British man who 'started new life' in Thailand desperately ill amid insurance wrangle

[sawadee1947]

Another no quality tourist starts to exploit the farang community. 

 

[Hoppyone]

9 hours ago, brokenbone said:

yeah, the insurance company would have to commit break of duty to pay up when he didnt have a driving license

Even if he had motorcycle license,the not pay next step was being careless while riding motorcycle ,always a no win situation 

[Ctkong]

8 hours ago, SammyT said:

"Mr Workman posted another video a few months later, saying he was leaving Bangkok.

"I loved Bangkok and I learned a lot about it and about myself," he said."

What does this even mean? Aside from the fact you like Chang and bargirls, what can you actually "learn about yourself" in a couple of months as a tourist in Bangkok?

How come so many young people from the west go traveling months on end? What about their careers and aspirations ? Or is life a long vacation from end to end? I don’t see people from Asia doing that.. nothing like reality to kick some sense into your head. Here, nobody owe you a free lunch. You make your own bed so you lie in it. 

Edited March 7, 2019 by Ctkong

[SammyT]

1 hour ago, snooky said:

And to those of you who posted comments which were only sarcastic and mean spirited just to increase your posting numbers, it is sad to see so many vile persons on one thread. 

I'm not entirely sure that anyone actually has the sole purpose of posting just to increase their numbers?

[4MyEgo]

I reckon 99.99% of people that take out travel insurance, don't read the exclusions.

 

Would love to see every insurance company online putting up in BIG RED WRITING motorbike cover is excluded, or motorbike cover for anyone unlicensed is excluded etc etc

 

It is far too easy for insurers to take the money and run, not saying they are at fault, but insurance exclusions should be made clear and like I said, in BIG RED WRITING with the intending policy holders ticking that they agree to those terms, then they might think twice, <deleted>....no cover, won't take a motorbike, one would hope.

 

We can dream on, but change is needed, definitely IMO.

[richard_smith237]

4 minutes ago, Hoppyone said:

Even if he had motorcycle license,the not pay next step was being careless while riding motorcycle ,always a no win situation 

Not Necessarily true... IF he had a Motorcycle license and corresponding IDP, IF he was here on a two week visit and not living here full time (Travel Insurance) and IF his Insurance had no small print to omitting the use of a motorcycle while in Thailand - then they would have to pay up. 

 

I had to get my Medical Insurance cover to specifically write me a letter outlining that I am covered to ride my Motorcycle and that they don't consider riding a motorcycle in their 'dangerous activities' clause. 

[e2x10]

sad situation

 

Edited March 7, 2019 by e2x10
done thinking about it

[Ctkong]

35 minutes ago, ExpatOne said:

A better fix is to not let anyone rent a bike without a license. No one complains about that.

The onus is on the bike renter to have a valid license and proper safety equipment to drive on the road just like you need to have a valid passport to enter the country. No brainer. If you ignore that common sense, then you are answerable to your own action and no others. 

[SammyT]

1 hour ago, unamazedloso said:

people need to insure fun or not have fun at all? What a miserable world we live in then.

 

.On another note I dont have nor need insurrance. Im not wealthy but have assistance if the sht hits the fan so lucky. I hope this compulsory need for insurance for visas is never implemented. Its a scam.

Classic strawman argument right there. Debating isn't your thing, huh? 

 

I'm not saying uninsured people shouldn't have fun, I'm saying uninsured people shouldn't ride vehicles which frequently are involved in death and serious injury or else they should man up and face the consequences. 

 

Is your assistance a Gofundme page? Because it's normally the people who take the "I don't have or need insurance" who end up with the gofundme pages being set up...

[bkk6060]

5 minutes ago, e2x10 said:

Money always more important than people

Well, now we know how you think and what is important to you.

Edited March 7, 2019 by bkk6060

[sanemax]

11 minutes ago, Ctkong said:

How come so many young people from the west go traveling months on end? What about their careers and aspirations ? Or is life a long vacation from end to end? I don’t see people from Asia doing that.. nothing like reality to kick some sense into your head. Here, nobody owe you a free lunch. You make your own bed so you lie in it. 

Some are between jobs , save up money and go travelling or just finished studying and take a year off .

  Quite a few Asians , Japanese , Koreans , Chinese also do that as well

[Baerboxer]

10 hours ago, smedly said:

so what   ?

 

out of the millions that come here and spend money in Thailand every year making them billions (12% of the countries GDP) how many end up with a medical emergency like the OP, it is so insignificant it isn't worth considering, Thailand is dangerous especially on the roads - it is their duty to make it as safe as possible for people who come here for a holiday, it's not as if they haven't had long enough to improve things.

