800K 5 Months 400K Indefinitely In Bank For Ext To Stay Based In Retirement

[Graviton]

17 minutes ago, elviajero said:

The TM.30 is the form used to report a foreigners stay (Section 38).

 

Nice video, but again it's office specific.

 

All that you are posting is pretty much backing up everything I've written. And specifically that the enforcement was ramped up due to "national security" following the bombing. It hasn't been done to make life harder for expats or force them into using agents, which was the claim that started this conversation.

 

 

Spain has different authorities and districts? I don’t have any issues with abiding by the law... but lack of clarity bugs me...... its as I thought in Chonburi so alls well.....

 

Edited May 31, 2019 by Graviton
Incomplete

[newnative]

1 hour ago, Graviton said:

Then next year no extn balance went less than 400k?

     You and Jingthing are, naturally, looking at the law, which you also think is unfair, personally.  Basically, what happens to me, personally, if I don't follow this law that I don't like and think is unfair?  What happens if I, personally, don't keep my bank account at the required amount?   Thailand and all other countries are not thinking of you personally when they pass laws.  They are thinking of the collective good.  

     Country X passes a law that will take away your driver's license if you are pulled over for driving drunk.  It's not aimed at anyone personally.  It's aimed at the general good of keeping drunk drivers from getting behind the wheel.  Now, it's up to the individuals in Country X to decide if they still want to drive drunk or not--and deal with the consequences.   Joe Blow losing his driver's license for drunk driving is really of no concern to Country X.   Sorry, Joe.

   Same with Thailand's law.  Thailand wants to see retirees who are not using the monthly income scheme keep a certain amount of money in the bank.  Thailand has made the determination, whether you agree with it or not, that it's for the collective good to not have foreign retirees be a burden for the country.  It's up to the individual to decide how he or she handles the requirements, and the consequences of not following what is required.  Joe Blow losing his retirement visa because he didn't follow the rules is really of no concern to Thailand.  Sorry, Joe.   

    You can bang your head against the wall and scream that the rules are unfair or inconsistent but it's Thailand's ball and they make the rules of the game.   I, myself, just think of the 800,000 as a required security deposit for my 1 year lease on living in Thailand.  

 

[newnative]

4 hours ago, Joe Mcseismic said:

Except that the 65k per month is retrospective with no indication that they can meet the current year's expenses.

     I'm surprised Thailand doesn't require at least some money being kept in Thai banks by those using the monthly income method.  

[Graviton]

17 minutes ago, newnative said:

     You and Jingthing are, naturally, looking at the law, which you also think is unfair, personally.  Basically, what happens to me, personally, if I don't follow this law that I don't like and think is unfair?  What happens if I, personally, don't keep my bank account at the required amount?   Thailand and all other countries are not thinking of you personally when they pass laws.  They are thinking of the collective good.  

     Country X passes a law that will take away your driver's license if you are pulled over for driving drunk.  It's not aimed at anyone personally.  It's aimed at the general good of keeping drunk drivers from getting behind the wheel.  Now, it's up to the individuals in Country X to decide if they still want to drive drunk or not--and deal with the consequences.   Joe Blow losing his driver's license for drunk driving is really of no concern to Country X.   Sorry, Joe.

   Same with Thailand's law.  Thailand wants to see retirees who are not using the monthly income scheme keep a certain amount of money in the bank.  Thailand has made the determination, whether you agree with it or not, that it's for the collective good to not have foreign retirees be a burden for the country.  It's up to the individual to decide how he or she handles the requirements, and the consequences of not following what is required.  Joe Blow losing his retirement visa because he didn't follow the rules is really of no concern to Thailand.  Sorry, Joe.   

    You can bang your head against the wall and scream that the rules are unfair or inconsistent but it's Thailand's ball and they make the rules of the game.   I, myself, just think of the 800,000 as a required security deposit for my 1 year lease on living in Thailand.  

