Must Read 41 percent of vegetables in Thai markets exceed contamination standards

[ocddave]

10 minutes ago, Jonah Tenner said:

Coin flip of the type: Heads - I win, tails - you lose...

More like the type: Heads - you lose, Tails - you lose.

[johng50]

8 hours ago, nausea said:

Scary, especially if you rely on eating out or takeaways, I'm guessing many vendors might be less than thorough on the washing front, and a lot of the food here is stir fried which probably removes little or nothing in the way of contaminants. Like RobboR I tend to cook at home, so I'm hopeful that washing, and boiling veg in salted water, get's rid of most of the crap, as for fruit, most of it is peelable, just have to wash things I eat unpeeled and raw - apples, tomatoes, grapes, etc. - extra thoroughly, I suppose.

Peelable or not, it does not matter as the chemicals are sprayed on the plant as well

as the actual fruit and vegetable, so the chemical is then induced into the product thru the the actual plant, poisening the product, so what im saying is the chemical is already inside the fruit or veggy, whether it has a peelable skin or not.

[Vacuum]

10 hours ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

41 percent of vegetables in Thai markets exceed contamination standards

Should keep the vegetarians quiet.

[OutofSiam]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

And on your last point, yes, the so-called premium or various Thai supposed versions of organic came back better than fruit and veggies overall, but hardly clean or pesticide free. Half of the relatively few Organic Thailand and GAP items tested came back in the red.

 

So it looks like the only solution is to buy only "organic" produce certified by an international/non-Thai standard.

 

I wonder what the meat numbers look like. S-Pure, which is carried at places like Gourmet Market and Foodland, is NSF certified, so I'm guessing it's okay.

 

TOPS carries a different brand of higher quality meat though. Can't remember the name.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 minutes ago, OutofSiam said:

So it looks like the only solution is to buy only "organic" produce certified by an international/non-Thai standard.

 

I wonder what the meat numbers look like. S-Pure, which is carried at places like Gourmet Market and Foodland, is NSF certified, so I'm guessing it's okay.

 

TOPS carries a different brand of higher quality meat though. Can't remember the name.

 

I've often wondered the same about S-Pure, which is a brand of Betagro, and which we tend to use at home. They make all kinds of claims... But here in Thailand, whether there's any truth to those is always a big question mark.  I kind of figure, they might be somewhat better than the rest.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

17 minutes ago, OutofSiam said:

So it looks like the only solution is to buy only "organic" produce certified by an international/non-Thai standard.

 

I think, there tends to be a lot of variation from one particular type of fruit or veggie to another. In other words, some particular items regularly come back with high levels of contamination here, while others relatively free of problems, at least according to Thai-PAN's testing.

 

For example, for whatever reason, cabbage seems to come out pretty clean most of the time. And cucumbers not to bad. But the Thai red chilis and seasoning veggies like basil and coriander come out very bad, time after time. Long beans usually pretty bad also. The chart below is from their 2016 testing.

 

 

When it comes to eating local veggies, I tend to try to stick to cabbage and cucumbers, and rinse and wash them well...  Another whole category that Thai-PAN never seems to address is the whole variety of salad type lettuce, which is widely served here, albeit not in traditional Thai dishes. I'd really like to know how the local salad veggies fare.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

25 minutes ago, OutofSiam said:

TOPS carries a different brand of higher quality meat though. Can't remember the name.

 

Whenever I'm shopping in some of the markets here or reading their advertising circulars, I'm always intrigued when they describe/label this or that meat or veggie product as "hygienic."  I've always wondered what exactly that's supposed to mean in the world of Thai foods....

 

If certain kinds of meats or veggies they carry are supposed to be "hygienic," then does that mean that the other varieties of meats or veggies on sale are non-hygienic???

[ocddave]

1 minute ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Whenever I'm shopping in some of the markets here or reading their advertising circulars, I'm always intrigued when they describe/label this or that meat or veggie product as "hygienic."  I've always wondered what exactly that's supposed to mean in the world of Thai foods....

 

If certain kinds of meats or veggies they carry are supposed to be "hygienic," then does that mean that the other varieties of meats or veggies on sale are non-hygienic???

How often do you see soap in restrooms? I rest my case...

[balo]

You just have to look for imported fruits/veggies and try to avoid any locally produced stuff. Apples from NZ, Blueberries from S-America. Frozen veggies from Australia. There's plenty of options if you look for it. I cook food at home most days anyway.   

[xylophone]

3 minutes ago, balo said:

You just have to look for imported fruits/veggies and try to avoid any locally produced stuff. Apples from NZ, Blueberries from S-America. Frozen veggies from Australia. There's plenty of options if you look for it. I cook food at home most days anyway.   

Yep and plenty of frozen veggies from NZ as well. Possibly the best bet all round is to keep some in the freezer balo.

[xylophone]

2 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

The other day I was contemplating more fresh fruit and vegetables in my diet. Guess, I'll stick to meat with extra meat...

