Thailand's Tourism Ministry admits Chinese visitors down nearly 20% in October

[DrTuner]

It's a good start. I'm hoping for 120%. 

[Media1]

Great news nobody wants them

[simoh1490]

8 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

"Those spending the most money were (in order of the most) from: China, Malaysia, Russia, the US, Japan, Korea, the UK, Australia, Laos and India."

 

How would this be determined?

By sampling. TAT (like many others in Thailand and elsewhere) gets data on tourism from a large number of hotels and tourist outlets who report their data every week/month, from that data they can see the spend per person, nationality, length of stay etc etc. A TAT sampling program for this purpose is likely to involve over 1,000 outlets. FWIW it's a very reliable method of finding out the details when there is no other easier way to get an answer - many western countries use sampling for census and for reporting unemployment figures, amongst other things.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, simoh1490 said:

By sampling. TAT

I thought they just lied and made it all up.

[zzaa09]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I thought they just lied and made it all up.

.....and no one is the wiser.

 

It's all good.

 

????

[mok199]

Looks like the Chinese have broken up with Thailand ,with the old excuse ''mabey we should see other people''..

[Ulic]

Tourism revenue down .5% Hardly worth reporting if true. That said I do find the math intriguing. Chinese tourists down 20%, tourist revenues down .5%. As Chinese tourists represent the largest single group and spend the highest daily amount,(according to TAT figures) I can only conclude that the other group numbers are up significantly. Either that or because the Chinese tourists have such short stays a small increase in the numbers of other tourists quite easily offset the drop in the Chinese numbers.

[DrTuner]

2 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

By sampling. TAT (like many others in Thailand and elsewhere) gets data on tourism from a large number of hotels and tourist outlets who report their data every week/month, from that data they can see the spend per person, nationality, length of stay etc etc. A TAT sampling program for this purpose is likely to involve over 1,000 outlets. FWIW it's a very reliable method of finding out the details when there is no other easier way to get an answer - many western countries use sampling for census and for reporting unemployment figures, amongst other things.

"Sampling program". Unless they sourced it from Farangia, snowball's chance in hell of it actually working or even existing.

 

I think they use undercover somtam sellers that report the aliens using facebook. Highest probability around here.

[DrTuner]

1 hour ago, Ulic said:

Tourism revenue down .5% Hardly worth reporting if true. That said I do find the math intriguing. Chinese tourists down 20%, tourist revenues down .5%. As Chinese tourists represent the largest single group and spend the highest daily amount,(according to TAT figures) I can only conclude that the other group numbers are up significantly. Either that or because the Chinese tourists have such short stays a small increase in the numbers of other tourists quite easily offset the drop in the Chinese numbers.

There's another explanation, they got rid of the low spending Chinese segment. That is if the numbers were real to begin with.

[bangrak]

HURRAH!

[balo]

20% down this week , but we have good news for you next week when it will be 30% up!   

 

[Fex Bluse]

8 hours ago, mok199 said:

Looks like the Chinese have broken up with Thailand ,with the old excuse ''mabey we should see other people''..

China has used tourism as a weapon for awhile now

 

 

[a977]

11 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

By sampling. TAT (like many others in Thailand and elsewhere) gets data on tourism from a large number of hotels and tourist outlets who report their data every week/month, from that data they can see the spend per person, nationality, length of stay etc etc. A TAT sampling program for this purpose is likely to involve over 1,000 outlets. FWIW it's a very reliable method of finding out the details when there is no other easier way to get an answer - many western countries use sampling for census and for reporting unemployment figures, amongst other things.

So they run around ask all the street sellers how much each person spent with them and which country they came from, same same bars and markets come on TAT  I might be an Aussie but I'm not that gullible you haven't got a bloody clue what you talk about

[simoh1490]

15 minutes ago, a977 said:

So they run around ask all the street sellers how much each person spent with them and which country they came from, same same bars and markets come on TAT  I might be an Aussie but I'm not that gullible you haven't got a bloody clue what you talk about

2

I'll cut you some leeway simply  because you're an Aussie and kinda slow and I'll help you get some of the education 

 you seem to missed earlier in life. Here, read this:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_(statistics) and his http://www.egovernment.tas.gov.au/stats_matter/toolkit/Statistical_Sampling

 

And in case you're too lazy to click on the links:

 

Sampling is a statistical technique that is used around the world by governments, and private sector to determine unemployment levels, identify interest and in the case of Tasmania, even undertake their census.

