What Rights Do I Have If My Name Is On The Birth Certificate?

[shane]

If i were to have a child with a thai national(female) in Thailand what custody rights would i have with the child if we brake up. I ask this because a farang man jumped to his death from my apartment recently because his girfriend ran away to esaan with his child and he couldn't find them. His name was on the birth certificate so i don't understand why he didn't wait for the police to arrest the mother. I plan on having a child with a Thai national soon but am now getting worried.

thanks for any help.

[chatette]

I can't imagine why you're even considering having a child with someone you obviously think may run away. That should be the last worry on yr mind. Maybe you should consider having a child with a national of some other country than Thailand if you think that person wld be more reliable and you would have more rights....? I can't at all see the link between someone committing suicide over his own woes and your plans. And, for the record, the father of a friend of mine's child ran away with their child...he's Dutch and she's Thai, so it has nothing to do with nationality, rights or anything else. He was in the wrong but it didn't help her. Haven't you ever heard of the myriad cases of western women married to men from the middle east whose children are whisked away never to be seen again by estranged partners? It's stuff that goes on all around the world, regardless of nationality, race, etc.

[buriramboy]

how i understand it (and anyone feel free to correct me) if you are not married, even though your name is on the birth certificate, you basically have next to no rights. i say this as 1 of my freinds faced this problem and in the end had to pay his x-girlfreind (he found out she was using drugs) off go to court to get custody, it took him well over 6 months before everything was sorted.

[Erwin1011]

Your name on the birth certificate gives the guaranteed right to pay, when so claimed by the mother.

[GuestHouse]

Your name on the birth certificate gives the guaranteed right to pay, when so claimed by the mother.

And that is an example of confusing rights and responsibilities.

Your rights only come into question if there is a conflict between both parents, in which case you would have to go to court to have your rights enforced by the court.

The wise thing is to never let it get that far.

As the father the court can up hold your rights of contact, guardianship, parental authority (in things like aproving medical treatment, aproving travel overseas etc and ultimately the rights of full guardianship).

I have no direct experience myself, but I understand that the Thai courts are pretty supportive of fathers maintaining contact with and parental authority over their children.

If you think there might be a problem brewing you might want to start with some basic back up planning. First and formost get a copy of your child's mother's ID card and try to get names and addresses of her close family, listings of her telephone numbers etc.

That information would be of help finding her if she did do a runner.

[Khun Bob]

I addition to what guesthouse has stated

Take a visit to her home/village with her and go with camera, gps and maps

* take photos of key locations - there more the better digital camera han hold several hundred photos

* record GPS readings

* ask locations names and write them down

* take photos of the family home and family too - get names of family and write them down

* find out nearby towns and ask to visit - see what she does there

* observe how she reacts in the company of different people

* if you have a voice recorder - record situations and get it translated elsewhere, unless of course you can understand thai and the many other dialects/langugages throughout the regions - small mp3 players can record several hours of audio now.

* find out names of other family members and where they live

* find out who friends are, where they live, what they do and contact details

* find out who is the village head man

* find out where the local ampur office is

* ask where the local school is and pay a visit - get the contact details of the teachers there - emails, phone

* visit the local temple and get the phone number and names of head monks

Of course there are some other things you can do, but it depends how far you want to go and what opportunities you have.

And bear in mind that in the course of doing this you may uncover something you wih you hadnt found. Above all if something does come to surface dont not be confrontational over discovering the truth - think of alternative ways you can establish information you need to know. At the end of the day you have to choose what is acceptable and what is not and like many things in Thailand be prepared to walk away.

What rights were you looking for ? If there is any particular ones then maybe someone can help with those.

[shane]

I mean if we split up a couple of years down the track and she decides to stop me from seeing the child, what rights would i have? Could i go to the police and if so what would they do? Would that be considered kidnapping?

I thought if my name was on the birth certificate that would be more important than being married.

I Don't think that she would ever do somthing like that but after hearing about the guy at my apartment it got me thinking, that if this were to ever haapen to me what rights would i have. I am only asking this question out of curiosity.

Any information would be great.

[Khun Bob]

Getting the information GuestHouse and myself have mentioned is going to be useful whether you have a child or not - realistically think how easy it is to pull something over on a foreigner - dont consider it bad - just consider it risk mitigation.

The UK Government Foreign and Commonwealth Office website has an article on the Thailand page on Child Abduction - I'm sure what you are talking about has happenned many times and there is a body of knowledge - tapping into it may be hard as it could be a touchy subject. Personally I can comment as I have not been in that situatio, nor do I know anyone who has. Your embassy in Thailand may be able to give some advice, which is specific to other nationals of your country in a similar situation.

HTH

I mean if we split up a couple of years down the track and she decides to stop me from seeing the child, what rights would i have? Could i go to the police and if so what would they do? Would that be considered kidnapping?

I thought if my name was on the birth certificate that would be more important than being married.

I Don't think that she would ever do somthing like that but after hearing about the guy at my apartment it got me thinking, that if this were to ever haapen to me what rights would i have. I am only asking this question out of curiosity.

Any information would be great.

[chanchao]

> Take a visit to her home/village with her and go with camera, gps and maps

> * take photos of key locations - there more the better digital camera can hold

> several hundred photos

> * record GPS readings

> * if you have a voice recorder record situations and get it translated elsewhere

Wow. >

I think you got most of them, but why not go all the way and suggest surgically implanting a tracking device into your kid's skull.

Control-Freak 101 anyone?

..Ultimate levels of paranoia coming together with ultimate levels of cluelessness about the most basic of things in Thailand, like not being able to find a village/district back without GPS coordinates, or not understanding a basic conversation...

Hello: He's on the birth certificate. The birth certificate clearly states the place of residence/registration of both parents. He can grab any taxi/minivan driver off the street, show him the address and he'll be driven right to it.

