Italian police arrest migrant-rescue ship captain after docking

[sead]

8 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Is that what you call pulling people out of the sea?

Would you go to a shop to buy water if you already knew there wasn't any left?

Ofc they will continue as long as they are allowed to.

[atyclb]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It's called putting words in my mouth. 

 

I get to do that, not you. 

"as equally a convincing argument as you not having the names and background of at least one person on that ship to show they are refugees."

 

read it again. unless you do indeed have the names and status then what i said would be a valid point as per your own admission.

 

sorry if i upset you.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, atyclb said:

"as equally a convincing argument as you not having the names and background of at least one person on that ship to show they are refugees."

 

read it again. unless you do indeed have the names and status then what i said would be a valid point as per your own admission.

 

sorry if i upset you.

For the second, and final time, I have not once claimed these people are refugees. 

 

Your argument has passed baseless and is heading into trolling. 

 

 

[atyclb]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

A bunch of migrants frothing at the mouth about other migrants in search of a better life. 

 

The hypocrisy is only eclipsed by the total lack of introspection. 

 

my grandparents emigrated from russia and poland. they were brazen and bold as they applied, listed their profile and i assume skills, educatiion, languages, etc etc, waited for an acceptance. they did not travel to mexico and cross the border illegally. they did not board a ship attempting to be dropped off at another country with good welfare benefits.

 

i have dear friends from university that emigrated to the usa. from nigeria, pakistan, india, jamaica, dominican republic, haiti, etc

 

i have tremendous empathy for people trying to survive in poverty stricken, disaster torn, war torn countries but the reality is it is the recurring history of the world. reality is if developed countries opened the doors to anyone and everyone you would see a majority exit from their own countries and a very high if not insurmountable burden on the recipient countries. even less developed countries like thailand are trying to avoid this however since thailand provides little in welfare it would not impact them to a high degree.

Edited June 29, 2019 by atyclb

[fxe1200]

53 minutes ago, Joinaman said:

So you say she could not have taken them back to the nearest port, the nearest safe haven, which seems to be the one they just left, rather than sail all the way across the med to Italy ?

Are you saying she is denying assistance if she takes them back to the nearest port ?

You must be well informed, where the ship picked up the migrants, probably you could read it in your crystal ball.

[jany123]

1 hour ago, Joinaman said:

 

Why ???If its good enough for tourists, its good enough for the so calledd refugees / asylum seekers

C’mon... let’s not be completely and deliberately ignorant.

 

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/tunisia

[jany123]

2 hours ago, arithai12 said:

Would people smuggling be good enough for you? That is what that ship has been doing, the "rescue ship" label is simply outrageous.

Smuggling of people is defined as a secret and illicit act... this rescue ship made no secret of its activity, so that term would be incorrect, too.

it seems that the outrageous term “rescue ship” is the most accurate so far.

[Tug]

Soo I’m at sea see someone in distress I’m supposed to let them drown?are you nuts sorry I don’t think it’s criminal to help people in danger let the authorities sort them out don’t criminalize rescue that’s viscous cruel and against humanity save the people then let the authorities sort them out 

[Chomper Higgot]

I see a test case coming.

 

[jany123]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

She was entirely within her rights to pick up as many passengers from the sea as she wished. However, Italy is not, far as I know, obliged to let her off load them on Italian soil.

If the Italian authorities deny her entry, then she did break Italian law by entering. They still, far as I know, have sovereign right to deny anyone entry.

Arguable... Italy lost the last time it tried denying entry and seizing the sea watch... they will probably lose this time, using the same argument.

http://irep.iium.edu.my/28408/1/AJBAS_2012.pdf

 

[jany123]

9 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I see a test case coming.

 

https://www.dw.com/en/sea-watch-3-migrant-rescue-ship-released-by-italian-authorities/a-49001534

 

European human rights courts ruled on this a few weeks ago... it did not go well for Italy.

[fxe1200]

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

She was entirely within her rights to pick up as many passengers from the sea as she wished. However, Italy is not, far as I know, obliged to let her off load them on Italian soil.

If the Italian authorities deny her entry, then she did break Italian law by entering. They still, far as I know, have sovereign right to deny anyone entry.

As long there face an emergency situation aboard, they have to let the ship enter the port. Finally Madame captain entered the port. Why?

