Yet more confusion over the removal of Income Certification Letter for British expats

[soalbundy]

2 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

No need to change the law. The law says you need to show proof of income but definition of an acceptable/valid proof is not in the law.

So Immigration could well tomorrow (if they wanted to!) just change their internal rules to define a proof (nearly) impossible to get, and it would be the end of the income method... 

I really doubt the would want to do that though. 

Trust in life,it's not there to thwart you and has taken care of you so far, the solution will be simple, TI wants it that way and so do we. Of course it is worrying but worry never did any good, patience is required and if possible plan for the worst outcome if you can. I've been here for 13 years, during that time several things changed, both positive and negative but I am still here and hope to be in the future until I meet the bright light.

[Bwlch]

Surely your P60 gives you proof of income.


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[soalbundy]

4 minutes ago, Bwlch said:

Surely your P60 gives you proof of income.


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Another one who wont understand that IO is not interested in your proof without an embassy letter

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

No one knows what Thai Imm will accept because there is no information from the BE that they are negotiating anything. Simply withdrawing a service without negotiating  with Thai Imm is not fair or just to citizens

 

Instead of shooting down every proposal or idea- please feel free to provide an alternative to British citizens who under Thai law can still use the income method.  Thailand has not changed its Immigration law.

Posters have a right to shoot down other posters proposals as well as assume many things about my posts whether I'm right or wrong.

 

Listening to the vid I understand the British Embassy Bangkok has spoken with Thai immigration at their head office in Bangkok.

And as I understood the Thai immigration head office in Bangkok will except a years Bank statements from a UK bank that's how I believe the conversation ending up.

 

At this moment they will not except this so Thai immigration head office in Bangkok will have to change one of the present confirming methods of earnings as it stands at the moment.

 

As to providing an alternative to British citizens income, there is another in place already and has been for a long time that is why some despicable people in Gov UK have decided to cut down on staff and paperwork and not assist UK expats in Thailand this way.   

 

I wasn't happy when just before I came to retire in Thailand they put the marriage year extension amount up from 250,000 to 400,000 but there was nothing I could do about it.

 

As I see it the Gov UK will not back down on their directive to the UK Embassy Bangkok.

 

 

[Thaidream]

4 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

wasn't happy when just before I came to retire in Thailand they put the marriage year extension amount up from 250,000 to 400,000 but there was nothing I could do about it

Quite so- nor was I happy when they put the Retirement amount up from 200K, then 500K. then 800K. and that is why it is so important to maintain continuity of extension because if they ever raised it again and one has maintained continuity of extension - Thai Imm normally grandfathers everyone.

[Kwasaki]

13 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Quite so- nor was I happy when they put the Retirement amount up from 200K, then 500K. then 800K. and that is why it is so important to maintain continuity of extension because if they ever raised it again and one has maintained continuity of extension - Thai Imm normally grandfathers everyone.

Not sure but did they not do away with grandfarthering ???? we get treating the same as newly married couples at immigration.

It was much stricter this year, the immi guy apologized to my Mrs about it taking a long time because they were had a new directive from Bkk immi office on processing marriage extensions. 

[Thaidream]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

ot sure but did they not do away with grandfarthering ???? we get treating the same as newly married couples at immigration.

It was much stricter this year, the immi guy apologized to my Mrs about it taking a long time because they were had a new directive from Bkk immi office on processing marriage extensions. 

They have grandfathered  retirement extensions as police order shows different levels and years- but I do not believe they did for marriage. Last time I used marriage- I had to show 400K but this was several years ago- one of the posters indicated it used to be 250K

I do know the level of proof for marriage extensions has been raised .

[Kwasaki]

18 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

I had to show 400K but this was several years ago- one of the posters indicated it used to be 250K

I do know the level of proof for marriage extensions has been raised .

Yes there's a official list they give you now and tick off each item as they go through another pile of rain-forest supplied A4 paper.

 

Be interesting to see how things pan out about this BE letter thing.

I am sympathetic towards people not having savings and have just relied on showing earnings.

 

Personally I think and hope the Thai immigration will come up with a solution, showing a letter as I do confirming my funds is just from my Thai bank, so I do not see why they cannot accept an amount paid into a Thai bank every month and the Thai bank letter confirming that.

