Must Read Holding the balance: Phuket Immigration clarifies new rules on retirement visas to start March 1

[ginjag]

2 minutes ago, JingjoDave said:

The "spirit" was to get honesty in the system and force out visa scammers , border runners and other illegals

To my mind there is nothing wrong with the "BORDER runner" scammers and illegals ,yes.  Why would a border runner be stopped from doing this, if he re enters and is spending money here ??  same arriving on a flight and getting 30 days free visa,  why not  ??  why limit this person to how many visits.

[DJ54]

23 hours ago, nasa123 said:

No one need Embassy/Consulate letter no more in Phuket, that what Phuket Immigration says.

According to the US Embassy Immigration said the Income Affadavit will be valid for 6 months from issue date. I’m only

relaying what I’ve read and was told at the Embassy.

 

Just read through the entire article and it suggests different types 

of Visa for those with Thai family / supporting a Thai family.

 

Also anyone living here full time 1998 and prior requirements stay 

the same as when got their first visa / or extensions.

 

Article suggests going to your local immigration office and see what is offered and Best suits you. 

 

We have a wealth of visa/extension to stay on TV. Hopefully for those who want to stay can find a suitable fit. 

[Joe Mcseismic]

2 hours ago, peter14 said:

Cambodia...is getting richer by the days. Happier there.  No one really care about Visa ither there and it's much cheaper     Gave up on Thailand long ago ....

My own theory as to why rules are being tightened, is that the expat resident population has exploded in the last 15 years. Go anywhere in Thailand now and there will be foreigners. Go to any small village and there will be some foreigner living not too far away. In the 90's it was rare to see foreigners in the cities of Esaan, now there are many.

Immigration are just culling the herd by trying to keep the richest ones, the ones that have the least chance of being a burden on the State.

Edited February 17, 2019 by Joe Mcseismic

[kg1947]

By emphasizing " Financial procedures " ..... the average pensioners on " fixed income " will lose and must leave the Kingdom .

ANY CRIMINAL - will be able to play with rules and come up with ANY AMOUNT REQUIRED as deposit or better , they can just buy the THAILAND ELITE CARD and live happily ever after here .

Maybe this group is the prime objective of this policy.

Those formulating this policy are out of touch with reality of how pensioners from Western Europe & North America live their lifes.

Might as well make a new regulation that each person who apply for long term stay must DEPOSIT

THB 10,000,000.- in a THAI Bank to cover possible medical emergencies  ?

Kick out all PENSIONERS on ( minimum ) fixed income .... maybe we should move to Laos & Cambodia .

But we choose Thailand - because we like it here .

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

Edited February 17, 2019 by kg1947
additional text

[seancbk]

On 2/16/2019 at 1:34 PM, smedly said:

well that's cleared that up - not

 

I am under 60yo and have been using the 800k balance for the last 5 years so do the new rules apply to me or not

 

more confusion

If you've been using the 800K balance just keep using it.   How is that confusing?

[Felt 35]

5 hours ago, Such a Hairy Guy said:

thanks, I hope you are right. But as usual it may depend on the individual officer's interpretation.

I plan to use embassy letter + updated bankbook and a bank letter which confirm the amount coming in monthly. Unfortunately do I have a couple of months since last extension (last year) where I have dipped under 65K due to visit in home country and are unsure if I shall transfer more monthly from now on to next extension (august) or if Immigration will show a bit leniency because the new regulation start from this year? Anyway after 1-2 months with new rules I hope I have got a feeling about what Immigration will accept and if only 800K is accepted placed in a bank I should have time to scrape that together before extension.

Edited February 17, 2019 by Felt 35

[indepth]

2 hours ago, xylophone said:

Thanks all the same, but my two examples are enough as that's really all I worry about.........anyway automatic transfers take the '"remembering" out of the equation!

Keep your eye on the exchange rate. If it crashed overnight as your transfer is taking place and its at he end of the month, you will have to start all over again, another 12 months. Now that is something I will be worrying about a lot.

[sambum]

On 2/16/2019 at 1:43 PM, smedly said:

The only issue I have is keeping the balance at 800k for 6 months instead of 3, the rest I was doing anyway

 

I fail to see any practical advantage of the 6month balance of 800k - what is the point of it

The point is that the THAI banks have your dosh for an additional 3 months to make THEM some more interest!!!

