New Requirements for 'O' Visa & Married 'O' Visa

[cyberfarang]

35 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I don't think that's entirely certain as yet, that the Thai bank deposit method (800 or 400K) will be the only financial method that ends up being allowed for extensions of stay.

 

There's still the possibility that Thai Immigration will end up accepting monthly or periodic deposits to a Thai bank account meeting the 40K or 65K baht monthly amounts, and the Thai bank book as documentary proof of that.

 

At this point, I don't think anyone knows for sure if any kind of monthly income method is or isn't going to survive.

 

I don`t think so. Thai immigration still require to see proof of source of income and an embassy confirmation letter. Or the money in a Thai bank option 2 or 3 months prior to application.

 

Also if Thai immigration don`t understand the proof of monthly income documents from abroad, they may still refuse them.

 

What I assume you are saying is; that immigration will accept 40K or 65K baht per month accompanied by a bank statement letter on date of application. It won`t unless the amounts total 800 or 400K 2 or 3 months prior to application.

 

As I said; there are no shortcuts or loopholes around this. It`s obvious immigration want long term expats to deposit there money with the Thai banks. This will affect a lot of people, but to see the situation is crystal clear.

 

 

[Dillpickles98]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

The ACH IAT format has only been around since approx 2009...not even ten years ago when banks/CU started to implement it...or at least be able to "receive" IAT format, but not necessary offer ACH IAT "sending" capability to retail customers.  Instead, they just offer ACH Domestic format and International Wire (SWIFT).  

That may be true, whatever policy is in effect now, I choose to believe my banks IT guy, until it fails. A federal credit union would have everything up to date, knowing millions of U.S. expats depend on them. There is one in every major city, every city, state, & federal employee is encourage to use them. I do have the data sheets for transfers & Soc.Sec. deposits, they are identical, except bank transfers show my name as well as my Thai address. Soc.Sec. goes to a fixed account deposit only, I must appear in person, or my wife can move those funds to our joint account. Bangkok Bank employee's know us that well.

 

DP.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Dillpickles98

[Pib]

I have account with three credit unions; none of them offer ACH "IAT" sending capability.  And none of my US banks do either. 

 

I would just recommend if you depend greatly on using your CU to transfer funds to Thailand using ACH, you might want to confirm your CU truly has IAT "sending" capability and the CU rep you talked to let's say was just wrong.  Maybe he/she things since they can receive ACH IAT for many years that equate to being able to send ACH IAT.

 

Transferwise sums it up pretty well regarding US bank/CU capability to "send" ACH IAT.  And those banks they refer to below are most like large banks which also offer "business" account for business which want to use ACH IAT to pay foreign companies, foreign payroll, etc.  

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

48 minutes ago, cyberfarang said:

What I assume you are saying is; that immigration will accept 40K or 65K baht per month accompanied by a bank statement letter on date of application. It won`t unless the amounts total 800 or 400K 2 or 3 months prior to application.

 

As I said; there are no shortcuts or loopholes around this. It`s obvious immigration want long term expats to deposit there money with the Thai banks. This will affect a lot of people, but to see the situation is crystal clear.

 

What you think will happen is not necessarily the same as what will happen, regarding the monthly income issue.

 

Right now, the U.S. and UK Embassies are telling their citizens that they should be able to do monthly income extensions in the future, documented by Thai bank books showing those funds being imported into Thailand. And meanwhile, Immigration HQ thus far has said NOTHING.

 

So that advice from the embassies may or may not end up being the case once Immigration finally says directly what they're going to accept. But right now, you're premature in advising others that it's a certainty only the bank deposit method is going to survive, and no monthly method will survive.

 

People come here in part looking for factual information, as best as is known at the time. And right now, there's no factual information that supports anyone saying -- right now -- that no monthly income method will survive.

 

What you or I THINK may happen in the future are opinions, not facts.

 

 

Edited October 31, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[cyberfarang]

1 minute ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

What you think will happen is not necessarily the same as what will happen, regarding the monthly income issue.

 

Right now, the U.S. and UK Embassies are telling their citizens that they should be able to do monthly income extensions in the future, documented by Thai bank books showing those funds being imported into Thailand.

 

That may or may not end up being the case once Immigration finally says directly what they're going to accept. But right now, you're premature in advising others that it's a certainty only the bank deposit method is going to survive, and no monthly method will survive.

