Pattaya Trip, First for Ten Years

[Thaidream]

Pattaya will remain an attraction to the mongers as long as the sex remains available- but they are on a limited time- as those that they seek will be much older; less friendly; and generally become more commercialized.  The  Pattaya sex scene will become less friendlier- more costly and start to resemble Amsterdam; Boston; and other World cities. It's already headed in that direction  and the Central Government will encourage it .  The mongers will never believe it until one day they come and it won't be worth it anymore.

[simoh1490]

2 minutes ago, starky said:

To be honest I thought I was pretty fair in only naming those sois. Would you say soi 8, pattayaland,  post office, LK, walking Street, soi Diana and buakhow only contain " some" bars? It is near impossible to have a reasonable debate with people that are so defensive and so in denial about the place in which you live. I am not making any judgement calls at all but at least be truthful to the realities. I always love the " oh yes I live in Pattaya, you really wouldn't even know there was a bar here" crowd.

I hope I'm not coming across as defensive because I live in Chiang Mai and nearly always have hence you will almost certainly know more about Pattaya than me - plus I certainly don't have a need to defend Pattaya other than via what I have seen personally. And whilst I have spent time there in the past and I do know many of the soi's you've named, I was able to walk down Beach Road on this trip without being aware those sois were there and the things they offer, that I think is the point, they are not constantly in your face. Pattaya Klang between Beach and Second does have some beer bars (from memory) but it's also a long road that has much more on it than just beer bars, ditto soi 1,2,3 as I recall and we did walk down one of those sois on this trip.

 

The most telling part of the trip for us was whilst taking a taxi back to the hotel one evening, along Second Road heading North between Pattaya Klang and Big C, most of the large beer bar complexes I had known previously were gone and in their place was an assortment of businesses. 

[starky]

2 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Pattaya will remain an attraction to the mongers as long as the sex remains available- but they are on a limited time- as those that they seek will be much older; less friendly; and generally become more commercialized.  The  Pattaya sex scene will become less friendlier- more costly and start to resemble Amsterdam; Boston; and other World cities. It's already headed in that direction  and the Central Government will encourage it .  The mongers will never believe it until one day they come and it won't be worth it anymore.

But until that day....

[irishken]

47 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

Yes, and who are these replacements, the Chinese? The taxi drivers and road sweepers are not going to be happy about that.

Could well be, as apparently only 6% of Chinese have passports while 50% of Americans and other western nations have passports. 

Can you imagine when that rises to even 20%. 

They will need a new airport for Chinese visitors alone. 

[starky]

Just now, simoh1490 said:

I hope I'm not coming across as defensive because I live in Chiang Mai and nearly always have hence you will almost certainly know more about Pattaya than me - plus I certainly don't have a need to defend Pattaya other than via what I have seen personally. And whilst I have spent time there in the past and I do know many of the soi's you've named, I was able to walk down Beach Road on this trip without being aware those sois were there and the things they offer, that I think is the point, they are not constantly in your face. Pattaya Klang between Beach and Second does have some beer bars (from memory) but it's also a long road that has much more on it than just beer bars, ditto soi 1,2,3 as I recall and we did walk down one of those sois on this trip.

 

The most telling part of the trip for us was whilst taking a taxi back to the hotel one evening, along Second Road heading North between Pattaya Klang and Big C, most of the large beer bar complexes I had known previously were gone and in their place was an assortment of businesses. 

Mate I got no dog in the fight either my Pattaya days are over but as I stated the other day, IMO it's only lipstick on a pig. Possibly one day Pattaya may be known as a world class family holiday destination but at the moment I think it is still best known for what it is best known for. At least we can discuss it reasonably.I got all sorts of shit hurled at me the other day for having the hide to say that Pattaya was best known as a sex tourist destination. 

[Thaidream]

That day has already come- you just don't realize it yet. However,  beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

[starky]

Just now, Thaidream said:

That day has already come- you just don't realize it yet. However,  beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

Much like lipstick on a pig.

[irishken]

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

  I much prefer the Southern Coast of Thailand but Pattaya does have things to do for families. The sleaze can be avoided. 

