Do Residents Of Thailand Need To Declare All Their Assets?

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

I recently learned that anyone who stay in thailand for more than 180 days

in a year, is considered a thai resident for tax purposes and have to

pay income tax on all his income from all over the world.

my question is, in such a case, does a thai resident (for tax purposes - this has

nothing to do with the type of visa) have to declare all his assets accross

the globe to the thai tax authorities?

this is the law in many - but not all - other countries - anyone who is considered tax resident

must declare all his assets all over the world.

is this the case now also in thailand?

this is important because now most banks all over the world cooperate with each other,

and sometimes will not let you withdraw your money if you don't show

that you paid taxes in your country of tax residency (or just like that

becasue the bank manager don't like you)

Edited April 7, 2019 by metisdead
ALL CAPS removed from topic title.

[ThaiBunny]

You need to read all of that in the context of any tax treaty your home country has with Thailand.  You are right - where you are actually (physically) resident may have nothing to do with where you are (and remain) a tax resident.  Most of us remain tax residents of our home country as we continue to receive income from there.  If that home country has a tax treaty with Thailand it will say something like your tax residence in your home country trumps any claim to tax residence by Thailand.  In practice the Thais are simply not interested.  I'll now let the bush lawyers here argue otherwise

[Peterw42]

I think most people consider any money bought into thailand as savings, not income earned in that year. Thailand has tax treaties with UK, Australia etc so any money is usually only taxed in the country it is earned in. Assets are usually purchased with money you already paid tax on and dont attract a further tax liability.

Never heard of a bank that wont let you withdraw your own money, no matter what your tax liability is, that is conspiracy theory rubbish.

[ThaiBunny]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

Never heard of a bank that wont let you withdraw your own money, no matter what your tax liability is, that is conspiracy theory rubbish.

The IRS (or equivalent) would need some legal authority to freeze your assets for non-payment of tax.  There have been reports of Australians being prevented from leaving the country because of substantial unpaid debts for child support that's been ordered as part of a divorce settlement, but their bank accounts aren't frozen

[jackdd]

Thailand has this loophole which says you only have to pay income tax on income which is brought into Thailand the year it's earned. So i do of course only bring savings from last year into Thailand.

[glegolo]

10 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

I think most people consider any money bought into thailand as savings, not income earned in that year. Thailand has tax treaties with UK, Australia etc so any money is usually only taxed in the country it is earned in. Assets are usually purchased with money you already paid tax on and dont attract a further tax liability.

Never heard of a bank that wont let you withdraw your own money, no matter what your tax liability is, that is conspiracy theory rubbish.

Surprice!!! The world is a little bit bigger than many people think.... Tax treaties is found amongst almost all countries in Europe with Thailand, so absolutely nothing special at all....

 

glegolo

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

16 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

You need to read all of that in the context of any tax treaty your home country has with Thailand.  You are right - where you are actually (physically) resident may have nothing to do with where you are (and remain) a tax resident.  Most of us remain tax residents of our home country as we continue to receive income from there.  If that home country has a tax treaty with Thailand it will say something like your tax residence in your home country trumps any claim to tax residence by Thailand.  In practice the Thais are simply not interested.  I'll now let the bush lawyers here argue otherwise

where you are actually (physically) resident HAS ANYTHING to do with where you are (and remain) a tax resident. THIS IS THE THAI LAW NOW. if you stay in thailand - no mattar on which kind of visa - for more than 180 days a year, you have to pay tax in thailand.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

14 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

The IRS (or equivalent) would need some legal authority to freeze your assets for non-payment of tax.  There have been reports of Australians being prevented from leaving the country because of substantial unpaid debts for child support that's been ordered as part of a divorce settlement, but their bank accounts aren't frozen

i don't know where do you live, but here on planet earth many banks don't accept anymore payments from other banks, if they can't see the tax papers for it. try to send 100,000 USD to a U.S. bank account, and see what happans.

[elviajero]

@SCOTT FITZGERSLD

 

You are 'tax Resident' if staying in the country more than 180 days in a tax year; therefore, should complete an annual tax return.

 

Whether or not you have an actual tax liability is another matter.

