do you live in the past or future

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

The movement switched from simple proletariat vs bourgeois's to a whole realm of victimization and identity politics. Now nearly every group is victim oppressed by white privilege, or misogynists, or global corporations... But they still want the redistribution of wealth to create utopia. It is the same wrong thinking that killed millions in the 20th century.

The redistribution of wealth is going the other way. Trump is living proof of that.

In Australia, it is possible to be a millionaire and get the old age pension. All you need is a good accountant.

You think Thailand is an example of the redistribution of wealth in favor of the victims? AFAIK no white privilege here, unless you want to count in the fetish of skin whitening.

[Lacessit]

10 hours ago, Brunolem said:

You and Observer90210 above are missing the point.

When I mention the job losses, I am not referring to the manufacturing and maintenance of these machines, but to the users.

With a computer, one employee can do the work that used to be done by five or so before.

 

No matter what, there is always the need for a very large pool of low qualifications jobs.

 

In the past, factories and offices provided many of those jobs.

 

Nowadays, these jobs have disappeared, yet people with low qualifications remain, and instead of, say, shuffling paper in a confortable office building, they are flipping burgers in a shitty fast food joint...when they are not unemployed.

 

There is no way that these people will become computer programmers and will be recruited by Microsoft.

 

Like it or not, the more technology advances, the more we are building an elitist society!

 

How come that the three richest Americans, among them Microsoft's Bill Gates and Amazon's Jeff Bezos, own as much as the lower 50% of the American population (160 million people)?

Such a situation would have been unthinkable 50 years ago...

Point taken. I think the observation about Microsoft and Windows went through to the wicketkeeper. I was being sarcastic.

[canuckamuck]

14 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The redistribution of wealth is going the other way. Trump is living proof of that.

In Australia, it is possible to be a millionaire and get the old age pension. All you need is a good accountant.

You think Thailand is an example of the redistribution of wealth in favor of the victims? AFAIK no white privilege here, unless you want to count in the fetish of skin whitening.

You can't see the Marxism but you sound like you believe in it. And no Thailand is not the same situation as the west. They haven't even made it out of feudalism yet.

[Brunolem]

2 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

You can't see the Marxism but you sound like you believe in it. And no Thailand is not the same situation as the west. They haven't even made it out of feudalism yet.

Feudalism reigns even more supreme in the West, between nations as well as inside nations.

 

Following Trump walking out the Iran deal and threatening nations who would dare making business with Iran, many European leaders have come to realize (better late than never) that European countries were US vassals.

 

This is also obviously the case for Japan, South Korea, Australia, New Zealand and Canada who dutifully report their every move to their US master.

 

Now, all of these countries have morphed from being democraties with a modicum of equality to being oligarchies where the oligarchs, or new nobility, own everything, while a large part of the population has to rely on government handouts and debt to survive...this is the modern version of feudalism.

 

And it is all a consequence of globalization, whose supporters' dream is to make the world in the image of a giant China: a small minority of unelected leaders (Brussels comes to mind), a small minority of billionaire oligarchs (already the case everywhere save Bhutan) and a large mass of indebted slaves/consumers!

[canuckamuck]

1 hour ago, Brunolem said:

Feudalism reigns even more supreme in the West, between nations as well as inside nations.

 

Following Trump walking out the Iran deal and threatening nations who would dare making business with Iran, many European leaders have come to realize (better late than never) that European countries were US vassals.

 

This is also obviously the case for Japan, South Korea, Australia, New Zealand and Canada who dutifully report their every move to their US master.

 

Now, all of these countries have morphed from being democraties with a modicum of equality to being oligarchies where the oligarchs, or new nobility, own everything, while a large part of the population has to rely on government handouts and debt to survive...this is the modern version of feudalism.

 

And it is all a consequence of globalization, whose supporters' dream is to make the world in the image of a giant China: a small minority of unelected leaders (Brussels comes to mind), a small minority of billionaire oligarchs (already the case everywhere save Bhutan) and a large mass of indebted slaves/consumers!

I agree with you, but it is not cut and dry like that. Feudalism is the natural power structure of humans. It is true that America has become a superpower and in doing so has feudalistic power like that of an empire. The best situation for the rich and powerful of any country is a feudal arrangement where there are entitlements and inequalities in the application of law.

