A year away from Brexit, Britons' views remain as entrenched as ever

[webfact]

A year away from Brexit, Britons' views remain as entrenched as ever

By Elizabeth Burden

 

Pin badges are displayed for sale at a market stall in Great Yarmouth, Britain, March 21, 2018. REUTERS/Hannah McKay/Files

 

GREAT YARMOUTH, England (Reuters) - Leaning over the counter of his seafood stall in the English seaside town of Great Yarmouth, Darran Nichols-George says those still moaning about the British vote to leave the European Union need to stop complaining.

 

"At the end of the day we live in a democracy and therefore they've had the vote," said 51-year-old Nichols-George, peering over cartons of prawns, crabs, mussels and jellied eels.

 

"We voted out so we're going to go out."

 

The fishmonger was one of the 17.4 million Britons who voted to quit the EU in a 2016 referendum, giving the Brexit campaign victory over the 16.1 million voters who wanted to stay.

 

Since then, Brexit has never been far from the headlines, from difficult talks with the EU and leaks of government forecasts that Britain will be worse off, to fish dumped into the River Thames by fishermen angry at European quotas.

 

A year before Britain leaves the bloc in March 2019, allegations that the main campaign for leaving the EU broke the law have revived memories of the bitter referendum battle.

 

Despite the issue dominating discussions in parliament and the pages of newspapers, voters' views seem entrenched as ever.

 

"People now think of themselves as Leavers or Remainers and see developments from that perspective," Sara Hobolt, a professor of politics at the London School of Economics, told Reuters. She estimates that 80 to 90 percent of Britons have not changed their minds since 2016.

 

Some senior figures, such as former Prime Minister Tony Blair, have demanded a second referendum on the final deal agreed with the EU, so people could have a say in full knowledge of the possible outcome. But polls and research suggest there is no overwhelming support for another vote.

 

Even if there was another plebiscite, the surveys show Britons are still deeply divided and most would probably vote the same way.

 

"Tony Blair -- he should keep his snout out," said retired 68-year-old Michael Cutting, who voted Leave and has lived in Great Yarmouth his whole life.

 

His view is shared by many in the rundown holiday resort, a once bustling fishing port some 140 miles (200 km) northeast of London, where paint peels off windswept ferris wheels and mainly elderly visitors wander past its "Golden Mile" sandy beach and drab amusement arcades.

 

"NO MESSING AROUND"

Great Yarmouth has the country's lowest percentage of college graduates -- 14.2 percent -- and a high rate of unemployment. In 2016, 71.5 percent of votes cast here were for Leave, putting it in one of the top 10 Brexit-supporting areas in the country.

 

"I think we should all get out of [the EU] now, straight away, no messing around," said Philip Blake, 60, between chopping cuts of prime British beef for display at his family-run butchers.

 

"They're taking too long over it now. Just go. Hard Brexit, whatever, I don't mind."

 

While an EU flag flies in tatters beside Great Yarmouth's seaside promenade, in the affluent university city of Norwich just 21 miles (34 km) away, the sentiment about Europe could hardly be more different but the intransigence is the same.

 

"I hate it, I really do," said Gaye Sorah, 59, who was close to tears at the thought of Brexit. "One year to go, it’s a disaster. I just wish we could rewind the clock."

 

Norwich, where tourists wander between the market's stalls, chattering in a variety of tongues while students cycle down medieval cobbled streets, bucked the trend for the region with 56 percent of voters backing staying in the EU.

 

Pro-EU posters adorn the whole foods stall owned by Gareth Butcher, 69, and his 66-year-old wife Jane Wirgman, who proudly wears a "We are Europe" badge.

 

"I could see no advantage in leaving, particularly not on a dream of empires past," Butcher said. "I’ve not changed my mind at all and it's a source of some amusement to me that as the ramifications become clear ... that a lot of other people’s minds are being concentrated."

 

Expressions of such regret are hard to find, but dishing out bags of chunky fries from his van in Great Yarmouth, Robin Platten thinks he was wrong to vote to leave.