 

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

 

I also would prefer Southern Thailand  over Patts but as we have  to visit Mukdahan first each time  i go to Thailand and then  we have our beach holiday, its hard to get to the south without going back to BKK. The flight from Ubon to Utapao is the easiest option with kids

[simoh1490]

2 minutes ago, starky said:

Mate I got no dog in the fight either my Pattaya days are over but as I stated the other day, IMO it's only lipstick on a pig. Possibly one day Pattaya may be known as a world class family holiday destination but at the moment I think it is still best known for what it is best known for. At least we can discuss it reasonably.I got all sorts of shit hurled at me the other day for having the hide to say that Pattaya was best known as a sex tourist destination. 

You'd be correct in saying that, Pattaya is known as exactly that but I think the headline is that things are changing. And I agree also that today, Pattaya is not a world class family holiday destination but it has changed, it is changing and it is becoming a family holiday destination, much much more so than ever before in the past. This is not about Pattaya being a 1 or a 10, today it's heading towards 6 or 7, the Pattaya I knew of old was around a 2 or a 3.

[Jeremia Juxtaposed]

2 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

You may be really surprised how many respectable Thai ladies have a chequered past, I know of several in different professional fields who used to be bar girls etc.

And during the crash of '97 the other way around......

[Rimmer]

A number of posts that were trying to hijack the topic have been removed, also replies

[bkk6060]

55 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Pattaya will remain an attraction to the mongers as long as the sex remains available- but they are on a limited time- as those that they seek will be much older; less friendly; and generally become more commercialized.  The  Pattaya sex scene will become less friendlier- more costly and start to resemble Amsterdam; Boston; and other World cities. It's already headed in that direction  and the Central Government will encourage it .  The mongers will never believe it until one day they come and it won't be worth it anymore.

Not even close to what is going on now.

Ever hear of the internet and online dating?

 

I think this place is better then ever, but I do not meet girls in bars.  

[Jeremia Juxtaposed]

3 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Not even close to what is going on now.

Ever hear of the internet and online dating?

 

I think this place is better then ever, but I do not meet girls in bars.  

Totally agree but I am lucky because as Pattaya has matured so have I.

 

Over the years Pattaya and I have enjoyed each others company in the middle of our lives and we have both began to settle down to a steady existance filled with more toe tapping than pogoing. It suits me and I love it...... I just don't understand why some people feel the need to mock a happy relationship, comfortable in each others company, dreaming of days past and looking forward to a 99 baht breakfast....

[Acemaker]

9 hours ago, torrzent said:

A fair and balanced review.  Refreshing compared to the wannabes who are always trying to knock it, like the HH expats and the whinger in the other thread complaining it is too low class so has to be avoided, even for one night.

Well, we are all entitled to our opinion, dont get your Jockstrap in a twist if others have a different perception than yours.

[newnative]

3 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

You're living proof that if you want something bad enough and are prepared to go looking for it, you'll find it. By the same token, others who didn't go looking for those things yet are still fairly observant, didn't see much of them at all and certainly not as primary attractions! Which is the whole point of all of this: ten-fifteen years ago it would have been impossible to miss such things, no matter where you went, today they are easily avoided and not seen. (BTW you over exaggerate the extent of the problem by citing the names of sois that contain some bars but are not dominated by them, as in the case of sois 6/7).

Nicely said!  I was about to reply to his post but you did it for me., and better than I would have.

[newnative]

3 hours ago, starky said:

To be honest I thought I was pretty fair in only naming those sois. Would you say soi 8, pattayaland,  post office, LK, walking Street, soi Diana and buakhow only contain " some" bars? It is near impossible to have a reasonable debate with people that are so defensive and so in denial about the place in which you live. I am not making any judgement calls at all but at least be truthful to the realities. I always love the " oh yes I live in Pattaya, you really wouldn't even know there was a bar here" crowd.

     Well, maybe I will jump in after all.  I think you continue to miss the point.  Pattaya has bars, nobody is saying otherwise.  But, as a resident, most of the streets you mentioned are mainly for tourists.  As a resident, I never go to Walking Street, Soi 6, Pattayaland (whatever that is), and so on at all.  My normal, everyday life does not revolve around the bars and I don't think I am alone in that.  Major streets that I do use have far more regular businesses than bars.

