No-deal Brexit fears rise as parliament sinks May's deal

[ivor bigun]

Much as many,especially the French would love to be the no 1 language English is ,followed next by Chinese,our son is fluent in English and because of that has a really well paid job running an Indian company based here in Thailand our nephew also has a first rate job ,and is in China most months ,why because he speaks English and Chinese, .they are and will be the main languages for the foreseable future.

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[Greenisland]

13 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

I think the UK was exporting English way before the US was. But indeed, as the British Empire declined after WW11 the American Empire flourished. 

 

 

But of course it was like that.. in the past. 

 

UK no longer hold the ceremonial mace of English language. It was transferred to USA many moons ago when Hollywood got the soft power it now holds. 

 

UK is now a vassal state when it come to the English language. Sorry for your loss. 

 

 

[Baerboxer]

1 minute ago, Greenisland said:

Go and do educate yourself about the linguistics of diplomatics in not so far past. 

 

Incidentally lingua franca is called as faranji in Arabic. It's fun to learn new stuff. 

 

 

 

Off topic but hopefully the mods will tolerate this.

 

"It[English] has replaced French as the lingua franca of diplomacy since World War II. The rise of English in diplomacy began in 1919, in the aftermath of World War I, when the Treaty of Versailles was written in English as well as in French, the dominant language used in diplomacy until that time."

 

De Gaulle did well to insist French was a UN language as he fort to keep France relevant after WW11. Hardly succeeded! I remember when working in France some colleagues lamenting how disappointed they were when travelling to find out French wasn't the international language they thought it was.

 

Who gives a toss what the Arabic word for French is? But if it amuses you. You'd be better learning about the EU though as clearly there's a gap there.

[Baerboxer]

2 minutes ago, Greenisland said:

But of course it was like that.. in the past. 

 

UK no longer hold the ceremonial mace of English language. It was transferred to USA many moons ago when Hollywood got the soft power it now holds. 

 

UK is now a vassal state when it come to the English language. Sorry for your loss. 

 

 

 

The languages for the future will be English and Chinese. 

 

You should think about learning them.

 

Ironic really, that the common language of the EU, even after Brexit will be English! 

[Greenisland]

6 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Then don't bother reading the posts newbie. No one forces you too.

 

Yep, Greece maintained it's unjustified self indulgent lavish lifestyle for much longer with EU hand-outs.

 

Too bad you seem to expect this, that others should work and pay to support the lazy. 

 

The UK won't have to pay anything if the negotiated deal isn't formally signed by both parties. It's a proposal at the moment. Should the UK agree to pay, then the EU must make clear how the UK's share of EU assets will be apportioned to the UK too. 

 

 

I'm aware of the ignore ability. I hope I don't have to use it with you. 

 

Greece had huge internal problem, which was kind of solved by the crisis they had and the aftermath of all that. Really, giving your friend, the cleaner man, more salary than an engineer would get, is the way to go? That was the situation in Greece at that point. It got fixed, I hope.

 

UK will pay it's previously agreed commitments as required by the international law. There is no way UK could slip away from that. 

 

Or there is.. but afterwards, no other country in the world will trust British government's commitments in the future. Britain will cease to exists. 

 

 

[Greenisland]

5 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Off topic but hopefully the mods will tolerate this.

 

"It[English] has replaced French as the lingua franca of diplomacy since World War II. The rise of English in diplomacy began in 1919, in the aftermath of World War I, when the Treaty of Versailles was written in English as well as in French, the dominant language used in diplomacy until that time."

 

De Gaulle did well to insist French was a UN language as he fort to keep France relevant after WW11. Hardly succeeded! I remember when working in France some colleagues lamenting how disappointed they were when travelling to find out French wasn't the international language they thought it was.

 

Who gives a toss what the Arabic word for French is? But if it amuses you. You'd be better learning about the EU though as clearly there's a gap there.

I do agree with this. 

 

This is also an example how the French used to be the language of the world back in time. Quite like English is that language on our era. 

 

This also means that lingua francas do tend to change over the years. English is not forever our common language. 

[Greenisland]

5 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

The languages for the future will be English and Chinese. 

 

You should think about learning them.

 

Ironic really, that the common language of the EU, even after Brexit will be English! 

English, Spanish and Chinese are the three languages, we all should learn.

 

Chinese writing is unfortunately so different that it's not likely the Chinese language will penetrate the whole world, unless they figure out how to really simplify their writings. 

 

Common language in EU is, as said, rather bad English ????

 

I hope it stays that way. 

