Pheu Thai Party Could Be Dissolved If Under Thaksin: EC

[seajae]

come on, everyone is aware thaksin says jump and the ptp say how high, this fact is well known to most thais and the ptp even back it up at times with what they say/do. There will always be those that think he is a great man and those that think he is a corrupt criminal, the courts will have the final say in all probability. The thai political scene would be a much better place without his interference and the ptp would probably be a much better party without him as well but that will be up to those that have sway in this matter even though it has been  a forgone conclusion for some time, the writing has been on the wall since the coup

[holy cow cm]

So now they should outlaw anyone who ever voted red party way before by affiliation. Keep it coming and a major revolt is on their doorstep. Dictatorship representation is not the way to go. Gonna bite them in the gonads. Or it should. 

[holy cow cm]

27 minutes ago, seajae said:

come on, everyone is aware thaksin says jump and the ptp say how high, this fact is well known to most thais and the ptp even back it up at times with what they say/do. There will always be those that think he is a great man and those that think he is a corrupt criminal, the courts will have the final say in all probability. The thai political scene would be a much better place without his interference and the ptp would probably be a much better party without him as well but that will be up to those that have sway in this matter even though it has been  a forgone conclusion for some time, the writing has been on the wall since the coup

BS

[zzaa09]

32 minutes ago, seajae said:

come on, everyone is aware thaksin says jump and the ptp say how high, this fact is well known to most thais and the ptp even back it up at times with what they say/do. There will always be those that think he is a great man and those that think he is a corrupt criminal, the courts will have the final say in all probability. The thai political scene would be a much better place without his interference and the ptp would probably be a much better party without him as well but that will be up to those that have sway in this matter even though it has been  a forgone conclusion for some time, the writing has been on the wall since the coup

And what of the numerous other political parties and their associations?

Should they be "managed" as well?

[JCauto]

11 hours ago, robblok said:

He is breaking the law and its only logical not to let convicted criminals influence a countries politics while not being subjected to the same rules as other politicians. Thaksin influences the government but does hot have to show his assets can do his dirty deals behind the scene with far less checks and balances then those that apply to normal leaders of parties.

 

So i fully understand why they are going after him. I am of two minds here, i want the PTP to run in the election. But if this finally separates Thaksin from the PTP then its worth it. Disbanding until the others in his party understand he is a liability and and gives more problems then advantages and they ditch them. 

I'll give you one thing. You're consistent. We've been down this discussion rabbit hole so many times, yet you still cannot get it. Let me try again.

 

1. When a non-elected military takes over, it is a coup, it is illegal. Any "law" stemming from this is illegitimate. Particularly laws that seek to entrench the illegal usurpers of power.

2. How can one be a convicted criminal when one rewrites the constitution and laws to exempt one from conviction for what are clearly, unequivocally, criminal activities to usurp power? 

3. "Subjected to the same rules as other politicians" - how about the Junta? Are they subject to the same laws as the other politicians? They're currently campaigning and spreading government largesse while all other political parties are sidelined until they decide whether they're allowed to do anything and what exactly it is they're allowed to do. They only way this would be even slightly "fair" would be for them to state, clearly and on the record, that they have no intention to run for office. They haven't and anyone who thinks they aren't is a rube.
4. So have you seen the checks and balances working with the Junta? How about their assets? Watches, etc.? What's your remedy for this? Where's your outrage? 

5. So you're all for having no opposition just so long as the Boogeyman is eliminated. The same BS that precipitated the coup, the last several years of misrule, and the upcoming several years and however many hundreds of Dead Red protesters that it will take to finally dislodge this mob of military strongmen. Great to have such fine principles. I hope that you're willing to own them when you're watching the mangled bodies.

[Redline]

What do they say about doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result?  ????

[webfact]

Pheu Thai could be dissolved if Thaksin is found to be interfering, EC warns

By THE NATION

 

 

PHEU THAI PARTY could be dissolved if it were found to have let former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra interfere with its internal affairs, a senior Election Commission (EC) official warned yesterday.
 

EC secretary-general Jarungvith Phumma said the agency was gathering information regarding Thaksin’s alleged interference.

