Move to make health insurance mandatory for long-stay visas

[kannot]

5 hours ago, AAArdvark said:

This may have been mentioned earlier.  The O-X visa is a long-term visa and it already requires health insurance.

 

http://www.thaiembassy.ca/en/visiting-thailand/visas/types-visas-periods-stay-fees/visa-ox-10yrs-long-stay

Wonder how  many have "rushed"  to sign  up,i  bet the figures are almost a big fat ZERO.

Maybe the govt will get the hint  that no one wants it.

[scubascuba3]

 
My personal opinion is that Thailand should allow long stay expats to buy into the Thai government health system. It would provide an additional income stream for the Thai system, and would IMO be profitable because many expats would go back to their country for major health issues anyway.
 and provide travel health insurance for visitors again through the Thai health system.
I don't trust private health insurance companies.   

I agree that's a good idea and a win win for everyone perhaps. If i decide I'm not comfortable with buying the insurance i may instead choose to stay on a tourist visa for shorter periods, and maybe eventually phase Thailand out if I'm enjoying another Asian country enough

[JLCrab]

4 hours ago, kannot said:

Wonder how  many have "rushed"  to sign  up,i  bet the figures are almost a big fat ZERO.

Even if no one has signed up for the O-X, that 40K baht IP / 400K baht OP per year insurance scheme is in the O-X MoFA regulation so has already received Ministerial Approval and may be a tough nut to change even with all the 'why don't they do this' or 'what they really should do is' stuff in here.

[moogradod]

14 hours ago, sirineou said:

Sure you do. you can leave , you can not come to Thailand. Nobody is forcing you to come to Thailand. 

This is a limited view. Nobody does force you but maybe something will "force" you like for example inheritance laws, existing Thai family and Wife or if you have already initiated everything to move and cannot turn back anymore or if you are 70 years old, living in Thailand for decades happily without insurance. But not very considerate and compassionate in view of possible complex individual situations. Easy statement if you are yourself young and can get insurance cheap and easy as well and if you do not (need) to care if living in Thailand or elsewhere.

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, moogradod said:

This is a limited view. Nobody does force you but maybe something will "force" you like for example inheritance laws, existing Thai family and Wife or if you have already initiated everything to move and cannot turn back anymore or if you are 70 years old, living in Thailand for decades happily without insurance. But not very considerate and compassionate in view of possible complex individual situations. Easy statement if you are yourself young and can get insurance cheap and easy as well and if you do not (need) to care if living in Thailand or elsewhere.

Sure, I understand that , and I sympathise. In every thread about moving to Thailand I sound like a broken record ' dont burn your bridges"  "have a plan B"  

We are guests here at the whim of the Thai government, are we willing to bet our lives on that?

  I could sell my home in the US , get upwards a quarter of a million dollars, and be sitting pretty in Thailand, But for how long? when will the Thai government introduce some draconian requirement that would make it impossible to live there? 

When will I get old and sick with no insurance that will cover me in Thailand?

PS: if a health insurance requirement is introduced, I think those having come here under the old requirements and have invested here , should be grandfathered in and excluded from the requirement, and perhaps they will be.

[JLCrab]

8 hours ago, sirineou said:

PS: if a health insurance requirement is introduced, I think those having come here under the old requirements and have invested here , should be grandfathered in and excluded from the requirement, and perhaps they will be.

From the OP: "The amended criterion is aimed at ensuring health protection for long-stay visa holders – mostly elderly foreigners – and also benefit the public and private hospitals in the country, he added."

 

So why would they 'grandfather in' grandfather types when it is the grandfather types that they are most looking to make sure have insurance?

[sirineou]

35 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

From the OP: "The amended criterion is aimed at ensuring health protection for long-stay visa holders – mostly elderly foreigners – and also benefit the public and private hospitals in the country, he added."

 

So why would they 'grandfather in' grandfather types when it is the grandfather types that they are most looking to make sure have insurance?

Grandfathered means having entered in to a system under different requirements and when the rules change you not having to play under the new rules.

 To change the rules in the  idle of the game would be unfair. 

so those who entered the game under one set of rules, regardless of their age should continue to play under that set of rules. New players can be presented with the new rules and they can decide to play or not.

 

 

[JLCrab]

25 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 To change the rules in the  idle of the game would be unfair. 

Oh.

[garyk]

21 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

On 1/1/2019 at 4:46 AM, sirineou said:

Sure you do. you can leave , you can not come to Thailand. Nobody is forcing you to come to Thailand. 

Old line and if insurance is compulsory a lot of people will go elsewhere, which is fine all round, apart from the Thais who rely on those people to make money

Agree, the insurance and the 800K seasoned in a bank are government scams plain and simple. Anyone that travels around Thailand knows it.  Income is easily verified, and with that kind of money you don't need insurance in Thailand. I feel for the average Thai person. The government and big business sh!# on them big time. 

