2 hours ago, sanemax said:

You cannot be serious .

Prior to the first meeting , Kim was threatening to nuke the USA and the USA sent an aIRCRAFT CARRIER TO confront NK on the Korean peninsula , war was a likely/possible  outcome then  , are you seriously suggesting that its a similar situation today ?

I'm saying that anyone taking Kim's threats seriously is someone who hasn't learned from North Korea's behavior in the past. And claiming it's progress to have stopped him from making those threats ignores the fact that he was rewarded for staging those tantrums with 3 meetings with POTUS.

6 hours ago, sanemax said:

You cannot be serious .

Prior to the first meeting , Kim was threatening to nuke the USA and the USA sent an aIRCRAFT CARRIER TO confront NK on the Korean peninsula , war was a likely/possible  outcome then  , are you seriously suggesting that its a similar situation today ?

All that happened under Trump.  So Trump and Kim got into an ego driven shouting match, then Trump made some major concessions to Kim, now things are no more threatening than before Trump took office.  Why do you think that is a major improvement?

17 hours ago, heybruce said:

Ok, after Trump gets North Korea to open up and follow Vietnam's path to prosperity I'll concede he has accomplished something.
 

 

One question, where does that leave the sanctions in place against North Korea for developing nuclear weapons and delivery systems?  Do you advocate accepting North Korea as a nuclear power and dropping all sanctions?

North Korea is a Nuclear Power. Us accepting it or not can't change anything at this point. The key is to keep them as small and regional of a nuclear power and possible and even more importantly, end the underlining conflict between them and South Korea. Once we end the Korean War, and NK agrees to limit its nuclear deterrent to some reasonable level, we will have won and there will be no more need for sanctions. We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now. 

55 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

North Korea is a Nuclear Power. Us accepting it or not can't change anything at this point. The key is to keep them as small and regional of a nuclear power and possible and even more importantly, end the underlining conflict between them and South Korea. Once we end the Korean War, and NK agrees to limit its nuclear deterrent to some reasonable level, we will have won and there will be no more need for sanctions. We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now. 

We are further from that dream than at any point in history right now. 

 

Past Presidents refused to make concessions to North Korea until it made meaningful steps towards disarmament.  Presidents would not meet with North Korea's leaders, US/South Korea military drills would continue, sanctions would remain in place and there would be no formal peace between the two Korea's.

 

Trump has given away two of these four levers against North Korea in exchange for photo-ops that he dearly loves.  You propose giving away another.  In exchange for what?

 

Other than the fact that we have less leverage now against North Korea, and the North has built more bombs, nothing has significantly changed.

Remains of US military dead returned. North Korea and South Korea fielded unified team at many events in the Asian Games (as well as marching out as one in the opening ceremony and fielding a unified team in hockey). Ship to ship military communications resumed. Landmine removal agreement. First ever address by a South Korean President to the North Korean people in North Korea. End to large scale military exercises. Landmine removal agreement. Resumption of family reunification meetings. First ever US Presidential to ever step on North Korean soil. These are just some of the things that have happened over the past two years. The momentum towards peace is undeniable. The polices of the past yielded nothing but failure. Trump's bold new approach, on the other hand, is clearly working. 

35 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

Remains of US military dead returned. North Korea and South Korea fielded unified team at many events in the Asian Games (as well as marching out as one in the opening ceremony and fielding a unified team in hockey). Ship to ship military communications resumed. Landmine removal agreement. First ever address by a South Korean President to the North Korean people in North Korea. End to large scale military exercises. Landmine removal agreement. Resumption of family reunification meetings. First ever US Presidential to ever step on North Korean soil. These are just some of the things that have happened over the past two years. The momentum towards peace is undeniable. The polices of the past yielded nothing but failure. Trump's bold new approach, on the other hand, is clearly working. 