 

Information or evidence obtained will help the agency determine whether the Political Parties Act was violated and whether the party should be dissolved, he said. The commission is reviewing photos, video clips and media reports, including those of Pheu Thai politicians meeting Thaksin in Hong Kong recently, Jarungvith said. 

 

“In order to determine whether the party has been influenced, the EC will see if the party lacks the freedom to carry out its activities. If any wrongdoing was committed, the party in question risks being dissolved,” Jarungvith said.

 

The EC’s reaction came after Deputy Prime Minister Prawit Wongsuwan, who is also defence minister, called on the agency on Monday to look into Thaksin’s interview, which many critics saw as a move to exercise influence over Pheu Thai. 

 

In an interview to Japanese TV channel NHK in Hong Kong last week, Thaksin made several comments about the upcoming election, including one predicting that Pheu Thai would win some 300 out of 500 seats in the House of Representatives. Thaksin is not a member of the party nor does he hold an executive post, but he is viewed as Pheu Thai’s patriarch and some say he has retained much influence among its politicians, with many of them referring to him as “Big Boss”.

 

Many Pheu Thai politicians including senior figures met Thaksin in Hong Kong earlier this month. Similar meetings took place in May in Singapore. The former leader has lived in self-imposed exile since 2008. While in Japan in March, Thaksin predicted a “landslide victory” for Pheu Thai in the next election, and earlier this year, he was also heard condemning party defectors and predicting their election loss.

 

A new law governing political parties prohibits non-members from interfering in internal affairs and parties from allowing such interference. Those violating the law risk a jail term of between five to 10 years, a fine of between Bt100,000 and Bt200,000, and a ban from elections. The party also faces dissolution. According to the law, the EC can seek an order from the Constitutional Court to have the violating party dissolved.

 

Jarungvith said yesterday that the agency was scrutinising all political parties suspected of violating the Political Parties Act. A fact-finding committee is being set up and investigations will begin as soon as there was convincing evidence, he added. 

 

Meanwhile, Pheu Thai leader Wirote Pao-in maintained yesterday that Thaksin had nothing to do with the party and that he had made the remarks as a Thai citizen who was concerned for his country. As for Pheu Thai politicians meeting Thaksin overseas, Wirote said they still respected the former prime minister and the “party had nothing to do” with the meetings. 

 

Wirote said he saw no valid reason for Pheu Thai to be dissolved due to this matter, as Thaksin has not interfered in the party’s internal affairs. 

 

The party leader dismissed speculation that Pheu Thai has “spare parties” in case it is dissolved. Observers believe Puea Chat and Puea Tham parties are affiliated with Pheu Thai, and politicians from the former ruling party hold executive posts. 

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/politics/30357043

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2018-10-24

[Thechook]

12 hours ago, robblok said:

Unlike the convicted criminal Thaksin Prayut does have to show all his holdings so it can be checked if he gained money or has conflicts of interests. Thai politicians have to show all kinds of data to combat corruption. Thaksin however has none of these checks as that are mandatory for politicians. The chances of corruption and hidden wrongdoing are so much higher this way.

 

So talk about an unfair advantage for Thaksin because of his illegal actions (being a party leader but not subjected to all the checks). 

 

If they can prove Thaksin still is the boss of the PTP (everyone knows he is just have to prove it) they have the right to disband the PTP.

 

I would like the PTP to run in the election but if this forces Thaksin out for good to cut ties to the PTP then its a good outcome too. 

 

Now honestly Eric.. do you believe Thaksin is the leader of the PTP or not. I am 100% convinced he is and you ?

Prayut hasn't declared a single thing and refuses to do so.

[JCauto]

13 hours ago, robblok said:

Unlike the convicted criminal Thaksin Prayut does have to show all his holdings so it can be checked if he gained money or has conflicts of interests. Thai politicians have to show all kinds of data to combat corruption. Thaksin however has none of these checks as that are mandatory for politicians. The chances of corruption and hidden wrongdoing are so much higher this way.

 

Uh, do you recall the case of the "borrowed watches"? Do you recall the case of the very expensive monument? Do you recall...

