Trump: Harley-Davidsons being made in Thailand is "the beginning of the end"

[DILLIGAD]

You don't think HD would constantly monitor build quality? Mmmm...........

Triumph do and I’ve heard favorable comments about the current range from LOS.


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[Lacessit]

20 hours ago, jenny2017 said:

But he shouldn't sleep with his friends' wives. 

AFAIK Trump has no moral compass. Anyone who can talk about pardoning himself before the jury has even come back in is proof of that.

[KiwiKiwi]

 

Trump is doing (and will hopefully continue to do), exactly what he was elected to do. Make the Republicans unelectable. Watch and see.

[ramrod711]

On ‎6‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 11:10 AM, doggie1955 said:

Tariffs need to be increased first of all. (I am from the US). If the tariffs were higher then the money it costs to outsource products might make companies start to use Americans to produce goods. I believe it is always better to have any country use their own people to do the jobs to get things made, instead of getting poor little Chinese people to make our shoes and toys, and yes I do realize that China is not the only country that companies use to make cheaper products, but its a big one. If tariffs were higher then the companies would not make as much money from foreign people and more local citizens would have jobs, and more businesses would buy materials from inside their own countries...MAGA

Tariffs raise prices for consumers. Canada imports 80% of household appliances from the U S. If Canada slaps a tariff on appliances Canadians pay more for appliances, unless of course they decide to import Japanese or Korean appliances which would put Americans out of jobs. Factor in the tariffs on Canadian steel and aluminum imported to the U S to make the appliance, you have a washing machine no one can afford. Tariffs are stupid.

[lvr181]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

AFAIK Trump has no moral compass. Anyone who can talk about pardoning himself before the jury has even come back in is proof of that.

Same same happens here.  

[jenny2017]

On 6/28/2018 at 7:13 PM, Lacessit said:

World's biggest vibrators.

Trump's philosophy is when someone hits you, you hit them back twice as hard. That only works when your opponent is the same size. He's trying to take on the whole world.

Or you hit back with an oversized snap on tool. ?

[jenny2017]

2 hours ago, lvr181 said:

Same same happens here.  

The tiny joke?

[jenny2017]

5 hours ago, DILLIGAD said:

Triumph do and I’ve heard favorable comments about the current range from LOS.


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Thanks. I'd buy one now if I had the money in my pockets. 

[Hummin]

On 6/28/2018 at 10:39 AM, Just1Voice said:

  But let's face it, Harley is the All American Bike. That's an undisputable fact. HD is, and almost always has been, a symbol of "Americana".  

yes, you said it, they are big fat and noisy, and hard to handle with sense. Can not trust them at all to the end! 

[DILLIGAD]

Thanks. I'd buy one now if I had the money in my pockets. 

That’s what I’m waiting for,Mike!


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[roo860]

yes, you said it, they are big fat and noisy, and hard to handle with sense. Can not trust them at all to the end! 

Are you on about the bikes or American women?
[emoji2]

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[Hummin]

2 minutes ago, roo860 said:

 

Are you on about the bikes or American women?


Sent from my SM-G920F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

I just want to touch the starter gently, and get going, not call the mechanic or a friend to make it happen,,,,,,,

[jenny2017]

A friend came by last night and he let me drive his Harley. The ride gave me enough kicks on route 66 to wait for one that's built here.

 

 

[Monomial]

9 hours ago, Johnnyondaspot said:

Obviously you haven't taken an economics class and you've just done what Trump does all the time, oversimplify the subject.  It's that easy, huh? ( Like healthcare and budget matters).

 

It is as simple or as difficult as you want to make it. From an average, macro perspective, the free trade enthusiasts are correct. The existing system is more efficient when averaged over a whole country.  But that average can be deceiving, as the wealthy and investor class get a disproportionate share of the benefits,.

 

Tariffs will certainly raise the price of everything, however, along with that, it will also inject more money into the American economy through rising labor costs. A new equilibrium will be established, where the country may be worse off on average, but when looking at the distribution of income, the biggest income hit will be taken by the investment class. The labor class will probably be relatively better off, paying steeply higher prices, but also getting substantially higher wages.

 

Like most things, framing the question and establishing perspective is very important. Some people (namely labor) will likely benefit from Trump tariffs. Others (investors and those on fixed income) will likely lose.   Which group you are in will determine how you ultimately feel about it.

 

Tariffs are not all bad. They have been the standard for most of history, and likely will be again. Free Trade has had its day. The pendulum is swinging back.