 

But regardless of that, considering the very small number of people that end up in this sort of situation while here on holiday it is no real big deal (all things considered) for the country to provide free emergency medical assistance to the few that need it, they make huge revenue from tourism how about giving some back when some fall foul of the poor safety.

 

Not so long ago we had some children that got themselves into trouble in a cave - there was no shortage of foreign volunteers willing to put their lives at serious risk to save them. 

 

No one forced, coerced, bribed or offered payment to the wonderful people who chose to use their knowledge and skill to help save all the lives of those boys. That's why they're called volunteers.

 

No one forced this chap to ride a moped. He chose to do it, having been here long enough to know the high risks and knowing his insurance wouldn't be valid if he was injured whilst doing it.

 

People decide to take risks and then have to face the consequences and take responsibility. No country that's a holiday / tourist / expat destination is going to pick up the tab for foreigners who decide to do risky things.

 

Are you going to make a sizable donation to his crowd fund then?

[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, SammyT said:

Classic strawman argument right there. Debating isn't your thing, huh? 

 

I'm not saying uninsured people shouldn't have fun, I'm saying uninsured people shouldn't ride vehicles which frequently are involved in death and serious injury or else they should man up and face the consequences. 

 

Is your assistance a Gofundme page? Because it's normally the people who take the "I don't have or need insurance" who end up with the gofundme pages being set up...

I would go even further and suggest that foreigners shouldnt ride motorbikes in Thailand at all, even if they are insured

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I would go even further and suggest that foreigners shouldnt ride motorbikes in Thailand at all, even if they are insured

 

Thats getting a little silly now then isn't it. 

 

What would your reason be for an experienced, licensed and fully insured rider not being able to ride a bike in Thailand?

 

Do you place more value on the life of a Westerner than a Thai or are you under the highly flawed impression that a West are incapable of riding safely here?... then what about driving?

 

 

[bkk6060]

54 minutes ago, Darkside Gray said:

If it was a Thai in the UK that had been seriously injured he would have the same medical facilities made available to them as everyone else, time the Thai's had a rethink on there policies, or maybe the UK should have a rethink on there's.

Certainly the world should follow the UK formula it has worked out very well....

[Ebumbu]

Brain damage. That's not good. Sorry for this guy. Trying to enjoy his life. Young and careless. Weren't we all at some point? 

[bkk6060]

20 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I would go even further and suggest that foreigners shouldnt ride motorbikes in Thailand at all, even if they are insured

In one way you may be right.

I am an experienced rider and have 2 motorbikes here.

Sorry to call them out but the Thai m/b riders are terrible.  Especially the females.

Now I know the young guns ride too fast, but just the opposite of the females here.

Their lack of ability to ride in what appears to be a normal manner, coordination and awareness, creates a lot of problems here.  All my close accidents which have been several, there has been a female involved.

 

None of it matters I know.  If I am involved in an accident no matter what it will be my fault.

That is good to know and actually makes me much more aware.  Head on a swivel.

 

But if I am in or around a female on a m/b, I will purposely try to avoid them.  Go past them, to another lane, whatever it takes to get away from them.

 

 

Edited March 7, 2019 by bkk6060

[SupermarineS6B]

No license to ride a moped......?  BS ! That comes the moment you get a provisional license, 50cc at sixteen-125cc if you've a car licence at seventeen ...... Just the insurers dodging again.....

Edited March 7, 2019 by SupermarineS6B

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thats getting a little silly now then isn't it. 

What would your reason be for an experienced, licensed and fully insured rider not being able to ride a bike in Thailand?

Do you place more value on the life of a Westerner than a Thai or are you under the highly flawed impression that a West are incapable of riding safely here?... then what about driving?

 

 

I do think that it should be a personal choice , rather than enforced law .

I was also speaking about new arrivals to Thailand and them being unaware of how Thais drive and even if you are aware of the dangers and you are an experienced motorbike rider , that doesnt account for other peoples dangerous driving .

  Like, if you are approaching a red light, dont stop assuming that all the vehicles behind you also going to stop , if you are at a T-Junction , dont expect other vehicles to go infront of you are around, they are likely to cut in on the inside on the wrong side of the road etc

[smedly]

9 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

No one forced, coerced, bribed or offered payment to the wonderful people who chose to use their knowledge and skill to help save all the lives of those boys. That's why they're called volunteers.

