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Tiny leak


pikao

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Hi there,

I´m rentig out a house. My tenants are nice and clean and they pay. They are a bit pedantic though. Under the sink in the bathroom (after a failed repair) there stays a tiny leak. Outflow about 10 ml (or less) per day. But there is a leak and they insist (softly) to fix it. It´s about the PVC pipe coming out directly flat from the wall with a male thread (also PVC) to fix the hose to the tap. At the last torque the thread broke at it´s bottom. It was still holding on so I´ve let it dry (not enough obviously) and put some two component glue on. Better, but not. Next I tried several other kinds of stuff but as the water was once under it nothing would stick. Next I would have to  open the wall, which I want to avoid. Years ago in a teleshopping program they advertised a "glue" that was made for wet surfaces (such as a leaking roof during rain).

Don´t know if it worked. Does anyone know if such thing (maybe for boats) is available in TH ? Any other good advice is also appreciated. Thanks

P.S. Long story for a tiny leak, but I wanted to show the situation and the dimesion of the options. A bit of glue or opening a wall

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The best way would be to "open the wall" and replace the broken joint....but you could try some 2 part epoxy putty it will set in the wet but not under pressure so turn the water off for a few hours to allow time for it to dry a bit.

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I 2nd, 3rd the above.  The problem is that you over-torqued in the first place.  So, don't do that again!  Most threaded joints really do not need much more than finger tighten.  A bit more but not much.

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can you get a close-up clear photo of the problem / fitting coming from the wall, it will help us to devise a good fix-up for you.

 

Possibly you can chip away a bit of the wall to expose the pipe / fitting, then using a 2 part epoxy and female / male PVC fitting  - after fitting the new fitting apply a good amount of epoxy into the hole and around the pipe fitting. 

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2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

There's a saying about leaks. They never get better.

I disagree.

 

Many small leaks actually right themselves relatively quickly, with impurities coming via a water main or crap that ended up down the waste pipe.

 

I have had a cup under the sink for a leak on the water main but i was very wary to overtighten an already twisted flexi. After 6months the problem disappeared.

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You might try aqua putty two part adhesive that is available from home pro.  it can be wised under water and i used it to repair a couple of small leaks when i built my house 20 years ago intending to go back and fix them right later.  here it is 20 years later, i haven't repaired the leaks  and they still do not leak,  my motto "don't fix something that is not broken".  I've actually used it to repair a small hole in a biG plastic bucket and it still holds water.

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Assuming theres some good PVC thread poking out of the wall, try this:-

  • Get an iron (not PVC) female - female and an iron male - male fitting (or better a stop tap) fitting of the correct size.
  • Apply LOTS of PTFE tape to the PVC coming out of the wall.
  • Put the female fitting on.
  • The thread is much longer than the flexy nut and should seal nicely on the remaining good PVC.
  • Screw the stop-tap into the other end of the fitting (use enough PTFE).
  • Re-fit the flexy (check the rubber washer).

Job done.

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First of all.....Thank´s a lot to everybody

19 hours ago, faraday said:

You tried the ptfe plumbers tape? 

I did, but it doesn´t work on the wall as the pipe comes out too flat (even)

19 hours ago, johng said:

The best way would be to "open the wall" and replace the broken joint....but you could try some 2 part epoxy putty it will set in the wet but not under pressure so turn the water off for a few hours to allow time for it to dry a bit.

Agree with the first point, but it would be a bigger job + very inconvenient to work (difficult access)

Tried the putty (which I called "glue", sorry), without pressure, but it worked out only 99%

19 hours ago, Arjen said:

The best repairs in cases like this is start all over again. But maybe you are lucky.....

Agree to both (hoping)

 

18 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

The problem is that you over-torqued in the first place.

Yes. And I know about the sensibility of PVC pipes. Problem was that it´s a combination of several connections and it should be horizontal. Last 5mm were...just..too much

 

18 hours ago, Artisi said:

can you get a close-up clear photo of the problem / fitting coming from the wall, it will help us to devise a good fix-up for you.

Can´t do that now, and you would only see the "mess" that it is at present (putty, tape, glue..)

 

18 hours ago, Artisi said:

Possibly you can chip away a bit of the wall to expose the pipe / fitting, then using a 2 part epoxy and female / male PVC fitting  - after fitting the new fitting apply a good amount of epoxy into the hole and around the pipe fitting.

Probably the next step if I´m not lucky, referring to eyecatchers post

 

16 hours ago, eyecatcher said:

Many small leaks actually right themselves relatively quickly, with impurities coming via a water main or crap that ended up down the waste pipe.

That´s what I´m hoping for

 

9 hours ago, wayned said:

You might try aqua putty two part adhesive that is available from home pro.

