For better or worse? Expats think Thailand is going down the pan, poll

[mok199]

11 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Price? You are kidding, yes? I can buy a kg of mangos ( in season ) for a quarter of the price it would cost for a single mango in Oz. North of Chiang Rai, again in season, I can buy 4 kg of pineapples for the same cost as a single pineapple in Oz. And the pineapples are far sweeter. Are we on the same planet?

Eating tropical fruit every day is a pleasure , the bananas here are amazing as is the pineapple and mango and on an on...Shopping for food in Pattaya is a daily exercise , we usually go to 3 or 4 stores ,we now know which store or market has the best ..shopping is a blast in Thailand ..

Edited January 26, 2019 by mok199

[jabis]

12 hours ago, jimn said:

You think its cheap and you are shopping at Tops which is expensive. Yes agree imported Strawbwlerries very expensive 250 baht small box. I have been buying them out of the back of a truck in Pattaya. 80 - 120 baht a kilo.

Satloobelliis now in season - well at least here in Chiang Mai, price competition furious in markets: 149-150 baht a box ???? Going to the actual seller you can get a kilo for same price ^^

11 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

It's only a big difference if you don't have any money and are living on a shoe string.

That sort of margins were made for the 2 week millionaire, just to bitch about your ignorance 

[mok199]

10 hours ago, Spidey said:

I live on a gated estate. Bluetooth access. Security 24/7 (not armed). Estate completely covered by CCTV.  Perimeter walls, if you include, steel railings, yes 3m. Neighbours are either farang or middle class Thais. Several RTP live on the estate. The Donald would be proud of our security!

Yes living ground zero in the city is a daily battle...now our latest challenge is the pregnant dogs,next door,which ,in about 8 weeks will be 12 whinning whimpering barking pups 24/7....''ear plugs mate''

[mok199]

1 hour ago, rubyjuan said:

Life in Vietnam is terrific!  I left Thailand in 2014 and been in VN since. High quality and low cost.

Yes it is ,I spent 2 years in dist 1 hcm and 2 years in Vung tao...I love Vnm ..but life has its curves..

[bkk6060]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Good luck when you are trying to sell said condo. There's a four-letter word called glut.

I'd rather keep my money in Oz, where it earns income and doesn't have political uncertainty dogging it.

Yes.

No flexibility in buying a condo and it is a poor investment.

And a person is foolish if they think they are making appreciation or can sell it quickly.

1000's of condos on the market just in Pattaya.

Rent ( which is so unbelievably cheap here) and keep your money working in other places.

[Spidey]

5 minutes ago, mok199 said:

Yes living ground zero in the city is a daily battle...now our latest challenge is the pregnant dogs,next door,which ,in about 8 weeks will be 12 whinning whimpering barking pups 24/7....''ear plugs mate''

Yes, dogs can be a problem, even on an estate like mine. Estate has a rule, "Dogs must be on a leash at all times", with signs everywhere, which is generally adhered to.

 

However, the people who live 2 doors from me have a little yappy dog that they leave outside every night.

 

Obviously very wealthy Thais and I was told that the guy is "Thai mafia". The house is completely enclosed by railings and has it's own CCTV. 

 

At 3am one morning, after being woken up for the 3rd night in a row by it's constant yapping, I went to their front gate, shouted and screamed at the dog, grabbed it by the scruff of the neck and tried to drag it through the bars of the gate.

 

The commotion must have woken the street up, certainly the people in the house, who obviously viewed my antics on their CCTV as peace and tranquillity has reigned ever since.

[mikebell]

It's the police that killed it for me: glaringly obvious corruption; racism; inadequate justice; road stick-ups; traffic fatalities whilst police fiddle.

Added to inability to own a house and there you have my view of Thailand where ex-pats are viewed as targets and not valued.  I'm looking at Vietnam.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Skallywag said:

So you dont find the communist government to be a hinderance in your lifestyle at all?  Just wondering as my google of world nomads suggest trouble with the law there if you engage or discuss in politics , religion, prostitution, "sensitive" photography, blogging, gambling, etc...   Never been - curious

 

You're imagining problems that don't exist, not in China or Vietnam anyway.

Thailand is far more restrictive on speech.

Edited January 26, 2019 by BritManToo

[Fex Bluse]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

And you know this how?

Scientific studies 

[Fex Bluse]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

If they didn't want the retired population why would they make the visa so easy, A pittance in the bank and 10 minutes a year at the immigration office?

Pardon me as I jump in here. 