 

 

[jenny2017]

11 minutes ago, DILLIGAD said:

That’s what I’m waiting for,Mike!


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I had the ride of the year last evening. OMG, the sound, the handling and the power. If anybody would ask me my wife or a Harley, I'd take the wheels. 

[Hummin]

It is not only Harley who suffers, but also many other projects involving Americans doing the jobs on American soil. 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2018 by Hummin

[jenny2017]

10 minutes ago, roo860 said:

 

Are you on about the bikes or American women?


Sent from my SM-G920F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

A rhetorical question? ?

[jenny2017]

15 minutes ago, Hummin said:

It is not only Harley who suffers, but also many other projects involving Americans doing the jobs on American soil. 

 

 

Why would you use a renewable energy if you can take other countries and just take their oil? Just declare war with country xxx and tell others that they have nuclear Trumpboobs, aeeh bombs. 

Isaan could be the place for Grass plants, the absolute plant for an almost emission-free car with a lot of power. It's a joke that not all houses in the States are solar powered by now. But hate and insanity seem to be more important these days. 

He doesn't seem to see the trees in the forest, that's a problem for all, not only his own Twitting Bs.. Shame on him. 

Edited June 29, 2018 by jenny2017

[candide]

15 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

It is as simple or as difficult as you want to make it. From an average, macro perspective, the free trade enthusiasts are correct. The existing system is more efficient when averaged over a whole country.  But that average can be deceiving, as the wealthy and investor class get a disproportionate share of the benefits,.

 

Tariffs will certainly raise the price of everything, however, along with that, it will also inject more money into the American economy through rising labor costs. A new equilibrium will be established, where the country may be worse off on average, but when looking at the distribution of income, the biggest income hit will be taken by the investment class. The labor class will probably be relatively better off, paying steeply higher prices, but also getting substantially higher wages.

 

Like most things, framing the question and establishing perspective is very important. Some people (namely labor) will likely benefit from Trump tariffs. Others (investors and those on fixed income) will likely lose.   Which group you are in will determine how you ultimately feel about it.

 

Tariffs are not all bad. They have been the standard for most of history, and likely will be again. Free Trade has had its day. The pendulum is swinging back.

 

 

Thanks for this post. Not sure you're right, but at least you bring interesting and challenging arguments in this debate. I need to think more about it......

PS I would not bet that what you argue is what Trump has in mind (providing benefits to the working class at the expense of investors)

[DILLIGAD]

I had the ride of the year last evening. OMG, the sound, the handling and the power. If anybody would ask me my wife or a Harley, I'd take the wheels. 

You will have to put on a bit more weight and buy a waistcoat if your turning to Hardley Moveable, mate!


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[pegman]

3 hours ago, Monomial said:

 

It is as simple or as difficult as you want to make it. From an average, macro perspective, the free trade enthusiasts are correct. The existing system is more efficient when averaged over a whole country.  But that average can be deceiving, as the wealthy and investor class get a disproportionate share of the benefits,.

 

Tariffs will certainly raise the price of everything, however, along with that, it will also inject more money into the American economy through rising labor costs. A new equilibrium will be established, where the country may be worse off on average, but when looking at the distribution of income, the biggest income hit will be taken by the investment class. The labor class will probably be relatively better off, paying steeply higher prices, but also getting substantially higher wages.

 

Like most things, framing the question and establishing perspective is very important. Some people (namely labor) will likely benefit from Trump tariffs. Others (investors and those on fixed income) will likely lose.   Which group you are in will determine how you ultimately feel about it.

 

Tariffs are not all bad. They have been the standard for most of history, and likely will be again. Free Trade has had its day. The pendulum is swinging back.

 

 

How is stock in FaceBook, MicroSoft or Amazon going to get hit? That's where investors have their $$$. GM shares are cheap but they employ directly or indirectly a hell of a lot of people. I heard today that the average American car, which sells for $32k, will see its sticker price go up $6k because of the tariffs. Consumers will stop buying vehicles as quick as when Bush's near depression happened in late 2007. That my friend will put a lot of very well paid unionized workers out of work and may put GM back into bankruptcy. Do some research on why W. Bush flip flopped with steel tariffs in 2002-3. Many more jobs were lost than created that's why. Wages do need to go up but a better way would be to strengthen unions rather than trying to destroy them like the Republicans so love to do. 

[ramrod711]

10 hours ago, Hummin said:

It is not only Harley who suffers, but also many other projects involving Americans doing the jobs on American soil. 