That being said, socialism and the mean brother Marxism is very popular among intellectuals, educators artists and media (communities that do not need to prove their ideologies actually work and they can thrive on idealism and selective memory) Strangely, these groups are funded heavily by the globalists which seems somewhat backwards until you realize that the dysfunction and certain failure of socialism, along with multiple wars and destabilized nations will open the door to salvation by world government. Eventually taking the form of super feudalism. The world will likely be separated into several (continental) kingdoms with serfs becoming property of the state and the elite separated entirely from the masses.

 

[soalbundy]

Even nostalgia is not what it used to be.

[Lacessit]

34 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

I agree with you, but it is not cut and dry like that. Feudalism is the natural power structure of humans. It is true that America has become a superpower and in doing so has feudalistic power like that of an empire. The best situation for the rich and powerful of any country is a feudal arrangement where there are entitlements and inequalities in the application of law.

That being said, socialism and the mean brother Marxism is very popular among intellectuals, educators artists and media (communities that do not need to prove their ideologies actually work and they can thrive on idealism and selective memory) Strangely, these groups are funded heavily by the globalists which seems somewhat backwards until you realize that the dysfunction and certain failure of socialism, along with multiple wars and destabilized nations will open the door to salvation by world government. Eventually taking the form of super feudalism. The world will likely be separated into several (continental) kingdoms with serfs becoming property of the state and the elite separated entirely from the masses.

 

In other words, 1984 revisited.

[Brunolem]

3 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

Strangely, these groups are funded heavily by the globalists which seems somewhat backwards until you realize that the dysfunction and certain failure of socialism, along with multiple wars and destabilized nations will open the door to salvation by world government. Eventually taking the form of super feudalism. The world will likely be separated into several (continental) kingdoms with serfs becoming property of the state and the elite separated entirely from the masses.

 

Exactly!

Dysfunction and destabilization are essential components of the globalists' scheme.

 

We have a good example of this process currently in Italy, a former sovereign country which is becoming a template for the globalization process: out of control immigration, massive debts, rampant poverty and unemployment, and total control by the bureaucrats in Brussels who just refused to accept the verdict of the last elections!

 

Meanwhile, everything is done to cancel Brexit, because here again the results of the popular vote don't fit with the scheme of the Brussels' globalists.

 

The idea is to have 3 China-like land masses (like the 3 pseudo continents in 1984): America (the whole continent), Western Europe and East Asia (China, India, South East Asia).

 

Places that don't fit in the plan, for now, are the Middle East, in state of permanent war, and Russia with some other Eastern European countries, hence the constant provocations and threats, in order to force them to comply...

[canuckamuck]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

In other words, 1984 revisited.

1984 was quite prophetic on many levels. How could he have known that people would be happy to put little boxes in their houses that listened to everything they said and connected to a massive computer infrastructure which records everything. Sure he thought it would be little TV screens, but he didn't think we'd keep those in our pockets instead of on the wall.

 

[Odysseus123]

36 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

1984 was quite prophetic on many levels. How could he have known that people would be happy to put little boxes in their houses that listened to everything they said and connected to a massive computer infrastructure which records everything. Sure he thought it would be little TV screens, but he didn't think we'd keep those in our pockets instead of on the wall.

 

John Brunner's 'Stand on Zanzibar'was also quite prophetic.

 

An overpopulated dystopian world ruled by corporations,senseless act of violence and a proto-internet system where everyone logs on as "Mr and Mrs Everywhere"

 

A combination of Orwell and Brunner would be a very interesting picture of the present/future...

Edited May 31, 2018 by Odysseus123

[Brunolem]

39 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

1984 was quite prophetic on many levels. How could he have known that people would be happy to put little boxes in their houses that listened to everything they said and connected to a massive computer infrastructure which records everything. Sure he thought it would be little TV screens, but he didn't think we'd keep those in our pockets instead of on the wall.

 

The more the days go by, the more 1984 appears to be incredibly prophetic.

Orwell had anticipated the flat screen on the wall, in his book it was also interactive.

He had also anticipated the fake news, abundantly served by a totally controlled MSM to the hapless masses.

He had anticipated massive emprisonment for trivial offenses, such as this British blogger-reporter just sent to prison under complete secrecy.

He had anticipated total impunity for the state and its representatives, like the American cowboy-policemen who shoot and kill first, and ask questions later.

In more and more countries, laws are implemented to criminalize what the state labels offensive speaking...

 

I have long been convinced that the future, say, post 2030, would be a mix of 1984, for the areas under government control, and Mad Max for the rest.

 

Every passing day appears to bring us closer to that ugly future...