 

Upon closer reflection, you will conclude that in fact the retired population you refer to amounts to no more than longer term tourists and are treated as such. 

 

Unless permanent residency is on offer and reasonably attainable, you should not consider yourself a stable retiree. When you cannot own nearly any real assets, you are not a stable retiree. 

 

The thai "retirement visa" confers almost no benefits that a tourist does not already have. 

 

What makes Thailand a questionable place to "retire" 

• ease of buying and owning property and the value of property investments: 

Value of investments is almost always negative, especially with condos. 

• cost of renting

This is fine. The cost is low for low quality, so the value is OK. For high quality, however, the cost is prohibitive and a very poor value. If you want to love comfortably in older age, Thailand is not competitive. 

• benefits and discounts on things such as health care and entertainment

None on offer and in fact Farangs are double priced and scammed whenever the Thais can get away with it. 

• visa and residency requirements

Easy but unstable. You never know when your application will be rejected or the rules fundamentally changed. 

• cost of living

Cost or living is competitive for poor quality but uncompetitive for high quality. 

• fitting in and how easy it is to make friends

Thailand is a country where expat "retirees" from all socioeconomic backgrounds almost always have no Thai friends. I wonder why. 

• entertainment and amenities

This is one of the few places Thailand is competive. 

• healthy living

Arguably, one can live healthy but there is a lack of controls for things like food supply safety, air quality, driving, falling off of balconies, being murdered, ect. 

• development and infrastructure

Terrible and terrible unless you consider malls development and infrastructure. 

• climate

Fantastic, depending on what one prefers. 

• stability of the country’s political situation

Horrific, needless to say. 

Edited January 26, 2019 by Fex Bluse

[bkk6060]

1 hour ago, mikebell said:

It's the police that killed it for me: glaringly obvious corruption; racism; inadequate justice; road stick-ups; traffic fatalities whilst police fiddle.

I have never had a problem with the police they have absolutely no influence on my life because I have all my documents and stay out of trouble.

A shame if others cannot do the same.

[Henryford]

The only reason i would leave is if they really started to make it difficult to get long stay visas, like 100k+ monthly incomes or 2 million + in the bank. Maybe what they are doing now is just the start of a gradual culling of long stay foreigners. But if that happened it would be next to impossible to sell any property. I love the weather and can live without HP sauce, or even wine.

Edited January 26, 2019 by Henryford

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, mikebell said:

It's the police that killed it for me: glaringly obvious corruption; racism; inadequate justice; road stick-ups; traffic fatalities whilst police fiddle.

Added to inability to own a house and there you have my view of Thailand where ex-pats are viewed as targets and not valued.  I'm looking at Vietnam.

I've been here nearly ten years. I've never had any of the problems you mention. Police here are polite and smiling. Try getting a smile out of an Australian traffic cop.

IMHO Thais retaining control of their assets is sensible. Rent is so cheap here it's not worthwhile to own property anyway. I just wish Australia had the same sense. National assets there are flogged off to anyone with money.

Vietnam has some very nice places. Being reasonably fluent in Thai now, I'd find it difficult to start over learning Vietnamese.

[GinBoy2]

54 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Pardon me as I jump in here. 

 

Upon closer reflection, you will conclude that in fact the retired population you refer to amounts to no more than longer term tourists and are treated as such. 

 

Unless permanent residency is on offer and reasonably attainable, you should not consider yourself a stable retiree. When you cannot own nearly any real assets, you are not a stable retiree. 

 

 

Isn't that the crux of the matter? 

 

No matter what phrase folks use, there is no such thing as a 'retirement visa'

 

As you rightly state, regardless of what you have bought, spent, you are never more than a long term tourist, with exactly zero rights, on an extension of stay.

 

Hard to know where it's all going, but hard to see it's going to get any more attractive any time soon

Edited January 26, 2019 by GinBoy2

[pieeyed]

Yeah I am thinking of moving on after 28 years in Thailand. The military ruling, visa bs and the strong baht are really making me rethink my retirement here. 

[BritManToo]

41 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Thailand is a country where expat "retirees" from all socioeconomic backgrounds almost always have no Thai friends. I wonder why. 

Probably because Thais don't have friends. Their Thai family take the place of our western friends concept. I think they have it right, and we western people have it wrong.

[bert bloggs]

The only problem i find here is the strength of the baht,luckily i have a loving wife and family , our house is "owned" by our son  , when i die my wife and son will still own it ,all our affairs are joint , both here and in the UK  just wish the baht would collapse ,lol

[Fex Bluse]

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Probably because Thais don't have friends. Their Thai family take the place of our western friends concept. I think they have it right, and we western people have it wrong.