[david555]

21 minutes ago, Greenisland said:

But of course it was like that.. in the past. 

 

UK no longer hold the ceremonial mace of English language. It was transferred to USA many moons ago when Hollywood got the soft power it now holds. 

 

UK is now a vassal state when it come to the English language. Sorry for your loss. 

 

 

Indeed it was Hollywood who made me understand English American English as I never learned at school ,as we only learned the 3 languages spoken in my country ,and only later because of internet  I started to try writing it with much help from auto corrector .

So thanks to those good and bad Hollywood heroes I am a little bit able to be on this forum ...

Only later  those British comedy ones which I enjoyed too as " minister minster " , when I see the Brexit saga I get flash backs to those " minister minister " comedy series ….., looks they where years ahead ….Or where you always to laughing with already...

Edited March 31, 2019 by david555

[Monomial]

As much as I enjoy the esoteric discussion of which language is appropriate to use to express the ultimate death of the United Kingdom, I was wondering if someone could explain the actual situation to those of us who don't really get it.

 

On one hand, I see articles like this one that talk about the worry people have that a no deal Brexit may be more likely. On the other hand, I see articles about Monday being the final "remainer trap" that makes any Brexit essentially impossible, let alone a no deal exit.

 

I have to admit I have no time to understand the nuances, but can someone give an unbiased summary on what is really going to happen?  Seems to me that there is essentially no option now but to stay in the EU and ask for an extension, and that May can do that all by herself without anybody's permission.  Does anyone seriously believe she won't do this?

 

As for the EU vetoing this idea, it seems only France has said anything like that...and, well, they're French. I seriously doubt that they would actually torpedo the whole EU block just to stick it to the English.

 

So why is there a fear of a no deal Brexit at all? It seems more likely that the only thing on the table is kicking the can down the road forever, and frankly I don't see it in any country's interest not to accommodate this. Is there something I am missing that makes a "no deal Brexit" more likely than extending the Article 50 date forever?

 

[Greenisland]

2 minutes ago, Monomial said:

On one hand, I see articles like this one that talk about the worry people have that a no deal Brexit may be more likely. On the other hand, I see articles about Monday being the final "remainer trap" that makes any Brexit essentially impossible, let alone a no deal exit.

 

I have to admit I have no time to understand the nuances, but can someone give an unbiased summary on what is really going to happen?  Seems to me that there is essentially no option now but to stay in the EU and ask for an extension, and that May can do that all by herself without anybody's permission.  Does anyone seriously believe she won't do this?

1) Brexit is going to happen in the most hardest way possible on April 11th.

2) There is no longer will on the EU side to keep on supporting UK's failing government

3) Most reasonable members of UK's parliament, businesses and people do know that suffering about brexit decision will happen. 

 

This was always a stupid 'game' of political power, which will show it's hard hand in the future. 

 

Stupid, stupid game started by a big loving previous PM.

[david555]

8 minutes ago, Monomial said:

As much as I enjoy the esoteric discussion of which language is appropriate to use to express the ultimate death of the United Kingdom, I was wondering if someone could explain the actual situation to those of us who don't really get it.

 

On one hand, I see articles like this one that talk about the worry people have that a no deal Brexit may be more likely. On the other hand, I see articles about Monday being the final "remainer trap" that makes any Brexit essentially impossible, let alone a no deal exit.

 

I have to admit I have no time to understand the nuances, but can someone give an unbiased summary on what is really going to happen?  Seems to me that there is essentially no option now but to stay in the EU and ask for an extension, and that May can do that all by herself without anybody's permission.  Does anyone seriously believe she won't do this?

 

As for the EU vetoing this idea, it seems only France has said anything like that...and, well, they're French. I seriously doubt that they would actually torpedo the whole EU block just to stick it to the English.

 

So why is there a fear of a no deal Brexit at all? It seems more likely that the only thing on the table is kicking the can down the road forever, and frankly I don't see it in any country's interest not to accommodate this. Is there something I am missing that makes a "no deal Brexit" more likely than extending the Article 50 date forever?

 

In connection with the red marked lines ….this cartoon looks fit to it  

Yes May can ask and have her extension ….forever....( shall serve Macron's purpose about the fishing rights ..????

Edited March 31, 2019 by david555

[malagateddy]

They can go forth and multiply

A important quote from Barnier …., (especially for trade talks after a nodeal Brexit end …)
 
 

The EU’s chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, told the diplomats during the meeting that a no deal was now “the most plausible outcome”, and that there was an urgent need to war-game the bloc’s response to it. The EU is to step up its “full-on crisis” preparations, according to a diplomatic note.