[sanemax]

56 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

How could he have known that people would be happy to put little boxes in their houses that listened to everything they said and connected to a massive computer infrastructure which records everything.

Although people do not have little boxes in their houses that listen to everything & record everything

[canuckamuck]

11 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Although people do not have little boxes in their houses that listen to everything & record everything

Ask Alexa, or Siri.

Edited May 31, 2018 by canuckamuck

[Odysseus123]

3 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

Ask Alexa, or Siri.

Indeed..or what they can get off your computer whenever they feel like it.

 

The curious thing is that if Apple/Microsoft announced with great fanfare that they were establishing clinics-for free-to implant chips directly into the brain the queues would be miles long with people camping out all night for the privilege of getting the newest cerebral update.

[sanemax]

33 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

Ask Alexa, or Siri.

Do they listen to everything that you say and record everything that you do, like in the book 1984 and does everyone have one installed ?

[canuckamuck]

17 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Do they listen to everything that you say and record everything that you do, like in the book 1984 and does everyone have one installed ?

Are you trying to pin me down on the fact that today is not identical to the book 1984? Because the point was about similarities to the 73 year old book, not replication

 

[Brunolem]

21 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Do they listen to everything that you say and record everything that you do, like in the book 1984 and does everyone have one installed ?

Indeed they do!

There was an interesting article not long ago from a guy who went looking into his personal accounts as they were kept by Google and Facebook.

Everything was recorded, absolutely everything!

Every photo he had ever taken or received, every email, every single page of every website he had ever visited, and so on.

It is really frightening if you think about it...

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎5‎/‎30‎/‎2018 at 1:13 AM, swissie said:

Still I believe that the last secrets of the universe will be discovered before

men understand women and visa versa.

[thaibeachlovers]

18 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Indeed they do!

There was an interesting article not long ago from a guy who went looking into his personal accounts as they were kept by Google and Facebook.

Everything was recorded, absolutely everything!

Every photo he had ever taken or received, every email, every single page of every website he had ever visited, and so on.

It is really frightening if you think about it...

If you have a sm@rt phone, they know where you are at all times. Even if you turn it off, when you turn it back on it sends the information to Big Brother.

Their plan is to make those phones necessary for everything and then they control everyone.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎5‎/‎30‎/‎2018 at 6:57 AM, Lacessit said:

The only downside I see is that the most successful people are increasingly the most successful liars.

If you mean the most wealthy people, they don't contribute anything to society, but exploit it. The people that actually "do" things like plumbers and nurses don't make anywhere near as much as people that move money around, and have far less satisfying lives.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎5‎/‎30‎/‎2018 at 12:22 PM, Brunolem said:

Indeed, the international excuse for not doing something is "I don't have time for that!".

Actually, labour saving devices have given us far more time at any point in history with which to do personal things. Unfortunately, most of us ( including myself ) have been seduced by the medium and spend most of our free time watching tv, on a phone, or on the computer.

With all the time I spend watching a tv or even just on TVF, I could do many far more beneficial things, but I'm addicted to the medium.

That's one reason I prefer the past, as tv was pretty rubbish so I didn't watch a lot and without computers or the internet, I spent far more time doing better things than wasting my time on the medium.

[Jonah Tenner]

20 hours ago, sanemax said:

Do they listen to everything that you say and record everything that you do, like in the book 1984 and does everyone have one installed ?

Yes, yes, no.

[Jonah Tenner]

On 5/31/2018 at 12:37 PM, soalbundy said:

Even nostalgia is not what it used to be.

That is because you don't remember...

[soalbundy]

On 6/1/2018 at 1:19 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

If you mean the most wealthy people, they don't contribute anything to society, but exploit it. The people that actually "do" things like plumbers and nurses don't make anywhere near as much as people that move money around, and have far less satisfying lives.

They have meaningful lives, that is a lot, admittedly it doesn't pay the rent but on the other hand I have known and still know some who have a lot of material comfort but inside they are unhappy people, that is the path of 'form', it's never enough. Form, things,relationships,beliefs don't last, that is the nature of form, it is like a ready made tv meal, there is no nourishment in it, just bulk. That is not to say there are no happy rich people but they have been able step out of believing that the world of form will bring them happiness. The greed of the unhappy rich provide the normal citizen a job and the aspiration to achieve such dizzy heights of comfort and unhappiness.