 

Thai immigration have not changed the rules. They are still saying applicants using the monthly income method must have proof of source of income accompanied by an embassy confirmation letter. It is the embassies that have thrown a spanner into the works, nothing to do with Thai immigration regardless what the embassies have stated.

 

I can`t see what is so difficult to understand about that? So if some are willing to take the chance on a hope and a prayer that Thai immigration will accept monthly incomes without proof of source of incomes, without an embassy confirmation and without the 400k/800k being in a Thai bank 2 or 3 months prior to application, then I wish them good luck. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

49 minutes ago, Dillpickles98 said:

That may be true, whatever policy is in effect now, I choose to believe my banks IT guy, until it fails.

 

U.S. bank and FCU staff may know various things, but in general, they at the retail and CSR level tend to be pretty ignorant re the details of international fund transfers, because those aren't things their customers typically are doing.

 

In all the months this issue has been going on here, NOT ONE Thai Visa poster has been able to identify a U.S. bank or credit union that would allow them to send an IAT formatted ACH.

 

So you can believe what you wish, but odds are, when April 2019 rolls around, you'll find that your past ACH transfer method from your credit union to BKKB New York branch and onward is going to fail.

 

[JackThompson]

11 hours ago, Dillpickles98 said:

As many know printing a bank statement is a simple matter. I do it every month for my own records. Just wonder if this will suffice? I have downloaded the requirements in both English & Thai and intend to present them at my bank. If such a letter meets this requirement. I also download, and print my U.S. Bank statement as a matter of habit.

Something you print is unlikely to do much good, imo.  Your Thai Bank can give you something with a stamp on it, showing your deposit-history.  We don't know if this will be accepted either - but a much better chance than something someone could have easily made/altered in photoshop.  A bank-book could be good too, but unless you update it regularly, it will not show all history.

 

8 hours ago, Dillpickles98 said:

We have been seeing the same Immigration Officer in Pattaya, Jomtiem Beach Office for the past nine years. I have never spoken to her, she doesn't know I speak Thai.

Wouldn't speak to me, either - even when I politely asked a question - just berated my wife, instead.

 

8 hours ago, Dillpickles98 said:

... Out of the some 45 pages only four change from year to year. However this officer seems to never be satisfied with something.

Did she become increasingly rude to your wife on each of the 3 visits it took the last time?  She is not satisfied, because you did not use an agent, so she didn't get a payoff - and you didn't figure out that this was the goal from the first pointless runaround she arranged. 

 

11 hours ago, Dillpickles98 said:

This year for the first time they wanted a photo (Besides the one's required) of the house owner holding her I.D. to include us in the photo.

That's a new one.  Try getting that when your landlord is out of the country.  No doubt one of the 3 smiled to herself, for coming up with that.  This has nothing to do with a valid-marriage.    You already have a current TM-30 submitted.  They are sending out the police to verify you live at that address together.  A map should be the end of the story on "where you live."

 

8 hours ago, Dillpickles98 said:

I could set up scheduled deposits every month from my U.S. bank if need be. But that would add expenses to the charges of Bangkok Bank, which is not cost effective.

At this point, we have no idea what they will want *after* the embassy letter is gone.  A Phuket IO is saying you need to prove "State Pension" evidence in addition to an Embassy-Letter - not sure if the family-desk Jomtien is using that trick yet.  But I would bet the Jomtien family-desk IOs will be quick to add that to their game, to increase agent-revenue.

[cyberfarang]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

Something you print is unlikely to do much good, imo.  Your Thai Bank can give you something with a stamp on it, showing your deposit-history.  We don't know if this will be accepted either - but a much better chance than something someone could have easily made/altered in photoshop.  A bank-book could be good too, but unless you update it regularly, it will not show all history.

 

Wouldn't speak to me, either - even when I politely asked a question - just berated my wife, instead.

 

Did she become increasingly rude to your wife on each of the 3 visits it took the last time?  She is not satisfied, because you did not use an agent, so she didn't get a payoff - and you didn't figure out that this was the goal from the first pointless runaround she arranged. 

 

That's a new one.  Try getting that when your landlord is out of the country.  No doubt one of the 3 smiled to herself, for coming up with that.  This has nothing to do with a valid-marriage.    You already have a current TM-30 submitted.  They are sending out the police to verify you live at that address together.  A map should be the end of the story on "where you live."

