Why you should always hold some money back

[sometimewoodworker]

The title isn't the most clear but I couldn't think of something concise. Our builder was very good but didn't know enough about electrical systems to supervise the "electricians" he employed. The term electrician is used as a polite face saver for the people. When they had "completed" the work I made the mistake of thinking that they would have tested the circuits to be sure that they worked.

 

from the outside they looked OK!

 

SWMBO had seen what was behind the cover but thought that it was normal to have a mess and just cover it

Having been splitting my time between work Thailand I didn't test every outlet or point.

 

Move forward a few months, I'm now retired and so testing and installing lights and fans where there were places for them to go.  Now I find that the farmers who pretend to know how to wire a house definitely don't.

 

 

1st in the livingroom a couple of power circuits would instantly trip the RCD if anything bigger than a light was installed.

2nd the same happened in the computer room.

luckly I had insisted on more than 1 circuit per room so that didn't stop us using the house.

3rd although there is a functional under/over unit that is powered it isn't connected to anything. ( the same unit in the workshop is wired in and works correctly)

4th the emergency stop in the workshop cuts out everything including the lights (not safe)

5th ⅓ of the outside lights have no power ( because the farmers didn't know why the RCDs would trip due to a borrowed neutral fault so just disconnected them, we think )

6th the outside fan points have no power.

7th the workshop AC points have no power.

 

We have been fortunate in finding an electrical repair technician who is also a qualified electrician and who has two qualified assistants 

He takes a professional pride in doing a good job and leaving a tidy setup even when he's fixing another persons mistakes.

 

He has almost finished cleaning up all the problems and just has to run new cable to get all the outside lights fixed.

 

The takeaway from this is that there are competent electricians in Thailand though the are definitely not easy to find.

Edited July 11, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[Crossy]

Chalk-n-Cheese there STWW, that re-done job is a good un.

 

I'm sure your man will be getting lots more work if he needs it, I hope you have his number but please don't publish it here. PM only.

 

 

 

[sometimewoodworker]

4 hours ago, Crossy said:

Chalk-n-Cheese there STWW, that re-done job is a good un.

 

I'm sure your man will be getting lots more work if he needs it, I hope you have his number but please don't publish it here. PM only.

 

 

 

I certainly do have his number for work not to far from Udon & for a moderate consideration (maybe a beer) would certainly pass it on privately to worthy individuals.

??

 

Compared to his quotation for new install work, the reparation work quote was rather high, but as it was coming out of the money we owned our builder I was not complaining.

 

He has good tools and safety equipment and uses it.

Note the safety hat safety rubber gloves and eye protection 

Nice tools 

Edited July 11, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[Crossy]

7 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

He has good tools and safety equipment and uses it.

OMG an angle grinder with a guard, no way he's a real Thai sparks ?

 

He does have a suitably large hammer mind.

 

Not sure he needed the hard hat when drilling that hole, gloves and glasses yes.

 

Certainly a rare sight.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

3 hours ago, Crossy said:

Not sure he needed the hard hat when drilling that hole, gloves and glasses yes.

I think that it's an ingrained habit that any time he is around mains to use all the protection, as in his day/night job he is often dealing with 11kv and up faults so it's better not to think and just use it all the time.

 

Your right about suspecting his credentials. He also has a big selection of non rusty pliers virtually new good 18v battery powered drills good extension leads etc. He has enough so that none of his team has to wait fo a tool and his electrical test equipment looks to be at least as good.

 

I think that the only tool deficiency could be in the hammer department, he has very few of those.?

 

This is all his his own work

Edited July 12, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[jorgenweihrauch]

Only if you have agreement with the builder about it from start. If you don`t have that you only get problems and are not sincere 

[sometimewoodworker]

41 minutes ago, jorgenweihrauch said:

Only if you have agreement with the builder about it from start. If you don`t have that you only get problems and are not sincere 

We do, we did, we are. And FWIW are holding back a much smaller amount than is in our contact and agreement.

 

We also discussed the problems at length with our builder over a couple of weeks and he agreed that as he could not find anyone to complete the job we should do it ourselves, at which point his responsibility for the electrical work would be over.

 

if you don't have that in your agreement then you are not at all sensible or have no idea how the majority of Thai builders work.