[Alan Whickerbasket]

The past is as real as the present is as real as the future, the terms don't really apply in terms of the bigger picture - the raindrop fell every way down the window pane. What 'you' perceive to be 'random' is just de-coherence - it's quantum mechanics and like a few others on here I have read books of the stuff in my time here in the LOS but feel unqualified to answer any questions on it - you understand it when you're reading it, but then if someone were to ask you what you had just read you tend to shrug your shoulders and say fkked if I know mate ?

 

Technology... hmmm yeah, could have made life pleasant for as many people as possible, but when you see 50,000 people jump up in the air ecstatic expecting it to be a cure for cancer, only to find out somebody has just kicked a football in to a net and been paid a quarter of a million pounds sterling per week for the pleasure. You begin to see the hopelessness of the task !!

 

I live in the present though I am aware that 'live' is only skin deep and there is a far deeper reality. When I speak to 'god' I don't look to the sky I stare straight in front of my nose because that's where he is - I just can't see him because all I can see is my brain. Observation.

 

In a word 'observation' it's not so straightforward but it's all in the 'observation' and it comes before baggage like mathematics and language, ask Albert.

 

As for my opinion on how technology has shaped society I can only offer up my final hope - my final hope is to be here when the shit hits the fan, AI becomes fully self- aware, uses our cars against us like it's first terminators (internet of things), and proceeds to wipe us all out - you can gather my opinion of society from that. Would they have fought the wars for us if they had known what they were dying for?

 

Alan.

Edited June 2, 2018 by Alan Whickerbasket

[jgarbo]

On 5/29/2018 at 7:49 AM, StreetCowboy said:

If it wasn't flat your spirit level wouldn't work

An accurate spirit level would show the earth's not flat, but the level would need to be about 50kms long, then the ends couldn't touch the ground.

[jgarbo]

18 hours ago, Alan Whickerbasket said:

The past is as real as the present is as real as the future, the terms don't really apply in terms of the bigger picture - the raindrop fell every way down the window pane. What 'you' perceive to be 'random' is just de-coherence - it's quantum mechanics and like a few others on here I have read books of the stuff in my time here in the LOS but feel unqualified to answer any questions on it - you understand it when you're reading it, but then if someone were to ask you what you had just read you tend to shrug your shoulders and say fkked if I know mate ?

 

Technology... hmmm yeah, could have made life pleasant for as many people as possible, but when you see 50,000 people jump up in the air ecstatic expecting it to be a cure for cancer, only to find out somebody has just kicked a football in to a net and been paid a quarter of a million pounds sterling per week for the pleasure. You begin to see the hopelessness of the task !!

 

I live in the present though I am aware that 'live' is only skin deep and there is a far deeper reality. When I speak to 'god' I don't look to the sky I stare straight in front of my nose because that's where he is - I just can't see him because all I can see is my brain. Observation.

 

In a word 'observation' it's not so straightforward but it's all in the 'observation' and it comes before baggage like mathematics and language, ask Albert.

 

As for my opinion on how technology has shaped society I can only offer up my final hope - my final hope is to be here when the shit hits the fan, AI becomes fully self- aware, uses our cars against us like it's first terminators (internet of things), and proceeds to wipe us all out - you can gather my opinion of society from that. Would they have fought the wars for us if they had known what they were dying for?

 

Alan.

Sorry, no Past, no Future, which are only concepts. There is only Now. Oops, you missed it.

[bannork]

I am here in the present right now, but I can only write that by depending on my past when I learned to write and develop thought processes. 

So my present only exists for me due to my past.

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, bannork said:

I am here in the present right now, but I can only write that by depending on my past when I learned to write and develop thought processes. 

So my present only exists for me due to my past.

That's true, your present abilities were learnt in the past and are stored in the present but the past no longer exists and the future is yet to be, the present is so fleeting, soon to be the past, that one could say that the present doesn't exist either, what is the present moment, the now, this very second, this thousandths of a second or millionth of a second ?  there is only the timeless now, you are the space in this now in which things happen but you are not what happens, you are the witness, the space in which it happens, what happens 'is' you are not the doer, you are the presence, the witness of what is.

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, soalbundy said:

That's true, your present abilities were learnt in the past and are stored in the present but the past no longer exists and the future is yet to be, the present is so fleeting, soon to be the past, that one could say that the present doesn't exist either, what is the present moment, the now, this very second, this thousandths of a second or millionth of a second ?  there is only the timeless now, you are the space in this now in which things happen but you are not what happens, you are the witness, the space in which it happens, what happens 'is' you are not the doer, you are the presence, the witness of what is.

So what you are saying is that you don't really exist . So here I am replying to non existent people .