Edited March 8, 2007 by chanchao

[JacknDanny]

how i understand it (and anyone feel free to correct me) if you are not married, even though your name is on the birth certificate, you basically have next to no rights. i say this as 1 of my freinds faced this problem and in the end had to pay his x-girlfreind (he found out she was using drugs) off go to court to get custody, it took him well over 6 months before everything was sorted.

Sorry to disagree, as this is completely false, and I am living proof of that.

I too was afraid of not being granted custody, however I found a good lawyer, went to court and within 3-4 months got full custody of my son. My ex girlfriend got ZERO rights.

My name WAS on the birth certificate which is of paramount importance.

My advice is get a good lawyer, and if you are genuinly concerned about your childs welfare and can prove your ability to take care of the child, the chances are you will win

[Khun Bob]

Risk Mitigation ? Always nice to have info for ANY unexpected situation (In the Land Of (unexpected) Situations and U-Turns).

Have you tried finding maps with small villages on them ? It is easy to pick up on a generaisation/abstraction and not have the exact information ?

If you havent been out in the sticks much and know how things work then you will know thet a GPS doesnt lie as much as a Thai Girl can - however even a GPS is not always that accurate !

Clerly you have tried to find several remote addresses from Thai ID cards and other official docs and never find it a problem to get straight there (in a taxi of course!)

Cynisims aside - of course it is up the the individial to decide what information they want to establish them selves - and how much they want to trust information from other sources. Clearly if your having children with a Thai you must have soem degree of trust with your partner - it is just a question of whether you prefer true until proven otherwise or uncertified till proven or somewhere inbetween.

> Take a visit to her home/village with her and go with camera, gps and maps

> * take photos of key locations - there more the better digital camera can hold

> several hundred photos

> * record GPS readings

> * if you have a voice recorder record situations and get it translated elsewhere

Wow. >

I think you got most of them, but why not go all the way and suggest surgically implanting a tracking device into your kid's skull.

Control-Freak 101 anyone?

..Ultimate levels of paranoia coming together with ultimate levels of cluelessness about the most basic of things in Thailand, like not being able to find a village/district back without GPS coordinates, or not understanding a basic conversation...

Hello: He's on the birth certificate. The birth certificate clearly states the place of residence/registration of both parents. He can grab any taxi/minivan driver off the street, show him the address and he'll be driven right to it.

Edited March 8, 2007 by Khun Bob

[Flow]

I mean if we split up a couple of years down the track and she decides to stop me from seeing the child, what rights would i have? Could i go to the police and if so what would they do? Would that be considered kidnapping?

I thought if my name was on the birth certificate that would be more important than being married.

I Don't think that she would ever do somthing like that but after hearing about the guy at my apartment it got me thinking, that if this were to ever haapen to me what rights would i have. I am only asking this question out of curiosity.

Any information would be great.

Thais or for that matter non-thai females are capable of anything when it comes to their offspring. One day I cam back home, gone was my son. This was 18 years ago. But anyway still remember it as if it were today. I found out that she was living with a new Thai guy somewhere in Bangkok. She was from a well to do family. Didn't know where they hid my son until I recieved a call after 6 months asking for a copy of my son's birth certificate form the Embassy. An opportunity for me to control the situation had arisen, a phone number! To keep a long story short, I managed to get both of them back. Once I got them back I planned to fully control the situation by gathering evidence of my wife's infidelities, phone calls she was making with this other guy, etc. taking pictures of certain notes she had in her dairy and so on. I spent 1 year doing this until the day, my non suspecting now ex wife went shopping. Went to the airport and flew out of the country, to Columbia, my home country, with my son. Returned to Thailand 6 years after and faced my wife in court with a good lawyer and the evicence I had gahtered. I was awarded full custody of my son. They caught me by surprise when they snatched away my son, and I gave them an even bigger surprise when I snatched my son away from them a year and a half later. I have no remorse for what I did and in fact I feel really good about it!

[Khun Bob]

Well done !

Just goes to show the more information you have the better - even then there can be surprises !

(pure self justification for my previous post - I speak from personal experience as a child who was involved in a kidnapping and custody battle - makes you evaluate where and how to place your trust !)

I mean if we split up a couple of years down the track and she decides to stop me from seeing the child, what rights would i have? Could i go to the police and if so what would they do? Would that be considered kidnapping?

I thought if my name was on the birth certificate that would be more important than being married.

I Don't think that she would ever do somthing like that but after hearing about the guy at my apartment it got me thinking, that if this were to ever haapen to me what rights would i have. I am only asking this question out of curiosity.

Any information would be great.

Thais or for that matter non-thai females are capable of anything when it comes to their offspring. One day I cam back home, gone was my son. This was 18 years ago. But anyway still remember it as if it were today. I found out that she was living with a new Thai guy somewhere in Bangkok. She was from a well to do family. Didn't know where they hid my son until I recieved a call after 6 months asking for a copy of my son's birth certificate form the Embassy. An opportunity for me to control the situation had arisen, a phone number! To keep a long story short, I managed to get both of them back. Once I got them back I planned to fully control the situation by gathering evidence of my wife's infidelities, phone calls she was making with this other guy, etc. taking pictures of certain notes she had in her dairy and so on. I spent 1 year doing this until the day, my non suspecting now ex wife went shopping. Went to the airport and flew out of the country, to Columbia, my home country, with my son. Returned to Thailand 6 years after and faced my wife in court with a good lawyer and the evicence I had gahtered. I was awarded full custody of my son. They caught me by surprise when they snatched away my son, and I gave them an even bigger surprise when I snatched my son away from them a year and a half later. I have no remorse for what I did and in fact I feel really good about it!