 

Read it yourself:

 

The duty to save life at sea is spelled out in Article 98 of the 1982 United Nations
Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS),6 which provides as follows:
1. Every State shall require the master of a ship flying its flag, in so far as he can do so without serious danger to the ship, the crew or the passengers:
(a) to render assistance to any person found at sea in danger of being lost;
(b) to proceed with all possible speed to the rescue of persons in distress,  if informed of their need of assistance, in so far as such action may reasonably be expected of him;
(c) after a collision, to render assistance to the other ship, its crew and its passengers and, where possible, to inform the other ship of the name of his own ship, its port of registry and the nearest port at which it will call.
2. Every coastal State shall promote the establishment, operation and maintenance of an adequate and effective search and rescue service regarding safety on and over the sea and, where circumstances so require, by way of mutual regional arrangements cooperate with neighbouring States for this purpose. This provision contains two separate obligations, addressed to two groups of States:
the duty of flag States to oblige masters of vessels flying their flag to rescue people at risk of being lost at sea, and the duty of coastal States to establish and maintain search and rescue services. The duty to rescue is further clarified in a number of international maritime law treaties, including the Convention for the Safety of Life at Sea (SOLAS)

[billd766]

9 hours ago, billd766 said:

Not really. The best thing to do would be for citizens like yourself is to contact the Italian government to take all of the refugees from this boatload under your own responsibility and let them live with you.

 

You personally would be responsible for obtaining visas for them all, feeding and clothing them, paying for their accommodation and be responsible for their welfare. In addition if they break any laws you will share their punishment.

 

Ian't that what you and others like you want governments in the area to do at the taxpayers expense.

How odd. The only person seeming to disagree with me is Chomper Higgot whose post I replied to originally. Humanity is one thing but when it personally affects you, that is something different.

 

Oddly enough I sort of think that many of the humanitarians in the world think that it is a great idea until it affects them personally, at which point the tune changes. 

 

If you really believe it then take a refugee family into your own house and be 100% responsible for them, In other words, put your money where your mouth is and sponsor a complete family.

[elliss]

 

  These poor people have been through a terrible experience , having paid their money ,

    to what they hoped was a ticket to freedom.  Sleep well tonight ?.

 

 

 

Edited June 29, 2019 by elliss

[sunnyboy2018]

9 hours ago, stevenl said:

Wiki disagrees with you: " Human trafficking is the trade of humans for the purpose of forced labour, sexual slavery, or commercial sexual exploitation for the trafficker or others. "

 

As does DHS, Interpol, etc.

Exactly.  The captain aided and supported all the above.

[Chomper Higgot]

6 hours ago, billd766 said:

How odd. The only person seeming to disagree with me is Chomper Higgot whose post I replied to originally. Humanity is one thing but when it personally affects you, that is something different.

 

Oddly enough I sort of think that many of the humanitarians in the world think that it is a great idea until it affects them personally, at which point the tune changes. 

 

If you really believe it then take a refugee family into your own house and be 100% responsible for them, In other words, put your money where your mouth is and sponsor a complete family.

That I disagree with your reactionary views is not at all odd.

 

Your suggestion that those who make arguments on the grounds of humanity should take in an be 100% responsible for a ‘refugee’ is hogwash.

 

Stay lucky, otherwise you yourself might someday be in need of a little human compassion.

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, petemoss said:

She broke maritime law by ignoring the instructions of a warship. She is in goal and the ship has been seized. It could be years before the ship is released and only then after hefty costs. The captain will no doubt be found guilty by the Italian courts and if, after exhausting all other leagal means of appeal, finds herself in the ECJ, will have already spent years, not months, behind bars.

 

She and her charity are screwed.

According to Al Jazeera she rammed an Italian vessel when docking. If for nothing else, that deserves jail time.

Wonder how many will be willing to contribute to that charity in future?

[Scott]

Off-topic post and reply removed.  

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

According to Al Jazeera she rammed an Italian vessel when docking. If for nothing else, that deserves jail time.

Wonder how many will be willing to contribute to that charity in future?

‘Rammed’? 

 

I suspect the people who donate to this particular charity have a different outlook than yourself.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TopDeadSenter]

19 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I suspect the people who donate to this particular charity have a different outlook than yourself.

Can't help but wonder, is there any way the naive do-gooders that donated to this cause be charged for reckless endangerment, aiding and abetting people smuggling, or at the very least conspiracy to commit immigration fraud? Seems to me that by going after the source of money we can deal with the problem better. Without these migrant magnet ships patrolling off the Libyan coast attracting the smuggling gangs attention so many lives will be saved.