 

I am on exactly the same page as you and don’t have any problems in complying to New regulations, as its no different really from when I first came, except it is locked in. I’d like to think it was done to prevent more hardship from mandatory health insurance being applied, as you have that safety net built in if you use that route. Some say to stop agents... who knows?

I just asked a question thats all......

 

I still like living here, good weather less stress....

[elviajero]

37 minutes ago, Graviton said:

Spain has different authorities and districts? I don’t have any issues with abiding by the law... but lack of clarity bugs me...... its as I thought in Chonburi so alls well.....

 

Bugs me too. But it’s best not to look at what happens nationally and just focus on your own office. 

[Graviton]

3 minutes ago, newnative said:

     I'm surprised Thailand doesn't require at least some money being kept in Thai banks by those using the monthly income method.  

That was a point I made lets face it no security in the bank account here except 1 month

[Graviton]

5 minutes ago, newnative said:

     I'm surprised Thailand doesn't require at least some money being kept in Thai banks by those using the monthly income method.  

What about folk that own 5 mill baht condos, in the west they are used as collateral?

[elviajero]

2 minutes ago, Graviton said:

7 minutes ago, newnative said:

     I'm surprised Thailand doesn't require at least some money being kept in Thai banks by those using the monthly income method.  

That was a point I made lets face it no security in the bank account here except 1 month

The 400K has nothing to do with ‘security’. It is to make fraud harder and help control numbers.

[Graviton]

4 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Bugs me too. But it’s best not to look at what happens nationally and just focus on your own office. 

I do and immigration here are brilliant, always pleasent. 

[bert bloggs]

8 minutes ago, Graviton said:

I am on exactly the same page as you and don’t have any problems in complying to New regulations, as its no different really from when I first came, except it is locked in. I’d like to think it was done to prevent more hardship from mandatory health insurance being applied, as you have that safety net built in if you use that route. Some say to stop agents... who knows?

I just asked a question thats all......

 

I still like living here, good weather less stress....

but you cant use it as health insurance ,if you do ,you lose your right to stay ,if it was for that ,then i have no problem.

[newnative]

2 minutes ago, Graviton said:

I am on exactly the same page as you and don’t have any problems in complying to New regulations, as its no different really from when I first came, except it is locked in. I’d like to think it was done to prevent more hardship from mandatory health insurance being applied, as you have that safety net built in if you use that route. Some say to stop agents... who knows?

I just asked a question thats all......

 

I still like living here, good weather less stress....

  I still like living here, too.  Being lazy, I will usually take the easiest path.  In this case, the easiest path for me is just parking the 800,000 and not doing anything with it year-round so I don't need to be bothered with what the 'seasoning' rule is this year, how much I can take out, etc.  As I said before, I just look at it as a required security deposit for living here and don't think of it as a big deal.  it's certainly easier for me than using the monthly income scheme.  

[xtrnuno41]

Im not allowed to guess, but looks simple

a) there is money to kick you out of Thailand

b) money on the bank is working capital for the banks, the longer its there , the more reliable to work with

[Graviton]

4 minutes ago, bert bloggs said:

but you cant use it as health insurance ,if you do ,you lose your right to stay ,if it was for that ,then i have no problem.

Been here before? you can use 400K and put it back before due, plus its in thai baht already.....

[Graviton]

3 minutes ago, newnative said:

  I still like living here, too.  Being lazy, I will usually take the easiest path.  In this case, the easiest path for me is just parking the 800,000 and not doing anything with it year-round so I don't need to be bothered with what the 'seasoning' rule is this year, how much I can take out, etc.  As I said before, I just look at it as a required security deposit for living here and don't think of it as a big deal.  it's certainly easier for me than using the monthly income scheme.  

Many cannot meet that criteria of 65k after 2008 collapse look at sterling today, 75 when I moved here

[newnative]

11 minutes ago, Graviton said:

What about folk that own 5 mill baht condos, in the west they are used as collateral?

I think Thailand wants to see cold, hard cash, immediately available in a Thai bank.

[ubonjoe]

A off topic post has been removed.

