Stop Brexit: A million people sign UK petition to stay in EU

[AlexRich]

4 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

You haven't realised yet that unemployment statistics have been manipulated beyond recognition?

You haven’t been realised that you are arguing against the facts ... which seems to be a Brexiteer theme. Opinions trump facts in this new world.

[nontabury]

8 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Again, nothing to do with the EU! Yes, some EU nationals in the UK are criminals, some are in gangs. But the crimes you are talking about are, in the main, committed by British citizens or, when they are committed by immigrants, committed by immigrants from outside the EU.

 

If you really believe leaving the EU will reduce crime in the UK then there really is no hope for you!

 

I wonder how many Brits living in one of the other 27 have committed crimes; I bet the answer isn't zero!

 

Of course, the ethnicity of criminals is mentioned in the press. When describing attackers in order to identify them, when they are arrested and again when the case comes to court.

 

There is no such thing; unless you mean the Schengen agreement.

 

The UK is not a member of the Schengen area. We control our own immigration laws and rules when it comes to non EEA or Swiss nationals.

 

Where EEA and swiss nationals are concerned, British citizens have exactly the same rights in those countries as their nationals do here. Ask any member of a British retirement enclave in Spain!

 

Thypical 7x7 B/S.  As I recently wrote in one of these threads, I regularly go into Boston,Lincolnshire. While there I often read in the local papers, reports from the local court of those found guilty of criminal activities, their names are also printed,and surprise,surprise the overwhelming majority are Eastern European. Perhaps this is One of the reasons that the majority of the good folk in Boston voted leave.

 Of course this fact will not be acceptable to someone who is so biased and blinkered into thinking that membership of this so called union £££ is off benefit to the British people.

 

 

[Basil B]

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

As there is free movement of people within the EU we have no way of knowing who is who nor wherever they may be at any time.

 

A Polish or Romanian murderer, rapist or psychopath can get on a coach or a plane and be in central London or Manchester in just a few hours and no one will be any the wiser.

We are in a better position than many of the European countries to do something about it because we have border controls, and I assume other countries do not want such scum from other countries residing in there country also, one thing would be for an European or even better, international register of persons convicted of certain crimes that are available to all border forces. 

Another is to actually look at the Freedom of Movement laws, make if for the purpose meant, so those moving to another country for a period of 3 or more months have to apply for a residency card, to get a card one needs to be in Employment or proof they looking and have reasonable prospect of getting work, may even have to demonstrate they have the means to fund their stay, Residency cards for family members or persons who can adequately fund their own extended stay, any country has the right to refuse entry to any person not being a citizen who has served a prison sentence of over 365 days.   

[nontabury]

25 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Will closing the door to everyone eliminate murders, rapes and the work of psychopaths?

 

Whose talking about closing the doors to Everyone.

Certainly not the supporters of Brexit. What we want is controlled immigration, accepting those who will be of benefit to the British economy. Be they highly qualified scientists or seasonal farm workers. This can easily be achieved by using a points system,similarly to that used so efficiently by the Australians.

[bkkcanuck8]

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

As there is free movement of people within the EU we have no way of knowing who is who nor wherever they may be at any time.

 

A Polish or Romanian murderer, rapist or psychopath can get on a coach or a plane and be in central London or Manchester in just a few hours and no one will be any the wiser.

 Well then, maybe the UK should also implement controls where you have to have permission to leave or enter different regions to avoid all those murders and rapists free movement.  You know, like some countries in this region... if you don't have appropriate travel papers you cannot move.  That will prevent all those killer Irish and Scots from coming easily to London... not to mention that god forsaken place called Manchester ????

Edited March 31, 2019 by bkkcanuck8

[adammike]

44 minutes ago, nontabury said:

 

 

Do you not realise it’s harder to smuggle 200 cigarettes into the country, than 200 illegal immigrants.

Easy for the far right to radicalise you it seems.

[7by7]

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

You know what they say about statistics.

 

Where are your statistics about the 8.6 million people of WORKING AGE in the UK who are classed as economically inactive. 

 

Economic Inactivity

Quote

The economically inactive are defined as people who are not in employment or unemployed. There are many reasons why an individual may be inactive, for example, they might be studying, looking after family or long-term sick

How is any of that the fault of the EU?

How will any of that change after Brexit?

 

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

Or your statistics about the three quarters of a million people on zero hours contracts.

How are zero hours contracts the fault of the EU?

How will it change after Brexit?

