Thailand vs. Malaysia, some observations

[YogaVeg]

3 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I'm old (mid-60s) and get falling down drunk every day.

Never worry about medical care, no insurance, not had any problems that a few stitches won't cure. 

Death is coming and I welcome it.

I'm sure you are a lot of fun but you are the last person I would go to for health care advice 

????

[YogaVeg]

Since we are comparing Thailand to Malaysia ????

I've got one for you:

 

Credit Cards.

 

Thailand -

Good luck finding a store,  budget hotel, or restaurant who will accept credit, and if you do, you are gonna pay 3-5% juice on it almost every time, unless you are spending big. 

 

Malaysia-

almost every place takes CC's and I never once paid a percentage on top nor had to deal with mandatory minimums.

Edited March 2, 2019 by YogaVeg

[marcusarelus]

4 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

Since we are comparing Thailand to Malaysia ????

I've got one for you:

 

Credit Cards.

 

Thailand -

Good luck finding a store,  budget hotel, or restaurant who will accept credit, and if you do, you are gonna pay 3-5% juice on it almost every time, unless you are spending big. 

 

Malaysia-

almost every place takes CC's and I never once paid a percentage on top nor had to deal with mandatory minimums.

What?  Thailand?  Lotus, Tops, Home Pro?  8000 7/11's in Thailand.  Have you ever been to Thailand?  Really? 

[lopburi3]

9 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

Thailand -

Good luck finding a store,  budget hotel, or restaurant who will accept credit, and if you do, you are gonna pay 3-5% juice on it almost every time, unless you are spending big. 

Outdated information by a least a decade or two as far as I can tell.  Everyone seems to use cards here (except me) these days (at least always the person in front of me)..  

[YogaVeg]

Just now, marcusarelus said:

What?  Thailand?  Lotus, Tops, Home Pro?  8000 7/11's in Thailand.  Have you ever been to Thailand?  Really? 

7-11 mandatory minimum.

I don't know if they juice it.

Lotus, Tops, Home Pro = didn't shop there.

I traveled Thailand for several months but didn't live there as a homebody. I spent my money at budget hotels, restaurants, small shops, and travel (the exact same things I spent my money on in Malaysia).

 

And sorry to point out the obvious, but a mindful read of the words I wrote would have already informed you of this and you wouldn't have to ask such 'counter-intuituve' rather antagonistic questions. ????

[YogaVeg]

4 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Outdated information by a least a decade or two as far as I can tell.  Everyone seems to use cards here (except me) these days (at least always the person in front of me)..  

Sorry bud but my first visit to Thailand was 2018 and you can read the previous post for further explanation. ????

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

7-11 mandatory minimum.

I don't know if they juice it.

Lotus, Tops, Home Pro = didn't shop there.

I traveled Thailand for several months but didn't live there as a homebody. I spent my money at budget hotels, restaurants, small shops, and travel (the exact same things I spent my money on in Malaysia).

 

And sorry to point out the obvious, but a mindful read of the words I wrote would have already informed you of this and you wouldn't have to ask such 'counter-intuituve' rather antagonistic questions. ????

In the past year I have not been to a store or restaurant that does not take credit cards.  I've lived in Thailand for 20 years.  You are 100% wrong.  Who doesn't shop at Lotus or 7/11? 

[lopburi3]

15 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

I spent my money at budget hotels, restaurants, small shops

That may explain your view - normal hotels/restaurants and stores all take cards these days (in the past it was an issue) - mostly places trying to avoid the tax man do not these days.

[YogaVeg]

7 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

In the past year I have not been to a store or restaurant that does not take credit cards.  I've lived in Thailand for 20 years.  You are 100% wrong.  Who doesn't shop at Lotus or 7/11? 

I shop at 7-11 all the time, for water lol. They have a mandatory minimum (again I have to say it) ????.

Lotus, nope. Not convenient location usually and for a traveler who lives in hotels and doesn't have a kitchen, what is there? Chips, water? Laundry detergent, nope, you get that in 5 baht bags at 7-11 when you are a traveler.