But then of course the meat in "contaminated" with antibiotics, antifungals, antimicrobials and just about every other anti..... you can mention.

 

If Thailand is anything like the USA in this then around 80% of the total US production of these sorts of chemicals ends up in livestock which we then consume. Frightening!!

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

17 minutes ago, balo said:

You just have to look for imported fruits/veggies and try to avoid any locally produced stuff. Apples from NZ, Blueberries from S-America. Frozen veggies from Australia. There's plenty of options if you look for it. I cook food at home most days anyway.   

 

Same here when I was cooking at home a lot when living in Pattaya and Bangkok. Best food import source was Villa in Bangkok on Suk soi 33/1. I had switched to imports after repeated reports of produce contamination. Veggies from NZ, OZ, US, Israel, Malaysia, etc. were regularly available on the Villa shelves. I recall another thread a couple of years ago being castigated for buying only import produce when the commenter said he can get great Thai grown veggies in his provincial town. Well, now you know the bad news. 

 

I noted in the Thai PBS report this little nugget: 

Quote

The lab also found contamination of 33% of imported fruit was over the standard, while 48.7% of locally grown produce exceeded acceptable contamination standards.

 

That says more than enough to me to stay away from market and supermarket veggies. 

 

[Fex Bluse]

11 hours ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

41 percent of vegetables in Thai markets exceed contamination standards

No surprise. 

 

Any smart person, seeing how all facets of Thai life are managed (or mismanaged), would treat every interaction with a Thai process with critical thinking, default high suspicion and even default distrust (guilty until proven innocent). 

 

There is no culture of safety or excellence or morality or law abiding in Thailand. 

[OutofSiam]

38 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I've often wondered the same about S-Pure, which is a brand of Betagro, and which we tend to use at home. They make all kinds of claims... But here in Thailand, whether there's any truth to those is always a big question mark.  I kind of figure, they might be somewhat better than the rest.

 

 

Well, judging by that chart, none of the produce certified by outside organizations failed the test, and S-Pure is certified by an outside organization (NSF). So, one could assume that it's relatively fine, though you obviously can't be sure.

 

I am curious about the overall quality of the meat here. I sometimes buy ground pork from Tesco Express -- looks like I'm going to have to cut that out, if the meat is anything like the produce.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

18 minutes ago, balo said:

You just have to look for imported fruits/veggies and try to avoid any locally produced stuff. Apples from NZ, Blueberries from S-America. Frozen veggies from Australia. There's plenty of options if you look for it. I cook food at home most days anyway.   

 

Imported may be better, some, depending on where it's coming from. Remember, in Thailand, a lot of times "imported" means coming from China....

 

At any rate, there was a chart in the Thai-PAN report that compared the results for imported fruits vs. locally grown fruits on sale here, as shown below. The first column results are imported, the second locally grown, the third fruit overall. (I don't believe they broke out where the various imports were coming from).

 

 

In our home, though, I try for myself to stick to frozen veggies, usually the Waitrose brand that Tops and Central sell, and the Birds-Eye brand imported from Australia that Villa often has.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, OutofSiam said:

I am curious about the overall quality of the meat here. I sometimes buy ground pork from Tesco Express -- looks like I'm going to have to cut that out, if the meat is anything like the produce.

 

I'm always amazed, when visiting a Tesco or Big C Supermarket here, where they have huge bins/tables of ground or sliced meat sitting out open to the air all day, not covered in any way, and I'm not even sure kept at a properly cooled temperature.

 

[bluesofa]

59 minutes ago, Vacuum said:

11 hours ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

41 percent of vegetables in Thai markets exceed contamination standards

Should keep the vegetarians quiet.

Or, if the contamination is really high it could end up converting the vegetarians into vegetables.

[OutofSiam]

29 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Whenever I'm shopping in some of the markets here or reading their advertising circulars, I'm always intrigued when they describe/label this or that meat or veggie product as "hygienic."  I've always wondered what exactly that's supposed to mean in the world of Thai foods....

 

If certain kinds of meats or veggies they carry are supposed to be "hygienic," then does that mean that the other varieties of meats or veggies on sale are non-hygienic???

I've always assumed that the "hygienic" meat refers to the way it's raised and harvested.

 

For instance, cage-free chicken/eggs or pasture-raised beef would be considered "hygienic".

 

But this doesn't include restrictions on how the animal is fed, whether it's been given antibiotics or growth hormones, etc. that the higher-quality certifications provide.

 

I'm less sure about how this applies to produce.

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

Regarding water rinsing of veggies and fruits. Multiple studies in Canada and US concluded specialty veggie washes are no more effective than simple mechanical action of water in reducing surface contamination. They do not seem to mention the action of using the hands to help the process along but I imagine it would help. One source: Consumer Reports, March 2015

[balo]

It would be interesting to know how much of the contamination is inside veggies/fruits, I guess most of it is outside and in the skin. Peel off the skin and it should be a lot safer to consume.  Or maybe not, who knows...

