Why each Thai Consulates, have so many differents requirements, is it logical ?

[Danielsiam]

Well, normally thinking, each Thai Consulates, should have the same requirements, in the logical way.

 

Exemple only Vientiane, Penang, & Savannakhet are issuing a Non "O" Visa for being father of Thai kid. The other Consulates, you will be turned away, is that normal ?!

 

In my country, EU country. No way to give any kind of that visa on Thai Consulates, if being father of Thai kid. You may even need to wait for 3 months for apply a TR visa, if you previously been in Thailand

 

They're asking even the original of your bank statement, some are asking nothing, some are asking tickets airplane, 

 

All kinds of combination

 

Even they don't dare to answer to the e-mail you sent to them, when you're asking some questions especially for the Non-O visa if being father should be fine.

When finally reach them on the phone ; They told "you check-on the website about MFA of Thailand".. hmm

 

But the main the problem, is that being of father of Thai kid.. most Consulates turn us over, we don't know even know if they're more Consulate, giving that kind of visa on this situation

 

Sorry for the criticism, but have also the right of comment, on theses random requirements which is kafkaesque and arnachic, because it should be nearly the same requirements for all Consulates, as they're affiliated to the MFA

 

Edited January 8, 2018 by Danielsiam

[tonray]

Different locations have different demands on Visa applications and also must respect certain aspects of their host relationship with the country they are stationed at. Every consulate has it's own staffing and budget demands and also likely given certain quotas and limits from higher ups, all which lead to differing requirements for applicants.

[BritTim]

I agree with the main thrust of your argument, especially on provision of family visas. Whether you are allowed to visit Thailand to spend time with your Thai child should not depend on the whim of the senior local consular official. I suspect you may be from France, apparently just about the worst among developed nations for Thai visa applications.

[elviajero]

4 hours ago, Danielsiam said:

Well, normally thinking, each Thai Consulates, should have the same requirements, in the logical way.

Logical for us, but not logical for the Embassies/Consulates who are part of immigration control.

[Borzandy]

Did you ever find something logical in any Thai institution?

[curtklay]

Logic? In Thailand?

[Langsuan Man]

Thai Consulates are different even within the same country

 

Visa requirements are different depending upon which of the three Thai Consulates in the US you apply for a visa from (LA, Chicago, NY)  and can be different than the Embassy in Washington, D.C. 

[moe666]

The requirements are all the same it is that little sentence at the end of requirements that states more information may be requested by the interviewing official that trips up many.

[ubonjoe]

A inflammatory off topic post has been removed.

[Proboscis]

The issues you have pointed to that differ between individual consulates are the most striking. But then no one ever gets to challenge them because they are outside the jurisdiction and are unable to bring the case to court.

 

I think that the problem arises from the complexity of the immigration system, with new rules tacked on every year. A politician decides he is going to clean up crime and very soon we have another restriction. Or there are too many Chinese coming in to live and another restriction is dreamed up that really only affects Westerners.

 

Recently, on arriving in the Kingdom the immigration officer did a gotcha look twice (once when he saw that my multiple entry visa was out of date and once when he saw that I had used up my two visa waivers for 2017 only to realise that it is now 2018). There appears to be no specific rule as to how many visa runs you may do before you will be denied entry for sure. To completely understand all the possibilities and probabilities you would need the equivalent of a PhD in knowledge for all the permutations and combinations.

 

I was recently in Cambodia and found out that there are at least 100,000 Western foreigners living in the country (not including visitors). The country is doing well economically (actually too well given the traffic in the capital!). In Thailand all I hear is doom and gloom from both expats and locals. Sure, Cambodia is not going to suit everyone who has lived in Thailand but it does have the benefit of at least allowing you to stay in country on a year visa without constantly having to report. And getting a work permit for a real job is not difficult, if you need to earn a crust.

[Suradit69]

14 hours ago, Danielsiam said:

Well, normally thinking, each Thai Consulates, should have the same requirements, in the logical way.