 

You can't keep holding Thaksin to a standard that Prayut and his unelected Junta do not accept or conform to. You keep saying how you "would like the PTP to run in the election but if this forces Thaksin out for good to cut ties to the PTP then its a good outcome too". Well, you've had how many years of forcing Thaksin out for good. How's that working out for you? How many decades of military dictatorship are you willing to stand for in order to "force Thaksin out for good", a goal that's not been achieved despite taking everyone's rights away to do so? How does what the Junta has done to "force Thaksin out for good" give you confidence that they should continue to keep usurping power to achieve this goal? Is it working? Not according to you.

[zzaa09]

2 hours ago, Redline said:

What do they say about doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result?  ????

Farang...??

 

????

[thesetat2013]

17 hours ago, robblok said:

He is breaking the law and its only logical not to let convicted criminals influence a countries politics while not being subjected to the same rules as other politicians. Thaksin influences the government but does hot have to show his assets can do his dirty deals behind the scene with far less checks and balances then those that apply to normal leaders of parties.

 

So i fully understand why they are going after him. I am of two minds here, i want the PTP to run in the election. But if this finally separates Thaksin from the PTP then its worth it. Disbanding until the others in his party understand he is a liability and and gives more problems then advantages and they ditch them. 

it doesn't matter if the break up the PTP. they will just start a new group with same leaders and same influence and same bribes to the poor for votes.   

[robblok]

14 hours ago, cookieqw said:

Thai politicians have to show all kinds of data to combat corruption.

not much data on those watches tho

He should be ashamed but at least a case was made and people are trying to get him for it. But are you advocating not upholding laws because some people break laws and get away with it. That is the whole reason this country is a mess.

[robblok]

8 hours ago, JCauto said:

I'll give you one thing. You're consistent. We've been down this discussion rabbit hole so many times, yet you still cannot get it. Let me try again.

 

1. When a non-elected military takes over, it is a coup, it is illegal. Any "law" stemming from this is illegitimate. Particularly laws that seek to entrench the illegal usurpers of power.

2. How can one be a convicted criminal when one rewrites the constitution and laws to exempt one from conviction for what are clearly, unequivocally, criminal activities to usurp power? 

3. "Subjected to the same rules as other politicians" - how about the Junta? Are they subject to the same laws as the other politicians? They're currently campaigning and spreading government largesse while all other political parties are sidelined until they decide whether they're allowed to do anything and what exactly it is they're allowed to do. They only way this would be even slightly "fair" would be for them to state, clearly and on the record, that they have no intention to run for office. They haven't and anyone who thinks they aren't is a rube.
4. So have you seen the checks and balances working with the Junta? How about their assets? Watches, etc.? What's your remedy for this? Where's your outrage? 

5. So you're all for having no opposition just so long as the Boogeyman is eliminated. The same BS that precipitated the coup, the last several years of misrule, and the upcoming several years and however many hundreds of Dead Red protesters that it will take to finally dislodge this mob of military strongmen. Great to have such fine principles. I hope that you're willing to own them when you're watching the mangled bodies.

I like your consistency too.. misplaced but great.

 

1) Thaksin was convicted and case brought before judges during judges when democratical parties were in power. Thaksin even used money in a cake box to bribe judges (hardly something an innocent man would do)

2) maybe one day it will get through to you you that there are people out there who judge both sides. I am one of those. The amnesty for the junta is as bad as the amnesty Thaksin wanted. Just because i attack one side does not mean i condone the other.

3) I have often commented on unfair advantage of junta, still Thaksin would have an ever greater advantage.

4) You obviously have been sleeping during the watch saga otherwise you would have seen my outrage in posts there again.. some people go after both sides.. 

5 I am all for the PTP following the rules and breaking with Thaksin then they can be in opposition too. No need for them to disband only to follow the rules. But we all know the PTP and Thaksin cant.

[robblok]

5 hours ago, Thechook said:

Prayut hasn't declared a single thing and refuses to do so.

Could you stop making up things

https://www.thephuketnews.com/pm-prayuth-can-justify-personal-wealth-49445.php#rT4OsEwXRYCfm1EA.97

 

here it shows he has declared it.

[robblok]

4 hours ago, JCauto said:

 

Uh, do you recall the case of the "borrowed watches"? Do you recall the case of the very expensive monument? Do you recall...