[wgdanson]

I read the full article where the man says

 

The Jan 18 order, issued by Immigration Bureau Deputy Commissioner Maj Gen Sarayut Sangonpokai, also made special mention that the new provisions specifically do not apply to:

 

- People supporting Thai families.

 

It says that different Visas are available for such foreigners.

 

Anyone know what those visas are please, and how to get one.

 

[Longcut]

52 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

My own theory as to why rules are being tightened, is that the expat resident population has exploded in the last 15 years. Go anywhere in Thailand now and there will be foreigners. Go to any small village and there will be some foreigner living not too far away. In the 90's it was rare to see foreigners in the cities of Esaan, now there are many.

Immigration are just culling the herd by trying to keep the richest ones, the ones that have the least chance of being a burden on the State.

Really? I remember a time when there were over 50,000 in Isaan alone.

[Joe Mcseismic]

2 minutes ago, Longcut said:

Really? I remember a time when there were over 50,000 in Isaan alone.

When was that and how did you come up with that number?

Were they all on retirement visas?

Edited February 17, 2019 by Joe Mcseismic

[CARLO BALDASSARRE]

What happened to the people over the age of 60 ...wasn't it 200,000 baht in the bank ....heard it on the radio ...

 

Edited February 17, 2019 by CARLO BALDASSARRE

[Papa Goose]

As someone who is planing a retirement in the LoS, theses slightly confusing and muddle messages do cause a little uncertainty, especially if your situation is not exactly standard. If your income is from a business that declares it's income annually, but that income when divided by 12 (on paper) exceeds the the 65K monthly income requirement... would that still qualify? We are considering selling them (they aren't in our home country, and we wouldn't settle there) setting up a company in Thailand buying 3 small condos for rental and a small house for us, would that change the income requirement, or would that then mean we aren't retiring? And for the 800k on deposit or 65k per month, is that per person or is the figure amended for a couple, as a couple would only pay 1 rent (or not if you have bought) and living costs don't actually double?

[Longcut]

2 minutes ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

When was that and how did you come up with that number?

Were they all on retirement visas?

Nope. They were all wearing U.S. military uniforms.

[CARLO BALDASSARRE]

6 minutes ago, Papa Goose said:

As someone who is planing a retirement in the LoS, theses slightly confusing and muddle messages do cause a little uncertainty, especially if your situation is not exactly standard. If your income is from a business that declares it's income annually, but that income when divided by 12 (on paper) exceeds the the 65K monthly income requirement... would that still qualify? We are considering selling them (they aren't in our home country, and we wouldn't settle there) setting up a company in Thailand buying 3 small condos for rental and a small house for us, would that change the income requirement, or would that then mean we aren't retiring? And for the 800k on deposit or 65k per month, is that per person or is the figure amended for a couple, as a couple would only pay 1 rent (or not if you have bought) and living costs don't actually double?

wow ..haven't you been reading any of the posts ....or are you just  not sure of the sites forums ......spend sometime on the site buddy ...an you will learn alot .... and work out the bullshit from the wingers and the genuine ..it's hard work ......good luck ..

 

[Bullie]

On 2/16/2019 at 1:43 PM, smedly said:

The only issue I have is keeping the balance at 800k for 6 months instead of 3, the rest I was doing anyway

 

I fail to see any practical advantage of the 6month balance of 800k - what is the point of it

The advantage is that avter 3 months they can check the bank balance again - or hit you with another 20,000 baht vacilitating vee, ovcourse. Its an overall win vor immigration, they are doubling their provits!!

Edited February 17, 2019 by Bullie

[smedly]

21 minutes ago, sambum said:

The point is that the THAI banks have your dosh for an additional 3 months to make THEM some more interest!!!

I have maintained a balance above 400k for years, I top it up once a year for 12 month extension 

[Shocked farang]

On 2/16/2019 at 1:49 PM, farangx said:

I am working towards reducing my time in Thailand to less than 5 months in a year that will allow me to avoid extensions and 90 days reporting altogether.