 

"I've been thinking maybe I might have made a mistake," Platten, 60, whose family have run the Brewer Chip Saloon takeaway stall in the town's market since 1902.

 

"It's a great big tunnel with no light at the end of it, as far as I'm concerned," he told Reuters. "I think maybe everybody should be given a second chance for the mistakes that they've made. But I don't think that's going to happen."

 

Even some voters who backed remain have no desire to see the process dragging on, however -- despite their continued misgivings.

 

"I think we may as well get on with it now," said Kathryn Fabian, 20, a student in Norwich. "I feel like we had our say back then, it's been decided. Let's just move on."

 

(Writing by Michael Holden; Editing by Guy Faulconbridge and Catherine Evans)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-03-28

[nauseus]

Yes, let's move on.

[Samui Bodoh]

Wow!

 

Given the unanimity of opinion that I see on TVF, I am shocked to see it is so different in the UK.

 

Shocked I tell you!

 

 

[GarryP]

8 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Wow!

 

Given the unanimity of opinion that I see on TVF, I am shocked to see it is so different in the UK.

 

Shocked I tell you!

 

 

They're all Great Yarmouth transplants. 

[sammieuk1]

How do you shoot yourself in the face when aiming at your foot 17.4m want to know . 

[StraightTalk]

I personally do hope all works out for the people of UK.
However, looking at my (treacherous) crystal ball there are cautious chances or opportunities for Russia to become more harmonious with Europe. This may even one day include China and, because of the geographical location, Australia. But by then the UK probably has rejoined the Club and Australia surrender some real estate to USA (after all Queensland is eight times the size of Texas).
The geographical location of UK in relation to USA, Canada, Australia and other Commonwealth Nations seems not very advantageous, imho.

[sawadee1947]

21 hours ago, nauseus said:

Yes, let's move on.

yes, move on backwards...!

[natway09]

The old fish monger might change his mind when he has no fish or shellfish to sell when 

all the Brit trawlers are not allowed into the good fishing grounds next year, another aspect that was not thought through

[petermik]

Fark the EU and the unelected bureaucrats telling US whats best for OUR country,we voted OUT were going OUT.........

[Grouse]

Why are so many of our east coast seaside resorts stuffed with morons? We should be told.

[petermik]

7 hours ago, natway09 said:

The old fish monger might change his mind when he has no fish or shellfish to sell when 

all the Brit trawlers are not allowed into the good fishing grounds next year, another aspect that was not thought through

Plenty of cockles/whelks/dabs/flounders in Morecambe bay........

And Iceland has freezers full if they,re not enough.

[Surasak]

45 minutes ago, natway09 said:

The old fish monger might change his mind when he has no fish or shellfish to sell when 

all the Brit trawlers are not allowed into the good fishing grounds next year, another aspect that was not thought through

Do read the agreement. Fishing arrangements will continue as now, until 29 March 2021.

[Thingamabob]

Best to get away from the thuggish, unelected members of the European Commission whatever the cost . They are not what Brits voted for when joining the Common Market. 

[dunroaming]

23 hours ago, nauseus said:

Yes, let's move on.

Move on to what?  The Brexiteers are being sold down the river. Brexit is being watered down with May making so many concessions and we are only half way to any agreements.  You leavers should be shouting from the rooftops over the way the so called negotiations are going.

[7by7]

2 hours ago, petermik said:

2 hours ago, natway09 said:

The old fish monger might change his mind when he has no fish or shellfish to sell when 

all the Brit trawlers are not allowed into the good fishing grounds next year, another aspect that was not thought through

Plenty of cockles/whelks/dabs/flounders in Morecambe bay........

And Iceland has freezers full if they,re not enough.

A joke, petermik? I hope so, but in case you were serious:-

 

1) Most fishmongers sell a bit more than just cockles, whelks, dabs and flounders. apart from shellfish stalls on the sea front, their biggest sales are deep water fish; cod, haddock etc.