 

You can't keep holding Thaksin to a standard that Prayut and his unelected Junta do not accept or conform to. You keep saying how you "would like the PTP to run in the election but if this forces Thaksin out for good to cut ties to the PTP then its a good outcome too". Well, you've had how many years of forcing Thaksin out for good. How's that working out for you? How many decades of military dictatorship are you willing to stand for in order to "force Thaksin out for good", a goal that's not been achieved despite taking everyone's rights away to do so? How does what the Junta has done to "force Thaksin out for good" give you confidence that they should continue to keep usurping power to achieve this goal? Is it working? Not according to you.

I recall the case of the watches.. maybe you did not recall it but i made numorous posts there complaining and attacking the junta. Maybe you should open your eyes and see they are all crook and should all be checked. That i feel Thaksin is a crook does not make the junta any less a bunch of crooks.

 

I don't see why the laws should not be used to go after crooks. By not wanting any action against Thaksin and others the mess keeps on going. Laws should be followed and all should be punished. Thaksin and junta and you have to start somewhere. By constantly clinging to the mantra let the junta be punished first it gets worse and worse and undermines all laws.Let Thaksin be punished first then the complaints will swell and the junta will have to be judged too.

 

I want both sides to be punishes and I comment on both sides their crimes.

[JCauto]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

I recall the case of the watches.. maybe you did not recall it but i made numorous posts there complaining and attacking the junta. Maybe you should open your eyes and see they are all crook and should all be checked. That i feel Thaksin is a crook does not make the junta any less a bunch of crooks.

 

I don't see why the laws should not be used to go after crooks. By not wanting any action against Thaksin and others the mess keeps on going. Laws should be followed and all should be punished. Thaksin and junta and you have to start somewhere. By constantly clinging to the mantra let the junta be punished first it gets worse and worse and undermines all laws.Let Thaksin be punished first then the complaints will swell and the junta will have to be judged too.

 

I want both sides to be punishes and I comment on both sides their crimes.

When I noted your consistency, I was referring particularly to your inability to understand the basic issue. That is that the A-maart will never let majority rule because they've lost the demographic ability to win elections and so rely on the military, courts and rigging elections through disqualification to maintain power. 

Any discussion about breaking laws and punishing crooks simply demonstrates your inability to understand the culture in Thailand. All ruling regimes, with the sole exception of the Anand Panyarachun Government that was installed after Suchinda's coup, are corrupt. All Thai people acknowledge this explicitly. However, according to the Yellow worldview, Thaksin was somehow too corrupt, and too power-hungry, and by being able to take over the entire political structure he would be able to make laws any way he wanted and evade taxes and engage in endless corruption and somehow rig the political system forever-more such that he'd be able to rule for life and turn the country into a Republic. Therefore it was important that the military take over to prevent this possibility from occurring and to punish this one-of-a-kind trickster who would somehow bring complete ruin to the country should he have been allowed to remain in power. 

 

Instead, in both instances, his political party has been replaced by someone with complete power, who grants no political freedom for anyone other than his own supporters, who implicitly supports the Yellow side who put him in power and who he is clearly courting so that he can remain in power. His government has been completely non-transparent, the press is not allowed to report on bad things and there are military courts for those who displease the Generals. And, of course, they've taken the constitution that was lauded as one of the most progressive of the many previous constitutions and ripped it up and replaced it with one of their own, enshrining all sorts of new power for the military. There is also, surprise, lots of corruption too. So exactly how is this vision any different than the supposed hell that Thaksin was going to bring? The economy is doing worse, so there's that...

 

There is only one difference, and that those who have always been in power remain so, and anyone from outside that circle who attempts to be elected with enough support to challenge that will be removed as soon as a reasonable excuse to do so is presented and the old regime is then installed to take over by the military. This is the fundamental problem of Thailand. It only ends when the military no longer enjoys amnesty for coups and citizens who lose elections stop demanding them. "The Junta will have to be judged." How and by whom? Why has it NEVER happened with all the other coups? You already know the answer.

Where exactly does the "law" fit into this? You're looking at this from the point of view of Western institutions and rule of law. It's charming, but completely irrelevant to Thailand. 

[robblok]

19 minutes ago, JCauto said:

When I noted your consistency, I was referring particularly to your inability to understand the basic issue. That is that the A-maart will never let majority rule because they've lost the demographic ability to win elections and so rely on the military, courts and rigging elections through disqualification to maintain power. 