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, Kwasaki said:

Yes there's a official list they give you now and tick off each item as they go through another pile of rain-forest supplied A4 paper.

 

Be interesting to see how things pan out about this BE letter thing.

I am sympathetic towards people not having savings and have just relied on showing earnings.

 

Personally I think and hope the Thai immigration will come up with a solution, showing a letter as I do confirming my funds is just from my Thai bank, so I do not see why they cannot accept an amount paid into a Thai bank every month and the Thai bank letter confirming that.

we can only hope and wait, a solution will come.

[Expattaff1308]

17 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Personally I think and hope the Thai immigration will come up with a solution, showing a letter as I do confirming my funds is just from my Thai bank, so I do not see why they cannot accept an amount paid into a Thai bank every month and the Thai bank letter confirming that.

Exactly, Mr Expat has shown deposits over the last 12mths which total 400/800k and equates to 40/65k per month. No difference to a letter stating 400/800k in deposit.

Edited October 21, 2018 by Expattaff1308

[HHTel]

2 hours ago, Bwlch said:

Surely your P60 gives you proof of income.


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Not everyone gets a P60.

[billd766]

5 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Several Law firms in Bangkok have British lawyers on staff who could  provide the same function as the BE does now. Has the BE made any effort at all to outsource this function?  British citizens need to be proactive and make sure their Embassy is being asked pertinent questions.

 

That is OK for those people who live in BKK but not so easy for those who live further away, Chiang Rai for example. Assuming that it would be acceptable it would probably involve a flight or a bus journey down to BKK, 1 or 2 nights in a hotel and the return journey.

 

I could take the inter provincial bus for about 400 baht return and 2 overnights I could get for perhaps 1,500 baht and it would work out about the same as the embassy letter.

 

 

I was talking with a group of friends yesterday and they suggested talking to a lawyer in Khampaeng Phet after talking with Immigration in KPP. Perhaps Immigration central would find that acceptable or not.

 

At this point I think it is just wait and see what comes up by the end of the year.

[billd766]

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Trust in life,it's not there to thwart you and has taken care of you so far, the solution will be simple, TI wants it that way and so do we. Of course it is worrying but worry never did any good, patience is required and if possible plan for the worst outcome if you can. I've been here for 13 years, during that time several things changed, both positive and negative but I am still here and hope to be in the future until I meet the bright light.

 

Me too.

[billd766]

2 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Another one who wont understand that IO is not interested in your proof without an embassy letter

 

It only show the tax you pay on 1 pension. If you have more than 1 you get a P60 for each pension. If your State pension is less than the UK tax threshold it is not taxed and therefore there is no P60 available for it.

 

Sorry I meant this reply for Bwlch. 

 

It's an age related thing.

Edited October 21, 2018 by billd766
added extra text

[Joe Mcseismic]

I think the Thai immigration solution will be this:-

"We need an embassy letter".

"No letter?" "Must use the 400k/800k in a Thai bank for the specified amount of time".

 

Sounds all too realistic, doesn't it?

 

For Brits and Brits only, the income route is dead. Toast. Finished.

For those affected by this you've already hoped for the best. It's now time for you to plan for the worst.

[DavoTheGun]

On 10/13/2018 at 4:42 PM, Jingthing said:

You are wrong. The Thais have NEVER required full import of claimed income into Thailand annually. 

The other option which is not under discussion here, the bank account option, not the income options, stands as is and yes that application is purely about showing the money IN THAILAND. Also not showing a required level of imports.

Don't make stuff up and don't conflate (as has the British embassy) the two types of applications. 

What have the Australians been doing, the Aussie Embassy has never issued letters?

 

[evadgib]

Food for thought..

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/540525-uk-pensions/?do=findComment&comment=13482539

[soalbundy]

27 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

I think the Thai immigration solution will be this:-

"We need an embassy letter".

"No letter?" "Must use the 400k/800k in a Thai bank for the specified amount of time".

 

Sounds all too realistic, doesn't it?

 

For Brits and Brits only, the income route is dead. Toast. Finished.

For those affected by this you've already hoped for the best. It's now time for you to plan for the worst.