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

21 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

I think most people consider any money bought into thailand as savings, not income earned in that year. Thailand has tax treaties with UK, Australia etc so any money is usually only taxed in the country it is earned in. Assets are usually purchased with money you already paid tax on and dont attract a further tax liability.

Never heard of a bank that wont let you withdraw your own money, no matter what your tax liability is, that is conspiracy theory rubbish.

yes, but my question was, besides the tax liability, do tax residents of thailand (anyone who stay in thailand for more than 180 days in a year) has to DECLARE their assets all over the world? cause that is the law in many other countries. declaration is  BIG HEADECH and potential problem.

[elviajero]

3 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

yes, but my question was, besides the tax liability, do tax residents of thailand (anyone who stay in thailand for more than 180 days in a year) has to DECLARE their assets all over the world? cause that is the law in many other countries. declaration is  BIG HEADECH and potential problem.

You only need to declare anything that creates a tax liability in Thailand. An asset aboard that does not create a tax liability does not need to be declared.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

3 minutes ago, elviajero said:

@SCOTT FITZGERSLD

 

You are 'tax Resident' if staying in the country more than 180 days in a tax year; therefore, should complete an annual tax return.

 

Whether or not you have an actual tax liability is another matter.

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

thanks, but this still does not answer my question - do thai tax resident HAVE TO DECLARE all his assets all over the world?

also, being tax resident in thailand does not mean you have to complete an annual tax return, if you did not earn anything in that year. but in many countries , you still have to declare ALL YOUR ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD, even if you did not earn anything.

[scorecard]

9 minutes ago, elviajero said:

@SCOTT FITZGERSLD

 

You are 'tax Resident' if staying in the country more than 180 days in a tax year; therefore, should complete an annual tax return.

 

Whether or not you have an actual tax liability is another matter.

 

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

Agree. Here's another example; I have PR more than 20 years, and in all of those years I have been physically in Thailand more than 180 days. For all of thos years my company accountant / my personal accountant completed and submitted my personal Thai annual tax return, a few times I had to pay a little more tax, for many years I got a small to large refund.

 

In all of those years my personal assets (In or out of Thailand) were never inserted on my annual thai tax return.

 

 

Edited April 7, 2019 by scorecard

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

2 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You only need to declare anything that creates a tax liability in Thailand. An asset aboard that does not create a tax liability does not need to be declared.

do you KNOW it, or just believe?

[elviajero]

2 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

also, being tax resident in thailand does not mean you have to complete an annual tax return, if you did not earn anything in that year. but in many countries , you still have to declare ALL YOUR ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD, even if you did not earn anything.

It's a self assessment system. My understanding is that you only need to complete a tax return if you have a tax liability to declare.

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

Just now, scorecard said:

Agree. Here's another example; I have PR more than 20 years, and in all of those years I have been physically in Thailand more than 180 days. For all of thos years my company accountant / my personal accountant completed and submitted my personal Thai annual tax return, a few times I had to pay a little more tax, for many years I got a small to large refund.

 

In all of those years my personal assets were never inserted on my annual thai tax return.

 

 

THAT IS THE ANSWER, I GUESS.

it is important, becuase in other countries, and i think most europe, a tax resident - or anyone who stay in the country for more than 180 days a year - has to DECLARE ALL HIS ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD !!

[elviajero]

1 minute ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

do you KNOW it, or just believe?

Know. I have businesses and assets in Thailand and the UK.

[UKresonant]

My understanding of it is that you do not need to declare your assets overseas, it would only be if you disposed of an asset and sent the money to Thailand in the same calendar/Tax year, if the capital gain could potentially be classified as income...

[GroveHillWanderer]

4 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

if you stay in thailand - no mattar on which kind of visa - for more than 180 days a year, you have to pay tax in thailand.

That's a mischaracterisation of what the tax code says. It says that if you're in Thailand for more than 180 days a year, you're considered resident in Thailand for tax purposes. So if you have taxable income that was earned and brought into Thailand in the current tax year - and file a tax return declaring that, you might potentially have a tax liability.

 

Being resident in a country for tax purposes does not automatically mean that you have to pay tax in that country.  It might potentially turn out to be the case but there are many different factors to consider before that can be determined.