 

Almost exclusively I eat at vegetarian restaurants or street stands, the meals cost 40-60 baht, and no way do they take CC's.

 

You really should try getting out of your comfort zone for a minute and realize that not everyone lives like you.

 

I am conveying my experience the way I lived, and I rarely got to use CC's in Thailand whereas I used them exclusively in Malaysia.

 

You, Sir, are 100% wrong with regards to my experience and out of touch with how many real budget tourists live and spend their money apparently. 

[marcusarelus]

20 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

I shop at 7-11 all the time, for water lol. They have a mandatory minimum (again I have to say it) ????.

Lotus, nope. Not convenient location usually and for a traveler who lives in hotels and doesn't have a kitchen, what is there? Chips, water? Laundry detergent, nope, you get that in 5 baht bags at 7-11 when you are a traveler.

 

Almost exclusively I eat at vegetarian restaurants or street stands, the meals cost 40-60 baht, and no way do they take CC's.

 

You really should try getting out of your comfort zone for a minute and realize that not everyone lives like you.

 

I am conveying my experience the way I lived, and I rarely got to use CC's in Thailand whereas I used them exclusively in Malaysia.

 

You, Sir, are 100% wrong with regards to my experience and out of touch with how many real budget tourists live and spend their money apparently. 

I've never seen a sign of a minimum at 7/11.    Lotus is just like 7/11 - Lotus Express.  Lotus has cooked hot meals to go and drinks for the traveler.  Lotus has a large fresh baked goods section .  Have you never been in one? 

 

Sorry.  I don't think you have ever been to Thailand. 

Edited March 2, 2019 by marcusarelus

[YogaVeg]

6 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

That may explain your view - normal hotels/restaurants and stores all take cards these days (in the past it was an issue) - mostly places trying to avoid the tax man do not these days.

I also sometimes go to what you call "normal" restaurants and hotels (I call them "unnecessarily expensive").

 

Yes, indeed, higher end places are more likely to take CC's,

At a 3-5% premium in Thailand!

 

Which is my whole point actually, and what I originally said.

 

Thailand= IF they take a card (and lower-end places don't) THEN they charge you an additional 3-5% juice, always. Train tickets, buses, ferries, all ding you extra for using a cc.

 

Malaysia= they all take cards and NO percentage is charged. 

 

That's my experience. Yours obviously differs. Sounds like we lead very different lives.

 

I'm happier eating at 40 baht vegetarian restaurants than I am paying 500 baht for a meal with smaller portions and meat products.

Not having a kitchen really cuts down on the usefulness of grocery shopping lol.

I enjoy paying 300 baht for a fan room and consider 2000 baht rooms a waste of resources. 

 

The more I skimp the longer I get to play.

 

 

[marcusarelus]

1 minute ago, YogaVeg said:

I also sometimes go to what you call "normal" restaurants and hotels (I call them "unnecessarily expensive").

 

Yes, indeed, higher end places are more likely to take CC's,

At a 3-5% premium in Thailand!

 

Which is my whole point actually, and what I originally said.

 

Thailand= IF they take a card (and lower-end places don't) THEN they charge you an additional 3-5% juice, always. Train tickets, buses, ferries, all ding you extra for using a cc.

 

Malaysia= they all take cards and NO percentage is charged. 

 

That's my experience. Yours obviously differs. Sounds like we lead very different lives.

 

I'm happier eating at 40 baht vegetarian restaurants than I am paying 500 baht for a meal with smaller portions and meat products.

Not having a kitchen really cuts down on the usefulness of grocery shopping lol.

I enjoy paying 300 baht for a fan room and consider 2000 baht rooms a waste of resources. 

 

The more I skimp the longer I get to play.

 

 

You stay in a 300 baht room and try to use a credit card for a 40 baht street meal?  You find a lot of vegetarian street outlets?  Aw come on.  India maybe but not in Thailand. 

[YogaVeg]

8 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

I've never seen a sign of a minimum at 7/11.    Lotus is just like 7/11 - Lotus Express.  Lotus has cooked hot meals to go and drinks for the traveler.  Lotus has large fresh baked goods.  Have you never been in one? 