 

Accurate sampling relies on a number of factors, sample size and accurate framing of questions being the two most important ones. In the case of TAT's use of sampling they rely on data from a large sample of tourism related businesses which they use repeatedly over time hence the source of the data never changes. TAT's sample may include for example, say 500 guest houses in Bangkok, 500 three to five star hotels in Bangkok, duty free shops at airports, department store and airline data as well information from major restaurants in tourist areas - information gathered will include nationality, data. spend, date and more. Other sources of data will include the information provided by Immigration and landing cards as well as the reverse side data filled out by passengers. 

 

The above will be repeated at major cities throughout Thailand by regional TAT offices and collated to provide statistics.

 

Come back to me with questions or words you don't understand.

 

[mikebell]

After the Japanese tourist got run down in Pattaya this week, watch for a fall in numbers from this country.  It's Korea's turn next.

[joecoolfrog]

15 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

Something does not add up here. The number of Chinese tourists is down almost 20% and their spending is down over 16%, they also claim the Chinese spent the most further in the article. Yet the overall revenue is just down 0.5%. And the Chinese remain the biggest group. So this points to either a price increase or a cost cutting if that figure of 0.5% is to be believed.

 

Furthermore, both Cambodia and Lao are listed as two countries where most tourists come from. Both are probably 90% workers, not tourists. 

This struck me as well , Cambodia and Laos are desperately poor countries . It begs the question of who exactly are counted as tourists .

[joecoolfrog]

15 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

Income tax, there are a shit load of Lao working in Thailand ????

Which means they are not tourists !

[Peterw42]

21 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

"Those spending the most money were (in order of the most) from: China, Malaysia, Russia, the US, Japan, Korea, the UK, Australia, Laos and India."

 

How would this be determined?

Any day/week/month they know the number of visitors from a country, any day/week/month they also know the amount of foreign exchange from each country, divide one by the other.

[Fex Bluse]

As always it's safe to ignore Thai pronouncements as half-truths at best. Either through incompetence or deceit, their numbers are always rubbery 

[Vacuum]

48 minutes ago, joecoolfrog said:

It begs the question of who exactly are counted as tourists .

Anyone who enter Thailand with a non-Thai passport.

[mlmcleod]

Perhaps the Chinese economy has something to do with it.  China is experiencing major upheavals due to Trump's tariffs.  Also this is not widely publicized but the high season prices and rates do not appeal to the Chinese.  There are as many or more Cheap Charlie's in China as the rest of the world.  The Thai's strict adherence to high prices during high season probably has a huge impact.  The Chinese are a frugal people not known for wasting their money so I doubt that tourism will improve during high season.

 

Putting all your eggs in one basket has rarely been a winning policy.  By alienating western tourists while coddling the Chinese, Thailand has tied their prosperity to the tail of a dragon.

[Wallander4]

This is just the beginning - say goodbye to your 20% GDP, you reap what you sow haha

[Peterw42]

1 hour ago, mlmcleod said:

Perhaps the Chinese economy has something to do with it.  China is experiencing major upheavals due to Trump's tariffs.  Also this is not widely publicized but the high season prices and rates do not appeal to the Chinese.  There are as many or more Cheap Charlie's in China as the rest of the world.  The Thai's strict adherence to high prices during high season probably has a huge impact.  The Chinese are a frugal people not known for wasting their money so I doubt that tourism will improve during high season.

 

Putting all your eggs in one basket has rarely been a winning policy.  By alienating western tourists while coddling the Chinese, Thailand has tied their prosperity to the tail of a dragon.

How is Thailand alienating western tourists ? Chinese get 15 days off the plane, most westerners get 30 days.

[Srikcir]

9 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

How is Thailand alienating western tourists ? Chinese get 15 days off the plane, most westerners get 30 days.

Thailand Introduces ‘Special Lane’ At Immigration To Select Chinese Visitors From Other Arrivals

The Don Muang Airport and Suvarnabhumi Airport have added VIP channels for Chinese tourists. Among them, Suvarnabhumi Airport has opened 17 VIP channels for Chinese tourists, which is convenient for traveling to Thailand. .... It is reported that Chiang Mai, Hat Yai, Phuket and other airports with direct flights to China have also opened special VIP channels for Chinese tourists.

https://loyaltylobby.com/2018/08/20/thailand-introduces-special-lane-at-immigration-to-select-chinese-visitors-from-other-arrivals/

Where are the VIP channels for other foreign tourists?

