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Pope blames devil for Church divisions, scandals, seeks angel's help


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1 minute ago, inThailand said:

The devil made me do it. I will try to use this excuse for my overstay. 

Then go to a border checkpoint and re-enter. In fact, the devil went down to Georgia Malaysia.

 

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2 minutes ago, bendejo said:

 

If JC came back he would go to a synagogue, not to a church.

He would paraphrase Groucho Marx and say "I would never belong to a religion that worships ME!"

 

Ole Groucho, was not only funny, but deep and true.

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14 minutes ago, Credo said:

You might want to read up about it.   There was no Devil and no Satan.   The word meant adversary and it was not a proper noun.   

 

The whole concept of the Devil was added and reinterpreted.   

 

There are many, many links.   Here's one:   https://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-topics/bible-interpretation/how-the-serpent-became-satan/

For the sake of brevity I will keep my response short as this forum is often intolerant of these discussions.

Your initial comment that the devil is not in the Bible is patently false. The New Testament is loaded with references to the devil, as I have proved. The article you have linked speaks nearly entirely about the Hebrew bible, which is essentially the Christian Old Testament. And although the Devil (the accuser) does feature frequently in the Old Testament. The usage is often more figurative there and open to some interpretation. The primary focus of your article is making the case that the serpent in the garden is never spelled out to be Satan. This is true, There are a lot of things in the story of creation which are handled uniquely and have been vigorously studied for thousands of years.  Obviously most people consider the serpent to be a 'type' of the devil (the accuser). When the the two testaments are considered together, a more complete picture occurs.

To get into this further would require tons of links and some ponderous translations of Hebrew and what not.

But the devil is certainly mentioned in the Bible.

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1 hour ago, Lungstib said:

Help me, I've woken up in the 15th century!

Indeed, in the Roman Catholic world the middle ages are alive and well. Is the pope saying there is no free will, kiddy fiddlers didn't want to sin, they had to ?

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Just now, canuckamuck said:

For the sake of brevity I will keep my response short as this forum is often intolerant of these discussions.

Your initial comment that the devil is not in the Bible is patently false. The New Testament is loaded with references to the devil, as I have proved. The article you have linked speaks nearly entirely about the Hebrew bible, which is essentially the Christian Old Testament. And although the Devil (the accuser) does feature frequently in the Old Testament. The usage is often more figurative there and open to some interpretation. The primary focus of your article is making the case that the serpent in the garden is never spelled out to be Satan. This is true, There are a lot of things in the story of creation which are handled uniquely and have been vigorously studied for thousands of years.  Obviously most people consider the serpent to be a 'type' of the devil (the accuser). When the the two testaments are considered together, a more complete picture occurs.

To get into this further would require tons of links and some ponderous translations of Hebrew and what not.

But the devil is certainly mentioned in the Bible.

Sooooo, does that mean Voldemort is the Devil and Nagini is the serpent.  They both died in the last movie so we can't blame them any more!

(p.s.  not a dig at you, I enjoyed the information)

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1 hour ago, canuckamuck said:

That is quite wrong, but I have noticed that people that haven't read the Bible have some very strange ideas about it.

23 instances of the devil in the Bible.

 

I find the Pope's defense of the church bizarre however. He is basically admitting his priests are controlled by the devil.

And we laugh about Thais and their ghosts.. seems the leader of the church has even more fantasy then the average Thai. I talk about shifting the blame.. i have yet to see the Buddhist leaders in Thailand say something equally stupid.

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I am happy to see so many atheist, i hope that religion is gone in a few generations. I doubt it as the poison has survived through the ages.

 

Just imagine how much less death and destruction there will be if there is no religion. Sure we will find something else but probably not on the scale of religion.

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The Roman Catholic Church sowed the seeds for sexual abuse when it instituted the code of celibacy for priests, in order to protect church property from paternity and inheritance claims. Statistically, it was inevitable a certain percentage of men living under a code of enforced celibacy would develop warped sexual drives.

Attempting to explain sexual abuse as evil vs good is farcical. Mess with Mother Nature, and she will sometimes bite you back.

Pope Francis's apologia reminds me of Pascal's quote :

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction".
 

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4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The Roman Catholic Church sowed the seeds for sexual abuse when it instituted the code of celibacy for priests, in order to protect church property from paternity and inheritance claims. Statistically, it was inevitable a certain percentage of men living under a code of enforced celibacy would develop warped sexual drives.

Attempting to explain sexual abuse as evil vs good is farcical. Mess with Mother Nature, and she will sometimes bite you back.

Pope Francis's apologia reminds me of Pascal's quote :

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction".
 

I think canon law was finally confirmed around five hundred years ago, even though celibacy was encouraged centuries before that.

 

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction". Yes - then they can avoid responsibility themselves and blame their imaginary friend instead.