I definately will

 

8 hours ago, Crossy said:

Assuming theres some good PVC thread poking out of the wall,

Unfortunately not. It´s that part that broke.

 

8 hours ago, Crossy said:
  • Get an iron (not PVC) female - female and an iron male - male fitting (or better a stop tap) fitting of the correct size.
  • Apply LOTS of PTFE tape to the PVC coming out of the wall.
  • Put the female fitting on.
  • The thread is much longer than the flexy nut and should seal nicely on the remaining good PVC.
  • Screw the stop-tap into the other end of the fitting (use enough PTFE).
  • Re-fit the flexy (check the rubber washer).

This could come in play in another occasion. Very good advice. Thanks

 

2 hours ago, CGW said:

If you can get it liquid PTFE would work

Will try

 

Again...thank you all

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19 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

I 2nd, 3rd the above.  The problem is that you over-torqued in the first place.  So, don't do that again!  Most threaded joints really do not need much more than finger tighten.  A bit more but not much.

Thai  fittings are absolute  junk with the worlds  sloppiest threads, even when done up tight with ptfe they often still leak in the smaller half  inch size pipe diameters, I always use the METAL (Brass) insert ones for females and ptfe AND joint compound which usually stops any leaks, but occasionally even then there  can be a  weep.

Gluing  is a total waste of  time

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I've had problems in the past with the cheap stop-tap thingies breaking off and leaving the snapped off thread in the female in the wall 😞

 

Having wrestled far too many of these out of the wall I now use a brass male-female "extender", either hunt for one or just screw a male-male into a female-female. Screw this into the wall and screw the "monkey metal" tap into it. Things break off it's easy to take off the wall and replace or extract on a nice comfy bench not under the bathroom sink. If it needs to look nice use chrome-plated fittings.

 

Something like this.

 

715TAaBQqaL._SX385_.jpg

 

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Lazada have a few different types.

If you search “Loctite” there are a variety of thread sealants ( high temp , coarse thread etc ) but most are really expensive ( 3,000/4,000 baht )
This is the cheapest:
IMG_0806.JPG

Or search “ liquid ptfe “ and I found this:

IMG_0807.JPG


NOTE : if you go this route you need a thread sealant that contains PTFE or TEFLON , ignore threadlocker as this will not work for your problem.

You also need to get the mating parts as dry as possible and leave as long as possible to set

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Perhaps you have already considered this but I'll throw it out there anyway...

 

If access to the wall (like under a wash basin) makes things difficult, I have gone through from the opposite side to open things up.  In my case, the AAC block was easy to remove after getting through the render and, after fixing the problem, it patched back up just fine.

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27 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

If access to the wall (like under a wash basin) makes things difficult, I have gone through from the opposite side to open things up. 

Will be phase 2

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On 1/12/2019 at 4:00 PM, Arjen said:

I also used always the fittings with the brass inserts, but recently, without using any force, the inserts came loose from the PVC tubing..... This happened only with the female connections (always problems with females) 

 

Arjen.

"quality" and  fittings  in Thailand dont really go together

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On 1/12/2019 at 4:27 PM, Andrew Dwyer said:

Lazada have a few different types.

If you search “Loctite” there are a variety of thread sealants ( high temp , coarse thread etc ) but most are really expensive ( 3,000/4,000 baht )
This is the cheapest:
IMG_0806.JPG

Or search “ liquid ptfe “ and I found this:

IMG_0807.JPG


NOTE : if you go this route you need a thread sealant that contains PTFE or TEFLON , ignore threadlocker as this will not work for your problem.

You also need to get the mating parts as dry as possible and leave as long as possible to set
 

I use  this in the tins its a  green sticky stuff, works  99% of the time permaflex   not sure if  thats the same as the one in your  tube  shown https://shopee.co.th/PERMATEX-น้ำยาทาเกลียวท่อ-PIPE-JOINT-COMPOUND-ขนาด-118ml-และ-473ml-i.34596850.1476877274/similar?from=ads&gclid=CjwKCAiA4OvhBRAjEiwAU2FoJWmnPI2zXqPnTUJU2vYuC4xGoWdiwx6sn2UJxVjlVGCFaPj5JUTZOhoCVoEQAvD_BwE

pt.jpg

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On 1/12/2019 at 4:16 PM, Crossy said:

I've had problems in the past with the cheap stop-tap thingies breaking off and leaving the snapped off thread in the female in the wall 😞

 

Having wrestled far too many of these out of the wall I now use a brass male-female "extender", either hunt for one or just screw a male-male into a female-female. Screw this into the wall and screw the "monkey metal" tap into it. Things break off it's easy to take off the wall and replace or extract on a nice comfy bench not under the bathroom sink. If it needs to look nice use chrome-plated fittings.