Most countries' embassies would have different rules or apply them differently depending on the country in which they operate.

 

Certainly the US or German embassy in Australia would treat applications for visas differently from their embassies in Nigeria or in Venezuela or even Thailand, for example. Different circumstances require different rules. "In the logical way,"  politics, international relationships and economic conditions all come into play. There is no expectation that embassies or consulates deal with foreign nationals in a democratic, one-size-fits-all sort of way. It's not some game played on a level field.

[canerandagio]

7 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

Most countries' embassies would have different rules or apply them differently depending on the country in which they operate.

 

Certainly the US or German embassy in Australia would treat applications for visas differently from their embassies in Nigeria or in Venezuela or even Thailand, for example. Different circumstances require different rules. "In the logical way,"  politics, international relationships and economic conditions all come into play. There is no expectation that embassies or consulates deal with foreign nationals in a democratic, one-size-fits-all sort of way. It's not some game played on a level field.

LOVE THIS. A bit of wisdom among a bunch of Thailand bashing comments...

And... similarly, I would add that logic and rationality are expressed in all cultures in a different way, but each culture and system of belief categorises rational and irrational, logical and illogical according to their own standards which are not universal but culturally, geographically and temporally determined. Therefore, what is logical to us today may not be tomorrow, what is logical to us may be illogical to Thais and vice versa.

This comment explains just that: the behaviour of Thai embassies and US and German embassies alike is perfectly rational to pursue their only objective, which we assume being controlling who enters their country in some way.

Reading it as irrational or illogical is simply a misplaced judgement as it applies scientific principles to international relations, in which economic, geo-political, social and even emotional factors play a role.

[Danielsiam]

10 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

Most countries' embassies would have different rules or apply them differently depending on the country in which they operate.

 

Certainly the US or German embassy in Australia would treat applications for visas differently from their embassies in Nigeria or in Venezuela or even Thailand, for example. Different circumstances require different rules. "In the logical way,"  politics, international relationships and economic conditions all come into play. There is no expectation that embassies or consulates deal with foreign nationals in a democratic, one-size-fits-all sort of way. It's not some game played on a level field.

Yes, but being father of a kid, and cannot get a Non "O" visa in some Embassy/Consulates, I don't know what the cultures, economics & politics have to do on this matter

[baneko]

Yes, but being father of a kid, and cannot get a Non "O" visa in some Embassy/Consulates, I don't know what the cultures, economics & politics have to do on this matter

Use the Embassy/Consulate which are sympathetic to your needs. You can be directed to which one to use on here.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Langsuan Man]

The reason that there are differences between consulates and embassies is that the Thais export their own brand of fiefdoms that  in many cases mirror exactly the same discord with Immigration in Thailand.  Has nothing to do with interpretation of "difficult" regulations

 

The problems have also been exacerbated by local hires , who are religiously guarding their turf, one example is the Serbian local hire in Washington who on her own initiated a State or FBI background check requirement for O-A Visas 

Quote

 Letter of verification stating that the applicant has no criminal record (verification have to valid for not more than three months and must be issued from a state or Federal Bureau of Investigation only. Online criminal record without authorizer’s signature is unacceptable )

 

[Mattd]

11 minutes ago, Langsuan Man said:

The problems have also been exacerbated by local hires , who are religiously guarding their turf, one example is the Serbian local hire in Washington who on her own initiated a State or FBI background check requirement for O-A Visas 

A criminal background check is standard worldwide for the O-A visa.

[Langsuan Man]

Just now, Mattd said:

A criminal background check is standard worldwide for the O-A visa.

Not from the FBI

[Mattd]

1 minute ago, Langsuan Man said:

Not from the FBI

The requirement you quoted was from a state or the FBI, i.e. from an official source with a signature?

The issue in the US may possibly be that if an applicant had a criminal record in one state, it may not necessarily show up in another state if it wasn't a serious offence? No idea as not American, just surmising.

[Evilbaz]

15 minutes ago, Langsuan Man said:

Not from the FBI

In Australia it is the Federal police - same, same.