But, this is nothing new in Thailand.

[cleverman]

The most rediculous advice a bloke in a bar gave me last night. If all long stayers have to take out the ins.,take out a pay by the month policy,get your visa then cancel the policy. So, you have an accident, get real crook, carted off to hospital, they ask , will it be cash or ins. claim, if you don't have the cash, and the hospital finds you can't supple ins. details, then what. They contact immigration and you are jailed and fined then black listed .  One born every minute. 

[JLCrab]

21 minutes ago, cleverman said:

If all long stayers have to take out the ins.,take out a pay by the month policy,get your visa then cancel the policy.

From an O-X visa link on the WashDC Thai Embassy website:

 

Each applicant, including spouse and children, must ensure that he/she has always held the Thai health insurance policy throughout the granted period of long stay visa. Failure to meet this requirement will be considered as disqualified to the standard requirements under the announcement by Department of Consular Affairs, and the granted visa will be withdr(awn).

Edited January 1, 2019 by JLCrab

[GinBoy2]

10 hours ago, sirineou said:

Sure, I understand that , and I sympathise. In every thread about moving to Thailand I sound like a broken record ' dont burn your bridges"  "have a plan B"  

We are guests here at the whim of the Thai government, are we willing to bet our lives on that?

  I could sell my home in the US , get upwards a quarter of a million dollars, and be sitting pretty in Thailand, But for how long? when will the Thai government introduce some draconian requirement that would make it impossible to live there? 

When will I get old and sick with no insurance that will cover me in Thailand?

PS: if a health insurance requirement is introduced, I think those having come here under the old requirements and have invested here , should be grandfathered in and excluded from the requirement, and perhaps they will be.

I'm totally with you on sounding like the 'broken record' with regard to a Plan B, but unfortunately for many on TVF that is akin to blasphemy and Thai Bashing. 

 

Health insurance is a great case in point. You're American, and as fuc**ked up as our system is, once you get to Medicare age, you do get peace of mind.

In Thailand, it's actually the opposite, and the older you get the more out of reach health security becomes, with premiums escalating and exclusions making any horribly priced policy basically worthless

 

If they are going to do this, then some regulation needs to happen to ensure that either the State, or private insurance companies are complied to offer some worthwhile coverage to elder long stay residents.

 

Problem with that is, that policy proclamations don't often follow through on the long term implications

[JLCrab]

3 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

If they are going to do this, then some regulation needs to happen to ensure that either the State, or private insurance companies are complied to offer some worthwhile coverage to elder long stay residents.

WELCOME TO THAILAND

Apply for Health Insurance for Long Stay Visa.

 

https://longstay.tgia.org/

[Joe Mcseismic]

On 12/31/2018 at 11:25 PM, BestB said:

Pacific Cross is known to be rather picky one when it comes to offering covers. They want healthy people, they look at BMI as well as smoker and drinker or not, as well as requesting xrays and blood tests prior to offering you full cover.

 

So basically unless you are in a tip top shape, they will not cover you or they will with a massive premium loading and loads of exclusions

Really?

I got started with them at the age of 57. No X-rays, no problem drinking etc.. Got the second best package with 50 million Baht per year cover. I pay first 100,000 Bt. Won't pay pre-existing conditions. Started at around 90K Baht with a 10% no claims bonus per year. I'm now 61 and expect to pay around 55k per annum this year.

 

[scubascuba3]

They should offer an alternative to the insurance such as a bank balance over a certain amount kinda like the 800k but make it larger if required

[Jumbo1968]

Just now, scubascuba3 said:

They should offer an alternative to the insurance such as a bank balance over a certain amount kinda like the 800k but make it larger if required

They could create a Bank Account, 1 million baht in a fixed account no withdrawals except for Medical treatment.

it would pay interest but the government could also benefit from the investment as well and any benefits would be paid into th healthcare system.

[LucysDad]

7 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

They could create a Bank Account, 1 million baht in a fixed account no withdrawals except for Medical treatment.

it would pay interest but the government could also benefit from the investment as well and any benefits would be paid into th healthcare system.

 

 

I never cease to be amazed by some of the hair-brained schemes that get posted on here.

 

Great idea  -  and, of course, the Thais can all suffer reciprocal arrangements for any country they go to.....

[Pattaya46]

15 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

They should offer an alternative to the insurance such as a bank balance over a certain amount kinda like the 800k but make it larger if required

9 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

They could create a Bank Account, 1 million baht in a fixed account no withdrawals except for Medical treatment.

It's a requirement for "Visas", so for people who are not in Thailand. How could someone who never came in Thailand open a Thai bank account ?

[Mapguy]

Is citizenship a requirement?  I doubt it.  There are branches of Thai banks in several countries, no doubt in Europe and North America as well as throughout Asia. 