 

That´s really the best. There are many other fantastic places to spend time and it´s terrible to have to show up every 90 days, having to figure out Visa extensions or having 800 thousand Baht in a bank account, it´s better to be just a tourist and when time is up just leave. That´s what airports are for. Congrats.

[JackThompson]

22 hours ago, madmitch said:

I'm assuming that if you renew or even get a new extension on or before 28th February 2019 you will get another whole year on the existing rules. though of course this has yet to be clarified, along with additional reporting requirements, if any.

 

Could be a busy couple of weeks at the Immigration Offices if this is the case!

Some offices are already reported as "enforcing" the new rules on current applicants - even re-setting 90-day reports and stating one must show bank-books on their 90-day report due in 3 mo after application. 

 

18 hours ago, Thailand Outcast said:

This is my idea also, but for sure they will change the rules to stop the same people they make go away, coming back, because they lose money from them to push them to tourist visa.

They already covered that, by enforcing unpublished/unspecified "time here before" limits on Tourist Visa use at many entry-points.  Since no such rule/limit on time exists to use for the rejection-stamp (have to specify a listed reason from the Immigration Act), they just claim you don't have money, while refusing to specify/accept any way to show otherwise.

 

5 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Married visa: minimum 40,000 baht per month or 400,000 baht in a Thai bank for 2 months prior and 3 months after application.

I thought the official said it didn't apply in Thai-family cases.

 

3 hours ago, nchuckle said:

The marriage visa does NOT require you to hold 400k 3 months afterwards. Some offices ,as previously ,want you to maintain that amount in the account during the 30 day under consideration period until the visa extension is confirmed.

Correct.  So 1 or 2 months after applying for the extension.  The rules only say 2 mo prior - they are adding "back door" extra seasoning this way, which is dishonest.

 

5 hours ago, mikebike said:

There is no entitlement to reside in country other than your home country. We live here by the grace of the Thai govt. and they have a sovereign right to make whatever rules they choose. Changes in global economics and currency are not Thailand’s responsibility...

But what they choose to do tells you a lot about how they view us.

Edited February 17, 2019 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

On 2/16/2019 at 2:14 PM, stephenterry said:

800K two months before and 3 months after = 5 months. The point of it is to (maybe) identify those who pay agents for the loan and at a cost. I understand that borrrowing money is not a crime, but the interest cost of holding it a further 3 months (=c.10k extra at c.5%) will adversely affect some who do not have the necessary funds.

Agents flash the money in/out of the account on the same day.  No seasoning is required if you use immigration's partner-agents.  I fail to see how adding more seasoning changes this at all.

 

As to loans - yes, where agents are more expensive (Phuket and CM), some alternate non-agent lenders may have been able to provide a cheaper alternative.  This will ensure those clients switch to immigration's partner-agents, ensuring they get a cut of the loot.

 

On 2/16/2019 at 2:14 PM, stephenterry said:

But that does seem unfair and heavy-handed. From the article, you could still use the combination method, if that's a better option and probably that flexibility will become the most favoured.

For example, 400k stuck in a Thai bank account for one year, earning interest of 8k, plus income of 33k per month sent to a Thai bank account. 

If the 400K min is enforced on combos - then, yes.  Any additional income above about 33K/mo would become superfluous.

[mindfulness]

Nationalists have such a repugnant mental disorder. However compassion has to be applied or one would be a hypocrite to those that do such corrupt methods towards humanity. 

 

‘I’m I free to travel ? Only with a Passport, Only with a Passport’ !!! 

- child ‘King in New York’.

 

Well since that movie a 101 things of other power flexing ideas. 

[mindfulness]

Just now, mindfulness said:

Nationalists have such a repugnant mental disorder. However compassion has to be applied or one would be a hypocrite to those that do such corrupt methods towards humanity. 

 

‘I’m I free to travel ? Only with a Passport, Only with a Passport’ !!! 

- child ‘King in New York’.

 

Well since that movie a 101 things of other power flexing ideas. 

Ideology f f s !!! 

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, CARLO BALDASSARRE said:

What happened to the people over the age of 60 ...wasn't it 200,000 baht in the bank ....heard it on the radio ...

 

You probably did hear or read about all of the requirements to qualify.

 

[rexall]

3 hours ago, ImJustHangin said:

I am Canadian. Luckily my embassy is still issuing affidavits. 

