Boys continue diving training as concerns over health emerge

[smutcakes]

5 minutes ago, sikishrory said:

I would have thought it much more logical to find alternative exits from the inside of the cave. rather than the top down

Any chance you can send this message to the front line, I am sure all the professionals and experts have not thought of this scenario.

[madusa]

1 hour ago, Mitker said:

I think it makes a lot of sense on a diver point of view at least

Indeed, the major risk is an unskilled panicking kid, and that environment makes that scenario very likely

 

Now, only medics could decide if, given their weak physical condition, it would be safe enough

 

This is all about balancing risks of very different nature. No exact science here

 

2 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

A rescue diver says the easiest way to get the Thai soccer team out of the cave is to drug them

http://www.businessinsider.com/thai-cave-diver-says-easiest-way-to-get-soccer-team-out-is-drug-them-2018-7?amp%3Butm_medium=referral

Not a lot of time left before the rain starts. So I guess if they try out the "Drug" way of getting them out. Just try one of them to see if it works. Put one of them in a body bag with oxygen mask on and seal the bag to bring it out. Of course with the parents permission, also to explain the risks to the parents . If they willing to take the risk, good.

[CGW]

3 hours ago, DILLIGAD said:

The time to take them out is when the cave diving experts say it is safe and not before.

If only it were that simple, if the "divers" say wait, the weather folks say the cave is going to flood, someone else is telling you there is no oxygen, difficult decisions to be made!

[greenchair]

Let's hope today some of them will come out. 

[smutcakes]

My only hope is that someone can make the decision and at least try to get them out rather than wait until the rains return and possibly trap many more people down there. 

 

The way the leave them there for 4 months option has faded away from official sources, it would appear that this is not an option and at some point they are going to have to pull the trigger and try to get them out. Although an impossible decision, hopefully someone can make that decision before rains return and possibly completely flood the channels.

 

I suppose one option could be that they continue to hope with the pumping the water out that they can maintain the water levels at a level where the lads won't be inundated, but i presume a huge risk.

 

Fingers crossed and good luck to all.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

A rescue diver says the easiest way to get the Thai soccer team out of the cave is to drug them

http://www.businessinsider.com/thai-cave-diver-says-easiest-way-to-get-soccer-team-out-is-drug-them-2018-7?amp%3Butm_medium=referral

 

That article, apart from its topic, had a very useful and informative graphic that I haven't seen shown in any of the news reports presented here thus far, that illustrates the path inside the cave:

 

 

Frankly, I just can't understand how or why the group, apparently led by their coach, would have felt the need or desire to travel so far into this underground labyrinth.

 

 

[jmccarty]

Getting them out on SCUBA will mean one or more will not make it. SRP with a commercial/military team and plan will work safely and in a short time compared to what they have been doing.

[jerry921]

8 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

That article, apart from its topic, had a very useful and informative graphic that I haven't seen shown in any of the news reports presented here thus far, that illustrates the path inside the cave:

 

 

Frankly, I just can't understand how or why the group, apparently led by their coach, would have felt the need or desire to travel so far into this underground labyrinth.

 

 

I thought I read that the last underwater section (the first one the boys would have to swim on the way out) was the longest, about 400m under water. I assume the above pic was not presented as being to scale, but I suspect it's still deceptive about how easy it would be to get them to Pattaya beach.

 

Edit: I'd love to find out I'm incorrect and that the first dive would not be the hardest for them. Please correct me if you can.

Edited July 7, 2018 by jerry921

[NoshowJones]

2 hours ago, Easy Come Easy Go said:

Ask the monk to do something, surely that will fix the situation 

This is not a time for jokes, have some respect.

[LennyW]

54 minutes ago, sikishrory said:

I would have thought it much more logical to find alternative exits from the inside of the cave. rather than the top down

i was thinking something similar, a bit of controlled precision blasting at the side to at least make the distance between the cave and the outside smaller then drilling could be much easier/quicker.

[khlongtoey]

I'm wondering how many underwater sections are narrow   ; the "two feet width" stuff they allude too, and if there is any vis at all usually, and how much the current changes,

 

Even if they get "oxygen" in, I wonder if they also need CO2 scrubbers ; they need exhaust I think, other than whatever the stream is absorbing ; 

 

May be some thought also, about getting them all out if your going to get any out, sad to say

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

Health and immune issues taking a front row seat. Plainly time to take them out now. 

Another "armchair rescuer" the time to get them out is when the time/conditions are correct... not before !

Health matters can be dealt with inside the cave with food/drink supplements & inoculations

[Rampant20]

4 hours ago, djjamie said:

Even if they get out before the 15th of July I cannot see them take advantage of the free offer by FIFA to fly them all to Russis to watch the world cup final. I hope the kids have not been made aware of this offer. 

This is of course what you deem to be the most important aspect of this situation. <deleted>

I just hope the experts can get their collective heads together for one and one reason only and to get them out the safest way possible with no more lives lost. RIP To Samarn Kunun.

