Thailand cave rescue: How would you survive in a cave?

[webfact]

Thailand cave rescue: How would you survive in a cave?

By Toby Luckhurst

BBC News

 

FILE photo

 

A group of 12 teenagers have been trapped underground in Thailand with their football coach for the last four days.

 

Heavy rain has flooded the cave system, hindering the authorities' attempts at a rescue.

 

But what are the best ways to survive in a cave? We spoke to cavers, who emphasised the need to stay warm, keep hydrated, and stay out of danger when trapped underground.

 

Full story: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-44633601

 

-- © Copyright BBC 2018-06-28

[mok199]

I would pray the ''thai authorities'' call ''professionals'' from outside thailand for advice and be willing to accept ''outside help and or adivce''..and please please..no monks no mediums and no politicians looking for some ''photo opp time'' absolutely sad how they handled this rescue and which is now likely a recovery ...

Edited June 28, 2018 by mok199
speliings

[Just1Voice]

It's been more than 5 days now.  I feel the chances of a successful rescue of all is no longer possible. 

 

Heartbreaking and sad but, unfortunately, probably true.

 

[Cancerian]

4 hours ago, Just1Voice said:

It's been more than 5 days now.  I feel the chances of a successful rescue of all is no longer possible. 

 

Heartbreaking and sad but, unfortunately, probably true.

 

They are young people have gone weeks and survived and theres obviously water and if one should unfortunatley die they also have food to 

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, Cancerian said:

They are young people have gone weeks and survived and theres obviously water and if one should unfortunatley die they also have food to 

That's a grim thought.

There have been reports there may be crickets in there but not sure how you catch crickets in complete darkness.

But the psychology of this situation comes up again.

People have tended to be thinking either they will all be saved, or none.

It's entirely possible that they will lose some of them. Then the group panic psychology of dealing with that could become even more intense. 

[worgeordie]

I would never have gone it,especially with a load of kids,

the sign at the entrance says don't go in during the rainy

season as the cave floods........but some people take no

notice.

I just hope they get them out,with all the experts there

gives hope, but it depends on the rain.

regards Worgeordie

[jaltsc]

"How would you survive in a cave?"

 

First, I wouldn't go caving the Thai way. Trusting an inexperienced person, with no extensive knowledge of caving in general, and this cave in particular, to be the leader. For some reason, many, if not most Thais, don't plan, they just do, and this is the worst case scenario as a result of what appears to be a culture of negligence.  They don't foresee any possible problems, and then when one appears, they haven't developed the skills to assess and formulate a solution other than Mai Pen Rai.

Edited June 28, 2018 by jaltsc

[Peterw42]

26 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

I would never have gone it,especially with a load of kids,

the sign at the entrance says don't go in during the rainy

season as the cave floods........but some people take no

notice.

I just hope they get them out,with all the experts there

gives hope, but it depends on the rain.

regards Worgeordie

 

23 minutes ago, Preut said:

I would stay warm by beating the clown who brought me into the cave. Really ingenius to do this trip during rainy season. Curious how many have died by now. Drinking fluids is 1 thing. Lack of sleep, the stress, the cold, humidity, hunger, etc... Pfffffff what a mess ?????

To be fair, the warning sign apparently says dont go in between July and September, and it wasn't raining at the cave entrance when they went in. But still not great planning.

[Expatthailover]

7 hours ago, mok199 said:

I would pray the ''thai authorities'' call ''professionals'' from outside thailand for advice and be willing to accept ''outside help and or adivce''..and please please..no monks no mediums and no politicians looking for some ''photo opp time'' absolutely sad how they handled this rescue and which is now likely a recovery ...

A very tragic situation and the usual type come on as an excuse to bash thai people, their abilities etc etc.

What a disgrace.

Have some compassion and humility.

I realise that is a big ask

[Expatthailover]

1 hour ago, jaltsc said:

"How would you survive in a cave?"

 

First, I wouldn't go caving the Thai way. Trusting an inexperienced person, with no extensive knowledge of caving in general, and this cave in particular, to be the leader. For some reason, many, if not most Thais, don't plan, they just do, and this is the worst case scenario as a result of what appears to be a culture of negligence.  They don't foresee any possible problems, and then when one appears, they haven't developed the skills to assess and formulate a solution other than Mai Pen Rai.

Again one of these overarching stereotyping comments aimed at the whole thai population.

It is and was an accident.

It is and should not be an excuse to bash thais.

People all over the world get into similar difficulties but no let us attribute misguided impulsion as solely a thai trait.

[colinneil]

2 minutes ago, Expatthailover said:

A very tragic situation and the usual type come on as an excuse to bash thai people, their abilities etc etc.

What a disgrace.

Have some compassion and humility.

I realise that is a big ask

Wake up and stop posting nonsense, posters saying bring in outside help are speaking sensibly your not.

Nobody is Thai bashing, Thais do not have the expertise in matters like this.

The British experts are world renown in their field, so they are the best men for the job.

[300sd]

2 minutes ago, Expatthailover said:

Again one of these overarching stereotyping comments aimed at the whole thai population.

It is and was an accident.

It is and should not be an excuse to bash thais.

People all over the world get into similar difficulties but no let us attribute misguided impulsion as solely a thai trait.

Get over it. I don't see many professional Thai service people helping when other countries are in need of assistance....with all due respect, possibly it is very limited!

[BangkokSausage]

It's been more than 5 days now.  I feel the chances of a successful rescue of all is no longer possible. 
 
Heartbreaking and sad but, unfortunately, probably true.
 

You can last week's with out food people fast for up to 30 days but not without water. They are young and it's a big plus.

[Boss]

What's the temperature in the cave and the waters down there ? Hypothermia is their biggest problem if they stay out of the water...