[Graviton]

Well thanks to all who contributed. My first topic on here, lets move on now and let the dust settle. I am confident it will be all for the good.....????

 

Does anybody know how to end a topic, ie close it so we can move on?  or does it fade into obscurity organically like..................

Edited May 31, 2019 by Graviton
Added

[Gecko123]

8 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Furthermore tge vast majority if Imm offices gave no agents operating. The agent 5hing us limited to locations with large numbers of expats.

Yet these many other Imm offices also do the various things some are suggesting are done for the purpose of encouraging use of agents.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Sheryl, I'm in Central Thailand, small regional IO, and not that many expats, but the last time I went in agents seemed to outnumber foreigners. Everybody had a little basket in their lap filled with passports. I'm guessing that they were processing people from ASEAN on work permits for farm labour. But I'd say, if agents are as active in my regional office as they appear to be, I'll bet there aren't many offices where you couldn't find one if you looked.

[Thaidream]

4 hours ago, Jingthing said:

You're speculating. From an expats POV, it's simply onerous. 

It's absolutely onerous simply because for 5 months your 800K is not allowed to be used for your living expenses.  Under the prior rules after the initial seasoning- one could use the 800K for  expenses; purchase a  home appliance; travel etc.

 

In essence- an applicant using this method now must use  added funds for their living expenses.  Since the Thai Government has indicated 65K was their monthly minimum that means the applicant not only needs the 800K but also  65K x 5 months  or 325,000 Baht.  In essence, they have raised the amount needed to 1,125,000 Baht.  Where is the Grandfathering that was so prevalent in prior raises?

 

If they had at least grandfathered those already on an extension- this may not have been so onerous but they didn't care to do it.

 

I have my own opinion on why they did this and it involves  an effort to cull the numbers of long stayers.

 

For those who say there is no change- you are wrong. There maybe no change for you but other's do have a change and it has nothing to do with not having the funds .

[Brickbat]

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Try doing that in person and one might end up paying big money not to go to jail. Not that I know personally, as never paid a bribe to stay.

 

7 hours ago, Graviton said:

Is this paid to an agent? 

All corruption is done through agents, from what I gather. Immigration staff can’t organise the cash deposit. 

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

It's absolutely onerous simply because for 5 months your 800K is not allowed to be used for your living expenses.  Under the prior rules after the initial seasoning- one could use the 800K for  expenses; purchase a  home appliance; travel etc.

 

In essence- an applicant using this method now must use  added funds for their living expenses.  Since the Thai Government has indicated 65K was their monthly minimum that means the applicant not only needs the 800K but also  65K x 5 months  or 325,000 Baht.  In essence, they have raised the amount needed to 1,125,000 Baht.  Where is the Grandfathering that was so prevalent in prior raises?

 

If they had at least grandfathered those already on an extension- this may not have been so onerous but they didn't care to do it.

 

I have my own opinion on why they did this and it involves  an effort to cull the numbers of long stayers.

 

For those who say there is no change- you are wrong. There maybe no change for you but other's do have a change and it has nothing to do with not having the funds .

Yes, for many of us the change is indeed massive and yes many people are in the process of being CULLED (in the shorter or longer term). 

[fishtank]

3 hours ago, Graviton said:

Well thanks to all who contributed. My first topic on here, lets move on now and let the dust settle. I am confident it will be all for the good.....????

 

Does anybody know how to end a topic, ie close it so we can move on?  or does it fade into obscurity organically like..................

If nobody responds it just fades away........

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, fishtank said:

If nobody responds it just fades away........

Yeah but sometimes these topics have lives of their own … 

[notrub]

800K 5 Months 400K Indefinitely In Bank For Ext To Stay Based In Retirement???  What?

Excuse me, I must have been asleep at the wheel.  What does this mean and where can I find out how it might affect me please?  I am 71, have a retirement visa due for renewal in 01 2020 and have over 1M THB (in a euro account) in the bank and a small pension too.  I am not married but plan to do so soon.  I live in my house built on land with an usufruct contract.