Any discussion about breaking laws and punishing crooks simply demonstrates your inability to understand the culture in Thailand. All ruling regimes, with the sole exception of the Anand Panyarachun Government that was installed after Suchinda's coup, are corrupt. All Thai people acknowledge this explicitly. However, according to the Yellow worldview, Thaksin was somehow too corrupt, and too power-hungry, and by being able to take over the entire political structure he would be able to make laws any way he wanted and evade taxes and engage in endless corruption and somehow rig the political system forever-more such that he'd be able to rule for life and turn the country into a Republic. Therefore it was important that the military take over to prevent this possibility from occurring and to punish this one-of-a-kind trickster who would somehow bring complete ruin to the country should he have been allowed to remain in power. 

 

Instead, in both instances, his political party has been replaced by someone with complete power, who grants no political freedom for anyone other than his own supporters, who implicitly supports the Yellow side who put him in power and who he is clearly courting so that he can remain in power. His government has been completely non-transparent, the press is not allowed to report on bad things and there are military courts for those who displease the Generals. And, of course, they've taken the constitution that was lauded as one of the most progressive of the many previous constitutions and ripped it up and replaced it with one of their own, enshrining all sorts of new power for the military. There is also, surprise, lots of corruption too. So exactly how is this vision any different than the supposed hell that Thaksin was going to bring? The economy is doing worse, so there's that...

 

There is only one difference, and that those who have always been in power remain so, and anyone from outside that circle who attempts to be elected with enough support to challenge that will be removed as soon as a reasonable excuse to do so is presented and the old regime is then installed to take over by the military. This is the fundamental problem of Thailand. It only ends when the military no longer enjoys amnesty for coups and citizens who lose elections stop demanding them. "The Junta will have to be judged." How and by whom? Why has it NEVER happened with all the other coups? You already know the answer.

Where exactly does the "law" fit into this? You're looking at this from the point of view of Western institutions and rule of law. It's charming, but completely irrelevant to Thailand. 

You fail to understand the basics of the law.. charming but a different view of mine.

 

When you don't apply the law and keep saying that others have to be punished first there will never happen anything. Fact is the law needs to be applied in Thailand to clean this mess up, if you want any progress people should stop protecting criminals on their side and go after all criminals. 

 

Your views are outdated just supporting one side while all of them are crooks like you said.. so they all should be punished if we ever want some change. Postponing punishment because they did not start with someone you like is just foolish and keeps change from happening.

 

Your views are similar to those of red light jumpers who say that they first have to go after drunks as they are more dangerous.. and in the meanwhile nothing happens to improve road safety. Maybe you get it now. 

[Raymonddiaz]

They want the peaceful situation to change so they can postpone the next election  or just cancel it once for all.

[malagateddy]

Being British..I honestly cannot comment about Thai politics.
I think back on likes of Blair..Iraq..wmd etc, the alledged suicide of the late Prof D Kelly.. also Cameron..regime change..Lybia.
What right do I or any other Brit have to pass comment re our host country????

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Eric Loh]

3 hours ago, thesetat2013 said:

it doesn't matter if the break up the PTP. they will just start a new group with same leaders and same influence and same bribes to the poor for votes.   

You forgot the same hearts and minds which the yellow junta can't buy. 

[scorecard]

9 hours ago, JCauto said:

I'll give you one thing. You're consistent. We've been down this discussion rabbit hole so many times, yet you still cannot get it. Let me try again.

 

1. When a non-elected military takes over, it is a coup, it is illegal. Any "law" stemming from this is illegitimate. Particularly laws that seek to entrench the illegal usurpers of power.

2. How can one be a convicted criminal when one rewrites the constitution and laws to exempt one from conviction for what are clearly, unequivocally, criminal activities to usurp power? 

3. "Subjected to the same rules as other politicians" - how about the Junta? Are they subject to the same laws as the other politicians? They're currently campaigning and spreading government largesse while all other political parties are sidelined until they decide whether they're allowed to do anything and what exactly it is they're allowed to do. They only way this would be even slightly "fair" would be for them to state, clearly and on the record, that they have no intention to run for office. They haven't and anyone who thinks they aren't is a rube.
4. So have you seen the checks and balances working with the Junta? How about their assets? Watches, etc.? What's your remedy for this? Where's your outrage? 