 

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

Do you have any statistics about the hordes of foreign mainly Eastern European men who assemble outside B&Q, Wickes, Homebase and other DIY and builders merchants in the UK touting themselves for casual work and by doing so are depriving British working men of an income. Do you have any figures on how many are paying income tax or GNI on their earnings

These men, regardless of their nationality and many of those I've seen in places like Deptford speak perfect English with a South London accent so are probably British, are working illegally. So those that are EU nationals should not be here. These men are also a tiny fraction of the workforce.

 

But I have not said the situation is perfect; just that the myth of EU nationals stealing jobs from British workers is just that; mainly a myth. Unemployment is falling, despite the presence of EU workers.

 

4 hours ago, yogi100 said:

Or how much they send home to Estonia, Albania or Poland. Or how many are claiming housing benefit and childrens allowances for offspring back in their own countries. Or how many can access our health services that we've spent a lifetime paying for. Or how many have been allocated local authority housing?

 

Do you have graphs for those statistics as well?

No.

 

Do you have statistics for British nationals doing exactly the same in other EU countries? Remember that most British nationals in other EU countries are pensioners, therefore far more likely to require state healthcare than EU migrants in the UK, most of whom are of working age.

 

What I do know is that EU workers contribute far more in tax and NICs than they take out in benefits. They are also more of a benefit to the UK economy than a drain.

 

The effects of EU migration on Britain in 5 charts

[7by7]

4 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

You haven't realised yet that unemployment statistics have been manipulated beyond recognition?

So you say.

 

Your evidence?

[7by7]

28 minutes ago, nontabury said:

Thypical 7x7 B/S.  As I recently wrote in one of these threads, I regularly go into Boston,Lincolnshire. While there I often read in the local papers, reports from the local court of those found guilty of criminal activities, their names are also printed,and surprise,surprise the overwhelming majority are Eastern European. Perhaps this is One of the reasons that the majority of the good folk in Boston voted leave.

 Of course this fact will not be acceptable to someone who is so biased and blinkered into thinking that membership of this so called union £££ is off benefit to the British people.

 

Lincolnshire does have a high percentage of EU migrants come to do the farm labouring jobs Brits don't want. Obviously the larger the population of a particular nationality is, the higher the number of criminals that population may contain.

 

Poles are the largest group of EU migrants in the UK, Irish the second largest. (Source). Poles are also the largest group in UK prisons,  Irish are the second largest (Source).

 

So you must want to do away with the nearly 100 year old CTA between the UK and RoI for the same reasons you want to stop Eastern Europeans from coming here. Otherwise your rhetoric is not based on any form of logic, but purely on prejudice.

[malagateddy]

Do you think security forces cannot " break into "encrypted messages????

What if they avoid phones Max? Or they use fully encrypted messaging services ... do you think they are completely stupid?

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[Anythingleft?]

 
Lincolnshire does have a high percentage of EU migrants come to do the farm labouring jobs Brits don't want. Obviously the larger the population of a particular nationality is, the higher the number of criminals that population may contain.
 
Poles are the largest group of EU migrants in the UK, Irish the second largest. (Source). Poles are also the largest group in UK prisons,  Irish are the second largest (Source).
 
So you must want to do away with the nearly 100 year old CTA between the UK and RoI for the same reasons you want to stop Eastern Europeans from coming here. Otherwise your rhetoric is not based on any form of logic, but purely on prejudice.

The labour force in Lincolnshire doing the seasonal work is mainly run by Eastern European gangs, they are extremely territorial and don't take kindly to anybody else working there
The labour they use is a high percentage unregistered labour that owe debts to the employers and receive very little of the actual salary

This has all been documented before in many instances....

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[wilcopops]

8 hours ago, yogi100 said:

As there is free movement of people within the EU we have no way of knowing who is who nor wherever they may be at any time.

 

A Polish or Romanian murderer, rapist or psychopath can get on a coach or a plane and be in central London or Manchester in just a few hours and no one will be any the wiser.

How many posts have there been on brexit and this has to be the most facile and racist of them all.......

[wilcopops]

2 hours ago, Anythingleft? said:

The labour force in Lincolnshire doing the seasonal work is mainly run by Eastern European gangs, they are extremely territorial and don't take kindly to anybody else working there
The labour they use is a high percentage unregistered labour that owe debts to the employers and receive very little of the actual salary

This has all been documented before in many instances....

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

All employed by English farmers.