 

At this point, we have no idea what they will want *after* the embassy letter is gone.  A Phuket IO is saying you need to prove "State Pension" evidence in addition to an Embassy-Letter - not sure if the family-desk Jomtien is using that trick yet.  But I would bet the Jomtien family-desk IOs will be quick to add that to their game, to increase agent-revenue.

The use of corrupt agents that can pull strings for applicants will soon be a thing of the past. Many on here obviously don`t keep up with the news. As I keep saying; within the near future the means to obtain a yearly visa extension, money in a Thai bank will be the only option.

 

At present this is only applicable for British and American nationals, but I am certain the other embassies will follow. My point being; get prepared and there is no use opening thread after thread on the same subject, because this is not going to change and there are no ways around this. Thai immigration doesn`t care, they make the rules and it becomes every applicants burden to qualify under those rules and policies.

[Dillpickles98]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

That's a new one.  Try getting that when your landlord is out of the country.  No doubt one of the 3 smiled to herself, for coming up with that.  This has nothing to do with a valid-marriage.    You already have a current TM-30 submitted.  They are sending out the police to verify you live at that address together.  A map should be the end of the story on "where you live."

JackThompson, Yes to all of the above you posted. Oh, that issue is not new to me either, Owner left her sister in charge of the office.  Imm. officer demanded a letter stating that, with sister's I.D. and her Tam Boon. Threaten to send Imm. Police to the office, not my house, if the sister didn't return her phone call. Our first year in the house owner was in Belgium, the sister wrote Moo 10, as opposed to Moo 5 on the lease, reason enough for another trip. That witch at desk 5 should know after nine yrs. she will not ever get a kick back some agency from us. She always gives back photos she doesn't want to file. Not a problem, My camera is wireless, just set it down near the PC. then send the photos to the printer. So a return trip for a different photo, takes min.s .

 

To all others, as far as the visa thing we all can speculate until some one knows for sure. Which was my initial inquiry, at this point in time that question had been answered, no one knows anything new for certain.

As far IAT banking, I know who I speak with, not some rep answering phones, or some lowly manager. I have first hand experience with his online banking capabilities. I'll be sure to come back and let you know. either way, and those of you from the U.S. can find a Federal Credit Union in any major city. If this thread is not in my history after April 2019 I'll start a new one to let all know the outcome.

 

DP.  

[onera1961]

13 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

However, BKKB is ending those as of April 2019, and only IAT (International ACH Transfers) transfers will be allowed thereafter (in addition to international wires).  IATs are an entirely different matter from regular U.S. ACH transfers, in part, because the sending details have to include your location in Thailand AND the location details for your Thailand recipient branch.  And neither of those are part of a normal U.S. bank ACH sent to BKKB New York.

No need to argue. As they say, "Past performance is no guarantee for future earnings" Just because it worked in the past, does not mean it will continue to work in the future for perpetuity. When it stops working after April 2019, I hope the OP does not come here and start new threads about why it stopped working. If he does, it will only prove his argumentative nature, not prepared for the future and his sheer stupidity. If it works, more power to him. Cheers.

Edited November 1, 2018 by onera1961

[Pib]

21 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The link you posted is non-working. It points to a file on your PC.

 

 

Maybe he's talking the Immigration Police memo attached within below post from a related thread.  The directive is in Thai but also has an English translation on the tail end.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2018 by Pib

[Kwasaki]

On 11/1/2018 at 1:53 AM, Dillpickles98 said:

To all others, as far as the visa thing we all can speculate until some one knows for sure. Which was my initial inquiry, at this point in time that question had been answered, no one knows anything new for certain.

Personally too much time wasted talking already, frankly I wouldn't wait if your married and you want to stay Thailand, sounds like you can afford too get 400,000 baht in a Thai bank "in your own name" and keep it there for three months before applying for your next 1 year marriage extension so just do it. 

No worries. 

Edited November 17, 2018 by Kwasaki

[Dillpickles98]

Hi, Kwasaki, No issue at all, I just don't like more than I need in a Thai bank. I make transfers as I need to 3-4 times a yr. the interest on 400,000 THB is small, but better I have than nothing, which I get from a Thai bank. The Homeland Security FBAR filing is annoying for transfers over $10,000. If need be, I'll transfer the 400,000 THB three or four months ahead of my next visa extension.

 

DP.

[Justin Side]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

Personally too much time wasted talking already, frankly I wouldn't wait if your married and you want to stay Thailand, sounds like you can afford too get 400,000 baht in a Thai bank "in your own name" and keep it there for three months before applying for your next 1 year marriage extension so just do it. 