 

2) Most fishmongers in coastal resorts sell local fish. Morecambe is on the west coast and over 250 miles away from east coast Great Yarmouth! Are you suggesting the fishmongers of Great Yarmouth and other east coast towns claim fish caught on the west coast is local?

 

3) The whole point of going to a proper fishmonger is to get fresh fish! Suggesting that a fishmonger buys frozen fish from a chain and then sells it on is ridiculous. Who would buy it when they could get the same from Iceland cheaper? Unless you are suggesting the fishmongers of the UK commit retail fraud by advertising frozen, chain store bought fish as fresh!

 

 

[7by7]

1 hour ago, Surasak said:

Do read the agreement. Fishing arrangements will continue as now, until 29 March 2021.

 Indeed, but that's only three years away; what will they be after that date?

[dunroaming]

As a remainer I am a lot less worried now than I was originally.  The concessions being made will make for less damaging end results.  I still think that the Northern Ireland issue needs to be sorted out and that that will have a considerable bearing on where we end up.

 

The government have a duty to deliver a Brexit that is the best for the country and if they don't do that then (quite rightly) parliament will vote against it in October.  I wish that the people could have that vote at that time but I doubt that will happen.

 

My main concern is the NHS, not as far as funding is concerned but where on earth are we going to get the doctors and nurses to replace the ones that will leave after Brexit?

[JAG]

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

Why are so many of our east coast seaside resorts stuffed with morons? We should be told.

Sadly they are not as clever, witty, well educated or as inclusive of others opinions as you are!

 

There again they are not arrogant four letter Anglo Saxon words like you either!

[JAG]

If I may add, (as I left it too late to edit the above post), do you see any irony in the probability that your excellent university education, which you have on several occasions trumpeted as the reason why your views are inherently superior, was paid for from the taxes of these "morons"?

 

Perhaps we should be told, eh?

[petermik]

9 hours ago, 7by7 said:

A joke, petermik? I hope so, but in case you were serious:-

 

1) Most fishmongers sell a bit more than just cockles, whelks, dabs and flounders. apart from shellfish stalls on the sea front, their biggest sales are deep water fish; cod, haddock etc.

 

2) Most fishmongers in coastal resorts sell local fish. Morecambe is on the west coast and over 250 miles away from east coast Great Yarmouth! Are you suggesting the fishmongers of Great Yarmouth and other east coast towns claim fish caught on the west coast is local?

 

3) The whole point of going to a proper fishmonger is to get fresh fish! Suggesting that a fishmonger buys frozen fish from a chain and then sells it on is ridiculous. Who would buy it when they could get the same from Iceland cheaper? Unless you are suggesting the fishmongers of the UK commit retail fraud by advertising frozen, chain store bought fish as fresh!

 

 

That,s the "fishiest" story to come out today.......Captain Birdseye

[petermik]

11 hours ago, Surasak said:

Do read the agreement. Fishing arrangements will continue as now, until 29 March 2021.

 

9 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Indeed, but that's only three years away; what will they be after that date?

"floundering" in cod s wallop and up to the gills in bureaucracy if the "remainers" had won....

[dunroaming]

11 minutes ago, petermik said:

 

"floundering" in cod s wallop and up to the gills in bureaucracy if the "remainers" had won....

So you think the leavers have won?  It's a long time before the fat lady gets to sing and I think you will find we have all lost in the end. 

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, JAG said:

Sadly they are not as clever, witty, well educated or as inclusive of others opinions as you are!

 

There again they are not arrogant four letter Anglo Saxon words like you either!

I'm glad you agree. Clearly, they have nothing to be arrogant about ?

 

It is a fair observation that UKIP for example were in greatest concentration on the east coast!

 

BTW, feel free to try and insult me anytime you like. Water off a grouse's back as they say! But do try and be a bit more inventive with your barbs!

Edited March 29, 2018 by Grouse

[Grouse]

35 minutes ago, JAG said:

If I may add, (as I left it too late to edit the above post), do you see any irony in the probability that your excellent university education, which you have on several occasions trumpeted as the reason why your views are inherently superior, was paid for from the taxes of these "morons"?

 

Perhaps we should be told, eh?