It was agreed among the member states that for there to be any talks after the UK has crashed out, the bloc’s 27 capitals will expect Downing Street to agree to signal by 18 April that it will pay the £39bn Brexit bill despite the failure of the Commons to ratify the withdrawal agreement......

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[david555]

43 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

They can go forth and multiply

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

Be not surprised that the 39 bill. is the most secret agreement made by May ….and "dancing around the truth"  when asked about it ...even in the commons , and Cox already explained carefully weighting his words on it ….(very hot item politically for the conservatives …)

Anyway for next chapter ..after /whenever / if it ever happens ….Brexit

Edited March 31, 2019 by david555

[Brigand]

The Remainers might not like it but I think the EU is quite happy for the UK to leave as many on the continent see the UK as a hurdle to ever closer integration on many fronts and it (the UK) has always been considered an obstacle to this due to the consensus requirements. If the UK stayed in, and everything went back to how it was with the Remainers dreams being realised, then it's back to slow motion on many fronts that the French and Germans want to speed up...plus a load of anti-EU MEPs will be elected shortly and Junkers/Tusk/Macron etc. will have 20 Nigel Farages telling them what a bunch of <deleted> they are instead of just one or two.

 

Personally, I think the EU is happy to see the back of the UK but just wants to screw-them-over on the way out for good measure as a parting shot/handbags gesture with connotations of a warning to others.

[Greenisland]

4 minutes ago, Brigand said:

The Remainers might not like it but I think the EU is quite happy for the UK to leave as many on the continent see the UK as a hurdle to ever closer integration on many fronts and it (the UK) has always been considered an obstacle to this due to the consensus requirements. If the UK stayed in, and everything went back to how it was with the Remainers dreams being realised, then it's back to slow motion on many fronts that the French and Germans want to speed up...plus a load of anti-EU MEPs will be elected shortly and Junkers/Tusk/Macron etc. will have 20 Nigel Farages telling them what a bunch of <deleted> they are instead of just one or two.

 

Personally, I think the EU is happy to see the back of the UK but just wants to screw-them-over on the way out for good measure as a parting shot/handbags gesture with connotations of a warning to others.

Most of EU member states see UK as a good guy, which have some serious internal problems. Quite like Greece or Italy at the height of their internal problems.

 

Let's face it. UK is currently in crisis. The state of the union is not going to be solved in anytime soon. It will take a decade or two to solve UK's internal issues. What it really wants to become and how it wishes to serve its citizens. 

 

If UK wishes to get out and figure out what it really wishes to be, that's all fine by the EU member countries. I see UK trying to re-join the EU in 10 years time. This time with less privileges UK still have today. 

 

I'd say that the future UK is going to be far more acclimated member to our union, than what the current state of UK is. That's when the real co-operation begins once again. 

[bannork]

May's plan seems to be to take her proposal to the wire with the understanding, ' It's this or no deal Brexit'. She's whittled down the opposition considerably over the three votes and now some of the hardline Brexiteers are saying half a loaf is better than no loaf at all. I won't be surprised if they finally vote for her deal this week. Half baked but there you go.

And yes, there are reports the EU leaders think a no deal Brexit will happen. They feel they've wasted enough time on the dithering UK so out the door the UK goes with May's deal or no deal at all.

A referendum not thought out followed by years of bickering over what 'leave' chosen by a narrow majority of 52 to 48% really means.

Cameron, what a tosser.

 

[BritManToo]

14 minutes ago, bannork said:

A referendum not thought out followed by years of bickering over what 'leave' chosen by a narrow majority of 52 to 48% really means.

The only bickering over 'what leave' is by people who never wanted to leave.

Everyone who actually voted to leave knew exactly what it meant, stop paying the membership fees.

Edited March 31, 2019 by BritManToo

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, Greenisland said:

Most of EU member states see UK as a good guy, which have some serious internal problems. Quite like Greece or Italy at the height of their internal problems.

France with rioting every weekend doesn't have any internal problems?

Greece has already been bankrupted by the EU, and Italy will be next.

But hey, the UK is the only country with problems?

As far as I can see the only problem the UK has, is membership of the EU.

[Greenisland]

Just now, BritManToo said:

France with rioting every weekend doesn't have any internal problems?

Germany, rape capitol of the world, doesn't have problems either?

Greece has already been bankrupted by the EU, and Italy will be next.

 

But hey, the UK is the only country with problems?

Oh my. Each country has both their own problems as well as their own excellence. That is what makes EU such an powerful union.