No worries. 

Money in the bank for TWO months.

[Kwasaki]

45 minutes ago, Justin Side said:

Money in the bank for TWO months.

Maybe at your immigration office but incorrect information for the Sukhothai immigration office, people should check what's required with their immigration office on the money in the bank requirement period especially if their changing from the defunct British Embassy letter way.

 

[Kwasaki]

1 hour ago, Dillpickles98 said:

Hi, Kwasaki, No issue at all, I just don't like more than I need in a Thai bank. I make transfers as I need to 3-4 times a yr. the interest on 400,000 THB is small, but better I have than nothing, which I get from a Thai bank. The Homeland Security FBAR filing is annoying for transfers over $10,000. If need be, I'll transfer the 400,000 THB three or four months ahead of my next visa extension.

 

DP.

Well for people changing just make sure the account is in your name only and it has been in the Thai bank for the correct number of months before making the next application.

[ubonjoe]

24 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Maybe at your immigration office but incorrect information for the Sukhothai immigration office, people should check what's required with their immigration office on the money in the bank requirement period especially if their changing from the defunct British Embassy letter way.

 

He quoting the requirements shown in the police order for extensions based upon marriage which is 2 months. Retirement is 3 months.

 "(6) In the case of marriage to a Thai woman, the alien husband must earn an average annual income of no less than Baht 40,000 per month or must have no less than Baht 400,000 in a bank account in Thailand for the past two months to cover expenses for one year."

[Kwasaki]

In view of someone posting 2 months instead of 3 months I put this on Central Thailand forum but other offices may be different.

 

      Sukhothai immigration check list for renewal of

   1 year extension for temporary stay for marriage as of June 2018.

 

Immigration prefers you to go about 1 month before or under to

re-apply.

In my case :-

 

(New) A form was presented to us written in Thai for working through the listed sections with the immigration official to check off with what is listed below.  

 

1. I fill out 2 TM7 application forms by hand & put contact phone  

number & and sign both sides of TM7 forms.

 

2. Affix late Colour Photos 4 x 6 cm to each TM7 form.

 

3. I take my original passport with at least 12 months validation with    

   the original TM6 arrival/departure card and 90 day notification  

   slip kept with passport.  

  

4. Take 2 colour photocopy’s of passport page showing your photo   

   in Colour and the passport number on A4 paper.   

  

5. Take 2 photocopy’s of passport pages with last entry date into    

 Thailand along with the adjoining page in passport on A4 paper.

           

6. Take 2 photocopy’s of all other opened passport stamped pages on A4 paper.           

   

7. Take 2 photocopy’s TM6 arrival/departure card with number on A4 paper.

   

8. Take 2 photocopy’s of the Bank passbook account details in applicants  sole name also Bank passbook page showing not less than 

400,000 baht deposited for no less than a three month period prior to  

renewal of 1 year application date on A4 paper.

 

9. Arrange to have a Letter from the Thai Bank before going, confirming the amount of 400,000 bht has been deposited in the account of applicant for the three month required period, make sure they sign in blue pen and update the Bank book on the day. take an A4 copy of letter.   

 

10. Take original Thai wife I.D. card and 2 photocopy’s of Thai

    wife I.D. card with  both sides of card shown on A4 paper.     

     

11. Take original Thai wife blue House registration book and 2 photocopy’s of Thai wife blue House registration book on A4 paper.

       

12. Take original Khor Ror 3 Official Thai marriage Certificate and 2  

    Photocopy’s of each side front & back on A4 paper.  

 

13. Take original part of Khor Ror 2 Official Thai marriage Certificate   

    and 2 Photocopy’s of each side front & back on A4 paper. 

 

14. Take 8 printed photos:- 4 late colour photos of couple inside rooms of the house and 4 late colour photos of couple outside by house.      

 Get 2 of each to shown on top half of 16 No. A4 photocopy paper.

                    

15. Take 2 photocopy’s of diagram area map showing location of your home address on A4 paper & write Google map coordinates on map.    

         

  Present TM7 forms and all Photocopies to immigration officer

  for checking.

  They will then rubber stamp a box section in blue on the papers to 

  where you sign with your signature and also write your full

  name in capital letters.

 

16.  Fill out and sign & write full name on 2 forms applying for extension permit acknowledgement given by officer in Immigration office.  