 

All you have to do is read the building stories on a website devoted to building cool houses in Thailand to find out that it is a frequent occurrence for a builder to walk away with advanced money, leave a job incomplete, often more than one builder on each house.

 

this is not limited to foreign ownership. The local building supply company is building a new house and has had three different builders walk off so far. 

 

So it should always be more profitable for the builder to complete the job than walk of before it's finished, he should always loose money by not completing.

Materials paid on delivery or only just before, labour after it's done, the majority of the profits on completion. All and any due and future payments forfeited by walking away from the job. 

 

That way way when the builder walks off (because the time of the month, his wife runs off, he has got enough money to live on, his girlfriend complains, he's found a job that pays more, etc) you can complete the job for not much more than you originally decided.

Edited July 12, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[Crossy]

2 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

This is all his his own work

His copious use of Unistrut and metal conduit clamps suggests what his day job is ?

 

The only Unistrut in our place is that which I installed.

 

[kamalabob2]

Sometimewoodworker hit the nail on the head. I've seen Thai builders draw up house building contracts that were very "front loaded'. If they got fired or quit in the middle of the job, they had already made maximum net profit. Yet in my observation the expat should be paying the cost of major building materials direct to any store, as often the Thai builder does not have the float or credit to pay large chunks of money for aspects of the build. You want to make a staged payment when the roof is completed, yet he is out the money for all the materials on the roof and can easily get caught short. The solution is to have the expat pay AL;L the roofing materials.   The expat might also consider being the person to pay for all shuttering rental as a Thai builder might not hire the best rental shuttering or leave any shuttering on for an incorrect time period. The expat might consider paying for burlap bags and/or plastic wrap when allowing concrete to cure. 

 That is fine looking electrical work for Isaan.  Far higher than I have seen at 99% of the homes where a Thai electrical contractor did electrical service or load center wiring in Isaan. 

[sometimewoodworker]

4 hours ago, kamalabob2 said:

Sometimewoodworker hit the nail on the head. I've seen Thai builders draw up house building contracts that were very "front loaded'. If they got fired or quit in the middle of the job, they had already made maximum net profit. Yet in my observation the expat should be paying the cost of major building materials direct to any store, as often the Thai builder does not have the float or credit to pay large chunks of money for aspects of the build. You want to make a staged payment when the roof is completed, yet he is out the money for all the materials on the roof and can easily get caught short. The solution is to have the expat pay AL;L the roofing materials.   The expat might also consider being the person to pay for all shuttering rental as a Thai builder might not hire the best rental shuttering or leave any shuttering on for an incorrect time period. The expat might consider paying for burlap bags and/or plastic wrap when allowing concrete to cure. 

 That is fine looking electrical work for Isaan.  Far higher than I have seen at 99% of the homes where a Thai electrical contractor did electrical service or load center wiring in Isaan. 

A lot of that works and is sound advice though most will want material purchases to go through them  and unless you have a different company doing the roof the builder will probably insist in the material payment going through him so he can collect his commission on it.

 

I think that it's fine work for anywhere in Thailand and certainly good enough for almost anywhere worldwide.

Edited July 12, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[Stevemercer]

Yes, if you see the electrician again you should say that other farangs viewing photos of his work were impressed by his commitment to safety, quality of tools and workmanship. He would certainly rank in the top 10% of his trade in Thailand.

[rosst]

On 7/11/2018 at 9:40 PM, sometimewoodworker said:

I certainly do have his number for work not to far from Udon & for a moderate consideration (maybe a beer) would certainly pass it on privately to worthy individuals.

??

 

Compared to his quotation for new install work, the reparation work quote was rather high, but as it was coming out of the money we owned our builder I was not complaining.

 

He has good tools and safety equipment and uses it.

Note the safety hat safety rubber gloves and eye protection 

Nice tools 

Damn, I like your home, very suave 

[sometimewoodworker]

7 hours ago, rosst said:

Damn, I like your home, very suave 

Thank you kindly, most of what you see is SWMBO 's work, I'll pass on the complement.

[Crossy]

55 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

most of what you see is SWMBO 's work

One assumes it was Madam who chose the fluorescent green walls on the utility room ?

 

[sometimewoodworker]

23 hours ago, Crossy said:

One assumes it was Madam who chose the fluorescent green walls on the utility room ?

 

Apart from the fact that it's her kitchen, yes she did