So Im still on the 65K/mo plan. 

So to be clear I still dont have to keep any  funds in the bank?

It sounds like you (Canadians) may continue to use the affidavit method as before. I hope that is correct, for your sake. It would be fascinating to know why the Canadians are still choosing to issue the affidavits.  HOWEVER, to the extent that you can, I would have a back-up plan because after throwing a hand grenade into the box and shaking everything up, who the hell knows what the hell Imm will ask you for next extension.

[bert bloggs]

There is going to be lots of pissed off immigration officers when ,lots of us change to a marriage visa ,

[Trollmann]

Phuket immigration says it would be better for many to use a supporting thai family visa than retirement visa.

I myself, and i think maybe 99% of the people on retirement visa are in fact supporting thai girlfriends and hers family already. I really can not see why the money requrement are lower for those that are married. For the farang that have absolutely no relationship and doesnt have to support anyone he are supposed to be spending 65 000 baht alone on himself?

Edited February 17, 2019 by Trollmann

[rexall]

2 hours ago, Jiggo said:

What is wrong with these people?  800,000, 3 months before, 3 months after and 400,000 the rest of the year,  unless first application 2 months before, 3 months after and 400,000 the rest of the year. For those staying, enjoy your life with millions of Chinamen and woman on route lol

And the joke is that originally--at least as I understood it--the 800K was to live on.  If you have to keep it in the bank, you are not living on it. If you are not living on it, then how are you supporting yourself? You are not allowed to work.  Of course, implicit in my argument is that it doesn't makes sense, and making sense is just not important here, it is just not an issue one way or the other.

[sfokevin]

3 hours ago, ImJustHangin said:

I am Canadian. Luckily my embassy is still issuing affidavits. 

So Im still on the 65K/mo plan. 

So to be clear I still dont have to keep any  funds in the bank?

Yes they will be accepted but one could read the Phuket’s latest “clarification” to mean that in addition to the embassy letter you will need to submit additional proof being a bank statements/bankbook (Presumably Thai) showing the 65k coming into Thailand...

 

“Of course any financial statements from banks and copies of bankbook records proving this income already being received should be provided”

 

If this is true the affidavit is essentially useless... 

[luckyluke]

4 hours ago, Mavideol said:

elections are suppose to take place March 24 or around there, let's assume (for one moment) the current (junta) ruler is not the chosen one, will all this new rules still apply or do we have a (slim) chance of getting them changed

You have a positive approach of things, as you expect that if there are other rulers after the election they will automatically create new directives which will be better ( not worse than ) for the expats.

 

 

[JackThompson]

This statement from Phuket was in regards to retirement, but ...

 

On 2/16/2019 at 2:21 PM, Christophers200 said:

For now. Savannakhet is unique in SE Asia so don't expect that situation to last

No, also Vietnam (HCMC for sure, not positive on Hanoi).  But, I agree, those making big money form agent-apps are probably spreading some cash around to get that shut that down.  It's not as if the ones pushing for "tightening" care about the families being supported on 35K/mo, who will lose everything.

 

23 hours ago, sumrit said:

And, if too many people do that as a way of getting around the new rules, that option is likely to be closed, or at least severely curtailed, meaning it will cause problems for those who genuinely need to use Savannakhet as a one-off instead of having to go back to their home country.

If they allow embassy-letters there (reported that KL embassy-letters work in Penang), then it's still do-able, with a stopover in Vientiane to get the letter, first - if you have the gross-income required.  This would still avoid the damage done by the "must import all" due to the loss of embassy-letters (for many of us) to use at immigration offices in Thailand.

 

3 hours ago, superal said:

Do they issue retirement visas ? I was told only marriage visas .

Single-entry - definitely.  It is used where folk's local imm-office makes the Non-O stamp needed as a pre-requisite to a Non-Imm-Non-O based extension difficult to impossible.

 

Some have reported getting the Multi-1-Year there for retirement - with financials, though.  We don't have many reports of this, though.

 

8 minutes ago, bert bloggs said:

There is going to be lots of pissed off immigration officers when ,lots of us change to a marriage visa ,

Expect them to make it a nightmare.  That was my and my wife's experience, even before these latest changes.