What you are talking to is a compromise whereby N.K. would retain it's current nuclear weapons arsenal and WMD development, one assumes with equivalent inspection regime as the Iranian deal, with trump lifting some US sanctions. Another complete U Turn by the trump administration. One could guarantee if the Democrats had put in-place a similar deal the outrage from minority voters supporting trump would be replete with claims of treachery, commies, etc etc

Edited July 2, 20197 yr by simple1

On 7/1/2019 at 11:14 AM, TopDeadSenter said:

Yes so true. The "liberals" are nowadays openly against America succeeding. Filled with hatred, they are trying to sabotage any chance for world peace, presumably to display that Trump is not their president? Quite an incredible situation.

 Watching Trump and Kim yesterday was every bit as profound as watching the Berlin wall come down, or the first Challenger space shuttle launch. Just an iconic moment in history, never mind what the liberal mainstream media says. 

<deleted> as would get a suspension for frankly posting my response

Edited July 2, 20197 yr by simple1

2 hours ago, usviphotography said:

Remains of US military dead returned. North Korea and South Korea fielded unified team at many events in the Asian Games (as well as marching out as one in the opening ceremony and fielding a unified team in hockey). Ship to ship military communications resumed. Landmine removal agreement. First ever address by a South Korean President to the North Korean people in North Korea. End to large scale military exercises. Landmine removal agreement. Resumption of family reunification meetings. First ever US Presidential to ever step on North Korean soil. These are just some of the things that have happened over the past two years. The momentum towards peace is undeniable. The polices of the past yielded nothing but failure. Trump's bold new approach, on the other hand, is clearly working. 

Symbolic gestures, many of them "resumed", meaning they were take away before and can be taken away again whenever North Korea wants something.  This is business as usual, North Korea has played the game this way for many years.

 

Nothing showing even an inclination to open nuclear facilities to inspection, to provide an inventory of weapons and delivery systems, to commit to a schedule of any sort.  In short, nothing of substance.

4 hours ago, usviphotography said:

North Korea is a Nuclear Power. Us accepting it or not can't change anything at this point. The key is to keep them as small and regional of a nuclear power and possible and even more importantly, end the underlining conflict between them and South Korea. Once we end the Korean War, and NK agrees to limit its nuclear deterrent to some reasonable level, we will have won and there will be no more need for sanctions. We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now. 

Redefining victory down.

Donald is surrendering to Kim face it they aren’t going to give up there nukes espically with Donald looking and acting so weak at home and abroad 

2 minutes ago, Tug said:

Donald is surrendering to Kim face it they aren’t going to give up there nukes espically with Donald looking and acting so weak at home and abroad 

These mad rants about Trump are getting a bit much 

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

These mad rants about Trump are getting a bit much 

I'd say the statement is pretty accurate.  Although I'd replace "weak" with "naive and easily manipulated".

US warns N. Korea not to renege on its denuclearization promises

"Questioned by reporters on Mar. 7 about intelligence reports that North Korea is rebuilding its West Sea satellite launch site at Tongchang Village in Cholsan County, North Pyongan Province, US President Donald Trump said he would be “very disappointed” in North Korean leader Kim Jong-un if the reports are true. The day before, he had stressed that the intelligence was “a very early report” but added that he would be “very, very disappointed in Chairman Kim” if they were true."

http://english.hani.co.kr/arti/english_edition/e_northkorea/885228.html

 

Apparently, not disappointed after all.

 

5 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I'd say the statement is pretty accurate.  Although I'd replace "weak" with "naive and easily manipulated".

Of course , just think of five random  abusive words and add "Trump is a" before it 

9 hours ago, usviphotography said:

North Korea is a Nuclear Power. Us accepting it or not can't change anything at this point. The key is to keep them as small and regional of a nuclear power and possible and even more importantly, end the underlining conflict between them and South Korea. Once we end the Korean War, and NK agrees to limit its nuclear deterrent to some reasonable level, we will have won and there will be no more need for sanctions. We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now. 

'We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now.'

You mean apart from the other 6 times NK pledged to denuclearize and went back on their word?

 

5 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

'We are closer to the realization of that dream than at any point in history right now.'

You mean apart from the other 6 times NK pledged to denuclearize and went back on their word?

 

That was in a different era and the World has changed alot since then .

5 hours ago, sanemax said:

Of course , just think of five random  abusive words and add "Trump is a" before it 

Well you should give it a shot and share the results with us. I haven't seen it done yet.