 

Thanks for any comments.  

 

[phuketrichard]

3 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

Sheryl, I'm in Central Thailand, small regional IO, and not that many expats, but the last time I went in agents seemed to outnumber foreigners. Everybody had a little basket in their lap filled with passports. I'm guessing that they were processing people from ASEAN on work permits for farm labour. But I'd say, if agents are as active in my regional office as they appear to be, I'll bet there aren't many offices where you couldn't find one if you looked.

dont know how its done up country, but in Phuket
Burmese, laos and Cambodian passports holders with L-A visas use a different immigration ( its back by the jail on ur right as u enter)

and i'd say 95% of those visa holders use agents as its included in the service they pay for.

[Jingthing]

16 minutes ago, notrub said:

800K 5 Months 400K Indefinitely In Bank For Ext To Stay Based In Retirement???  What?

Excuse me, I must have been asleep at the wheel.  What does this mean and where can I find out how it might affect me please?  I am 71, have a retirement visa due for renewal in 01 2020 and have over 1M THB (in a euro account) in the bank and a small pension too.  I am not married but plan to do so soon.  I live in my house built on land with an usufruct contract.

 

Thanks for any comments.  

 

800K bank method retirement extensions --

Do not go below 800K for two (or perhaps three depending on office) months before applying for your next extension.

After you get the new extension, do not go below 800K for three months after the extension.

After that do not go below 400K for the remainder of the year until the beginning of your next 800K seasoning period in which you need to be at least 800K yet again.

If you never touch that 1M baht account and it's been working for extensions for you in the past, I don't think there is ANY change for you.

Edited May 31, 2019 by Jingthing

[Tanoshi]

17 minutes ago, notrub said:

800K 5 Months 400K Indefinitely In Bank For Ext To Stay Based In Retirement???  What?

Excuse me, I must have been asleep at the wheel.  What does this mean and where can I find out how it might affect me please?  I am 71, have a retirement visa due for renewal in 01 2020 and have over 1M THB (in a euro account) in the bank and a small pension too.  I am not married but plan to do so soon.  I live in my house built on land with an usufruct contract.

 

Thanks for any comments.  

 

 

Police order35-2562changeof327-2557clasue2.22(Eng).pdf

[The Theory]

400,000 as health insurance. 

[Graviton]

4 hours ago, Thaidream said:

It's absolutely onerous simply because for 5 months your 800K is not allowed to be used for your living expenses.  Under the prior rules after the initial seasoning- one could use the 800K for  expenses; purchase a  home appliance; travel etc.

 

In essence- an applicant using this method now must use  added funds for their living expenses.  Since the Thai Government has indicated 65K was their monthly minimum that means the applicant not only needs the 800K but also  65K x 5 months  or 325,000 Baht.  In essence, they have raised the amount needed to 1,125,000 Baht.  Where is the Grandfathering that was so prevalent in prior raises?

 

If they had at least grandfathered those already on an extension- this may not have been so onerous but they didn't care to do it.

 

I have my own opinion on why they did this and it involves  an effort to cull the numbers of long stayers.

 

For those who say there is no change- you are wrong. There maybe no change for you but other's do have a change and it has nothing to do with not having the funds .

Don't forget cannot use the 400k

[zaZa9]

Nobody , that I have read here ( not all of it ) appears to want to talk about what an "agent" has to say.

 

So I meet acquaintance today , who has used an agent for a Retirement Extension for 2 years .

 

He says hes been paying an agent 17k baht a year - the agent purports to be an ex Immigration Officer. He mails off only photocopies of whats requested , then when hes given the ok , he meets the agent outside  the IO and his passport is taken inside and its stamped.

No  800k , no 90 day report ... no anything.

 

On the 'new deal' , hes says its the same deal  ,  and no 400k needs depositing , so he will bite  the bullet and pay  the new price later this year.

But the price has gone up to 28k per year - same deal , meet ONCE a year ...