Court decides: AirBnB illegal in Thailand for daily and weekly rental

[JAZZDOG]

9 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

Airbnb (or any other hotel booking agency) could easily ask to see a copy of the hotel registration of anyone wanting to rent out places for less than one month, but they choose not to. That is not a valid defence as far as I can see.

Would you say that it is also not Uber or Grab's job to verify that their drivers have proper insurance? I wouldn't.

Paperwork for anyone staying less than a month. Either a typo or you are clueless.

[happy chappie]

The way around this one is to rent out the property every time for a month,then when they leave charge them for how long they've stayed.thatll have them scratching their heads for a while.

[grkt]

7 hours ago, Chang_paarp said:

The issue is the rental of the room for less than 30 days is the legal domain of the licenced hotel. Over 30 day it is a residential tenancy with different laws.

 

It's not difficult to give a 31 days contract to the tenant in case someone asks him...

Anybody could have to leave earlier :-)

 

 

[gk10002000]

8 hours ago, Briggsy said:

I thought Thailand's legal system did not use precedents. Therefore another court could rule completely differently and it would make no difference. Indeed the same court could rule differently with another Air BnB landlord.

Thai "legal" system?  That is almost an oxymoron.  They do whatever they want whenever they want for whatever reasons they want.  Case law and precedent?  Previous Judges rulings?  ha

[Maestro]

The official-looking Thai document shown in the OP does not seem to be the actual court decision. Can anybody figure out what government agency or office issued it and to whom it is addressed? 

 

[KittenKong]

Paperwork for anyone staying less than a month. Either a typo or you are clueless.

Neither. However you did not understand what I wrote.

People (i.e. owners or operators) who rent out (note the "out") property on a short-term basis should have a hotel licence, or should be registered under the Hotel Act if they have few rooms. Airbnb could easily ask to see that licence or registration. Those who have neither are by definition operating illegally and Airbnb must know this perfectly well.

This has nothing to do with the tenant/occupant. It is entirely to do with the owner/operator of the property.

People renting out property for a month or more are not subject to this requirement, so they can happily continue to use Airbnb without providing any licence or registration to Airbnb. But their ads would have to indicate a minimum booking period of one month, and not one day as they currently all seem to do.

All that aside, the property owner or operator is indeed required to register any foreigner who stays in his property overnight, regardless of how long he stays or where he comes from or indeed whether he pays for the accommodation or not. However that is an Immigration requirement that has nothing to do with the Hotel Act and is not relevant to this discussion.

[CLW]

Thailand 4.0!

More Thailand 0.4

[CLW]

Grab is illegal - still operating
E-cigarettes are illegal - still used
AirBnb illegal - website for Thailand still working
Helmet duty on motorcycle - who cares
New tenant law - probably useless

Mai pen rai. This is Thailand.
No one cares about the laws and their enforcement.

[Richard Pumpaloaf]

4 minutes ago, CLW said:

Grab is illegal - still operating
E-cigarettes are illegal - still used
AirBnb illegal - website for Thailand still working
Helmet duty on motorcycle - who cares
New tenant law - probably useless

Mai pen rai. This is Thailand.
No one cares about the laws and their enforcement.
 

The laws here are more like guidelines than actually laws

[SABloke]

8 hours ago, MaxLee said:

First UBER and now AirBnB...... 

First running red lights, then motorbikes riding on the pavement, then buying alcohol near schools, and now....

 

Point is: another new law/threat that is meaningless without enforcement. (Uber operated under threats for 2+ years before they sold - never any real action)

[Maestro]

The following document, found on https://pantip.com/topic/37651043, appears to be a copy of one of the two court decisions mentioned in the OP:

 

Court decision 01.pdf

[Keira1]

Been visiting Thailand the last 18 years...getting more and more disappointed over this country, was actually planning my next trip using only airbnb, but now I know for sure, will not go to Thailand. Too much plastic, pollution, tourists, restrictions... forget it, I'm going elsewhere from now on...

[WinnieTheKhwai]

14 minutes ago, Keira1 said:

Been visiting Thailand the last 18 years...getting more and more disappointed over this country, was actually planning my next trip using only airbnb, but now I know for sure, will not go to Thailand. Too much plastic, pollution, tourists, restrictions... forget it, I'm going elsewhere from now on...

 

Where?

[Basil B]

9 hours ago, 8OA8 said:

I wonder if this rule is specific to condominiums, or will a person that rented his spare houses for daily or weekly stays via air bnb also be affected? 

I do not think it is specific to condominiums...

 

Just found 399 properties listed in Thailand on AirBnB  If I can do it so can the powers that be.

 

The only chance for airbnb is for the currant owners of AirBnB to sell to someone like Microsoft, Google, Amazon, Etc, who will may have the leverage.

[samsensam]

9 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

The court decision is about condos because the cases brought to court were about condos. It does not necessarily mean that the law cited in the court decision does no also apply to other types of residential premises. Perhaps someone can look up the law and post the relevant section here (I have to rush off now to a dentist appointment)

 

so the headline and article are misleading? is it just a cut and paste job with no value added by the OP?

[JAZZDOG]

2 hours ago, Richard Pumpaloaf said:

The laws here are more like guidelines than actually laws

vague suggestions

[reenatinnakor]

Accommodation is so cheap in thailand... Why would anyone want to use airbnb here? In the US and UK you are paying 100 quid for a crappy hotel if in the city, airbnb will be a third of that in a decent place. But thailand you can get a decent hotel for 20 quid so no need for airbnb.

Uber is a different matter since all the taxis here scam you.

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[JAZZDOG]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

Neither. However you did not understand what I wrote.

People (i.e. owners or operators) who rent out (note the "out") property on a short-term basis should have a hotel licence, or should be registered under the Hotel Act if they have few rooms. Airbnb could easily ask to see that licence or registration. Those who have neither are by definition operating illegally and Airbnb must know this perfectly well.

This has nothing to do with the tenant/occupant. It is entirely to do with the owner/operator of the property.

People renting out property for a month or more are not subject to this requirement, so they can happily continue to use Airbnb without providing any licence or registration to Airbnb. But their ads would have to indicate a minimum booking period of one month, and not one day as they currently all seem to do.

All that aside, the property owner or operator is indeed required to register any foreigner who stays in his property overnight, regardless of how long he stays or where he comes from or indeed whether he pays for the accommodation or not. However that is an Immigration requirement that has nothing to do with the Hotel Act and is not relevant to this discussion.

Why create that hoop and lose business. Owners agree to an entire list of requirements that make  sending licenses redundant. Airbnb has not broken any laws. Don't know why airbnb is singled out, one can find condos breaking the law on any of the major hosting sites.

The law is posted in the elevators of most condos affected stating fines for owners along with guests. That is were it should be enforced on a local level. Shutting down hosting sites that serve a vital interest in support of tourism is pure stupidity. How do you intend to replace it ?

[JAZZDOG]

16 minutes ago, reenatinnakor said:

Accommodation is so cheap in thailand... Why would anyone want to use airbnb here? In the US and UK you are paying 100 quid for a crappy hotel if in the city, airbnb will be a third of that in a decent place. But thailand you can get a decent hotel for 20 quid so no need for airbnb.

Uber is a different matter since all the taxis here scam you.

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You obviously don't understand the business. My guesthouse averages over 90% occupancy. If I relied only on walk-ins that number would drop to 20%. Booking fees average 15-18% and that is just added on as a fixed cost when determining rents.

If you have a better method of selling out rooms please share it with me.

[gk10002000]

2 hours ago, Richard Pumpaloaf said:

The laws here are more like guidelines than actually laws

The laws are there just in case.  I consider them like swords of Damocles.  Just hanging over head ready to drop if some Thai officials decide to act against you.

[diddygq]

1 hour ago, reenatinnakor said:

Accommodation is so cheap in thailand... Why would anyone want to use airbnb here? In the US and UK you are paying 100 quid for a crappy hotel if in the city, airbnb will be a third of that in a decent place. But thailand you can get a decent hotel for 20 quid so no need for airbnb.

Uber is a different matter since all the taxis here scam you.

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You obviously have never used AirBnB's in Thailand or anywhere for that matter. They are generally nicer and cheaper than most hotels. I use AirBnB every couple months to rent out a brand new, super modern condo in Hua Hin/Cha Am. It has two rooms, two bathrooms, living room, and a full western kitchen. 1,200 baht after the service charge and cleaning fee. Usually there are 4 or 5 of us so at 200-300 baht per person it's cheaper than a hostel. 

[jacko45k]

16 hours ago, shady86 said:

How can they regulate this? Airbnb is not located in Thailand and acting as a middle man. There is no money transaction done between owner and tenant too.

I am presuming they can monitor Airbnb websites looking for illegal booking opportunities.

 

Who says they have to go after Airbnb, the owner who facilitates the arrangement could be charged?  

 

If I was a condo owner, living in it, I would see this as a positive thing. 

[generealty]

This must mean Booking.com and Agoda and others are illegal too. Wonder what effect that will have on an already saturated property market. Could be another nail in the coffin. For the people on here who think this decision was a good one- lets see if they still feel the same way when they try sell their places and find prices drop considerably.

[Estrada]

An Aussie mate stays in an apartment  near Bangchak BTS for 2 - 3 weeks every year, since the law came in, he has to sign a contract for 30 days. However the one month price is discounted to cover 2 -3 weeks stay. The room has kitchen, TV and microwave and is only B6,000 for 3 weeks. This makes the contract legal.

[KittenKong]

Don't know why airbnb is singled out, one can find condos breaking the law on any of the major hosting sites.

The law is posted in the elevators of most condos affected stating fines for owners along with guests. That is were it should be enforced on a local level. Shutting down hosting sites that serve a vital interest in support of tourism is pure stupidity. How do you intend to replace it ?

I didnt "single out" Airbnb. They were mentioned and I continued to use their name. But obviously the same rules should apply to all other booking agencies, online or offline.

And no one is suggesting stopping Airbnb or anyone else from working. But they need to obey the law and as far as I can see that means no short-term rentals except in real B&B properties (ie a bedroom - not a condo - in your own residence in which you provide a bed and a breakfast). I see nothing wrong with longer term rentals being advertised on these booking sites.

The replacement for condos rented overnight? Hotels of course. That's what they are for. Condos are residential buildings and are intrinsically unsuitable for use as hotel accommodation. And the presence of transient tenants is highly detrimental to both the building and all resident co-owners and long-term tenants.

[RBOP]

So make a new law to make it legal.

[KittenKong]

Wonder what effect that will have on an already saturated property market. Could be another nail in the coffin. For the people on here who think this decision was a good one- lets see if they still feel the same way when they try sell their places and find prices drop considerably.

I expect it to have the opposite effect.

In my experience co-owners who rent out, especially those who rent out short-term, are those who want to spend the least on the building. Getting rid of them would make most buildings much better due to increased expenditure on infrastructure and maintenance, and that would put the value of the property up.

Many people who might like to buy a condo are put off from doing so by the large numbers of transients in some buildings, and the resulting poor maintenance. Other buildings that dont allow transients seem to enjoy much higher sale prices, much better management, and a much better class of resident.

[Trouble]

14 hours ago, observer90210 said:

The Thai Hoteliers mafia has apparently done the right P+R,  to the proper people...

Actually, most condo (homeowners) associations do not want short term renting.  Condo's are residential units not hotel units and most neighbors don't want that kind of activity.  Many Homeowner Associations are rewriting their by-laws (if not included)  to prevent the short term rental and with just cause.  Who needs people coming and going like a hotel in a residential building?

[crazykopite]

Illegal for all or just Farangs !  it’s like the electricity charges here where I live the Thais are charging between 6 and 10 baht per KW used  yet a law was passed earlier this year stating electricity charges should be charged as per PEA pricing but it appears no one is taking any notice. 

[anon537687643]

Ah competition ! Something the Thais don’t like


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