[Langsuan Man]

10 minutes ago, Mattd said:

The requirement you quoted was from a state or the FBI, i.e. from an official source with a signature?

The issue in the US may possibly be that if an applicant had a criminal record in one state, it may not necessarily show up in another state if it wasn't a serious offence? No idea as not American, just surmising.

The US does not have a nationalized police force but that is not the subject of this discussion, the thread is about why and how Thai Consulates around the world act differently

 

Criminal records check by US based Thai Consulates:

 

Quote

Los Angeles:*  *6. Four copies of police verification stating the applicant has no criminal record issued by the authority concerned of his/her nationality or residence.  The verification must not be more than three months old

Quote

Chicago*:  a copy of the applicant’s criminal record from the local police department.

Quote

New York: Three copies of criminal record (1 original and 2 copies) in good  conduct issued by local police, state police department, or Federal Bureau of Investigation

* required to be notarized 

[Tanoshi]

11 hours ago, Danielsiam said:

Yes, but being father of a kid, and cannot get a Non "O" visa in some Embassy/Consulates, I don't know what the cultures, economics & politics have to do on this matter

You appear to be under the impression that your child will automatically be granted Thai nationality, although you are an EU national and your pregnant g/f is a Filipino and therefore you (and presumably your g/f) will somehow be allowed to stay long term by claiming the child is Thai, when born.

 

Under the Nationality laws a child born to foreigners within Thailand does not automatically acquire Thai nationality.

Edited January 10, 2018 by Tanoshi

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

You appear to be under the impression that your child will automatically be granted Thai nationality, although you are an EU national and your pregnant g/f is a Filipino and therefore you (and presumably your g/f) will somehow be allowed to stay long term by claiming the child is Thai, when born.

He also has a child with Thai nationality. He mentioned that in a previous post.

I think that most embassies and consulates will issue a single entry non-o visa for being the parent of a Thai. But many will not issue a multiple entry non-o visa.

[SunsetT]

Because of appalling Thai education most Thais, lovely as they are,  are not taught to think so most are unable to think rationally. They have the hardware but not the software. In evolutionary terms imagination preceded rational thought. Thais have great imaginations. So if you ask them a question (especially my missus....lol), the answer is plucked straight from their imagination. Things are as they imagine them to be. Hence so many 'White elephants' (failed projects, businesses). In Thailand everything is just trial and error. Thats why there is so little consistency. Each ill-educated consular official  and ill-educated immigration officer  'imagines' how the rules should be so often interprets them differently and often implements them differently. What is imagined is different every time. Only rational thought is consistent and logical. Hence so little logic in Thailand and it will remain so until the education system greatly improves.

[VocalNeal]

On 1/8/2018 at 10:28 PM, Danielsiam said:

Exemple only Vientiane, Penang, & Savannakhet are issuing a Non "O" Visa for being father of Thai kid. The other Consulates, you will be turned away, is that normal ?!

Sounds normal? If one lives in Thailand supporting a Thai child then you go to the "nearest" consulate to get a new visa. Why go all the way to Europe to do that?

[BritTim]

3 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

Sounds normal? If one lives in Thailand supporting a Thai child then you go to the "nearest" consulate to get a new visa. Why go all the way to Europe to do that?

To me, it is not normal that you should be unable to visit your children if working to support them in Europe. Indeed, if working in Thailand, you will most likely have received a Non B visa, and have no need for a Non O to visit your child.

[elviajero]

4 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

Sounds normal? If one lives in Thailand supporting a Thai child then you go to the "nearest" consulate to get a new visa. Why go all the way to Europe to do that?

If one lives in Thailand they should enter the country with a non-immigrant visa and then apply for a 1 year extension of stay as a parent. No need to get another visa from anywhere.

[bruceamstutz]

On ‎1‎/‎8‎/‎2018 at 5:21 PM, Borzandy said:

Did you ever find something logical in any Thai institution?

 

100% correct and it will never ever change......