 

For instance, there have been several years when I was resident in the UK for tax purposes but did not have to pay any tax as I had not earned enough taxable income.

[elviajero]

6 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

THAT IS THE ANSWER, I GUESS.

it is important, becuase in other countries, and i think most europe, a tax resident - or anyone who stay in the country for more than 180 days a year - has to DECLARE ALL HIS ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD !!

There are thousands of expats living in Thailand and the Revenue Department aren't tracking them down demanding to know about their foreign assets. IMO that is all the proof you need.

 

 

[userabcd]

33 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

do you KNOW it, or just believe?

Paying tax depends on your assets, residence, domicile, where the income, dividends, capital gains etc... arises, is remitted, and the countries rules on what you should declare and be paying tax on what, where and when. There exists tax treaties between nation's so one can avoid paying tax twice. You can be resident for tax in more than one jurisdiction. Suggest you consult one of the big accountancy companies about your specific situation.

Edited April 7, 2019 by userabcd

[GroveHillWanderer]

11 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

it is important, becuase in other countries, and i think most europe, a tax resident - or anyone who stay in the country for more than 180 days a year - has to DECLARE ALL HIS ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD !!

I don't know about every country in the world but to the best of my knowledge, for most of them you only have to declare what is considered to be your taxable income according to the tax laws of that country. That is a long way from having to declare all your assets worldwide.

[NCC1701A]

nothing has changed since the last time this was brought up.

 

 

[wordchild]

39 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

where you are actually (physically) resident HAS ANYTHING to do with where you are (and remain) a tax resident. THIS IS THE THAI LAW NOW. if you stay in thailand - no mattar on which kind of visa - for more than 180 days a year, you have to pay tax in thailand.

true, but only on that portion of your income that is relevant; ie , most sorts of income earned within the country plus overseas income earned and brought into Thailand during the same tax year (Dec-Jan) 

[wordchild]

36 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

yes, but my question was, besides the tax liability, do tax residents of thailand (anyone who stay in thailand for more than 180 days in a year) has to DECLARE their assets all over the world? cause that is the law in many other countries. declaration is  BIG HEADECH and potential problem.

Short answer- No, thankfully.

[wordchild]

29 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

do you KNOW it, or just believe?

 

29 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

do you KNOW it, or just believe?

That is also the tax advise that i have had, from my own Thai tax advisers. . To the OP Thailand is not the USA!

[wordchild]

36 minutes ago, elviajero said:

It's a self assessment system. My understanding is that you only need to complete a tax return if you have a tax liability to declare.

spot on! (except that  you may also file if you have tax to reclaim) OP please note again, Thailand is not the USA. but , who knows, one day your tax paranoia maybe justified!

Edited April 7, 2019 by wordchild

[wordchild]

32 minutes ago, SCOTT FITZGERSLD said:

THAT IS THE ANSWER, I GUESS.

it is important, becuase in other countries, and i think most europe, a tax resident - or anyone who stay in the country for more than 180 days a year - has to DECLARE ALL HIS ASSETS ALL OVER THE WORLD !!

Not true!

[GroveHillWanderer]

As I read it, Thai tax law does not require you to declare "all the assets" you have everywhere in the world. According to their website they're not interested in what you have elsewhere, only what earn here or bring in.

 

Quote

Taxpayers are classified into “resident” and “non-resident”. “Resident” means any person residing in Thailand for a period or periods aggregating more than 180 days in any tax (calendar) year. A resident of Thailand is liable to pay tax on income from sources in Thailand as well as on the portion of income from foreign sources that is brought into Thailand.

 

[SCOTT FITZGERSLD]

18 minutes ago, elviajero said:

There are thousands of expats living in Thailand and the Revenue Department aren't tracking them down demanding to know about their foreign assets. IMO that is all the proof you need.

 

 

but laws are changing all the time, especially in the international tax arena, so i was just wondering...becuase in another country where i am resident my accountant told me that

sine two years ago, any resident has to declare all his assets world wide.

it does not mean neccasarily they will tax me now worldwide, but the law says i must declare it

to that country, and since thailand follows slowly, i was wondering if they implneted here

allready (i saw on the internet that thailand will join the CRS - authomatic financial reporting - by 2022, so here it comes.