[7by7]

2 hours ago, Anythingleft? said:

The labour force in Lincolnshire doing the seasonal work is mainly run by Eastern European gangs, they are extremely territorial and don't take kindly to anybody else working there
The labour they use is a high percentage unregistered labour that owe debts to the employers and receive very little of the actual salary

This has all been documented before in many instances....

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

In other words, illegal working practices, sometimes amounting to slave labour, which some British farmers are taking advantage of. 

 

Of course it is not just in the agricultural sector that these abuses happen, and it's not just Eastern Europeans who are the victims.

 

Gangmasters & Labour Abuse Authority

[AlexRich]

2 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Do you think security forces cannot " break into "encrypted messages????

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

No, they can't ... why do you think Edward Snowden remained undetected for so long? There is software that cannot be "cracked" by GCHQ and the rest. Someone who knows what they are doing can communicate undetected. 

[sanemax]

4 hours ago, AlexRich said:

What if they avoid phones Max? Or they use fully encrypted messaging services ... do you think they are completely stupid?

I was just giving an example  of how surveillance has improved over the last 30 years and they could try to avoid surveillance , just as the security forces will try to create more surveillance .

  The IRA are all old men now , Martin Mcguinness is friends with the Queen these days and the UK security forces are well trained , having to deal with Islamic terror threats these last 20 years  , will the younger generation of Irish rebels be willing to engage in violence ?

  You also seem to be using the threat of IRA violence to further your political cause and they dont take to kindly  by people using their name  to further any political cause .

   Following on your threats to go and slap some Brexitters on the streets of London and threatening the UK with IRA violence , I suggest that you move on from threats and continue with dialogue  

[malagateddy]

Yogi 100 tells the truth!!!

How many posts have there been on brexit and this has to be the most facile and racist of them all.......

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[malagateddy]

And I suggest that he goes forth and multiplies with some other appeaser

I was just giving an example  of how surveillance has improved over the last 30 years and they could try to avoid surveillance , just as the security forces will try to create more surveillance .
  The IRA are all old men now , Martin Mcguinness is friends with the Queen these days and the UK security forces are well trained , having to deal with Islamic terror threats these last 20 years  , will the younger generation of Irish rebels be willing to engage in violence ?
  You also seem to be using the threat of IRA violence to further your political cause and they dont take to kindly  by people using their name  to further any political cause .
   Following on your threats to go and slap some Brexitters on the streets of London and threatening the UK with IRA violence , I suggest that you move on from threats and continue with dialogue  

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[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

No, they can't ... why do you think Edward Snowden remained undetected for so long? There is software that cannot be "cracked" by GCHQ and the rest. Someone who knows what they are doing can communicate undetected. 

Because he flew to Moscow and seeked asylum there .................and he wasnt undetected .

 

[welovesundaysatspace]

3 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Because he flew to Moscow and seeked asylum there .................and he wasnt undetected .

 

Strong encryption with today’s available technology practically cannot be broken. Even using a supercomputer it would take billions of years. It would require a flawed implementation or an intentional backdoor. Guess why some countries like the UK have laws that require you to handover your password to law enforcement? 

[yogi100]

4 hours ago, Basil B said:

We are in a better position than many of the European countries to do something about it because we have border controls, and I assume other countries do not want such scum from other countries residing in there country also, one thing would be for an European or even better, international register of persons convicted of certain crimes that are available to all border forces. 

Another is to actually look at the Freedom of Movement laws, make if for the purpose meant, so those moving to another country for a period of 3 or more months have to apply for a residency card, to get a card one needs to be in Employment or proof they looking and have reasonable prospect of getting work, may even have to demonstrate they have the means to fund their stay, Residency cards for family members or persons who can adequately fund their own extended stay, any country has the right to refuse entry to any person not being a citizen who has served a prison sentence of over 365 days.   

Well said but neither the UK nor the EU has ever put such conditions or regulations in place.

 

Even Merkel in 2010 said multiculturalism was a failure and if the EU had acted on that realisation and along with the UK tackled the problems of mass immigration and daft human rights entitlements after Merkel's admission then we would never have sought to leave the EU.

 

But the opinions of the public are often totally ignored by those in power who claim to know best and in the case of the UK the price of that distant aloofness is now being paid.

 

Joe Bloggs knows and cares little about tariffs and foreign investment etc but has eyes in his head and knows what he can see happening all around him.

 

There is much discontent regarding immigration all over Europe but it's only the UK that has had the chance to do something about it so far. Whether the hand wringing fops in Westminster act on it in future when we do finally leave is another matter.

[Basil B]

Back on Topic...