 

Sorry.  I don't think you have ever been to Thailand. 

You are embarrassing yourself. 

 

Next time you go in a 7-11, open your eyes or ask.

Then take a slice of humble pie ????

 

I wouldn't consider putting 7-11 crap food in my body, the only thing I ever buy at 7-11 is water and nuts and maybe a toothbrush or a wine cooler; and if you say Lotus sells the same garbage I believe you ????

Hot cooked meals to go ????

 

I eat brown rice and vegetables and fruit smoothies exclusively.

 

Good luck with your hotdogs. At least medical care is cheap, huh?

 

[marcusarelus]

12 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

You are embarrassing yourself. 

 

Next time you go in a 7-11, open your eyes or ask.

Then take a slice of humble pie ????

 

I wouldn't consider putting 7-11 crap food in my body, the only thing I ever buy at 7-11 is water and nuts and maybe a toothbrush or a wine cooler; and if you say Lotus sells the same garbage I believe you ????

Hot cooked meals to go ????

 

I eat brown rice and vegetables and fruit smoothies exclusively.

 

Good luck with your hotdogs. At least medical care is cheap, huh?

 

You really should try visiting Thailand.  It is a nice country and they have a two week (or so) vegetarian holiday maybe you could schedule your trip for that time period. 

Edited March 2, 2019 by marcusarelus

[YogaVeg]

7 minutes ago, vinniekintana said:

Sorry, off topic, but where do you get your vegetarian meals?

I can only think of a couple of thai dishes other than those ghastly chinese 'kin jeh' places with the fake sausages etc

I'm happy to share my finds and I do appreciate a mindful soul with genuine interest asking in a polite manner...

 

Chiang Mai-

The Sathaphon is ripe with excellent options:

-Sangwiroon is a deli-style vegan mom and pop place that opens early morning and sells out by like 2 pm.

40-60 baht plates and brown rice

-Matae Veg is a mom and son place, deli style, brown rice 40 baht, open until 5pm

-Imm Aim vegetarian is a spendier vegan place that has black rice and really healthy but bland food and fantastic smoothies. Wifi too. You will drop 200 baht for a plate and a smoothie here.

-J Station vegetables is on the northern moat road and a lot like Sangwiroon open for dinner. 

-Starfruit smoothies uses organics and has an epic avocado smoothie, like 70 baht.

-the juice house has 25 baht smoothies in several mixes and will honor your "no sugar" request, I went here daily.

 

On the NE side of old city, are a string of open-late vegetarian (and meat) places that run 80-100 baht and several 300-400 baht hotels, it's a good part of town if a little touristy.

Check out

-Khun Kaes smoothies, 40 baht and open till 7pm.

-Pepperaint is open way late, has 80 baht vegan meals, and makes fresh pizzas too even gluten free.

-May Kadie is walking distance outside the moat and she's a chef and a cooking school and restaurant all in 1. Fantastic vegan.

 

Night bazaar has some good options, like vegan pad Thai and Curry's with tofu.

 

I've noticed the trend is: if they are strict vegetarian, they always have brown rice. And they are cheap.

 

But even at any Thai kitchen, when I say veggies and rice, it's usually great. Buddhists understand and honor vegetarianism better than most, even if they are not themselves. 

I ask about what tofu types might be available, I avoid deep fried tofu and deep fried anything really, as they use cheap oils in Thailand.

I will tell them "make it spicy, Thai spicey" and request mushrooms or ginger or tomoatoes to jazz up what might otherwise be boring.

 

I always say "no sugar, no salt" when they make my smoothie and "no shrimp, no oyster sauce no msg" when they make my food.

 

Any dish they make with meat they can make veggie. Try veggie green curry (it'll all have shrimp paste no matter what tho)

Try red curry rice. Try black pepper and ginger mixed veggies. You will be amazed how readily the little stalls will be to accommodate you.

 

 

[YogaVeg]

35 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

You really should try visiting Thailand.  

You really should try being relevant to the subject matter.