5. So you're all for having no opposition just so long as the Boogeyman is eliminated. The same BS that precipitated the coup, the last several years of misrule, and the upcoming several years and however many hundreds of Dead Red protesters that it will take to finally dislodge this mob of military strongmen. Great to have such fine principles. I hope that you're willing to own them when you're watching the mangled bodies.

And your just trying to divert from the subject at hand.

 

And yes all people who break laws should be investigated and if guilty punished.

 

 

[HappyAndRich]

Then it´s time to dissolve it then. How much proof can one instance really need?

[JCauto]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

You fail to understand the basics of the law.. charming but a different view of mine.

 

When you don't apply the law and keep saying that others have to be punished first there will never happen anything. Fact is the law needs to be applied in Thailand to clean this mess up, if you want any progress people should stop protecting criminals on their side and go after all criminals. 

 

Your views are outdated just supporting one side while all of them are crooks like you said.. so they all should be punished if we ever want some change. Postponing punishment because they did not start with someone you like is just foolish and keeps change from happening.

 

Your views are similar to those of red light jumpers who say that they first have to go after drunks as they are more dangerous.. and in the meanwhile nothing happens to improve road safety. Maybe you get it now. 

You are a bit of a broken record. Thanks for ignoring all of my points.

 

Your analogy is an apt one, but not in the way you think. Thaksin/Junta are the red light jumpers and the drunk drivers; the military and entrenched elite continuously disrupting democracy to usurp power is the underlying cause of the road safety issue. This Junta, that Junta, the other Junta, Thaksin, Banharn, Chatchai, the list goes on and on and on. As I noted, other than Anand, there are nothing BUT red light jumpers and drunk drivers. They prosecute the "other side" when they're in power, then get prosecuted by the "other side" when the other side are in power. The basic respect for rule of law is zero because it's not applied universally, nor will it be respected until it is. Until the military are not exempt from the law and stop interfering with the democratic process, nothing will change.

[JCauto]

40 minutes ago, scorecard said:

And your just trying to divert from the subject at hand.

 

And yes all people who break laws should be investigated and if guilty punished.

 

 

That's quite an insight and shows a deep understanding of Thai politics. Thanks. By the way, it's "you're" in this case.

[madmitch]

They'd probably want to delay a party dissolution so there's no time to form another political party prior to the election. 

[robblok]

10 minutes ago, JCauto said:

You are a bit of a broken record. Thanks for ignoring all of my points.

 

Your analogy is an apt one, but not in the way you think. Thaksin/Junta are the red light jumpers and the drunk drivers; the military and entrenched elite continuously disrupting democracy to usurp power is the underlying cause of the road safety issue. This Junta, that Junta, the other Junta, Thaksin, Banharn, Chatchai, the list goes on and on and on. As I noted, other than Anand, there are nothing BUT red light jumpers and drunk drivers. They prosecute the "other side" when they're in power, then get prosecuted by the "other side" when the other side are in power. The basic respect for rule of law is zero because it's not applied universally, nor will it be respected until it is. Until the military are not exempt from the law and stop interfering with the democratic process, nothing will change.

You seem to be thinking along the same lines as me, because you describe exactly what I have described before. They all prosecute the other side when in power and forget about their own. 

 

That is a major failing, and a reason why we are in the mess we are. But that s for me a reason to start prosecuting people and then in the end pressure will mount to prosecute their own too. At least that is what I hope will happen. The way it goes now just does not work as you rightly pointed out.

 

Guess you and I just have a different solution for it, mine is starting to prosecute to get changes. Yours is to wait till they prosecute the junta. Like you I want to see them all prosecuted but i just don't wan't them to wait and start right away. Then hopefully pressure will mount to also prosecute those on their side. By not doing anything nothing will ever change.

 

If a crime is committed do something about it, even if its on the side you like. 

[JCauto]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

You seem to be thinking along the same lines as me, because you describe exactly what I have described before. They all prosecute the other side when in power and forget about their own. 