[FarFlungFalang]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

If certain kinds of meats or veggies they carry are supposed to be "hygienic," then does that mean that the other varieties of meats or veggies on sale are non-hygienic???

If you ever spent any amount of time in Isaan you would know exactly what Hygiene means.I once hoped off the bus here with the missus walked ten meters into somebodies backyard and there was a cow being butchered the head was still attached the skin only half removed bit like a half removed coat,right there on the concrete driveway in amongst the normal Isaan mess one sees here.About ten people were standing around pointing to the bits they wanted including the missus.Now when the people get fresh beef like that here they eat it raw in a sort of blood and spice type of dip.Now I had spent a year living pretty rough in the Aussie bush and had gotten into skinning and tanning and had skinned just about every type of animal in the area including a bull calf and I found it a bit confronting!

[SunsetT]

11 hours ago, Nowisee said:

What you save on cost of living here you can spend on cancer treatment

With the GBP down nothing is saved here!

[hobz]

11 hours ago, canuckamuck said:

 Other than banning those chemicals and enforcing the ban, there is nothing to be done about it. Farmers here will continue to do what they do. No sense of caution or empathy. Unless of course they can be shown there is more money to be made organically. Most farmers here learn about how and what to spray from their dad, uncle, neighbor. None of them have been through a course. They wrap a cloth around their face to spray but use bare hands on the nozzle. My father in law sprays for neighbors, does it for days on end. No precautions, done it for years. This year he has hardly been off the couch, for health issues.

"more money to be made organically" you mean paying for a "organic farming certificate" or whatever its called and then continuing to use the same methods as before and slapping an "organic" sticker on the packaging? yeah, i'm sure that will make things better here.

 

The problem is corruption, thai society is almost completely corrupt from all the way at the top to ALL the way to the bottom. 

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Salt?Iron?

They are supplements. I don't think any nutritionist would class them as food.

[SunsetT]

9 hours ago, keemapoot said:

Actually, from an update on channel 3 news this morning, things are worse than in this article. 41% contamination at open markets, but over 60% contamination in food stores like Tops, Foodland, etc... Even those expensive "organic" section veggies tested positive for pesticides. I suppose the reason the stores have higher levels is that they are marketing a better looking product. The takeway from this is to make sure to wash veggies carefully (soak actually) in baking soda and vinegar, but there is a powdered product you can use which does the job too.  Nothing is safe. Also, the channel 3 newscast mentioned that the imported veggies and fruits of all types were found to be much lower in pesticides, and from experience, Makro has tons of these and is cheaper by far anyway.

But not from China! Probably worse!

[SunsetT]

8 hours ago, bluesofa said:

I'm glad you've mentioned those three deadly chemicals. The ones that aren't going to be banned any time soon, but will continue to be sold, because buyers 'will receive training on safe use'. Yeah, right.
 

Safe use for the buyers of those three chemicals - don't make me laugh. What about the buyers of the end product as the consumer?

This is the land of irresponsibility, where everything is always someone else's fault.

 

It might be interesting if the EU started to test produce from Thailand to be imported in to the EU. I'm surprised nothing has been said about it so far.

Unless of course, there's some underhand dealing going on, where maybe chemical-free produce is sent for export?

 

What is there exported that far apart from babycorn which is sheathed anyway? Maybe a little lemongrass and some dried sauce ingredients made in the West.

[SunsetT]

9 hours ago, keemapoot said:

Just did a quick search on lazada found this one for 1400

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/ozone-generator-n231-white-i5638283-s6973963.html?spm=a2o4m.searchlist.list.1.4ba8fb56LjoEvd&search=1

So how do you know ozone treatment works?

[SunsetT]

9 hours ago, Antonymous said:

While washing your veggies in various solutions will help, by far the most effective method of removing toxic residues is to ozonate them before consumption.

 

An ozone generator specifically for this use (NOT an air purifier) costs a few thousand baht and can eliminate 96-99.9% of pesticides (depending on which machine you buy).

 

We grow much of our own organic food, but ozonate everything we buy.

 

Place veggies in a bowl of water, place the diffuser from the machine into the bowl of water and ozonate for 15 mins. That's all it takes. Another benefit is that the veggies perk up and last longer afterwards.

So how do you know ozone treatment works? Can u reference research results please?

[FarFlungFalang]

29 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

They are supplements. I don't think any nutritionist would class them as food.

Salt is essential for life and is considered a food for that reason.Not sure but I think iron might also be essential.

food

/fo͞od/

Learn to pronounce

noun

 

1. any nutritious substance that people or animals eat or drink or that plants absorb in order to maintain life and growth.

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Salt is essential for life and is considered a food for that reason.Not sure but I think iron might also be essential.

Everything you eat contains salt. It's not essential to add salt to anything, that's just done for taste. Iron is present in red meat.

If you want to call these items inorganic food so you can disprove my original statement, go ahead. I'll try not to lose any sleep over something so significant.