     We are not being defensive--we are just pointing out that Pattaya, for residents, is not defined by the bars.  I imagine it's much the same for folks living in Vegas.  The tourists are focused on gambling--"My goodness there's gambling everywhere you look!  Even the airport has slot machines!"  The residents, on the other hand, are going about their regular, non-tourist lives.

[Enoon]

6 hours ago, starky said:

. I always love the " oh yes I live in Pattaya, you really wouldn't even know there was a bar here" crowd.

 

They are the end product of various Western cities, towns and their suburbs.

 

They only really live in their dwellings.

 

"Children of the Burbs"

 

The "place" where they put themselves is irrelevant.

 

Climate, consumer goods and "convenience" is all they crave.

 

They could build their suburban dream in Naples and pretend that Mt Etna doesn't exist.....or remain in total ignorance of it.

 

 

 

Edited April 6, 2018 by Enoon

[jacko45k]

9 hours ago, Thaidream said:

First visited Pattaya 48  years ago when it was a sleepy village with 1 Western style Hotel. Beach and sea pristine- lush gardens and shrubbery everywhere.  No pollution and little night time activity- no GoGo Bars or ladyboys plying their trade, No traffic and no stress.

I preferred the old Pattaya but  not everyone likes quiet. Terminal 21 in North Pattaya will attract Bangkok Thais for weekend out and as that becomes successful- expect more malls and traffic.

We got empty malls already and for sure got traffic!

Also plenty evidence of visitors from Bangkok already.

 

I agree traffic can get worse.... but not a lot.

 

[kevozman1]

It's still full of hookers, multiple sois where bars dominate the landscape, take a stroll down beach road any time after sunset. Blatant in the face soapies on second road. It's not just those damn Farangs anymore who go to Pattaya for P4P. Plenty of Chinese, Arabs, Indians and Koreans are also there for the booze and ladies of the night. Family destination? Get out of here. Apart from some Russian hillbillies who got blagged into a cheap package holiday, it's far from what most people who are at least sober for a few hours a day would consider a family destination.

 

I agree the P4P does not dominate Pattaya as much as before. It's basically one of the world's biggest brothels, with a Benidorm thing going on for Russians and Chinese.

[bkk6060]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

 

 

I agree traffic can get worse.... but not a lot.

 

I bet in 7 years it is double. 

There are millions of people in Asia and the world that either have never heard of this place and or want to/will come. 

Edited April 6, 2018 by bkk6060

[Hupaponics]

15 hours ago, CGW said:

Thailand has never won any arcitectural awards for obvious reasons 

 

Thats not entirely true. 

Some years back I read that the Chang Building in Bkk was awarded as the worlds ugliest building. No joke here:)

It was something  like the idea was good but the execution was beyond bad. 

[torrzent]

11 hours ago, newnative said:

     Well, maybe I will jump in after all.  I think you continue to miss the point.  Pattaya has bars, nobody is saying otherwise.  But, as a resident, most of the streets you mentioned are mainly for tourists.  As a resident, I never go to Walking Street, Soi 6, Pattayaland (whatever that is), and so on at all.  My normal, everyday life does not revolve around the bars and I don't think I am alone in that.  Major streets that I do use have far more regular businesses than bars.

     We are not being defensive--we are just pointing out that Pattaya, for residents, is not defined by the bars.  I imagine it's much the same for folks living in Vegas.  The tourists are focused on gambling--"My goodness there's gambling everywhere you look!  Even the airport has slot machines!"  The residents, on the other hand, are going about their regular, non-tourist lives.

Very good points.  It would be like saying I can't visit museums or go to shows in London, because Soho exists in another neighbourhood.  Cross Paris off the list as well, including the Louvre, the Eiffel Tower, and some great bistors, because of Pigalle, and of course cross Hamburg off the list because of the Reeperbahn.  In fact as almost any western city has some such establishment or zone, it would be impossible to go almost anywhere.  I recommend these types of easily offended people head to the middle east or some other puritanical place so as to not be tainted.  OTOH, who knows what goes on behind closed doors even in those places.  Best read Arabiann Nights before you make a final decision whether to go!