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Thailand Introduces ‘Special Lane’ At Immigration To Select Chinese Visitors From Other Arrivals

The Don Muang Airport and Suvarnabhumi Airport have added VIP channels for Chinese tourists. Among them, Suvarnabhumi Airport has opened 17 VIP channels for Chinese tourists, which is convenient for traveling to Thailand. .... It is reported that Chiang Mai, Hat Yai, Phuket and other airports with direct flights to China have also opened special VIP channels for Chinese tourists.

https://loyaltylobby.com/2018/08/20/thailand-introduces-special-lane-at-immigration-to-select-chinese-visitors-from-other-arrivals/

Where are the VIP channels for other foreign tourists?

Thats really just a measure to cope with the large numbers of Chinese arrivals, they are not getting any special service etc, if anything its an advantage for non-Chinese as there are less people in the non-Chinese queue.

[spidermike007]

Amazing. Someone in a position of authority spoke the truth? Astonishing actually. 

 

I think perhaps a few decades from now, they will have tourism classes at university, where they will discuss how Thailand lost the golden egg of Western tourism. Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $4,000 a day. They brought real money into the country, and in exchange, were treated with utter and complete disregard, scammed, disrespected, and abused. Eventually, most said no more. Thailand thought the country was something very special, and that nobody would ever say no, or find alternative places to visit. The fact is that there are countless other spots, many in this region, that offer better service, more expertise in food and beverage (especially wine service and selection at fair prices, which rich tourists demand), reasonable import duties to sustain a luxury goods market, better training, and far better english skills. Thailand simply lost sight of the big picture, and had very little vision, with regard to big spending tourists, who need to be catered to, instead of scorned.  

 

 So, what happened? The Western tourists started to decline in number, and the genius minds at the TAT decided it was time to "lure" the Chinese. They came. They came in droves. But, they did not spend much money. Hotels, restaurants, gift shops, jewelers, galleries, spas, massage shops, bars, and countless other businesses suffered, and will continue to suffer from this extreme myopia, on the part of the officials in charge of tourism. Oh well. Can't say they were not warned. Zero baht tourists are perhaps the majority who visit Thailand now. Sure, they spend some money in restaurants, and in 7/11. But, that is about it, for some of the super low budget Chinese tours. Not many rich Chinese are not visiting Thailand, for a dozen good reasons. They have too many other options.

 

There are countless things the government could be doing, if they wanted to attract the high quality tourists. The very first thing would be to repeal the anti faring wine bill, that was passed by a few very corrupt senators way back when, to protect an anemic local wine industry. They are losing billions of dollars a year in revenue, that would be had from a 100% wine duty, instead of 460%. The five star hotels would have major wine events, and the entire industry would flourish here. 

 

I was recently with a group of friends, and we wanted to order a bottle of wine, at of one of those high end restaurants in the EmQuartier complex. It was Bella Rocca Restaurant. I asked about a 2011 Chianti they had on the list. I was told they were out of stock. I asked about a Barbaresco, at 2,600 baht. Again, out of stock. How about this Nebbiolo? Do you have the 2010, as stated on the list? No, we only have the 2015. OK, what is that wine like? Is it drinking well now? I do not know. Is there anyone here that is familiar with this wine list? No. Sorry sir. Wait a minute. You have 100 bottles on this list, ranging from 1200 baht to 10,000 baht per bottle, and NOBODY who works here knows anything about the wine? Are you serious? We all just looked at each other, and got up and walked out. We realized the restaurant was a pretender. And more than likely the food was marginal at best. It was all dressed up to look like a very nice Italian restaurant. But, it appeared to be only window dressing. High end tourists have little patience for that lack of quality and lack of service. 

But again, the lack of vision, combined with a naive, surly, silly, churlish, and ignorant sense of nationalism, bites the country in the butt. And again, who is the loser? The Thai people. 

The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend. For a hundred valid reasons. 

[simoh1490]

23 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Thailand Introduces ‘Special Lane’ At Immigration To Select Chinese Visitors From Other Arrivals

The Don Muang Airport and Suvarnabhumi Airport have added VIP channels for Chinese tourists. Among them, Suvarnabhumi Airport has opened 17 VIP channels for Chinese tourists, which is convenient for traveling to Thailand. .... It is reported that Chiang Mai, Hat Yai, Phuket and other airports with direct flights to China have also opened special VIP channels for Chinese tourists.

https://loyaltylobby.com/2018/08/20/thailand-introduces-special-lane-at-immigration-to-select-chinese-visitors-from-other-arrivals/

Where are the VIP channels for other foreign tourists?