 

 

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3 hours ago, ezzra said:

But i thought that the devil went down to Georgia:


He was looking for a soul to steal
He was in a bind, 'cause he was way behind,
He was willing to make a deal
When he came across this young man
Sawing on a fiddle and playing it hot
And the Devil jumped up on a hickory stump and said,
"Boy let me tell you what:
I guess you didn´t know it, but I'm a fiddle player too,
And if you'd care to take a dare,
I'll make a bet with you
Now you play a pretty good fiddle,
Boy, but give the Devil his due
I bet a fiddle of gold against your soul
'Cause I think I'm better than you"

But when the devil challenged the catholic church to a fiddling contest little did he know that it wasn't fiddles they were fiddling.

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27 minutes ago, robblok said:

I am happy to see so many atheist, i hope that religion is gone in a few generations. I doubt it as the poison has survived through the ages.

 

Just imagine how much less death and destruction there will be if there is no religion. Sure we will find something else but probably not on the scale of religion.

Well. So if atheism is the perfect solution, we will live in a perfect world within 1 or 2 generations.

Evil is in the man, not necessarily in religion or philosophy.

I am not religious btw.

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1 hour ago, bluesofa said:

The plot wasn't that good anyway as a work of fiction goes - too many characters.

 

There's a lot of begatting though just to liven it up. Fair bit of violence as well. From memory didn't Samson smote a lot of the Phillipinoes  with the ass bone of a jaw?  

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1 minute ago, mauGR1 said:

Well. So if atheism is the perfect solution, we will live in a perfect world within 1 or 2 generations.

Evil is in the man, not necessarily in religion or philosophy.

I am not religious btw.

You must have not read everything i posted, i just said that religion enhances violence. I did not say once religion is gone all violence will be gone. Like you said evil is in man but some things can bring it out more then other things. Religion is one of those things.

 

Religion has been abused for many terrible things, just think about the crusades, the inquisition, and many other things. 

 

We will never live in a perfect world.  Plus i highly doubt that religion will die out in 1 to 2 generations. 

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10 minutes ago, robblok said:

You must have not read everything i posted, i just said that religion enhances violence. I did not say once religion is gone all violence will be gone. Like you said evil is in man but some things can bring it out more then other things. Religion is one of those things.

 

Religion has been abused for many terrible things, just think about the crusades, the inquisition, and many other things. 

 

We will never live in a perfect world.  Plus i highly doubt that religion will die out in 1 to 2 generations. 

We've had a similar argument few years ago, are you sure you are not confusing "religion" intended as "spiritual philosophy " , with the evil industry of "organised religion " ?

I totally agree with some of your points, but everyone with their eyes open can see a new "religion of profit" taking over.

I personally have my doubts that ' worshipping money' will lead the humankind to better shores.

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It's incomprehensible that in the 21st century mankind can send rockets into space and develop so much mind boggling technology, yet still can't rid itself of infantile religious hokus pokus.

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2 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

That is quite wrong, but I have noticed that people that haven't read the Bible have some very strange ideas about it.

23 instances of the devil in the Bible.

 

I find the Pope's defense of the church bizarre however. He is basically admitting his priests are controlled by the devil.

The bible is full off nonsense: http://godisimaginary.com/

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16 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

We've had a similar argument few years ago, are you sure you are not confusing "religion" intended as "spiritual philosophy " , with the evil industry of "organised religion " ?

I totally agree with some of your points, but everyone with their eyes open can see a new "religion of profit" taking over.

I personally have my doubts that ' worshipping money' will lead the humankind to better shores.

Lets call it organised religion comes closer to what I am talking about.

 

The religion of profit has always been there and will lead to conflict too. There are just too many humans and not enough land. Time to colonize space. 

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15 minutes ago, Saladin said:

It's incomprehensible that in the 21st century mankind can send rockets into space and develop so much mind boggling technology, yet still can't rid itself of infantile religious hokus pokus.

I would have thought you to be a religious man given your name 😂

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Pope & St Mike can find El Diablo hanging in Pattaya if they wants to come over to sort it out .. abit of Muay Thai in the ring 'alf way along Walking street should straighten this good/bad argument out once n' fer all ..

IMG_20181009_042456.jpg

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Quote

Pope blames devil for Church divisions, scandals, seeks angel's help

In a new twist, the pope is now blaming Doraimon and looking for help from Hello Kitty

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2 hours ago, BobBKK said:

There were NO Angels involved with the abuse your Eminence and I respectfully suggest you understand which side of the line you are standing on.

I would have given you a like but that Frank guy doesn't deserve to be called "your Eminence", nor does he deserve to be treated "respectfully". 

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5 hours ago, webfact said:

We should not think of the devil as a myth, a representation, a symbol, a figure of speech or an idea. This mistake would lead us to let down our guard, to grow careless and end up more vulnerable," he wrote in the document.

 

4 hours ago, Esso49 said:

By the devil he is metaphorically referring to the laws of most civilised nations that outlaws peodophilia

Not according to him, he’s not.

 

anyway.... daily prays for a month, that should do it.

 

before I lay me down to sleep, I pray to god for their dicks to take

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