 

Poor thing, musta forgot the question was does 7-11 cc use demand a mandatory minimum.

Hint- the answer is yes.

 

A cleanse would work wonders. Purge negative paranoia. Release those toxins that cloud thinking.

Let go of that inner-sanctum nitrate corndog 7-11 fetish...

 

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

You really should try being relevant to the subject matter.

 

Poor thing, musta forgot the question was does 7-11 cc use demand a mandatory minimum.

Hint- the answer is yes.

 

A cleanse would work wonders. Purge negative paranoia. Release those toxins that cloud thinking.

Let go of that inner-sanctum nitrate corndog 7-11 fetish...

 

7/11 does not have a mandatory minimum. 

Edited March 2, 2019 by marcusarelus

[StreetCowboy]

1 hour ago, YogaVeg said:

I shop at 7-11 all the time, for water lol. They have a mandatory minimum (again I have to say it) ????.

Lotus, nope. Not convenient location usually and for a traveler who lives in hotels and doesn't have a kitchen, what is there? Chips, water? Laundry detergent, nope, you get that in 5 baht bags at 7-11 when you are a traveler.

 

Almost exclusively I eat at vegetarian restaurants or street stands, the meals cost 40-60 baht, and no way do they take CC's.

 

You really should try getting out of your comfort zone for a minute and realize that not everyone lives like you.

 

I am conveying my experience the way I lived, and I rarely got to use CC's in Thailand whereas I used them exclusively in Malaysia.

 

You, Sir, are 100% wrong with regards to my experience and out of touch with how many real budget tourists live and spend their money apparently. 

I don’t think many of the hawker stalls take credit cards.  I doubt the Sentral Chappati Shop does.  Maybe you don’t live the same in Malaysia as you do in Thailand

[YogaVeg]

1 hour ago, StreetCowboy said:

I don’t think many of the hawker stalls take credit cards.  I doubt the Sentral Chappati Shop does.  Maybe you don’t live the same in Malaysia as you do in Thailand

Good point. I don't like Malaysia street food the way I like Thai street food. It's too meat-based and deep fried and breaded. So I go to cheap Indian vegetarian restaurants and eat at food courts more in Malaysia, true. Where they all take CC's it seems. But all the veggie restaurants I just wrote about in Chiang Mai are sit down affairs too. And the few cheap Thai restaurants that I found willing to take CC's all charge 3% cc fee.

 

Hotels in Thailand, if they take CC's, all charge the 3%.

(Malaysia however fleeces foreigners with a 10 ringgit hotel tax, selectively enforced and somewhat negotiable. So that is rather annoying on a daily basis).

 

Travel agencies in Thailand charge the 3% and Lomprayah dinged me 5%.

 

So there's that.

 

Why are CC's important to me? 

I got a killer card last year, no foreign transaction fees and apr waived for 15 months.

Better exchange rate than cash or any bank would give me.

After a few months of use it adds up.

 

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

 

[marcusarelus]

7 hours ago, YogaVeg said:

Good point. I don't like Malaysia street food the way I like Thai street food. It's too meat-based and deep fried and breaded. So I go to cheap Indian vegetarian restaurants and eat at food courts more in Malaysia, true. Where they all take CC's it seems. But all the veggie restaurants I just wrote about in Chiang Mai are sit down affairs too. And the few cheap Thai restaurants that I found willing to take CC's all charge 3% cc fee.

 

Hotels in Thailand, if they take CC's, all charge the 3%.

(Malaysia however fleeces foreigners with a 10 ringgit hotel tax, selectively enforced and somewhat negotiable. So that is rather annoying on a daily basis).

 

Travel agencies in Thailand charge the 3% and Lomprayah dinged me 5%.

 

So there's that.

 

Why are CC's important to me? 

I got a killer card last year, no foreign transaction fees and apr waived for 15 months.

Better exchange rate than cash or any bank would give me.

After a few months of use it adds up.

 

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled programming...

 

We do travel in different circles.  I've never used a travel agency nor stayed in a hotel that didn't take credit cards.  I like Thailand because you can use cash and I never use a credit or debit card outside of a bank.  I'd like to try living in Penang but the requirements are too high for me.  I'm not a tourist.  I move places and live there. 