[Thainesss]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Your suggestion that those who make arguments on the grounds of humanity should take in an be 100% responsible for a ‘refugee’ is hogwash.

 

So, to recap, you won’t lead by example (like most libs - all virtue signal, no action) and take any refugees in yourself but you’ll mock & guilt trip others for not wanting to foot the bill for billions of poor people. 

 

Nah, that’s hogwash. But typical liberalism. 

[Thainesss]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Your suggestion that those who make arguments on the grounds of humanity should take in an be 100% responsible for a ‘refugee’ is hogwash.

 

So, to recap, you won’t lead by example (like most libs - all virtue signal, no action) and take any refugees in yourself but you’ll mock & guilt trip others for not wanting to foot the bill for billions of poor people. 

 

Nah, that’s hogwash. But typical liberalism. 

[Scott]

Inflammatory, troll posts removed.   Continue and receive a suspension.

 

[mercman24]

funny how these illegals manage to traverse many countries to try and get to the free handouts UK.

[Alan Michael]

Thank you Salvini, Orban, Farage, Geert Wilders, Poland, Czechoslovakia and the Austrian's etc for bringing a little sanity into Europe.

All these economic migrant people have their own countries. It's not our fault if they can't look after what they have.

The same goes for the hordes of migrants trying to get to the US. Fight back against your oppressors like we Europeans had to in our past civil wars.

Do or die.

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, Alan Michael said:

Thank you Salvini, Orban, Farage, Geert Wilders, Poland, Czechoslovakia and the Austrian's etc for bringing a little sanity into Europe.

All these economic migrant people have their own countries. It's not our fault if they can't look after what they have.

The same goes for the hordes of migrants trying to get to the US. Fight back against your oppressors like we Europeans had to in our past civil wars.

Do or die.

For clarity, can you list the oppressors you personally fought back against?

 

[bert bloggs]

12 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

For the second, and final time, I have not once claimed these people are refugees. 

 

Your argument has passed baseless and is heading into trolling. 

 

 

No they are not refugees ,they are scroungers that cant or wont stay and help their country get better ,just want to come to the west ,destroy our way of life and make us the same holes that they came from in the first place , if your so worried about them go and help them in their country.

[Ozman52]

The captain has claimed that she had the right to enter the port because of an emergency.

" The need which we have on board is psychological and that's the reason why I declared the state of necessity," she said of her decision."It's like keeping the people here in a type of prison … keeping them here on board and not giving them access to a place of safety is a very, very grave thing."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-30/asylum-seeker-rescue-ship-captain-arrested-sea-watch-3/11264932

 

All of 17 days and they are suffering "ship fever".

 

Edited June 30, 2019 by Ozman52

[dick dasterdly]

4 hours ago, Thainesss said:

 

So, to recap, you won’t lead by example (like most libs - all virtue signal, no action) and take any refugees in yourself but you’ll mock & guilt trip others for not wanting to foot the bill for billions of poor people. 

 

Nah, that’s hogwash. But typical liberalism. 

Good point.

 

I was once horrified when my ex husband invited someone we'd met at a fish and chip shop (after a night drinking...) to stay at our house, when the 'address' she'd been given turned out to be a 'doss house'.  The stranger left before we woke up, leaving a lovely note saying how much she appreciated our generosity along with a 5 pound note.  (A lot of money at that time.)

 

And I'd always been the liberal, whereas my hubby was the conservative ☹️.

[atyclb]

15 hours ago, atyclb said:

 

my grandparents emigrated from russia and poland. they were brazen and bold as they applied, listed their profile and i assume skills, educatiion, languages, etc etc, waited for an acceptance. they did not travel to mexico and cross the border illegally. they did not board a ship attempting to be dropped off at another country with good welfare benefits.

 

i have dear friends from university that emigrated to the usa. from nigeria, pakistan, india, jamaica, dominican republic, haiti, etc

 

i have tremendous empathy for people trying to survive in poverty stricken, disaster torn, war torn countries but the reality is it is the recurring history of the world. reality is if developed countries opened the doors to anyone and everyone you would see a majority exit from their own countries and a very high if not insurmountable burden on the recipient countries. even less developed countries like thailand are trying to avoid this however since thailand provides little in welfare it would not impact them to a high degree.

 

additionally when my grandparents emigrated the usa did not even have the welfare system later enacted. my grandparents had to work hard and were not given a place to live, food stamps, payments for children.