[Peterw42]

Thank you OP for a realistic observation.

 

It refreshing to see people actually making their own judgement rather than just regurgitate the same old narrative. Often to appear knowledgeable or to justify their own sex-pat exsistance.

 

Its frustrating for those of us who live here and lead normal non sexpat lives. Its very odd when you have just gone about your day in central Pattaya, a movie, a trip to the mall, grocery shopping, dinning out and never hear the "hello Welcome" catch cry, only to be told by experts on Thaivisa that its a giant brothel.

 

I had my 20 year old daughter come to visit a couple of months ago and although we stayed at jomtien, we did everything all around central pattaya, night and day, malls, shopping, dinning etc. Towards the end of a 10 day stay, my daughter asked "so where are all the sexbars that everyone talks about" ??  Without even trying we had managed to avoid the sexpat sois. We went for a drive through soi 6 and a walk down walking street, got an icecream then went back to a mall and watched a movie.

 

 

Edited April 7, 2018 by Peterw42

[starky]

1 hour ago, torrzent said:

Very good points.  It would be like saying I can't visit museums or go to shows in London, because Soho exists in another neighbourhood.  Cross Paris off the list as well, including the Louvre, the Eiffel Tower, and some great bistors, because of Pigalle, and of course cross Hamburg off the list because of the Reeperbahn.  In fact as almost any western city has some such establishment or zone, it would be impossible to go almost anywhere.  I recommend these types of easily offended people head to the middle east or some other puritanical place so as to not be tainted.  OTOH, who knows what goes on behind closed doors even in those places.  Best read Arabiann Nights before you make a final decision whether to go!

Comparing Pattaya to Paris... Priceless

[bkk6060]

32 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Thank you OP for a realistic observation.

 

It refreshing to see people actually making their own judgement rather than just regurgitate the same old narrative. Often to appear knowledgeable or to justify their own sex-pat exsistance.

 

Its frustrating for those of us who live here and lead normal non sexpat lives. Its very odd when you have just gone about your day in central Pattaya, a movie, a trip to the mall, grocery shopping, dinning out and never hear the "hello Welcome" catch cry, only to be told by experts on Thaivisa that its a giant brothel.

 

I had my 20 year old daughter come to visit a couple of months ago and although we stayed at jomtien, we did everything all around central pattaya, night and day, malls, shopping, dinning etc. Towards the end of a 10 day stay, my daughter asked "so where are all the sexbars that everyone talks about" ??  Without even trying we had managed to avoid the sexpat sois. We went for a drive through soi 6 and a walk down walking street, got an icecream then went back to a mall and watched a movie.

 

 

Why did you come here in the first place?

Edited April 7, 2018 by bkk6060

[starky]

12 hours ago, newnative said:

     Well, maybe I will jump in after all.  I think you continue to miss the point.  Pattaya has bars, nobody is saying otherwise.  But, as a resident, most of the streets you mentioned are mainly for tourists.  As a resident, I never go to Walking Street, Soi 6, Pattayaland (whatever that is), and so on at all.  My normal, everyday life does not revolve around the bars and I don't think I am alone in that.  Major streets that I do use have far more regular businesses than bars.

     We are not being defensive--we are just pointing out that Pattaya, for residents, is not defined by the bars.  I imagine it's much the same for folks living in Vegas.  The tourists are focused on gambling--"My goodness there's gambling everywhere you look!  Even the airport has slot machines!"  The residents, on the other hand, are going about their regular, non-tourist lives.

Well Vegas is a good example more appropriate than the other poster comparing Pattaya to Paris or Berlin lol. I also take your point but your missing mine just because the residents of Vegas may not go down the strip often does not mean that Vegas is not full of casinos. The fact that you and other residents may not interact with the bars, gogo, soapies , massage parlours and all the rest, does not, change the fact that the average person or tourists perception of what that town is all about currently. No matter how much you purport to claim Pattaya has changed recently. Also having a few nice hotels and exclusive shops doesn't change the perception. Do you really think no mongers stay in 5 star hotels and shop at Central festival? I'll leave it at that as we can just agree to disagree.