 

Now over 6 Million...

6,009,044 signatures

[yogi100]

4 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

 Well then, maybe the UK should also implement controls where you have to have permission to leave or enter different regions to avoid all those murders and rapists free movement.  You know, like some countries in this region... if you don't have appropriate travel papers you cannot move.  That will prevent all those killer Irish and Scots from coming easily to London... not to mention that god forsaken place called Manchester ????

Which killer Scots?

[Anythingleft?]

Back on Topic...
 
Now over 6 Million...
6,009,044 signatures

Well when they pass 17 million let us all know......

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[7by7]

17 minutes ago, sanemax said:

<snip>

The IRA are all old men now , Martin Mcguinness is friends with the Queen these days

Friends? Well, not now he's dead! Her Majesty does have to shake hands with some really unsavoury people in her official duties, but I doubt she'd have invited him round for tea otherwise. He was the PIRA chief when they murdered her 'Uncle' Louis!

 

22 minutes ago, sanemax said:

<snip>

 and the UK security forces are well trained , having to deal with Islamic terror threats these last 20 years  , will the younger generation of Irish rebels be willing to engage in violence ?

The UK security forces were well used to dealing with terror threats well before the rise of Islamic fundamentalism and terrorism; they'd been dealing with Irish terrorism for 30 years!

 

But they still couldn't stop every attack by Republican or Loyalist terrorists.

 

"Today we were unlucky, but remember we only have to be lucky once. You will have to be lucky always." These chilling words of the PIRA after the Brighton bombing are as relevant today as they were then. As the fact that despite the best efforts and many successes of the security services, some Islamic terror attacks still happen.

 

The PIRA haven't gone away. As the recent letter bombs they claimed responsibility for prove. Fortunately, these were discovered before they could do any damage.

 

If you think that they will simply stand by and see the Good Friday agreement ignored to please you Brexiteers and not restart their violence, then you are really are extremely naïve.

 

[bkkcanuck8]

4 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

Which killer Scots?

Well, Dennis Nilsen was a doozy...

 

Or anyone on the receiving end of a caber toss ????

 

[yogi100]

1 hour ago, wilcopops said:

How many posts have there been on brexit and this has to be the most facile and racist of them all.......

How is it 'racist' or facile.

 

Polish or Romanian people are of the same race as me. Or yourself probably.

 

If you're going to play the race card make sure you shuffle the pack properly first.

 

 

 

Edited March 31, 2019 by yogi100

[yogi100]

17 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

Friends? Well, not now he's dead! Her Majesty does have to shake hands with some really unsavoury people in her official duties, but I doubt she'd have invited him round for tea otherwise. He was the PIRA chief when they murdered her 'Uncle' Louis!

 

The UK security forces were well used to dealing with terror threats well before the rise of Islamic fundamentalism and terrorism; they'd been dealing with Irish terrorism for 30 years!

 

But they still couldn't stop every attack by Republican or Loyalist terrorists.

 

"Today we were unlucky, but remember we only have to be lucky once. You will have to be lucky always." These chilling words of the PIRA after the Brighton bombing are as relevant today as they were then. As the fact that despite the best efforts and many successes of the security services, some Islamic terror attacks still happen.

 

The PIRA haven't gone away. As the recent letter bombs they claimed responsibility for prove. Fortunately, these were discovered before they could do any damage.

 

If you think that they will simply stand by and see the Good Friday agreement ignored to please you Brexiteers and not restart their violence, then you are really are extremely naïve.

 

Since 1967 2000 Irish people died as a result of domestic terrorist activity. It's unlikely they'll start that again over our leaving the EU but if they decide to kick off again that'll be their misfortune.

 

It was mainly pressure from the local people that brought an end to the violence rather than any action taken by security forces. The Irish people are no longer so naive as they were in those days and we'd all be naive to think that they are but if they don't want to make their own arrangement then that's up to them. 

 

If a few Irish head bangers want to raise Cain it will have no effect on the outcome of our leaving or remaining in the EU.

[yogi100]

23 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

I reckon most of the EU girls could give Tommy Islam a kicking.

 

 

What, like the EU girls of Rochdale, Newcastle, Telford, Huddersfield and Rotherham who were victims of the rape gangs.

 

Are they the EU girls you mean. 

[yogi100]

6 hours ago, AlexRich said:

Will closing the door to everyone eliminate murders, rapes and the work of psychopaths?

Who has said anything about closing the door to everyone.

You're the only one who has mentioned it.