 

 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, Greenisland said:

I'm using Canadian English keyboard as it's one of the only English speaking nations, which are rather good for the reasonably thinking people. NZ could be even better ????

 

I sent my elder daughter to Vancouver to learn English for a year. She came back speaking Canadian. I may sue.

[david555]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

France with rioting every weekend doesn't have any internal problems?

Germany, rape capitol of the world, doesn't have problems either?

Greece has already been bankrupted by the EU, and Italy will be next.

 

But hey, the UK is the only country with problems?

As far as I can see the only problem the UK has, is membership of the EU.

So your every day knife crime stabbings are just a daily life thing in U.K...…. seems Brexit debacle paralyses brains too now

[wabothai]

9 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

France with rioting every weekend doesn't have any internal problems?

Germany, rape capitol of the world, doesn't have problems either?

Greece has already been bankrupted by the EU, and Italy will be next.

 

But hey, the UK is the only country with problems?

As far as I can see the only problem the UK has, is membership of the EU.

UK no longer exists. Rather UN-united kingdom.

[Greenisland]

1 minute ago, Grouse said:

I sent my elder daughter to Vancouver to learn English for a year. She came back speaking Canadian. I may sue.

I shall not bear any responsibility for children learning to say "I'm sorry" as their fillup sentence.  

[david555]

1 minute ago, wabothai said:

UK no longer exists. Rather UN-united kingdom.

Still same letters G.B. as for ….Great Brexit  now ...

[adammike]

23 minutes ago, Greenisland said:

Most of EU member states see UK as a good guy, which have some serious internal problems. Quite like Greece or Italy at the height of their internal problems.

 

Let's face it. UK is currently in crisis. The state of the union is not going to be solved in anytime soon. It will take a decade or two to solve UK's internal issues. What it really wants to become and how it wishes to serve its citizens. 

 

If UK wishes to get out and figure out what it really wishes to be, that's all fine by the EU member countries. I see UK trying to re-join the EU in 10 years time. This time with less privileges UK still have today. 

 

I'd say that the future UK is going to be far more acclimated member to our union, than what the current state of UK is. That's when the real co-operation begins once again. 

You think the UK will exist in 10 years? Brexit is an English Tory party clustererf**k,The Catholics will be in a majority in NI in 10 years,The Scots will have another reason to despises the English if we really leave the EU and take away their right to live and work there.The only part of England that will count on the world stage is London and the south of England, the rest of England and Wales will be a vassel state and a source of cheap labour to one of the super powers and for your sake you better hope it's the USA or the EU because the Chinese think we are ignorant peasants. 

[damascase]

On 3/30/2019 at 2:35 PM, rocketman777 said:

WRONG!!!  The UK would be leaving under WTO rules, whereby they can set their own trade tariffs.

They can set zero trade traiffs with the EU if they wish and provided the EU reciprocates.

 

Wait and see how quickly Merkel will  want to deal once the UK operates with WTO rules

 

 

Yeah, set their own trade tariffs, but under WTO you’ll have to apply the same zero trade tariffs to all other WTO Members. If that’s what you want, go ahead!

[damascase]

23 hours ago, Pilotman said:

The fatal mistake was made on day one after Article 50 was triggered.  We should have sat down in the negotiating room and said to the EU people, "okay mateys, we're off, then sat back  and said nothing more until they came up with a deal". 

Well, the EU came up with a deal, didn’t it. It would have been a much better deal if the UK had had a clue about the direction to take.........

[malagateddy]

"You little minded fools"..dear oh dear greenisland..is that the best you can do??..try to be insulting to Brexiteers...tell you what..you could always go forth and multiply[emoji6]

Like, what, in realistic terms, about 20% of the population really wanted to leave?
 
You do get clarity for your membership feeds. You also get the thing called ESA and everything what comes with it. 
 
Good luck with your own, proud nationalistic space program! [emoji1] You little minded fools.
 

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[Pilotman]

50 minutes ago, damascase said:

Well, the EU came up with a deal, didn’t it. It would have been a much better deal if the UK had had a clue about the direction to take.........

not the one we want, so back to them.  What part of we want to leave their fairy tail, Federal European,  undemocratic club don't they understand?  

Edited March 31, 2019 by Pilotman

[Grouse]

I keep hearing about EU intransigence. I don't get it.

 

What does the U.K. Want that the EU is refusing us? Maybe a rational Brexiter can explain.

 

The EU is a club. 52% want to leave? What exactly is the EU doing to thwart this? 

 

To me, remaining is obviously the better option. The EU needs to make changes most certainly.