[Tony125]

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/efforts-to-rescue-boys-from-thai-cave-stall-as-it-becomes-clear-just-how-risky-every-method-is/ar-AAzE7an?li=BBnb7Kz

 

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/thailand-cave-rescue-162153947.html

[starky]

3 hours ago, pegman said:

Do a dry run with one of the fittest older boys first. That would be the best way to find out if the dive option is feasible for the main group.

Unless he dies of course which may be a bit counterproductive.

[CGW]

13 minutes ago, starky said:

Unless he dies of course which may be a bit counterproductive.

"positive action combined with positive thinking results in success"

Not your mantra is it? ?
 

[crankshaft]

The question is....how did they get 5k into the cave?

[Mitker]

1 hour ago, THE REVERAND said:

The COWBOYS are back with their BRILLIANT IDEAS .Remember it was THE PROFESSIONALS  who Found Them and are ASSISTING and ASSESSING, The Coach and The BOYS. They have their FINGER on the PULSE FOR the BEST  RESULT ,LEAVE THEM TO IT not listen to THE EMPTY HEADED REST .  It is Amazing where this MOB HAVE DISCOVERED THERE NEWLY FOUND KNOWLEDGE ON CAVE RESCUE.

maybe a forum (platform meant to share opinions) is not exactly the place you fit best..

[gamini]

I really can't, understand why nobody has suggested using oxygen rebreather's. The apparatus is small and, light and the tanks are small too. They would hold enough oxygen for over two hours use. There would be no air bubbles which could affect any visibility. They are normally not used for the diving because oxygen is toxic at over 30 feet depth. But water in the cave is very shallow, so there would be no problem.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

22 minutes ago, Tony125 said:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/efforts-to-rescue-boys-from-thai-cave-stall-as-it-becomes-clear-just-how-risky-every-method-is/ar-AAzE7an?li=BBnb7Kz

 

 

From that Washington Post report overnight:

 

Quote

The boys, he (the former CR governor) added, “cannot dive at this time” and are not ready to make the almost six-hour journey out of the cave. Two of them and their coach are in poor health.

 

[Wullie Mercer]

How about they prepare a drill rig onsite and drill a "pilot" hole and they can better estimate how the ground is for drilling a big hole. 600-800 metres in lime stone should not be a big problem these days.

Also as a bonus it will give access to a good air supply just  in case it is a long wait in there, brought on by illness or water problems.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 minutes ago, crankshaft said:

The question is....how did they get 5k into the cave?

 

Whether it's 4 or 5 km total distance from the entrance to their current location, that's a question that no one seems much interested in addressing or discussing.

 

[holy cow cm]

4 hours ago, DILLIGAD said:

The time to take them out is when the cave diving experts say it is safe and not before.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And the seals are not cave diving experts! Who do you think, foreign expert cave divers? big P and Small p are too into face to do that. 

[holy cow cm]

39 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

Another "armchair rescuer" the time to get them out is when the time/conditions are correct... not before !

Health matters can be dealt with inside the cave with food/drink supplements & inoculations

It is all a face thing on the Thai Big P Small p side. There is never going to be a perfect call. Do now or wait when more sweltering rain comes perhaps filling the cave to the brim. Staff infections or another serious sickness or bacterial infection will kill any chance of them being able to leave on their own accord. their word and update is it is almost or is the best time to do it now. I have had a staff infection before and almost lost my leg. so if it was my kid in there, I say now, take my kid out now!

[madusa]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

That article, apart from its topic, had a very useful and informative graphic that I haven't seen shown in any of the news reports presented here thus far, that illustrates the path inside the cave:

 

 

Frankly, I just can't understand how or why the group, apparently led by their coach, would have felt the need or desire to travel so far into this underground labyrinth.

 

 

I guess they were avoiding the sudden rush of flood water so that got them deeper and deeper into the caves. Difficult to imagine if you were not in the actual situation.

I was told by a Thai lady that these boys often went into those caves for fun so they were familiar with the caves. She said not to worry the boys know the cave well. But this is just a consolation in time of distress.

[ronaldo0]

Could they not set up a rope system to drag them through . Test it on a mannequin from one end to the other noting any spots where it gets stuck or cant be dragged . Or could they move them in stages maybe pumping water into areas back to where the group came from and use a material similar to expanding foam to stop the water flow returning to where it was pumped from. Problem with the last way is once you start you cant really stop. ?

[madusa]

Can explosive be use to blow a hole on the top of the cave and then drill a hole down ? You don't need a big hole.

[jenny2017]

2 hours ago, Henryford said:

When they get to the difficult parts of the cave can't divers in front just pull the boys through with ropes, so they don't have to swim.

And the climbing part is done by some soap opera actors? 

[Tongjaw]

51 minutes ago, crankshaft said:

The question is....how did they get 5k into the cave?

Uber, Tuk Tuk or Grab taxi maybe? If you read the story and you will find out that it wasn’t flooded when they entered 

[Media1]

6 hours ago, Cadbury said:

Other earlier unconfirmed reports stated that some unregistered volunteer "helpers" had inadvertently pumped water back into the cave. If that were to be true I expect it would not have helped the situation.

The worst command post l have ever seen ever seen.