[lopburi3]

8 hours ago, YogaVeg said:

And the few cheap Thai restaurants that I found willing to take CC's all charge 3% cc fee.

As you mentioned it is your choice of facilities - low cost anything try to keep no tax records so use of a credit card is going to cost them more than it is worth (normal card loss) so discouraged by extra fee request.  Almost nobody uses travel agents anymore but yes they were always a prime example for card fee charge.  Most people using cards in Thailand are not paying any extra fee to do so anymore. and even when they were if you turned around it was often lowered or none asked - part of the traditional bargaining process.

[YogaVeg]

3 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

We do travel in different circles.  I've never used a travel agency nor stayed in a hotel that didn't take credit cards.  I like Thailand because you can use cash and I never use a credit or debit card outside of a bank....

I'm not a tourist.  I move places and live there. 

And I like using a cc because I get a better rate than using cash.

You clearly don't stay in budget hotels or try to save money on ferry's using an agent.

 

TV is used by a significant number of expats living permanently in Thailand and Malaysia,

but no doubt the volume of tourists that come to Thailand looking for cheap travels dwarfs the expat population probably something like 10,000 tourists to every one expat, so I remain convinced that sharing my experience is quite valid to the public at large.

[YogaVeg]

2 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

Almost nobody uses travel agents anymore but yes they were always a prime example for card fee charge.  Most people using cards in Thailand are not paying any extra fee to do so anymore. and even when they were if you turned around it was often lowered or none asked - part of the traditional bargaining process.

I gotta respectfully disagree, tourist areas throughout Thailand are literally littered with travel agents everywhere you look, and they wouldn't be there everyday all day long if no one used them.

It's foolish not to use an agent when the ferry ticketers all charge 20% more than the agents, so savvy travelers who are smartly saving money use them all the time.

 

I spent months trying to use my cc in Thailand in 2018, and if they accepted, it was only with the prereq of 3% charge. There was no negotiating it. Cash was the only negotiation. One can haggle price on the streets but not in stores so much and def not with the cc surcharge.

 

So you may not use CC's or agents, but huge populations of tourists myself included use them daily and your pronouncements fly in the face of our daily experience.

 

I would suggest going out there and trying then reporting back once you have some first hand experience.

 

 

[lopburi3]

25 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

I would suggest going out there and trying then reporting back once you have some first hand experience.

Actually I have spent a lot of time in Thailand for the last 5 decades but admit do not go to the islands (which from your ferry mentions must be where you stay).  Would not expect ferry ticket seller to be keen on people using CC (which again is it leaves a tax record).  In Malaysia government control is much tighter and even traffic laws are enforced so not much choice but to accept cards. 

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, YogaVeg said:

So you may not use CC's or agents, but huge populations of tourists myself included use them daily and your pronouncements fly in the face of our daily experience.

I agree .........

Almost all travel and VISA business is done using agents in Cambodia and Vietnam.

[YogaVeg]

1 hour ago, lopburi3 said:

Actually I have spent a lot of time in Thailand for the last 5 decades but admit do not go to the islands (which from your ferry mentions must be where you stay).  Would not expect ferry ticket seller to be keen on people using CC (which again is it leaves a tax record).  In Malaysia government control is much tighter and even traffic laws are enforced so not much choice but to accept cards. 

Ah, that makes sense. 

Ya the drivers in Malaysia do obey the lights and I see police watching the streets. As a pedestrian I feel much safer in Malaysia, but a lot of that has to do with actual sidewalks to use. Motorists still gun it at me when I jaywalk tho, just like Thailand.

 

It was island hopping indeed, buses and ferries, where I started paying attention to agents. I wouldn't consider them for airline traveling.

 

For example, from Krabi, Lomprayah's website lists the cost 1100 baht to Koh Tao whereas at the ferry terminal itself they said 1200 baht.

I then went to an agent working out of my hotel and he gave me the same deal for 950 baht and threw in a free shuttle from the hotel to the bus terminal (which is like 4-5 km outside of town).