[AAArdvark]

5 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

It's a requirement for "Visas", so for people who are not in Thailand. How could someone who never came in Thailand open a Thai bank account ?

The same thing for insurance.  If you are applying for O-A visa, you are doing it in your home country.  How do you get Thai insurance and pay for it in Baht while in your home country and before you actually get the visa?

[scubascuba3]

It's a requirement for "Visas", so for people who are not in Thailand. How could someone who never came in Thailand open a Thai bank account ?

Easy, an equivalent amount in farang account would qualify, same with the 800k balance

[Jumbo1968]

6 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

It's a requirement for "Visas", so for people who are not in Thailand. How could someone who never came in Thailand open a Thai bank account ?

I opened a Bank Account at Krungsri the other week, all I did was show my Passport no other documents required. They asked for my U.K. address verbally also my address here, took 10 minutes.

[Mapguy]

10 minutes ago, LucysDad said:

 

 

I never cease to be amazed by some of the hair-brained schemes that get posted on here.

 

Great idea  -  and, of course, the Thais can all suffer reciprocal arrangements for any country they go to.....

Hare-brained. Well, no, not really.  Nonetheless, there is indeed reciprocity to consider when it comes to certain visa issues.  The government does so although it might or might not be relevant in this case.  To flip to a different case, as an illustration, GB requires a national (as I recall) to pick up financial responsibility for some foreigners on tourist visas. Thailand doesn't have a reciprocal policy of which I am aware.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy
clarity

[Mapguy]

7 minutes ago, AAArdvark said:

The same thing for insurance.  If you are applying for O-A visa, you are doing it in your home country.  How do you get Thai insurance and pay for it in Baht while in your home country and before you actually get the visa?

You'd be surprised how easy international banking is except --- maybe --- in Eritrea.....not to pick on Eritrea!

[Pattaya46]

22 minutes ago, AAArdvark said:

The same thing for insurance.  If you are applying for O-A visa, you are doing it in your home country.  How do you get Thai insurance and pay for it in Baht while in your home country and before you actually get the visa?

I don't see a problem. Any western card (visa, mastercard,...) allow you to buy online in Thailand and most countries, whatever currency this country uses.

 

21 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

I opened a Bank Account at Krungsri the other week, all I did was show my Passport no other documents required. They asked for my U.K. address verbally also my address here, took 10 minutes.

You were IN Thailand, very different. People above suggested you should put 800k or 1 million baht in a Thai bank account to get your O-A visa, so you would have to open this account while you are in your country.... No way.

[steve73]

4 hours ago, JLCrab said:

WELCOME TO THAILAND

Apply for Health Insurance for Long Stay Visa.

 

https://longstay.tgia.org/

Thanks for the link.. checking on a couple of the references for premiums..

 

Viriyah - 39.5k for 51-55 rising to 94k for 70-75, upwards to 249k for 95-99.

Navakij - 53k for 51-55 to 91k 76-80 (no cover above this)

Both for c. 400k IP & 40k OP

 

Combined with all the restrictions and exclusions, it is hardly worth bothering.. Much more sensible to self insure especially as you get older... unless of course you want much higher cover (which many will recommend), but expect to pay correspondingly higher premiums.

JMHO.

[mrmazinkle]

On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 9:05 PM, Longcut said:

What happens when you are too old to obtain insurance?

Its a no brainer..no insurance no visa..No stay..If this is implemented you need a plan B..Come here at 55 retire invest,build a family,commitments,relationships,forget it.Its a pipe dream.

[fforest1]

5 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

I don't see a problem. Any western card (visa, mastercard,...) allow you to buy online in Thailand and most countries, whatever currency this country uses.

 

You were IN Thailand, very different. People above suggested you should put 800k or 1 million baht in a Thai bank account to get your O-A visa, so you would have to open this account while you are in your country.... No way.

Well if we can create enough hoops for farang to jump through we can finally get rid of these damm foreigners....lol

[meechai]

32 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

You were IN Thailand, very different. People above suggested you should put 800k or 1 million baht in a Thai bank account to get your O-A visa, so you would have to open this account while you are in your country.... No way.

Actually it could be done the same way you season your account used for long term visa extensions

Meaning a grace period of a month (or more) to fund it etc

 

But the whole idea of having a bank account instead of medical insurance is bad for everyone

 

1-Bad for Thailand because it is not hard to exceed a million or two account funding in a crisis

 

2- bad for the individual because I hate to say it but many Thai medical systems are just as corrupt as other Thai systems. If doctors know you have a locked account of 1-2 million available to them "if" they claim certain emergency operations are needed then they WILL be needed.

I know from experience....

[JLCrab]

Whether the polices that Thai companies have set up to cover the minimum 400K OP / 40K OP baht per year policy required of the O-X visa are good deals or not, it seems those 40/400 numbers are now well established in at least the MoFA bureaucracy.

Edited January 2, 2019 by JLCrab