Correct, they did something when it was not their responsibility - exactly my point, Citizen and Tourist safety is the responsibility of Thailand and they refuse to admit it and step up

9 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

No one forced this chap to ride a moped. He chose to do it, having been here long enough to know the high risks and knowing his insurance wouldn't be valid if he was injured whilst doing it.

The fact is (and it has been made many times on this thread already) he was allowed to hire a vehicle he was not licenced to drive, you could not do this in the west were rules and standards are actually enforced and people are held accountable, in the UK for example - if you lend - rent - hire to someone a vehicle they are not properly licenced to drive you will be prosecuted, it is up to the owner of said vehicle to make sure the person is legally covered to drive said vehicle

10 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

People decide to take risks and then have to face the consequences and take responsibility. No country that's a holiday / tourist / expat destination is going to pick up the tab for foreigners who decide to do risky things.

Yes people do take risks but there is a difference between blatant stupidity and having an accident - in the OP it says the Chap was hit by a car who then did a runner. Now if this guy was being a clown and doing wheelies and generally being a <deleted> then that is entirely different - he could have been drunk but there is no mention of that

 

Thailand like every other country that promotes tourism and openly invites people here earning huge sums of money should bare some responsiblity for its failure to provide a safe environment - they make no attempt to do so, ask the victims of the numerous boating and road carnage that happens daily here, boats minivans buses etc, people that live here know the dangers as we are exposed to it every day, those coming here on holiday may not 

[w94005m]

I wonder what percentage of the self-righteous expats here have ridden a motorcycle in Thailand, thinking they have a licence and insurance, when they only have a car license. In the UK, you need to have a separate motorcycle licence, which I'm willing to bet a hefty percentage do not have. My scan for this suggested that only about 1% of car license holders actually hold a full motorcycle license. They would also probably be denied insurance payouts for the same reason, which may indeed be the case here. I did not see sufficient details to list the precise situation here.

Edited March 7, 2019 by w94005m

[SupermarineS6B]

3 minutes ago, w94005m said:

I wonder what percentage of the self-righteous expats here have ridden a motorcycle in Thailand, thinking they have a licence and insurance, when they only have a car license. In the UK, you need to have a separate motorcycle licence, which I'm willing to bet a hefty percentage do not have. My scan for this suggested that only about 1% of car license holders actually hold a full motorcycle license. They would also probably be denied insurance payouts for the same reason, which may indeed be the case here. I did not see sufficient details to list the precise situation here.

You can ride a 125 on L's with a car license....

[smedly]

30 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I would go even further and suggest that foreigners shouldnt ride motorbikes in Thailand at all, even if they are insured

If I was advising a tourist on things they should not do here - the list would be massive, avoid boats - roads - minivans - buses - jetskis - police etc the list is endless, best to just stay in the airport because Thailand makes no attempt to provide a safe environment they should be held accountable and step up and do something with the trillions they earn in revenue but no - not our fault - we are not responsible even if it is our fault

[Jonathan Swift]

10 hours ago, SammyT said:

Travel insurer "would not" cover costs. 

 

I think it should have said "should not have to" cover costs. 

 

It's not for the insurer to cover the poor choices of a wandering hippie. 

How old are you sonny? I'm sure if you prepare a list of the kinds of people you don't like, be it "wandering hippies", black people, muslims, Chinese, Buddhists (I'm sure you have a long list) etc., and give it to the insurance companies they'd happily put your hate list to work. Now while you wait to grow into your big boy pants here's a clue how the adult world works. If you pay for something you're entitled to get what you paid for. Insurance companies are not legally allowed to use prejudices or arbitrary and capricious decision making, such as you display here, to determine coverage. If there is a clause in the contract that says it will not cover for driving accidents if the driver does not have a license, so be it. But if there is no such exclusion then the insurance company is on the wrong side of the law. Whatever the company covers, or does not cover, must be clearly and explicitly spelled out in the contract. If it covers motor vehicle accidents and does not specifically exclude accidents when the insured has no license the company can and should be sued into oblivion. Now as to the matter of your lacking all sympathy or humanity for a young man's tragic experience, well I guess there's no insurance to protect him from your malice is there? 

[Pasumwan]

Crazy riding without a licence. I'm afraid you made a bad choice. And of course, the travel insurance company would not valid cover. I see many farangs riding a motorcycles without helmets on. Probably 80% without a license. I don't understand why one-way ticket? Open return would have been a better option. 