And he took my cc but did charge the %, but that was my choice.

I admit I liked the fact that when I came downstairs to catch my shuttle, the agent was sitting right there smiling, so I didn't have to make my way on my own to Lomprayah's obscure Krabi bus stop and no worries that my shuttle wouldn't show up.

And he did it cheaper than I could have myself.

 

(On a side note, that particular agent ONLY uses Lomprayah for those islands, there are some unscrupulous agents who will put you on bad connections to get a few extra baht. But this agent insisted that Lomprayah is the best with fewest hassles, and he was right. I later took a Queen ferry and the difference between the two was staggering, for very little price difference)

 

I agree it isn't much savings relatively, but it meant a nice free lunch to me.

Yes I'm a penny pincher by nature ????

[YogaVeg]

15 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

I've never seen a sign of a minimum at 7/11.    Have you never been in one? 

 

Sorry.  I don't think you have ever been to Thailand. 

 

15 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

You stay in a 300 baht room and try to use a credit card for a 40 baht street meal?  You find a lot of vegetarian street outlets?  Aw come on.  India maybe but not in Thailand. 

 

15 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

You really should try visiting Thailand. 

 

14 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

7/11 does not have a mandatory minimum.

 

C'mon guy you are better than this!

 

Here you go:

7-11

50300 Chang Wat Chiang Mai, Amphoe Mueang Chiang Mai, Thesaban Nakhon Chiang Mai, Santitham Rd

 

Sign posted: All credit card payments require a 300 baht purchase minimum.

 

Name your price. I will bet you any amount of money.

 

A simple Agoda search for rooms in CM with a price cap of 300 baht will yield a dozen hotels.

You are online, do the simple search. Takes you 30 seconds.

 

In a previous post I highlighted a few of the many cheap CM options, but EVERY street stall will sell me stir fry vegetables and rice for 40-80 baht all day long throughout Thailand.

Have you seriously never tried to order veggies at a street stall?

They all have them lol.

All you have to do is ask.

 

Frankly it sounds like I know a bit more about Thailand than you seem to, at least in certain topics.

 

I now invite you to end polluting the thread with useless taunting, and engage in some meaningful discourse.

Thanks in advance for your anticipated cooperation!

[marcusarelus]

The topic is Thailand vs Malaysia because of the recent visa problems.  The current visa problems in Thailand have to do with long term staying in Thailand is no longer an option for those without any cash.  One would have to be very well to do to be able to park a 8 million baht in a Malaysian bank which I'm told is going to be the required amount next year. 

 

The thread is not a backpackers guide to frugality in South East Asia.  

 

I'd be interested if anyone has found a way to stay long term in Malaysia for the same amount of investment currently required in Thailand. 

[YogaVeg]

2 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

The topic is Thailand vs Malaysia because of the recent visa problems.  

 

The thread is not a backpackers guide to frugality in South East Asia

???? Wrong once more! ????

 

Guess again. The OP clearly states in their opening statement that this thread is about contrasting Thailand and Malaysia from the perspective of a self-proclaimed "budget traveler" who is using tourist visas and exemptions to wander SE Asia.

That's what I have been responding to. 

 

You lost there buddy?

 

If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.

 

Next...

[StreetCowboy]

3 hours ago, YogaVeg said:

...

If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.

....

That;'s how I went to Munich.

 

I was lucky, because the main London road ran almost past my house, and once you're on the London road, the world's your oyster, if you can stomach foreign food.

 

I walked up to the end of the street, and stuck out my thumb

"Whair ye gaun', pal?"

"I don't know, where are you going?"

"Berwick"

"Well, that's on the way"

 

We were out today on the motorcycle lanes all the way to Klang, and back, and I can't imagine such pleasant cycling in urban Thailand - except perhaps on the back road from Bang Na to Bangkok port, and the point of that is that you can find what you are looking for anywhere, if you look hard enough,

 

That's pretty much why I have stopped going on holiday.  I think it's better to find what you are looking for where you are, than to go somewhere else on someone else's recommendations.