wmlc Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 What new rules? The embassies stopped issuing income verification letters and immigration has become less strict now. They issued the new regulation of 12 months of monthly deposits to a Thai bank of 65,000 baht and issued a notice for immigration officials to be lenient and less strict and forgiving. So again, what new regulations are you referring to that have been set up to protect against illegal extensions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time Traveller Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 Define what an "illegal extension application" is. I highly doubt that there is such a thing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 3:23 PM, stanleycoin said: Maybe disband the current immigration work force. and start again. Any illegal extension can only be issue by them , so thats the real problem. Takes 2 to tango. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colabamumbai Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 Allow everyone a long term visa, five or ten years, but a maximum stay of one year, then exit and re-enter. Similar to what India offers. No money in the bank, no bullshit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olmate Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 1 hour ago, wmlc said: What new rules? The embassies stopped issuing income verification letters and immigration has become less strict now. They issued the new regulation of 12 months of monthly deposits to a Thai bank of 65,000 baht and issued a notice for immigration officials to be lenient and less strict and forgiving. So again, what new regulations are you referring to that have been set up to protect against illegal extensions? Suggest you read the other thread that’s running Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walinton Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 3:34 PM, KittenKong said: If Immigration never accepted bribes the agencies wouldn't bother offering them. you are very correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodojero Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 I would do exactly the same as my bank did with me to issue a credit card for myself. Just put a certain amount (e.g. 500K) on a bank account in the applicant's name and let the bank block it there. The money could be used to prove liquidity and as security for any illness/death if there is no insurance. This procedure saves the Immigration a lot of time of controlling work. How much the applicant spends on his/her daily life should be a personal matter. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classic Ray Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 I can’t really see the point of any financial requirement for extensions of visas based on marriage. Marriage to a Thai woman entitles you to apply for a work permit anyway if you have a company together, so there is no question of working illegally. Also the marriage would not last very long if the Thai wife was kept short of money. There is no financial requirement for a Thai man married to a Thai woman, so what’s the difference? Also making the requirement for retirement (1person) at 800,000 versus marriage (2 persons) at 400,000 makes it nonsense. If they are relying on the wife working, why make any financial restriction on the man? its all muddled thinking typical of Thai administration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owenm Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 At the moment only four countries income certificates are no longer available from their respective embassies. What would happen if Immigration decided in the future that NO income certificates would be accepted from any country and everyone had to abide by the new conditions with the new police order? We have seen that the goal posts are forever moving for retirees and those on marriage visas in Thailand. If the same rules were applied for all, then the other 50-70% who are here on low pensions and without the min 800k savings would also be in real trouble. I know a few Europeans who have invested 4-5 million Bht up on their farang Mc Mansions but are now cash poor and asset rich, relying on their pensions that fall under the 65k or 45k monthly min. Then everyone would fall under the same umbrella and have their futures threatened in LOS.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moe666 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 I guess I live a sheltered life 9 years living in Thailand extensions at BKK and Chiang Mai never been asked for tea money but of course all of my paper work is accurate and I do have the required money. Maybe the real problem is with the people applying for extensions. Never asked for tea money is my experience I cannot vouch for others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ancharee Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/3/2019 at 9:58 AM, JackThompson said: So, yes, there is a clique (apparently growing in power) who want us to Just Leave with our Thai families How do you leave with your Thai family if you don't meet the requirements with uk immigration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moe666 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 28 minutes ago, owenm said: At the moment only four countries income certificates are no longer available from their respective embassies. What would happen if Immigration decided in the future that NO income certificates would be accepted from any country and everyone had to abide by the new conditions with the new police order? We have seen that the goal posts are forever moving for retirees and those on marriage visas in Thailand. If the same rules were applied for all, then the other 50-70% who are here on low pensions and without the min 800k savings would also be in real trouble. I know a few Europeans who have invested 4-5 million Bht up on their farang Mc Mansions but are now cash poor and asset rich, relying on their pensions that fall under the 65k or 45k monthly min. Then everyone would fall under the same umbrella and have their futures threatened in LOS.. I really do not know what goal post you are talking about the current changes are the first official changes in more than 10 years. Yes the IO has always been able to ask for more info if he or she didn't feel what they had was sufficient. I would say people being asked for more info are in the minority as compared to those who apply and are approved with the info they produce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worrab Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 10:34 AM, KiChakayan said: Proof of health cover effective in Thailand should be added to the requirements. Members keep coming up with this as a requirement. But keep forgetting that either due to age or pre existing conditions, are unable to get insurance. I am one of those unfortunates but do have enough in funds to cover any hospital stay if needed. Or, according to your thoughts, we all have to leave the country where we are now