[Cancerian]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

That's a grim thought.

There have been reports there may be crickets in there but not sure how you catch crickets in complete darkness.

But the psychology of this situation comes up again.

People have tended to be thinking either they will all be saved, or none.

It's entirely possible that they will lose some of them. Then the group panic psychology of dealing with that could become even more intense. 

Grim as it is its a real possibility. Watch the movie survive

[Falcon]

Apart from bringing experts in from the UK, there is another option which also would work out and closer to home too, bring in the Chinese who also have, through necessity, become quite adept at cave rescues from having so many mine cave ins in various parts of China, on a yearly basis. But then, why would the Thais want to bring in someone from China who might actually know what they are doing and end up with the ‘loss of face’ issue because China manage to do something that Thailand can’t!!

[Gulfsailor]

15 minutes ago, Falcon said:

Apart from bringing experts in from the UK, there is another option which also would work out and closer to home too, bring in the Chinese who also have, through necessity, become quite adept at cave rescues from having so many mine cave ins in various parts of China, on a yearly basis. But then, why would the Thais want to bring in someone from China who might actually know what they are doing and end up with the ‘loss of face’ issue because China manage to do something that Thailand can’t!!

From an early stage there have been foreigners involved in the rescue. Right now there are some experienced British cave divers on site, as well as the US military. 

That whole ideaof Thais not accepting foreign help and advice is bull, and probably based on some barstool experts on here not being listened to by their extended family and neighbors in some Issan backwater village. 

Edited June 28, 2018 by Gulfsailor

[Tug]

I would like to know the water temp and air temp inside water will absorbed a lot of co2 if they are on a ledge it’s possible they are alive let’s hope so and let’s hope they don’t kill any rescuers still praying tug

[Bangkokazy]

"How would you survive in a cave"
It is just standing on the shoulders of the others boy´s when water rises.

[Lacessit]

Food is not an issue for a month. Water is not an issue. Their two threats are hypothermia and air supply.

As far as survival in a cave goes, I would not be going in. Although I suppose peer group pressure was in play.

[Toscano]

Firstly it is proved very unwise to go exploring caves at this time of year when there is heavy rain and the caves may be flooded , the dry season is the only time that is reasonably safe .  One would like to think that people exploring such a large cave system would go well equipped with survival rations and small portable water purification kits , a small primus or gas cooker .  One of the problems seems to be a lack of oxygen that may not be a problem for a small group of people as it appears to be for a large number of rescuers .  One wonders that a rope has not be trailed from the point of entry  .

[BangkokSausage]

Apart from bringing experts in from the UK, there is another option which also would work out and closer to home too, bring in the Chinese who also have, through necessity, become quite adept at cave rescues from having so many mine cave ins in various parts of China, on a yearly basis. But then, why would the Thais want to bring in someone from China who might actually know what they are doing and end up with the ‘loss of face’ issue because China manage to do something that Thailand can’t!!

Chinese can't even manage a buffet without attacking each other . KEEP THEM OUT!

[yrag]

All should pray for their recovery, Americans have new tools now to drill and go through side of cave, hoping tomorrow be the day...

[kannot]

3 hours ago, yrag said:

All should pray for their recovery,

biggest waste of time

[busa]

All is good, Thai navy seals will rise to the ocassion. 

Nort sure how their iPhone google maps will work in caves. 

[BobbyL]

13 hours ago, Falcon said:

Apart from bringing experts in from the UK, there is another option which also would work out and closer to home too, bring in the Chinese who also have, through necessity, become quite adept at cave rescues from having so many mine cave ins in various parts of China, on a yearly basis. But then, why would the Thais want to bring in someone from China who might actually know what they are doing and end up with the ‘loss of face’ issue because China manage to do something that Thailand can’t!!

Ridiculous post.

[overherebc]

12 hours ago, Tug said:

I would like to know the water temp and air temp inside water will absorbed a lot of co2 if they are on a ledge it’s possible they are alive let’s hope so and let’s hope they don’t kill any rescuers still praying tug

Air temp' probably around 20 C, water a bit cooler.

One big problem is coping with the complete lack of light. If they have a watch or two among them that is luminous it helps. 

Short exercise in the Cheddar Gorge we had watches removed and all lights out for a period. Sat in total darkness and quiet for a period and then lights back on. Everyone estimated the time we were in the darkness and estimates varied from 10 minutes to 30 minutes, it was in fact 15 minutes.

100% no light and no idea of time past can play strange tricks with your mind.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎6‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 10:10 AM, Just1Voice said:

It's been more than 5 days now.  I feel the chances of a successful rescue of all is no longer possible. 

 

Heartbreaking and sad but, unfortunately, probably true.

 

As long as they are in a "safe" place, and have access to water, they can last weeks. They would be pretty skinny, but alive. Severe symptoms start at 35 to 40 days and death at 45 to 61 days.

However, given they are sportsmen, they may last less time that fat people would, as less reserves.

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, Toscano said:

Firstly it is proved very unwise to go exploring caves at this time of year when there is heavy rain and the caves may be flooded , the dry season is the only time that is reasonably safe .  One would like to think that people exploring such a large cave system would go well equipped with survival rations and small portable water purification kits , a small primus or gas cooker .  One of the problems seems to be a lack of oxygen that may not be a problem for a small group of people as it appears to be for a large number of rescuers .  One wonders that a rope has not be trailed from the point of entry  .

They had been there before, and marked the way, according to reports.

It's also unwise to drive drunk, but that seems to be done by a significant number of Thais.

[overherebc]

32 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

They had been there before, and marked the way, according to reports.

It's also unwise to drive drunk, but that seems to be done by a significant number of Thais.

And, as a rough estimate 90% of the expats I know drive drunk. Isn't that a novelty as a famous comedian from uk used to say.