' to interact with those who've transitioned through the use of VR goggles.    The technological advancements in VR and CGI will mean that the Second Life environment will be indistinguishable from Real Life, except for it being vastly better (no restrictions on scale, physics, biology or anything.... you can do or be whatever you want in that virtual plane).

The move to this virtual, digital existence, will ultimately be what allows our species to travel the Universe.  Once we are digitally immortal timeframes of 100,000,000 years to travel across the galaxy will be possible.  So perhaps large groups of people (100's of millions may opt to head out on voyages of discovery.     This idea is sort of covered in the short stories at this link - http://localroger.com/

Ultimately, whilst I hope I'm around when humanity changes from biological to digital, chances are pretty slim and even if I am around the first people to get the opportunity will be the world's billionaires (trillionaires in 30 years most likely).    Start saving Bitcoins and other cryptocurrencies if you want to have a chance at being amongst the first billion people to become immortal.

 

An intelligent reply . . . finally.  Thank you.

 

LOL, people here truly are an impatient lot.  O.K., if that's what you want then I'll dispense with any foundational information and get right to the punchline.

 

The answer to why no one will ever be able to deliver physical proof of an afterlife is contained within a simple phrase we're all familiar with:  "You can't take it with you."  In other words, the after death environment is not physical.  That might be a bit tough for people to understand when all they've known, the only reality they generally have awareness of, is the physical world.

 

Anyone who is cognizant of their dreams may have a at least a bridge for understanding the concept of multiple realities.  I'm an avid dreamer, I have a great deal of dream recall, and I've come "awake" in my dreams on several occasions.  Meaning, of course, you're normal consciousness becomes fully aware that it is in a dream environment.  Bottom line is, our dear old physical world, which I call physical reality, is not the only one.  In that regard, the person you see in the mirror is only a part of who you are.

 

Now as to evidence of an afterlife, since you "can't take it with you," then neither can you do the reverse.  But there is a way to experience the afterlife environment before you die.  I'll use an analogy that should help people to connect to an understanding of what it takes to experience that environment.  Is anyone here familiar with stereograms?

 

 

This one's a bit bigger than I'd like but perhaps it will work better because of it's size.  While it appears you're looking at nothing more than a random pattern refocusing the eyes will reveal an image of something else.  This is merely an example of refocusing the eyes.  To experience the after life environment, or any reality other than our familiar one requires a refocusing of your consciousness.  Some people have trouble refocusing their eyes to see the actual image meant to be portrayed.  Refocusing your consciousness would be perhaps a bit more difficult.  It can be done, though.  It has been done.  And it is anything but unnatural.

 

Beware, though, that some may feel they're losing their sanity if they suddenly found themselves in a very unfamiliar environment, an environment where the rules governing that environment may be as foreign as the environment itself.  Most on this site have lots of experience traveling to different countries, different parts of the world.  Traveling to another country which is very different from your home country may involve some disorientation.  It's only natural that altering your consciousness would be disorientating as well.  But just as familiarity eventually sets in when traveling to a very foreign country so too familiarity sets in with experience.

 

Science has indeed uncovered it's share of truths.  One of them is that time doesn't really exist.  Everything is happening at once.  Any theory of an after life, any explanation of what this world truly is, must account for that truth.  Another truth science has recognized, and one that I agree is valid, is that energy cannot be destroyed.  It can only be transmuted.  We know very, very, very little of who we truly are (O.K., in my opinion).  So I'll deliver another punch line.  Everything that is known is composed of energy.  We are composed of energy.  We are energy.  And since energy cannot be destroyed we are then . . . eternal.  No need to devise a technological means to give you eternal life.  We have it already.

 

Death is a transformation.  A necessary one.  If that statement is not understood I can empathize.  But it can be understood.  Reincarnation doesn't really exist as one life after another.  They're all happening at once.  There is no such thing as a closed system.  And since no system is closed (the expression, "no man is an island" comes to mind) then pathways exist between all realities.  And if pathways exist then so too does travel.  Travel is not done using physical ships (which simply wouldn't work in other realities) but with our consciousness.

 

O.K., I'm sure that will all make sense to everyone.  Let the flaming begin . . . 

 

BTW, seanbck, while our technology has created marvelous toys and devices and plenty of weapons for death and destruction as well I, myself, would not hold out for technology to produce eternal life for us.  And what for???  We're eternal anyway.  Besides, living inside a box doesn't seem appealing to me.  What if someone tripped over the power chord?  How would you have sex?  

 

In any case, thanks for a decent reply, seancbk.

Edited November 28, 2017 by Tippaporn

[bazza73]

4 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

So I'll deliver another punch line.  Everything that is known is composed of energy.  We are composed of energy.  We are energy.  And since energy cannot be destroyed we are then . . . eternal.  No need to devise a technological means to give you eternal life.  We have it already.

No we are not. We are matter. We can produce energy if our bodies are cremated; however, we then react to form mostly carbon dioxide and water, with a few oxides of nitrogen as well. That is still matter.

So anyone who agrees with you is intelligent, and anyone who begs to differ is unintelligent. What BS.

Let me know when you start passing the collection plate around so I can absent myself.