Edited April 7, 2018 by starky

[starky]

42 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Thank you OP for a realistic observation.

 

It refreshing to see people actually making their own judgement rather than just regurgitate the same old narrative. Often to appear knowledgeable or to justify their own sex-pat exsistance.

 

Its frustrating for those of us who live here and lead normal non sexpat lives. Its very odd when you have just gone about your day in central Pattaya, a movie, a trip to the mall, grocery shopping, dinning out and never hear the "hello Welcome" catch cry, only to be told by experts on Thaivisa that its a giant brothel.

 

I had my 20 year old daughter come to visit a couple of months ago and although we stayed at jomtien, we did everything all around central pattaya, night and day, malls, shopping, dinning etc. Towards the end of a 10 day stay, my daughter asked "so where are all the sexbars that everyone talks about" ??  Without even trying we had managed to avoid the sexpat sois. We went for a drive through soi 6 and a walk down walking street, got an icecream then went back to a mall and watched a movie.

 

 

Is your daughter sight impaired? 10 days and never saw 1 bar in central Pattaya ok then, and why pray tell did you originally move to Pattaya? And historically could you maybe tell us experts then what Pattaya has been best known for and associated with for the past 5 decades? If you are going to debate at least be realistic. I think it is a positive thing the Pattaya isn't just a town for sexpats anymore but it is a long way purely IMO of being rid of the image it has been world renowned for, for so many years.

Edited April 7, 2018 by starky

[bkk6060]

Yeah, I got to say funny enough Central Festival may be one of the biggest brothels in town.

Walk around there in the afternoon it is full of working girls killing time.

The place is a gold mine.

Oh, sorry, if that is your thing. :)

 

[torrzent]

25 minutes ago, starky said:

Well Vegas is a good example more appropriate than the other poster comparing Pattaya to Paris or Berlin lol. I also take your point but your missing mine just because the residents of Vegas may not go down the strip often does not mean that Vegas is not full of casinos. The fact that you and other residents may not interact with the bars, gogo, soapies , massage parlours and all the rest, does not, change the fact that the average person or tourists perception of what that town is all about currently. No matter how much you purport to claim Pattaya has changed recently. Also having a few nice hotels and exclusive shops doesn't change the perception. Do you really think no mongers stay in 5 star hotels and shop at Central festival? I'll leave it at that as we can just agree to disagree.

You seemed to have trouble with higher level conceptualizing and logical reasoning.  Nobody said Pattaya was Paris, other than you,  with your silly strawman twisted logic.  The point that was made, which I shall copy for you here, was  " In fact as almost any western city has some such establishment or zone, it would be impossible to go almost anywhere.  I recommend these types of easily offended people head to the middle east or some other puritanical place so as to not be tainted. "

 

You also need to pull out an atlas.  Hamburg and Berlin are not the same place.

 

I hope I have simplified this enough for you to understand.

[newnative]

51 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Thank you OP for a realistic observation.

 

It refreshing to see people actually making their own judgement rather than just regurgitate the same old narrative. Often to appear knowledgeable or to justify their own sex-pat exsistance.

 

Its frustrating for those of us who live here and lead normal non sexpat lives. Its very odd when you have just gone about your day in central Pattaya, a movie, a trip to the mall, grocery shopping, dinning out and never hear the "hello Welcome" catch cry, only to be told by experts on Thaivisa that its a giant brothel.

 

I had my 20 year old daughter come to visit a couple of months ago and although we stayed at jomtien, we did everything all around central pattaya, night and day, malls, shopping, dinning etc. Towards the end of a 10 day stay, my daughter asked "so where are all the sexbars that everyone talks about" ??  Without even trying we had managed to avoid the sexpat sois. We went for a drive through soi 6 and a walk down walking street, got an icecream then went back to a mall and watched a movie.

 

 

     I had much the same experience when my 4 sisters visited last September.  We had a great time and were all over Pattaya--the malls, Nongnooch Garden, Floating Market, Sanctuary of Truth, Kaan show, great seafood dinners at beach restaurants, and so on.  What surprised them the most was how big Pattaya is--they were all under the impression that Pattaya was a much smaller town and were not expecting to see the skyline with all the highrises.