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

That was in a different era and the World has changed alot since then .

How has North Korea changed?  Why would any thinking person believe they will behave differently this time?

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

Well you should give it a shot and share the results with us. I haven't seen it done yet.

No, you cannot trick me into joining the gang 

Just now, sanemax said:

No, you cannot trick me into joining the gang 

You're confusing me with Trump. And he succeeded.

Just now, heybruce said:

How has North Korea changed?  Why would any thinking person believe they will behave differently this time?

It was Kims Dad that made all the agreements last time .

Kim has yet to make and break an agreement .

When the previous deals were made , NK has the backing of China , Russia and various other nations .

These days . NK is pretty much isolated and cannot rely on China for support if it went to war with the USA .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The   

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

That was in a different era and the World has changed alot since then .

And I would suggest it's changed for the worse.

The whole point with any of this is you Trump fans are hailing a process that has so far yielded nothing of any substance (other than a few good photo ops) as the coming of the next messiah.

NK is an old hand at promising the world and delivering nothing and has been doing this for some 40 years, yet because your beloved leader is involved, you miraculously think they are going to give up the one bargaining tool they have used to great effect and get rid of their nukes. Aint going to happen and if you think it is then can I sell you this chocolate fireguard? 

1 minute ago, johnnybangkok said:

 

The whole point with any of this is you Trump fans are hailing a process that has so far yielded nothing of any substance (other than a few good photo ops) as the coming of the next messiah.

 

Do stop being ridiculous .

Trump & Kim being on friendly terms has significantly reduced the threat of war between the two Countries .

Rid yourself of your Trump hatred and appreciate his efforts to avert a war 

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

It was Kims Dad that made all the agreements last time .

Kim has yet to make and break an agreement .

When the previous deals were made , NK has the backing of China , Russia and various other nations .

These days . NK is pretty much isolated and cannot rely on China for support if it went to war with the USA .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The   

So you believe that Russia and China aren't doing business with the North Koreans and violating sanctions?

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

It was Kims Dad that made all the agreements last time .

Kim has yet to make and break an agreement .

When the previous deals were made , NK has the backing of China , Russia and various other nations .

These days . NK is pretty much isolated and cannot rely on China for support if it went to war with the USA .

Kim is acting very much like his father (Meet the new boss, same as the old boss). 

 

North Korea hasn't had any serious backer other than China for decades, and China has never wanted to see a South Korean style democracy on one of its borders.  China may try to reign North Korea in a little when its provocations result in more and better US military systems brought close to China's borders (such as the installation of the THAAD anti-missile system in South Korea).  However China will never allow North Korea to have a western style democracy or host US troops, at least not without a fight.  Kim knows this.

 

In short, nothing has changed

Just now, bristolboy said:

So you believe that Russia and China aren't doing business with the North Koreans and violating sanctions?

Well no. Had I thought that  , I would have written that .

As I didnt write that , that isnt what I think 

4 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Do stop being ridiculous .

Trump & Kim being on friendly terms has significantly reduced the threat of war between the two Countries .

Rid yourself of your Trump hatred and appreciate his efforts to avert a war 

The threat of war has lessened since the days when Trump was making little rocket man comments and bragging about his big nuclear button.  However it is no less that it was before Trump took office.

2 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Kim is acting very much like his father (Meet the new boss, same as the old boss). 

 

North Korea hasn't had any serious backer other than China for decades, and China has never wanted to see a South Korean style democracy on one of its borders.  China may try to reign North Korea in a little when its provocations result in more and better US military systems brought close to China's borders (such as the installation of the THAAD anti-missile system in South Korea).  However China will never allow North Korea to have a western style democracy or host US troops, at least not without a fight.  Kim knows this.

 

In short, nothing has changed

Since NK caused a nuclear explosion/accident on Chinas borders  , China wants nothing more to do with them 

6 hours ago, sanemax said:

These mad rants about Trump are getting a bit much 

They dont call it trump derangement syndrome for nothing.

 

We have a number of chronic, irreversible cases here.

 

It's going to go on till 2024.