That has yet to be seen, I am not affected by this but I hope that a solution ls found for my fellow Brits and I think it will be, the TI has sufficient time before it becomes critical. The last resort could be the agent route.

[Jingthing]

21 minutes ago, DavoTheGun said:

What have the Australians been doing, the Aussie Embassy has never issued letters?

 

The Australian embassy has been and is still issuing the required income documents that are REQUIRED by Thai immigration for income based applications. Thai immigration may demand additional evidence of the income claimed in such embassy documents, but usually doesn't. 

[soalbundy]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

The Australian embassy has been and is still issuing the required income documents that are REQUIRED by Thai immigration for income based applications. Thai immigration may demand additional evidence of the income claimed in such embassy documents, but usually doesn't. 

That is also my experience, I place my passport, supporting evidence and the embassy letter on the table, all they look at is the letter.

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, soalbundy said:

That is also my experience, I place my passport, supporting evidence and the embassy letter on the table, all they look at is the letter.

To be clear, it is best practice for applicants to only present what is explicitly required. For income based applications unless told in advance (such as through a cautious agent) only the embassy letter should be provided for the income "proof" part. The idea is to have some supporting evidence ready only IN CASE it is demanded. Obviously only relevant to people that actually can provide such supporting evidence (if demanded). 

[Bwlch]

Another one who wont understand that IO is not interested in your proof without an embassy letter

But surely with the P60 they can check it one department to another same government.


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[billd766]

19 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

To be clear, it is best practice for applicants to only present what is explicitly required. For income based applications unless told in advance (such as through a cautious agent) only the embassy letter should be provided for the income "proof" part. The idea is to have some supporting evidence ready only IN CASE it is demanded. Obviously only relevant to people that actually can provide such supporting evidence (if demanded). 

When I did my last extension and the 8 other extensions I was told that without the supporting pension letters it would be held up until it was produced. That was at Nakhon Sawan and also at Khampaeng Phet.

 

25 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

That is also my experience, I place my passport, supporting evidence and the embassy letter on the table, all they look at is the letter.

 

Not in Khampaeng Phet. They even examine the embassy letter to see is it is embossed.

[phutoie2]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

 

It only show the tax you pay on 1 pension. If you have more than 1 you get a P60 for each pension. If your State pension is less than the UK tax threshold it is not taxed and therefore there is no P60 available for it.

 

Sorry I meant this reply for Bwlch. 

 

It's an age related thing.

sure about that?

https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-pension/how-your-tax-is-paid

[Jip99]

5 minutes ago, Bwlch said:

But surely with the P60 they can check it one department to another same government.


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I fear that you expect too much.

 

 

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

When I did my last extension and the 8 other extensions I was told that without the supporting pension letters it would be held up until it was produced. That was at Nakhon Sawan and also at Khampaeng Phet.

 

 

Not in Khampaeng Phet. They even examine the embassy letter to see is it is embossed.

Yes. That is why I specified only if explicitly required. At your office, it is.  

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, Bwlch said:

But surely with the P60 they can check it one department to another same government.


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but they wont even bother looking at it without the embassy letter, much less check, they don't want the hassle of checking they want an embassy letter saying this guy is OK, BE doesn't want to play the game anymore.

[Bwlch]

but they wont even bother looking at it without the embassy letter, much less check, they don't want the hassle of checking they want an embassy letter saying this guy is OK, BE doesn't want to play the game anymore.

I’m talking about the British Embassy check on your government pension they can do that,and your P60 covers your other pension,that’s two inter departments talking to each other.


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[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, Bwlch said:

I’m talking about the British Embassy check on your government pension they can do that,and your P60 covers your other pension,that’s two inter departments talking to each other.


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BE isn't playing anymore

[bigginhill]

50 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

The Australian embassy has been and is still issuing the required income documents that are REQUIRED by Thai immigration for income based applications. Thai immigration may demand additional evidence of the income claimed in such embassy documents, but usually doesn't. 

Why can't the BE do some ( "top notch" ) diplomatic work and contact the AE and arrange that the British can go there, joining the Australians. 

Australians would be in pocket... more fees, the BE would have actually done something to resolve the situation.  

Come on we've got Harry and Megan there now must count for something ????.