living. It would be a different story if, and it is a big if, there was a sensibly priced insurance for all retirees no matter their situation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naamblar2014 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/3/2019 at 6:19 AM, dcnx said: The few times I did have to go to immigration, I used an agent and they told me to be there at a certain time, so I showed up and they walked me right to a desk (no waiting), we did our thing and I walked out. 3 - 5 mins tops and cut in front of everyone. No questions from the IO and no hassle. That’s what you’re paying for. But it’s rare I even have to go. They do everything for me. Worth every baht, which actually isn’t much. What you are paying for is my time and all the other immigration customers who are waiting in queue. Thank you, you and your time is obviously more important than everyone else. Like others say it is most annoying when you see an agent walking up with 20 or so passports or a with a Client so he can get their photo taken in the immigration office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norfolkc Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 Why are there so many experts on Thai immigration on here do they have nothing better to do between raising fish and chickens than giving there so called expert opinion on telling the Thai officials how to run there operation get a life it is like Coronation street on here with people spending all day running each other down is that all you have to do all day with your life what a sad bunch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worrab Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/3/2019 at 2:36 AM, RJRS1301 said: My retirement to Thailand has been brief, Things are not informed about firstly beyond the 90 day reporting. (a)requirement neither the Embassy here nor anyone else informed me that even with a one year Visa I would have to repeatedly show funds in a Thai bank account at the 90 day reporting period I had already ( I thought) established my financial credentials, when being granted the 12 month visa. (2) Difficulty in attempting opening a Thai bank account, tried several branches of several banks, all different rulings and requirements, including having to show 12 month lease of condo ( had only taken out a 6 month lease to keep options open) , outrageous fees to access own funds. Lack of internet banking options,( we are in the internet age for gosh sake) I was prepared to use significant funds into the local economy to lead a reasonable life in LOS, alas this will not occur. 2 observations here. 1. If the new rules are implemented, there would only be a requirement to show bank account at the first 90 day report after being granted an Extension. Then a full year of bank records at the next extension to show you did not dip below the 400k limit in between. I still feel this is not going to happen because of the sheer logistics for the IOs. 2. I was able to open an account with Bangkok Bank when I had the IO visa whist waiting to convert to an Extension of Stay based on Retirement. And I have good internet banking with them for not only my accounts but the wife as well. Actually opened the account in the branch opposite Interchange 21 Building in Bangkok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanleycoin Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 2 hours ago, Colabamumbai said: Allow everyone a long term visa, five or ten years, but a maximum stay of one year, then exit and re-enter. Similar to what India offers. No money in the bank, no bullshit. I agree, but Exiting every year, falls into Bullshit category for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanleycoin Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 2 hours ago, Time Traveller said: Define what an "illegal extension application" is. I highly doubt that there is such a thing It would be the exact opposite of a legal one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Russell17au Posted February 4, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2019 There is only one way to reduce the corruption in the Royal Thai Police and that includes the Immigration section. Pay them a reasonable wage and supply them with the equipement that they need to do their jobs properly, the same as the other countries of the world. If paid reasonable pay then no need for brown envelope, but if after paid a reasonable pay rate they still take brown envelope, immediate dismissal and charges of corruption with a jail term. This does work in other countries 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattaya46 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 37 minutes ago, worrab said: 2 observations here. 1. If the new rules are implemented, there would only be a requirement to show bank account at the first 90 day report after being granted an Extension.// How do you know that? Written nowhere AFAIK, and many of us don't do 90D reports at immigration. High probability the only checking of balance will be at the next extension only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Naamblar2014 Posted February 4, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) Some good suggestions have been put forward. In reality though there really was nothing wrong with the current systems prior to this latest change which only seems to impact negatively on retirees. The recent change on bank deposits, effectively only gives retirees access to 400k for living expenses and then only after 5 months of seasoning. The only thing that is needed is to stop io's from behavior that is corrupt in nature. The approval/denial decision is made by immigration, so this is the only point at which an illegal application can proceed. How to stop that behavior is the question to be asked and that is where the attention must be focused. Corrupt and greedy officials bad for Thailand, honest and diligent officials good for Thailand. Perhaps that should be a motto to help Thailand move forward. Edited February 4, 2019 by Naamblar2014 wrong term used 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheshiremusicman Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 5:26 PM, Sheryl said: Every Imm office i have ever used - a total of 4 different ones over the years - has physically examined the original bank book as well as asking for a copy. I can say that my bank passbook was very closely examined when I recently went to renew my retirement visa at the Hua-Hin Immigration office, not just a cursory glance. I noticed, that there were some new rules for people who have had 'Retirement Visa's' issued for over 10 years consecutively and my understanding is that if you meet this criteria then you only need to have 200,000 in your bank seasoned for 2 months prior to your application, but you have to be over 60 years old. Has anybody else interpreted this new ruling as I have? One other criteria is that your first retirement visa must have been obtained prior to October 1998. The Hua-Hin Immigration office is moving well out of town (today I think), but I for one cannot see the sense in locating the Immigration so far out of the centre of HH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 8 minutes ago, cheshiremusicman said: I noticed, that there were some new rules for people who have had 'Retirement Visa's' issued for over 10 years consecutively and my understanding is that if you meet this criteria then you only need to have 200,000 in your bank seasoned for 2 months prior to your application, but you have to be over 60 years old. Has anybody else interpreted this new ruling as I have? One other criteria is that your first retirement visa must have been obtained prior to October 1998. That is not new. It has been in every police order since 1998. You would of had to of been 60 or 55 years old in October of 1998 and then kept getting extensions based upon retirement since 1998. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoshowJones Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 6:24 PM, Mavideol said: easy said than done, but good idea If that was done, there would be no agents left, and perhaps the odd IO. thus no more 90 day reporting.???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoshowJones Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/2/2019 at 10:20 PM, madmen said: On 2/2/2019 at 6:18 PM, Vacuum said: You'd need a WP for doing that. I'm sure an agent could organize that as well for a rather large fee Why use an agent? Do it yourself for much less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, scorecard said: Takes 2 to tango. Three, in many cases. Honest applicant denied legit-extension by an IO Agent who takes 10x the cost and splits proceeds with the IO Foreigner who can pay the agent or leave the country (or go to a Consulate for an honest Visa instead, as I did) 4 hours ago, Classic Ray said: I can’t really see the point of any financial requirement for extensions of visas based on marriage. ... Also making the requirement for retirement (1person) at 800,000 versus marriage (2 persons) at 400,000 makes it nonsense. If they are relying on the wife working, why make any financial restriction on the man? Neither can I, because ... Quote ... the marriage would not last very long if the Thai wife was kept short of money. ... anywhere on Earth, with any woman of any nationality. Men not willing to accept the terms of biological/sociological reality can join the MGTOW movement, and enjoy the company of inflatable dolls and such. Quote Marriage to a Thai woman entitles you to apply for a work permit anyway if you have a company together, so there is no question of working illegally. According to news reports (pointed out to me), some people from poor nations have come in and faked marriage, then worked jobs like "Underground consumer-electronics salesman." But none of the hurdles added to a marriage-based extension affect this - are only designed to force applicants to agents, where those hurdles go away. The only way to know, is to visit the home and see if they really live together there - especially in the first year. Quote There is no financial requirement for a Thai man married to a Thai woman, so what’s the difference? The idea that men and women are completely interchangeable is a new idea, which apparently (and thankfully) has not been adopted here. Quote its all muddled thinking typical of Thai administration. I would not say "muddled" at all - in fact, becoming more clear every day. The posters saying the authorities want to cull a bunch of us from the country appear to have been correct, after all. 3 hours ago, ancharee said: How do you leave with your Thai family if you don't meet the requirements with uk immigration Good question. Clearly, those with the mind-set of the IO quoted don't care what happens to some "traitor wife" that married a foreigner. 3 hours ago, worrab said: ... if, there was a sensibly priced insurance for all retirees no matter their situation. Who should pay to subsidize your health-insurance and why? Actually, I have posted a solution to this many times, which is "stabilize and send-home" policy for all visitors of any duration. Longer-stayers could pay less/mo via a deductible covered by 100K in the bank (locked-account), which would include return-flight costs. If everyone bought it, it would be dirt-cheap, so a little "burden sharing" would not be a problem. 3 hours ago, norfolkc said: Why are there so many experts on Thai immigration on here do they have nothing better to do between raising fish and chickens No, but there is another forum for those folks on this site. It seems all concerned about these matters are presumed to be either mongers, or dirt-poor farmers. Edited February 4, 2019 by JackThompson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 1 hour ago, cheshiremusicman said: I can say that my bank passbook was very closely examined when I recently went to renew my retirement visa at the Hua-Hin Immigration office, not just a cursory glance. Yes, because you applied in person, and paid only 1900 Baht. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazygreg44 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 5 hours ago, scorecard said: Takes 2 to tango. there is no illegality in the "tango". Immigration law allows the leniency. Refer and re-read my post no. 144 and a few which follow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacessit Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 (edited) On 2/2/2019 at 4:21 PM, Sheryl said: No matter what rules are developed, agents can circumvent them - but only if corrupt IOs and/or bank staff cooperate. The solution is not hard to understand, there is just no political will to implement it. 1. Outlaw Visa agents and enforce this. 2. Dismiss corrupt IOs. There are visa agents who operate within the law, and facilitate extensions for those of us who find it difficult to cope with the arcane multiple paperwork required. It would be a first. AFAIK most other countries in the world have visa agents as a legitimate part of the workforce. No problem with No. 2. Edited February 4, 2019 by Lacessit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoshowJones Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 On 2/3/2019 at 7:30 AM, Rally123 said: Does that make you feel smug or important? It's people like you that cause the problems that we're now facing. Long term expats will now have to leave, breaking up families, because of the likes of yous. Maybe what we need is a corruption hotline where we can report 'Immigration Fraud'? Wrong, it is greed and the way long term expats are treated by those who make up the immigration rules who are to blame, ie, why force somebody who is married to a Thai national to go to Laos for a multi entry visa based on marriage costing them 5000 Bt. plus the equivilant of 35 US dollars, plus hotel and traveling expenses? Why not just charge 5000 Bt at their local IO, and save them all the expense and hassle of going to laos? That is just one example of how some long term expats are treated here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Recommended Posts