 

That is a major failing, and a reason why we are in the mess we are. But that s for me a reason to start prosecuting people and then in the end pressure will mount to prosecute their own too. At least that is what I hope will happen. The way it goes now just does not work as you rightly pointed out.

 

Guess you and I just have a different solution for it, mine is starting to prosecute to get changes. Yours is to wait till they prosecute the junta. Like you I want to see them all prosecuted but i just don't wan't them to wait and start right away. Then hopefully pressure will mount to also prosecute those on their side. By not doing anything nothing will ever change.

 

If a crime is committed do something about it, even if its on the side you like. 

So you observe correctly that there's an endless cycle of prosecution of the other side, and your solution is to continue this cycle, while hoping that the side in power will somehow develop a conscience and prosecute their own. Okay. I think it will just continue the cycle. The evidence is on my side as this is what has happened 100% of the time over the course of decades. How, exactly, do you expect this mob to suddenly develop a conscience and prosecute their own? Or the next one for that matter? 
 

The hope was that maybe this General would be the one who finally broke the cycle, brought about reconciliation, involved both sides, had clean hands, set it up for resumption of democracy and stood aside. How do you think he's done in those respects? How have every other military government done in those respects? It never happens. Until the military and old guard consent to genuine democracy and an end to the coups, and learn to develop relationships and alliances with the majority rural population towards a greater good, it won't happen. And the reason it won't is that the urban population keep supporting this minority Elite rule because they're able to gain from having those people in power rather than the rural people. 

[tomta]

I presume that the law against "influence" to maintain a facade of respectability does not mention Thaksin or Pheua Thai by name although it may as well. It would be a law against "influence" by outsiders. Whoever they might be.

 

This is quite ridiculous. No political party in the world - unless its three revolutionaries plotting in a bedsit in Battersea - is free of outside influence. And nor should they be. Any political party will seek information, ideas and strategies from wherever they can get it - fugitive criminals, successful leaders, social and political theorists, And so they should. A political party that refused influence from outside itself would be ridiculous.

 

Palang Pracharat praises  Prayuth who is not (openly at least) a member of the party and are presumaby influenced by them. The Democrats are a member of the world wide asssociation of liberal democratic parties so presumably they are influenced by out siders - although given their illiberal undemocratic principle, it would appear that they have not been influenced enough.

 

 

Any  reasonable constitutional court in the world would throw this law out in a heartbeat

 

 

[tomta]

2 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Being British..I honestly cannot comment about Thai politics.
I think back on likes of Blair..Iraq..wmd etc, the alledged suicide of the late Prof D Kelly.. also Cameron..regime change..Lybia.
What right do I or any other Brit have to pass comment re our host country????

The right of any free person to comment on whatever they want to comment on be it your own country or any other

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

You seem to be thinking along the same lines as me, because you describe exactly what I have described before. They all prosecute the other side when in power and forget about their own. 

 

That is a major failing, and a reason why we are in the mess we are. But that s for me a reason to start prosecuting people and then in the end pressure will mount to prosecute their own too. At least that is what I hope will happen. The way it goes now just does not work as you rightly pointed out.

 

Guess you and I just have a different solution for it, mine is starting to prosecute to get changes. Yours is to wait till they prosecute the junta. Like you I want to see them all prosecuted but i just don't wan't them to wait and start right away. Then hopefully pressure will mount to also prosecute those on their side. By not doing anything nothing will ever change.

 

If a crime is committed do something about it, even if its on the side you like. 

Agree, and while  we have politics / governments dominated by family dynasties (mostly with strong benefits to their dynasty rather than for development, respecting, pushing for total fair observance of the law and fair justice all, rather than the justice wanted by each dynasty) then nothing will change.

 

Further, when will we see many parties (or at least one) give a clear honest sincere manifesto which is focused on the development of Thailand, fair benefits for all people, (not special handouts etc., for teachers etc.), fair and equal quality education, fair justice regardless of the power of family or friends, and at the same time clear strategies and time line, actions to be taken to achieve the manifesto goals, and more...

 

Sadly I'm not holding my breath. 

 

I did have hopes that Future Forward were gearing up for something like the above but they seem to be hell bent on causing friction and possible disbandment, rather than make strategic comments which will keep them alive and well and in a position ultimately to make a positive difference.