 

 

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-koch-brothers-dirty-war-on-solar-power-20160211

 

Trump is a late entry to the war on solar, the Koch brothers are pioneers. Just one of the nasty things they represent.

[Hummin]

21 minutes ago, ramrod711 said:

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-koch-brothers-dirty-war-on-solar-power-20160211

 

Trump is a late entry to the war on solar, the Koch brothers are pioneers. Just one of the nasty things they represent.

Im thinking of the movie "Back to the future 2" starring Michael J Fox. It is a sad comedie for the world! 

 

Anyway solar power, electric cars, does not free us from future problems with exploiting this planet for its resources, and the more fossil fuel we use, and the more trees we remove we digg our selves down in a black hole. 

 

All together with plastic and all other kind of things we are not aware of yet. Humans it is just a plain sad specie. 

[StevieAus]

On 6/29/2018 at 8:58 AM, Bluespunk said:

What are “white goods”?

Refrigerators, washing machines etc I understand that’s the generic term used unless I am out of date which could well be!!!

[duanebigsby]

On 6/28/2018 at 2:47 PM, kickstart said:

Do they build Triumph, Ducati's and BMW, from the ground up, ie do all the engine castings and machining etc, here in Thailand, or as I think with Triumph's and maybe other makes, some parts are imported into Thailand and built here in to complete bikes.

We have a Triumph dealership in Lopburi, drive past with a drooling mouth, nice bikes. 

with Triumph, about 80% is manufactured here. Some engine castings, crankshafts, camshafts, etc are British manufacture.  British parts come here for final assembly, Thai parts shipped to UK for final assembly of bikes.

Win/ win I think.

[lvr181]

Wow, there is nearly as much posting here, about HD, as about the poor kids missing in a cave. 

[Hummin]

4 hours ago, lvr181 said:

Wow, there is nearly as much posting here, about HD, as about the poor kids missing in a cave. 

Hard to write anything we do not know anything about, even we do in all other treads. At least we can silent follow the progress and news about this tragedy, and hope it will be an happy ending for everyone involved. 

Edited June 30, 2018 by Hummin

[ChrisY1]

Won't make them any cheaper.....they'll be called "luxury" and have the huge taxes that are present now.

[janclaes47]

8 minutes ago, ChrisY1 said:

Won't make them any cheaper.....they'll be called "luxury" and have the huge taxes that are present now.

Well it made the triumph, bmw, yamaha and several other bikes considerable cheaper

Edited June 30, 2018 by janclaes47

[Monomial]

16 hours ago, pegman said:

How is stock in FaceBook, MicroSoft or Amazon going to get hit? That's where investors have their $$$. GM shares are cheap but they employ directly or indirectly a hell of a lot of people. I heard today that the average American car, which sells for $32k, will see its sticker price go up $6k because of the tariffs. Consumers will stop buying vehicles as quick as when Bush's near depression happened in late 2007. That my friend will put a lot of very well paid unionized workers out of work and may put GM back into bankruptcy. Do some research on why W. Bush flip flopped with steel tariffs in 2002-3. Many more jobs were lost than created that's why. Wages do need to go up but a better way would be to strengthen unions rather than trying to destroy them like the Republicans so love to do. 

 

Not saying stock will get hit. Most stock will probably go up, in fact. But it won't go up as much as prices go up in goods in order to compensate for the tariffs. At the same time, wages will increase more than investor profits. The result is that absolute economic efficiency will decrease, but the investor class will suffer comparatively more than the labor class. You need to think beyond, the price will go up so nobody will buy. High tariffs will encourage production in America, injecting more money in American wallets, allowing them to continue purchasing even at the higher prices. Meanwhile, high tariffs will help to offset the trend of decreasing salaries of the American labor class over the last few decades, pushing wages up. A new equilibrium will take at least a decade to be reached, so any flip flopping on tariffs during short periods in the past has little to do with real economics, and everything to do with politics.

 

The people who lose the most in this scenario are those on a fixed income. The second biggest losers are the investors, who will see a larger percentage of corporate revenues going to salary, and less to investor profits. In aggregate, the efficiency of wealth generation will decrease, and absolute production will also decline. But the labor class stands to be relatively better off in this scenario vs. investors. It isn't really all that difficult to understand, but it is obviously going to be an unpopular option for those who currently benefit from the status quo.

 

This is not the first time free trade has been tried, reached a peak and then declined throughout history. The effect is well studied.