 

17.  Also another 2 forms to fill out & sign & write full name   

     on acknowledgement form of overstay.

 

18.  Sign & write full name on 2 house map location forms.

 

19. (New) They wanted proof of address which I produced my Yellow house book for and they took 2 photocopies for me to sign.

 

20.  While sitting in front of Immigration officer they will take a  

     computer picture of you.

 

21.  Pay cash fee as of now 1,900 bht on request and keep receipt for

     when returning to have 1 year extension stamped in passport.   

 

22.  Wait until passport is returned to you and stamped with the date

     you are to return to the office for the 1 year extension stamp.

 

Just in case :- l take Yellow house + Birth certificate + The Khor Ror 3 translation.

 

It took 2 hours this year when in passed years it took about 20 minutes.

 

 

[Kwasaki]

25 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

He quoting the requirements shown in the police order for extensions based upon marriage which is 2 months. Retirement is 3 months.

 "(6) In the case of marriage to a Thai woman, the alien husband must earn an average annual income of no less than Baht 40,000 per month or must have no less than Baht 400,000 in a bank account in Thailand for the past two months to cover expenses for one year."

Well they told us 3 months when we did our marriage in Masot and when Sukhothai Office opened it was the same, I'm not gonna argue with em anyone who wants to there welcome.

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Well they told us 3 months when we did our marriage in Masot and when Sukhothai Office opened it was the same, I'm not gonna argue with em anyone who wants to there welcome.

They are about 10 years out of date on that or they are confusing marriage with retirement. It was changed to 2 months on November 25, 2008 when police order 777/2551 went into effect.

[Kwasaki]

23 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

They are about 10 years out of date on that or they are confusing marriage with retirement. It was changed to 2 months on November 25, 2008 when police order 777/2551 went into effect.

Well maybe they decided that because I'm retired on a marriage extension. ???? 

Thanks anyway l'll get the Mrs to call them on it because next year for our situation it will help us. 

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, Justin Side said:

Money in the bank for TWO months.

Apologies but you could of elaborated on knowledge, us old guys that have been here a while only know what it was when we came.

Thanks anyway it will help me in 2019.????

[vmack153]

If the seasoning period for an extension based on marriage was 3 months and a non-o visa only allows a 90 day stay in the country, there would not be enough time to apply for the extension. Even a 2 month period would make it tight. One would have to be married within a week of arrival, run around to a dozen banks to find one that will allow you to open a an account, transfer the 400,000 baht then wait and hope there aren't more hassles from IO before your visa expires. 

[Dillpickles98]

Hi vmack153, Though I went about getting my married visa 16 yrs. ago. I was told then, if you get married here in Thailand it could take as long as two yrs. before it becomes legal. They will want proof of a two year relationship. My intention was to take my wife to the U.S. on a finance visa, which took 5 months. Married there, then on return to Thailand an embassy letter stating I was eligible to be married. That had to be translated into Thai, then taken to the Bureau Of Foreign Affairs, the paperwork there must be taken to her home Ampho, with her families home Tam Boon, and written statement from a parent, or blood relative of consent. Then you are issued a marriage registration, not a Thai marriage license. The last I heard Bangkok Bank will allow you to open account on a tourist visa. We came back on a two month tourist visa, and immediately set to work on getting our first Married 'O' Visa. With the paperwork filed. I was given a temporary extension for a month until my visa came back from Bangkok, with the one year married 'O' extension.  Of course there are agencies that offer that service, if you wish to go that route.  

 

Check with you embassy first, don't listen to anybody there, but embassy personnel, as there are touts explaining how you can avoid all the paperwork for a fee, which is a rip off, and further complicates matters. I'm sure there are other experts in the matters as my info is old on the subject.

 

DP.

[Dillpickles98]

On 10/31/2018 at 10:38 PM, Pib said:

I have account with three credit unions; none of them offer ACH "IAT" sending capability.  And none of my US banks do either. 

 

I would just recommend if you depend greatly on using your CU to transfer funds to Thailand using ACH, you might want to confirm your CU truly has IAT "sending" capability and the CU rep you talked to let's say was just wrong.  Maybe he/she things since they can receive ACH IAT for many years that equate to being able to send ACH IAT.

 

Transferwise sums it up pretty well regarding US bank/CU capability to "send" ACH IAT.  And those banks they refer to below are most like large banks which also offer "business" account for business which want to use ACH IAT to pay foreign companies, foreign payroll, etc.