[SammyT]

14 minutes ago, Jonathan Swift said:

How old are you sonny? I'm sure if you prepare a list of the kinds of people you don't like, be it "wandering hippies", black people, muslims, Chinese, Buddhists (I'm sure you have a long list) etc., and give it to the insurance companies they'd happily put your hate list to work. Now while you wait to grow into your big boy pants here's a clue how the adult world works. If you pay for something you're entitled to get what you paid for. Insurance companies are not legally allowed to use prejudices or arbitrary and capricious decision making, such as you display here, to determine coverage. If there is a clause in the contract that says it will not cover for driving accidents if the driver does not have a license, so be it. But if there is no such exclusion then the insurance company is on the wrong side of the law. Whatever the company covers, or does not cover, must be clearly and explicitly spelled out in the contract. If it covers motor vehicle accidents and does not specifically exclude accidents when the insured has no license the company can and should be sued into oblivion. Now as to the matter of your lacking all sympathy or humanity for a young man's tragic experience, well I guess there's no insurance to protect him from your malice is there? 

Lol. I should have stopped reading your comment after you called me a racist for referring to a guy someone as a  hippie but I continued, undeterred.

 

Do you win all your arguments using ad hominem?

 

Unless he signed a travel insurance policy markedly different to what everyone else does then I'd say the I insurance company doesn't have to do anything so the rest of your comment is pointless. I also dont think the insurance company protects against my malice, but then hes probably got bigger battles to care about at the moment. 

 

Ironic you talk about big boy pants. You seem to be the one tantruming about something you read on the internet. 

Edited March 7, 2019 by SammyT

[Speedhump]

10 hours ago, SammyT said:

Travel insurer "would not" cover costs. 

 

I think it should have said "should not have to" cover costs. 

 

It's not for the insurer to cover the poor choices of a wandering hippie. 

Where do you get your information from? Hippie? Wandering? As far as I see he came to Thailand and is still there. Did anything here say he's not working? You know nothing more than why you've read. Anyway, if people want to fund him for his mistakes, it's none of our business. I don't see him asking for handouts, only his worried family. Sick of these stupid forum comments shooting off the mouth on the basis of zero facts and maximum bigotry. Grow up. 

[yuiop]

8 hours ago, boonrawdcnx said:

Why do we only read about situations like this in Thailand?

 Never read about cases like this happening in Europe!

And I can tell you why - The problem is not the tourists.

 First those with valid licenses might have rented vehicles in the past in other countries and automatically assume that they are properly insured. Why does Thailand allow people to operate or companies to rent out vehicles without proper insurance? Especially for rented vehicles there should be comprehensive insurance mandatory!

 

For tourists the problem are Thai rental companies and nobody else!

 Thai rental companies should be held accountable for renting vehicles out to people without a proper license to drive - like in every other country - period!

 

I am not even sure if all of them do have a business license themselves to rent out vehicles?

 There is no way you could rent a vehicle in Europe without the rental company checking if you are licensed to drive such a vehicle!

 

Just look at the disgusting charade that is going on in Chiang Mai every single day.

 Rental companies rent out motorbikes to probably hundreds of people without a driving license every single day!

The police is then lurking around the corners around the moat and fine the tourists a 1000 baht for driving without a valid license.

 

When the tourist should have never been able to rent a bike without a valid license in the first place.

 

And then it comes - after taking the money - the tourists are then allowed by the police to carry-on and drive around without a license!

 

Rental companies who rent out vehicles without proper insurance to people without a license and police should be held responsible if accidents happen - not the tourists who should have never been able to rent a vehicle!

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

 

 

 

100% correct.

[simon43]

Quote

 

What would your reason be for an experienced, licensed and fully insured rider not being able to ride a bike in Thailand?
 

 

 

Well, that policy is firmly applied in the Myanmar tourist destinations of Bagan and Inle Lake. 

 

For their own safety, foreign tourists, whether they are experienced motorbike riders or not, cannot rent motorbikes in those regions - they are only allowed to rent the slow (ish) electric bikes.

 

Every time I drove on my motorbike into those regions, I had to show my documents to the local police to prove that I wasn't a tourist and lived in Naypyitaw - outside of that region, and legally owned the motorbike.

 

 

Edited March 7, 2019 by simon43

[SammyT]

2 minutes ago, Speedhump said:

 I don't see him asking for handouts, only his worried family. Sick of these stupid forum comments shooting off the mouth on the basis of zero facts and maximum bigotry. Grow up

You must be new to the internet? Welcome. 

 

I'd say he clearly doesn't have a job -no valid insurance, cant afford to pay his medical bills. Hes presumably not asking because hes in a serious condition in hospital...