Yeah, the whole "guanxi" concept. Thais generally form relationships for material benefit. If a person can help them in some way, they are keen. Otherwise, not so much. It encourages, though, a pervasive lack of trust amongst them, so I don't think they have it right in that regard. Thais generally trust ONLY their families. That's not the kind of society metric one should be proud of. 

 

Taking care of family? Sure, that is good, but I'm not so sure they are much better than western countries. 

[GinBoy2]

8 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Yeah, the whole "guanxi" concept. Thais generally form relationships for material benefit. If a person can help them in some way, they are keen. Otherwise, not so much. It encourages, though, a pervasive lack of trust amongst them, so I don't think they have it right in that regard. Thais generally trust ONLY their families. That's not the kind of society metric one should be proud of. 

 

Taking care of family? Sure, that is good, but I'm not so sure they are much better than western countries. 

Bit of a mixed bag there when referring to Thai's 'looking after family'

 

So if you ignore that fact that deadbeat Dads abandon their multiple kids without a second thought and move on to the next relationship, and usually more kids..

Women that drop off kids with Grandma for years while they are either working overseas or hooking in Pattaya or wherever.

 

I guess they do look after family!

[HuskerDo]

3 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

And you know this how?

Women are great and not so great everywhere in the world. Just like beautiful and not so attractive and good hearts and cold hearts. No country has "better" women than another. Silly thought.

[Ahab]

I wasn't asked but I don't think it is going down the "pan", whatever that means.

Edited January 26, 2019 by Ahab

[mok199]

2 hours ago, mikebell said:

It's the police that killed it for me: glaringly obvious corruption; racism; inadequate justice; road stick-ups; traffic fatalities whilst police fiddle.

Added to inability to own a house and there you have my view of Thailand where ex-pats are viewed as targets and not valued.  I'm looking at Vietnam.

I agree,corrupt selective enforcement of ethics,standards  and laws are disgusting, add to that the inflated thai baht.....XIN CHAO

[Pattaya46]

6 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

You need better sources. 

<image>

netflix-catalogs.pdf

You need updated sources 

Mine is updated daily

Yours is years old, not long after Netflix started in Thailand...

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

You're imagining problems that don't exist, not in China or Vietnam anyway.

Thailand is far more restrictive on speech.

Are there concentration (re education) camps for large numbers of ethnic minorities in Thailand?  I must have missed them. 

[HuskerDo]

4 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

Sure, I can agree that we should not expect things to be like our home countries. 

 

However, we CAN expect equal protections under law and we CAN expect to be treated with respect when we are so deserving.

 

We also should never surrender all our own beautiful culture and what makes us who we are. The Chinese, for example, import their culture wherever they emmigrate. Why shouldn't we expect similar flexibility for some of ours to be adopted? This is how the world has worked for more than a thousand years. 

 

Oh, and sometimes the people (many, not all) are, undeniably, stupid. 

No you shouldn't have to surrender your culture as long as you respect the culture of the country you are living in.

 

Hold off on the "stupid" comments tho as they probably look at you the same way. It's another country and not the one you grew up in. Accept that fact and be respectful of the people and culture and it will open many doors for you.

 

 

[marcusarelus]

1 minute ago, Pattaya46 said:

You need updated sources 

Mine is updated daily

Yours is years old, not long after Netflix started in Thailand...

https://unogs.com

[HuskerDo]

44 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Probably because Thais don't have friends. Their Thai family take the place of our western friends concept. I think they have it right, and we western people have it wrong.

"Thais don't have friends"... that is a stunningly bizarre and ridiculous comment. 

[marcusarelus]

4 minutes ago, mok199 said:

I agree,corrupt selective enforcement of ethics,standards  and laws are disgusting, add to that the inflated thai baht.....XIN CHAO

The Thai baht is not inflated.  Your currency is deflated.  Thailand does not have enough money to move currencies any substantial amount.

[Mac98]

I would think the oft mentioned horrors of living in the PC, screeching feminist West would keep most expats right here, even if prices do rise.

[mok199]

13 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

The Thai baht is not inflated.  Your currency is deflated.  Thailand does not have enough money to move currencies any substantial amount.

Thailand has been accused in the past  and is now on a USA watch list...can you help me understand ..how this is possible

Edited January 26, 2019 by mok199