I'm sure you will have noted that I always express my thanks for the education I received courtesy of the state.

 

I will also say that I have repaid this many times over through taxation personally and also via the large number of well salaried careers I have helped create.

 

Now do you have anything else to say? Or can we get back to the topic?

[JAG]

6 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I'm sure you will have noted that I always express my thanks for the education I received courtesy of the state.

 

I will also say that I have repaid this many times over through taxation personally and also via the large number of well salaried careers I have helped create.

 

Now do you have anything else to say? Or can we get back to the topic?

The discussion was diverted by a poster referring to people with whose views he disliked as "morons".

Remind me please, who was that poster?

[Grouse]

39 minutes ago, JAG said:

The discussion was diverted by a poster referring to people with whose views he disliked as "morons".

Remind me please, who was that poster?

The OP was about Great Yarmouth in particular. My comment concerning the higher than average concentration of morons in East coast seaside towns is entirely relevant and is, of course, why Reuters went there rather than Cambridge, say. I am sure you have noted that UKIP tended to get the greatest support in these areas. I would like to know why?

 

Did you look at the photograph accompanying the OP? Look at all the badges? What kind of people are into that in the twenty first century? Do they have stalls like that where you take vacations?

 

My comment stands, as does my query.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11539388/Mapped-where-is-Ukips-support-strongest-Where-there-are-no-immigrants.html

 

The map on the right shows UKIP penetration

 

The map on the left shows level of immigrants

 

 

 

And finally, from the OP :-

 

"Great Yarmouth has the country's lowest percentage of college graduates -- 14.2 percent -- and a high rate of unemployment."

 

Any more comments? ?

Edited March 29, 2018 by Grouse

[JAG]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

The OP was about Great Yarmouth in particular. My comment concerning the higher than average concentration of morons in East coast seaside towns is entirely relevant and is, of course, why Reuters went there rather than Cambridge, say. I am sure you have noted that UKIP tended to get the greatest support in these areas. I would like to know why?

 

Did you look at the photograph accompanying the OP? Look at all the badges? What kind of people are into that in the twenty first century? Do they have stalls like that where you take vacations?

 

My comment stands, as does my query.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11539388/Mapped-where-is-Ukips-support-strongest-Where-there-are-no-immigrants.html

 

The map on the right shows UKIP penetration

 

The map on the left shows level of immigrants

 

 

 

And finally, from the OP :-

 

"Great Yarmouth has the country's lowest percentage of college graduates -- 14.2 percent -- and a high rate of unemployment."

 

Any more comments? ?

Not really, after that display of breathtaking arrogance any further comment would be superfluous, other perhaps than to observe that you have absolutely confirmed what I suggested in post#18.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, JAG said:

Not really, after that display of breathtaking arrogance any further comment would be superfluous, other perhaps than to observe that you have absolutely confirmed what I suggested in post#18.

OK, you win

 

 

 

[Grouse]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p062p7l1

 

Barnier sums up the situation from the French side.

[juice777]

Move on to what?  The Brexiteers are being sold down the river. Brexit is being watered down with May making so many concessions and we are only half way to any agreements.  You leavers should be shouting from the rooftops over the way the so called negotiations are going.

They don't care as long as they can claim a victory with Blue passports what the European Union stopped us having.Oh, no wait we could have changed them back anytime we wanted to because it was only a suggestion by the European Union.

Or at least we will be able to kick out all the foreigners from the European Union claiming benefits for years.Oh no, wait we could have kicked them out if they didn't have a job or capital to support there selfs after 3 months like other European Union countries do, but our politicians chose not to.

But at least public service like The NHS and police force, Schools Etc will be able to cope with fewer immigrants.Oh no wait net migration is down and public services are getting worse and worse all the time.So maybe no connection there after all.

All lies and miss information


How can another VOTE of all things be against democracy if the outcome is different because everyone knows more now and a lot of people have changed there mind?

If its not the will of the people anymore it's not democracy anymore.

Even old Nigel boy wanted another vote if it was 52-48.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk