Court decides: AirBnB illegal in Thailand for daily and weekly rental

[fakename]

What about Home Stay, where does it fit into the picture? 

[bkk6060]

12 hours ago, Keira1 said:

Been visiting Thailand the last 18 years...getting more and more disappointed over this country, was actually planning my next trip using only airbnb, but now I know for sure, will not go to Thailand. Too much plastic, pollution, tourists, restrictions... forget it, I'm going elsewhere from now on...

Got to be one of the more stupid posts I have ever read......

[NanLaew]

21 hours ago, Briggsy said:

I thought Thailand's legal system did not use precedents. Therefore another court could rule completely differently and it would make no difference. Indeed the same court could rule differently with another Air BnB landlord.

...and a different sized brown envelope.

[Cowboyshoe]

BREAKING: Misleading and Inflammatory Headlines Drive Internet Traffic! Internet Traffic Creates Ad Revenue!

• Related: Billions of Bewildered Buffoons Baffled by Business Basics!

[wvavin]

Yes, it is good to ban otherwise it would not be fair to the home owners of the same block in many areas.

[natway09]

I am not sure of the actual law but some years ago the Government of the day wanted to slap a bed tax on hotels.

In the end they agreed on condition that apartment rentals had this restriction of 30 day minimum

to minimize competition & attempt to keep a level playing field.

To me it makes sense, but how would this apply to time share.

So in fact they are not singling out B & B who rightfully can rent for a minimum of 30 days

Please correct me if I am wrong

[mrdjt]

I must have made 50 trips to Thailand over the last 15 years. Business in Bangkok, Holiday Hua Hin. In my experience Airbnb is way more relaxing and quiet than those nice hotels I used to go to. No maids interrupting, no noisy kids in the pool.

In all those years, I've seen so many threads like this of reported legal changes or rulings that are bad for visitors. I've yet to be inconvenienced by one.

Mai pen rai. Thailand does it's own thing.

 

 

[bkk6060]

7 minutes ago, wvavin said:

Yes, it is good to ban otherwise it would not be fair to the home owners of the same block in many areas.

It will change nothing most of the places are on multiple sites.

Thailand will continue ST rentals every place.

[Mattd]

2 hours ago, SmartyMarty said:

Bad neighbours can be anywhere......sometimes not short term but permanent.

Don't disagree, however, when condos are being treated as short time hotels etc. then the bad neighbour part is guaranteed and rather annoying, I can handle a bit of door slamming during the day or evening.

[NextStationBangkok]

38 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Got to be one of the more stupid posts I have ever read......

 

That mean they are going to come to Thailand for sure....

[Jackin1960]

The simple way round this is to make it a booking for a month plus and only charge for the time they are at the place.

[NextStationBangkok]

44 minutes ago, fakename said:

What about Home Stay, where does it fit into the picture? 

 

As long as there is no proof, anyone can rent out their property for short or long term. Things can turn ugly, if some neighbor is complaining about it.

Rest assured it is going to be fine. Because it is going to increase household income, and government want that not Thais complaining the government.

[NextStationBangkok]

2 minutes ago, Jackin1960 said:

The simple way round this is to make it a booking for a month plus and only charge for the time they are at the place.

 

You mean come and stay in installment basis time to time ?

[David Walden]

22 hours ago, zaphod reborn said:

Renting out condo units for less than a month without a hotel license was always a legal violation.  The court ruling was expected.  It doesn't apply to single-unit homes.  

Yes the Condo in Cha-am I rent in will only take rentals for more then a month at a time,  This has been the case for some time.  At Catereya Condotel 600/700 rooms they have notices on each floor and lifts and front door about this advising tenants that the place is not a hotel and people renting out their Condos must do so at least a month at a time.  This legal decision will put the cat among the pidgins and the short term renters will just have to fly away.  

[DrTuner]

Now start cracking down on the Chinese and Russians. Where's Big Joke when we need him?

[DrTuner]

1 hour ago, robsamui said:

Yeah right, clear off out of it you irritating farang. Who needs you when we're getting 100 super-white slanty-eyed daytrippers for every one of you. All you lot do is whinge and moan about soi dogs and pollution and our lovely police,  and spend your time trying to make us look stupid, but those nice Chinese people just wanna buy stuff and then turn round and go home. Who needs you. Go back to your own country. Ha!

If you aren't Thai already, they should grant you nationality. Brilliant assimilation into the society.

[geisha]

From my experience, I don’t appreciate  my neighbours renting out their condos short term. The lifts and hall floors are always wet from the renters leaving the pool in their bathers, and noise . Plus sometimes the condos are over crowded. The mess they leave behind is sometimes incredible. 

[ChidlomDweller]

22 hours ago, Mattd said:

Personally I will give a big thumbs up for this IF it is enforced.

Weekdays sees me staying in a condo in central Bangkok, approx. 1km from Nana area and the last few months one of the owners on the same floor has been short term renting their unit, last lot were some young kids on holiday, 4 of them in the one condo, absolutely no thought for anybody else, coming home drunk at 3 am, slamming doors, shouting in the corridors and so on.

Most others there are working (myself included) and have to get up around 6 am, the last thing you need or want is this!

I had something similar with an apartment a floor down from me in Singapore when I lived there.  Some dick making hour-long loud Skype calls on the terrace, another chainsmoking literally 12 hours a day on the terrace (he used a metal foil basket like you put roasted chicken in for an ash tray), dumping their trash, and other nuisances.

 

Another thing is I read recently (regarding a recent law in Japan) is that the majority of offerings in Tokyo are Chinese investors.  It's one thing for owners to make some money renting out a spare room or while on holiday, but another when the thing becomes a business model driving up rents and housing prices in prime locations.  

Edited May 17, 2018 by ChidlomDweller

[Guitar God]

The fines are just another income stream for the government and a new source of bribe money for the Police. 

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, shady86 said:

How can they regulate this? Airbnb is not located in Thailand and acting as a middle man. There is no money transaction done between owner and tenant too.

Long term renters/ owners in condos are PO with the high turnover of people staying less than the allowed 1 month, and they can report the illegal rentals to the cops. The cops can then hold the condo management responsible, if they can't contact the owners.

Sounds a good move to me.

[ChidlomDweller]

9 minutes ago, Guitar God said:

The fines are just another income stream for the government and a new source of bribe money for the Police. 

It's possible, but in this case there's a good chance condo managements will enforce it rather than face the ire of actual tenants.

[KKr]

23 hours ago, Chang_paarp said:

The issue is the rental of the room for less than 30 days is the legal domain of the licenced hotel. Over 30 day it is a residential tenancy with different laws.

so, rent the room for 31 days with the right to cancel the contract in case the tenant or the landlord is perceived as not being polite in the elevator.

Having said that, given that short term tenants are not as morally bound by house rules as permanent tenants, the nuisance in some cases is of course considerable and a real bother for the other tenants..
Personally, I would be tempted to take action if my the neighbours start coming home at 2 or 3 a.m. as mentioned earlier, shouting, slamming doors, two guests audibly intoxicated, having fun with their newly met loving fiancee(s) next to a thin wall and on a balcony as I recently experienced in one of the CM hotels. (No, I will not tell the name of the Hotel ;-p )

Edited May 17, 2018 by KKr

[dallen52]

On 16/5/2561 at 2:51 PM, Chang_paarp said:

The issue is the rental of the room for less than 30 days is the legal domain of the licenced hotel. Over 30 day it is a residential tenancy with different laws.

And from previous attempts oversees i have seen that you cannot book more than 29 days?

But will stand corrected. 

[cryo]

No mention of unregistered businesses, non payment of tax, working without a work permit, money laundering. AirBnB is not illegal but using it to avoid paying tax or running illegal non registered businesses is and the Thai government is aware of this and is dealing with it. The Thai government has never had the ability to monitor these issues until now, but it now has the ability to pull the relevant info patterns out into the open using big data systems. For those people who do not understand what big data systems are they are interlinked computer systems running algorithms that specifically look for given patterns which given a reasonable amount of data on individuals (tourist, renter, bank account, business, visas etc) can easily pick out regular rentals and check owners against business registration, tax, work permits, etc. Big data systems are in use around the world by all big banks, industries, tax offices and you will find you cannot hide from them unless you are totally unregistered and only deal in cash which in this day and age is impossible. These systems have been and are being installed in all main Thai systems like immigration, tax, banking, licencing, visas, and credit card systems because these systems and the software that backs them up have a pay back of only a few years and then it is clear revenue for the Thai government so its a no brainier and an easy sell and install for the firms involved. I work for a firm who uses such a system to monitor worldwide operations of their process systems and the management of the said systems and you would be very surprised  how quickly the big data systems pick up regular patterns showing failure and mismanagement which once known can save millions of pounds a year. These systems are the ones the Thai government are using/installing which is why they require new data streams some of which you will see in the near future and some like the TM30 registration reintroduction you are seeing now. the days of Thailand being a tax free nation for Thais or Expats will be quickly numbered in the not to distant future. Big brother is already here and has been in the UK for the last 10 years and unfortunately and the number of countries where this is not the case is diminishing yearly. To those who disagree with this I will say you can only fool yourself for so long before they catch up to you so make your self legal and above board because once found out or caught you will be a constant income source for the legal or illegal force of the law. Sorry to be so negative but this is the present reality in the western world and is quickly becoming the reality in the far east and is the reality in Thailand now and if you think not that's simply because they haven't called out your number yet :-( 

Ken.

 

 

       

[Dukeleto]

7 hours ago, RBOP said:

So make a new law to make it legal.

Ahhh yes that would be the logical solution but the real drive behind this is the rich Thai elite families who own or have major shares in the big hotels and don’t want the competition. It’s really that simple.

 

What they are not understanding is that platforms such as Airbnb are significantly adding to the influx of tourists into the kingdom and the associated spend from those additional tourists. I would actually love to see them bar these platforms and watch the severe drop in tourist numbers they keep boasting about are getting bigger and bigger. They would be killing a massive sector of the tourist industry and the economic boost to other business supply these units not to mention the number of Thai people directly employed in the service or indirectly ancillary services which supply it.

Its all about keeping the elites happy which is why there is Junta in power in the first place. Thailand is for the Thais...my foot! Thailand is for the elite Thais...is really what they mean.

[DrTuner]

1 hour ago, ChidlomDweller said:

Another thing is I read recently (regarding a recent law in Japan) is that the majority of offerings in Tokyo are Chinese investors.  It's one thing for owners to make some money renting out a spare room or while on holiday, but another when the thing becomes a business model driving up rents and housing prices in prime locations.  

They don't need airbnb for that here, just let the tour operators herd them in straight from the buses into your illegal hotel.

[BobbyL]

6 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

its already being enforced, if you read the thread below.

 

"The arrest was the result of a sting with an officer posing as a client."

 

 

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Orac said:

 

Depends if they try and enforce it - not exactly rocket science for one of the many enforcement agencies here to turn up at a condo and then check ab&b for rooms for rent in it.

I can't see how.

 

What if I say the people staying in my condo are my friends and they aren't paying me. I highly doubt the RTP have the nous to trace transactions through AirBnb. 

 

As another poster said, AirBnB works great the world over. It is typical of here to even attempt to enforce something so hard to do so when they can't even enforce simple laws. 

[Orac]

I can't see how.
 
What if I say the people staying in my condo are my friends and they aren't paying me. I highly doubt the RTP have the nous to trace transactions through AirBnb. 
 
As another poster said, AirBnB works great the world over. It is typical of here to even attempt to enforce something so hard to do so when they can't even enforce simple laws. 

If it is the whole condo being targeted and they are knocking on doors of units they/management think are ab&b rentals chances are your renters have already told them they are not friends, how much they are paying and how long they are staying there - unless you are very carefully brief your renters what they need to say because it is being rented illegally...


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Dukeleto]

6 hours ago, Spock said:

I just booked an airbnb room in Bangkok last night in a condo for 18 nights beginning the end of June. The money has already been taken from my account. Can only hope that my stay is not affected. Never used airbnb before. Chose a bad time to try it.

Don’t worry your money is safe and you would get a full refund if your stay was affected by this.

[RichardL]

26 minutes ago, Dukeleto said:

Ahhh yes that would be the logical solution but the real drive behind this is the rich Thai elite families who own or have major shares in the big hotels and don’t want the competition. It’s really that simple.

 

Are the sort of people who'd normally book into those large and expensive hotels going to be people who use AirBnB?