 

Something like this.

 

715TAaBQqaL._SX385_.jpg

 

you seem to be doing an awful lot of "screwing"  Crossy😱

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On 1/14/2019 at 7:29 AM, kannot said:

"quality" and  fittings  in Thailand dont really go together

Too true for the PVC and cheap taps, but that's why we have got all PP-R and the much better, double the price, taps and quality fittings in our new house. The higher pressure lines are now all braided SS, we did have one of the light weight shower hoses burst so they got changed.

 

The biggest difficulty is that the cheap flimsy fittings are everywhere but you have to look hard for the quality ones.

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On ‎1‎/‎11‎/‎2019 at 6:37 PM, Crossy said:

Assuming theres some good PVC thread poking out of the wall, try this:-

  • Get an iron (not PVC) female - female and an iron male - male fitting (or better a stop tap) fitting of the correct size.
  • Apply LOTS of PTFE tape to the PVC coming out of the wall.
  • Put the female fitting on.
  • The thread is much longer than the flexy nut and should seal nicely on the remaining good PVC.
  • Screw the stop-tap into the other end of the fitting (use enough PTFE).
  • Re-fit the flexy (check the rubber washer).

Job done.

I assume that PTFE is Teflon tape. This is an absolute must on threaded joints.

Ok. Just answered my own question by a net search. Yes, PTFE/Teflon tape, same thing.

I am surprised how many responses before the use of PTFE was mentioned. Way to go Crossy.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 1/16/2019 at 9:57 AM, sometimewoodworker said:

Too true for the PVC and cheap taps, but that's why we have got all PP-R and the much better, double the price, taps and quality fittings in our new house. The higher pressure lines are now all braided SS, we did have one of the light weight shower hoses burst so they got changed.

 

The biggest difficulty is that the cheap flimsy fittings are everywhere but you have to look hard for the quality ones.

and the problem there often is that in Bangkok you may find it but outside it might well be impossible, I used this white  stuff a  few  years back, great stuff,  flexible so reducing any fittings to a minimum as if a  pipes  gonna  leak its always going to be a  joint, 3-4  layers cant remember the name but still available at Thai watsadu  in 20metre  rolls I think. I also use the 13.5  bar thicker pvc  pipe and the much better quality GLUE  not  the stuff  like water , tubes or tins.........no leaks in 6 years anywhere but then I clean the pipes with sandpaper and cellulose  thinner  before  gluing...................+ I remember the glue!!😄

IMAG1449.jpg

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I've long suspected that in SEA countries there is some kind of superstition cultural thing about having wet floors, like it's good luck or something.  This is particularly so in Malaysia and Indonesia.  But this may have to do with Indonesians being lousy plumbers, and that most of the plumbers in Malaysia are Indonesian; I think the Malaysians would approve of this assessment, as they like to blame everything that goes wrong on foreigners.  (As an aside, I lived in Brazil for a bit, and nearly everything that is wrong in Brazil, according to the citizens, has to do with Paraguay.)  More than twice I've stayed in places (in both countries) where there was a gap between the drainpipe and the connector at the bottom of the sink, you can see that as a positive as you can wash your feet without effort.  :biggrin:

No shortage of wet floors, leaky pipe joints and dripping faucets/spigots in LOS, but no one seems concerned, except the OP's tenants. 

IMO going around in anything other than slip-free deck shoes is something of a death wish.

 

 

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On 1/26/2019 at 2:32 AM, kannot said:
On 1/16/2019 at 9:57 AM, sometimewoodworker said:

Too true for the PVC and cheap taps, but that's why we have got all PP-R and the much better, double the price, taps and quality fittings in our new house. The higher pressure lines are now all braided SS, we did have one of the light weight shower hoses burst so they got changed.

 

The biggest difficulty is that the cheap flimsy fittings are everywhere but you have to look hard for the quality ones.

and the problem there often is that in Bangkok you may find it but outside it might well be impossible, I used this white  stuff a  few  years back, great stuff,  flexible so reducing any fittings to a minimum as if a  pipes  gonna  leak its always going to be a  joint, 3-4  layers cant remember the name but still available at Thai watsadu  in 20metre  rolls I think. I also use the 13.5  bar thicker pvc  pipe and the much better quality GLUE  not  the stuff  like water , tubes or tins.........no leaks in 6 years anywhere but then I clean the pipes with sandpaper and cellulose  thinner  before  gluing...................+ I remember the glue!!😄

Well no, poor availability outside Bangkok isn't true. PP-R is easily available in any of the cities where I've had the opportunity to look.

 

The complete range of joints etc. in different pipe sizes may require visiting more than a single location but in KK I know of at least 5 places that have it and in Udon about the same.

 

The white roll is also in both cities, possibly more than 1 location.

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