Those "special or VIP Lanes" for Chinese tourists are a polite way of keeping them apart from the masses of other tourists who typically have different rules when it comes to queuing and public behaviour.

[simoh1490]

14 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Amazing. Someone in a position of authority spoke the truth? Astonishing actually. 

 

I think perhaps a few decades from now, they will have tourism classes at university, where they will discuss how Thailand lost the golden egg of Western tourism. Those tourists, unlike most Chinese tourists, spent anywhere from $100 a day, to over $4,000 a day. They brought real money into the country, and in exchange, were treated with utter and complete disregard, scammed, disrespected, and abused. Eventually, most said no more. Thailand thought the country was something very special, and that nobody would ever say no, or find alternative places to visit. The fact is that there are countless other spots, many in this region, that offer better service, more expertise in food and beverage (especially wine service and selection at fair prices, which rich tourists demand), reasonable import duties to sustain a luxury goods market, better training, and far better english skills. Thailand simply lost sight of the big picture, and had very little vision, with regard to big spending tourists, who need to be catered to, instead of scorned.  

 

 So, what happened? The Western tourists started to decline in number, and the genius minds at the TAT decided it was time to "lure" the Chinese. They came. They came in droves. But, they did not spend much money. Hotels, restaurants, gift shops, jewelers, galleries, spas, massage shops, bars, and countless other businesses suffered, and will continue to suffer from this extreme myopia, on the part of the officials in charge of tourism. Oh well. Can't say they were not warned. Zero baht tourists are perhaps the majority who visit Thailand now. Sure, they spend some money in restaurants, and in 7/11. But, that is about it, for some of the super low budget Chinese tours. Not many rich Chinese are not visiting Thailand, for a dozen good reasons. They have too many other options.

 

There are countless things the government could be doing, if they wanted to attract the high quality tourists. The very first thing would be to repeal the anti faring wine bill, that was passed by a few very corrupt senators way back when, to protect an anemic local wine industry. They are losing billions of dollars a year in revenue, that would be had from a 100% wine duty, instead of 460%. The five star hotels would have major wine events, and the entire industry would flourish here. 

 

I was recently with a group of friends, and we wanted to order a bottle of wine, at of one of those high end restaurants in the EmQuartier complex. It was Bella Rocca Restaurant. I asked about a 2011 Chianti they had on the list. I was told they were out of stock. I asked about a Barbaresco, at 2,600 baht. Again, out of stock. How about this Nebbiolo? Do you have the 2010, as stated on the list? No, we only have the 2015. OK, what is that wine like? Is it drinking well now? I do not know. Is there anyone here that is familiar with this wine list? No. Sorry sir. Wait a minute. You have 100 bottles on this list, ranging from 1200 baht to 10,000 baht per bottle, and NOBODY who works here knows anything about the wine? Are you serious? We all just looked at each other, and got up and walked out. We realized the restaurant was a pretender. And more than likely the food was marginal at best. It was all dressed up to look like a very nice Italian restaurant. But, it appeared to be only window dressing. High end tourists have little patience for that lack of quality and lack of service. 

But again, the lack of vision, combined with a naive, surly, silly, churlish, and ignorant sense of nationalism, bites the country in the butt. And again, who is the loser? The Thai people. 

The entire country is suffering from a declining tourism industry. And that will not change. It is a permanent declining trend. For a hundred valid reasons. 

The amount spent by tourists from different countries in different countries on holiday is widely understood and available, they are not just Thai government numbers they are numbers that others have compiled in order to better understand tourist behaviour. And whilst every nationality has its high and low spenders it's the average that counts, there is no way on Gods green earth that daily average western spending in Thailand is even remotely close to $4k per day so why even mention it. Every set of stats. I have ever seen on the subject of daily tourist spend in any country has always shown the Chinese as the number one average spenders, not just in Thailand but globally.

[JAG]

19 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

Income tax, there are a shit load of Lao working in Thailand ????

 

19 hours ago, HiSoLowSoNoSo said:

Should not be in the statistics for tourism income (or spending per country). But who knows from where TAT get their figures from! 

Somehow I doubt that many of the Laos workers here pay income tax - I could be wrong...

[shackleton]

The Brits need to make the most of their spending power  before Brexit

on holidays to Thailand ect 

after they exit  quite a few will be staying at home