Why it’s time to step away from Thailand

[kuma]

On 7/31/2019 at 1:02 PM, CMNightRider said:

The last time I checked, the air quality problem during the burning season has been here for decades.  As I previously mentioned, the loonie idea of depositing 800,000 baht into a Thai bank rather than having the flexibility to keep your money in western banks or brokerage firms was the last straw for many expats.

 

The TM form idea has increased the 20% of foreigners who are leaving. ???? 

I miss the investing and compounding of the 800k but as I have set it up it is 800k one time, then I will top up at visa - 90 days. I live for the year off that 800k so only a portion is long term tied up, about 400-500k. I have had work visas then moved to a retirement visa here. I never did use the income letter system so I do not feel the sting as much as those who did. My one close friend that did was not bothered, he just deposited 800K and is done with it. The Thai perspective,  requiring short term residents to have adequate proven resources to manage a major health issue / requirement to repatriate, etc. - I can understand. But I also see the visa holders angst, 800k with a 6% return, for many that is at least a months day to day money so that loss of income generation can sting. Air quality would be the show stopper for me, so I am located where it is not an issue - if that were to change, then I would likely leave,

[Pattayabeerbacon]

thailand is expensive as u make it, Problem is locals are still greedy and think your rich.

[Falconator]

Which countries in Asia DON'T treat foreign husbands like this?

 

In practice, many other countries also don't give permanent residency to foreign spouses.

 

Take Laos, Myanmar, and China for example.

[nutsy65]

On 7/30/2019 at 11:31 AM, connda said:

 

 

On 7/30/2019 at 11:31 AM, connda said:

On 7/30/2019 at 11:31 AM, connda said:

The fact that we foreign men care for our Thai National wives, children, and extended family as well as injecting substantial amounts foreign capital directly into the Thai economy and paying taxes isn’t even considered

This post does not indicate that you care for your Thai wife. It suggests that only your concerns matter. No country is without its problems. Dealing with the problems, rather than running away would be the admirable thing to do. Dont think too much & ask your wife how she feels about the way you publicly talk about her people/nation, if that matters? Your wife/family may suffer similar or worse issues wherever you take her/them, but you have had enough, right?

 

On 7/30/2019 at 11:31 AM, connda said:

Families headed by foreign males will never be allowed to take root and flourish in Thailand - family legacies built around a foreign head of house-hold will never be condoned

Try acting like a normal bloke rather wanting to take root and flourish (whatever that crap means, does it mean your homeless?)

And what legacy is it you require? Are you royal?

Do you need an engraved plaque stating you are condoned?

The feeling of being condoned is generally a result of your attitude/actions/behaviours. If you feel like your not condoned, perhaps consider changing them rather than expecting it.

The paranoia oozing from your troubled mind borders on craziness.

Lower your expectations mate and you will be fine

In other words, try being a better bloke

The only difference between you and me is that I know & accept what comes with being a Farang male

Anyway - have a lovely day ????

And thank me later - I will be in Bangkok with my adorable Thai wife (who I would sacrifice anything for) in December if you wanna catch up for a pot.????

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 7/30/2019 at 11:31 AM, connda said:

 

 

[madmen]

I love threads like these. It really brings out how toxic and vindictive this forum is. Man posts valid & understandable reasons and thoughts behind his move and is met with constant trash such as:
 
 
And its not just this forum either, its a big part of the expat community in Thailand as well. 

Oh snap out of it. Your telling me the nob never had any good years here? Not even a good month?

Read the OP again he slags of thailand with every cliche in the book and then some. Sounds like the guy just attracted trouble to be bashed around by the Thais to that extent.
What a winner!

[rumak]

On 7/30/2019 at 10:12 AM, Gecko123 said:

 

Just kidding. Good luck to you Connda.

+1     And a much nicer way to say goodbye than " i don't care what you say".    

[rumak]

On 7/30/2019 at 3:42 PM, Odysseus123 said:

Connda has always been an excellent poster.

 

All the very best to you and your family in the future, a fair wind and a bright star to steer by.

I'm pretty sure he will STEER clear of thaivisa after the harsh good byes from many.  ????

Well, maybe not, as the hard core here are proof that TV can be addicting .  

[GinBoy2]

9 hours ago, Falconator said:

Which countries in Asia DON'T treat foreign husbands like this?

 

In practice, many other countries also don't give permanent residency to foreign spouses.

 

Take Laos, Myanmar, and China for example.

Isn't that the crux of the issue?

 

You can read a ton of posts on the bureaucracy of taking a Thai wife to farangland, wherever it may be.

 

But at the end of the day, after you have crossed that hurdle your wife enters afore mentioned farangland with the same rights as a citizen of that country.

 

I can only speak as an American, but by law you are entitled to bring your spouse to the United States as a permanent resident.

It took 100 days from me filing paperwork in BKK to us being on a plane to Chicago  

 

In Asia, the reverse is true.

 

A Thai woman has no automatic right to bring her spouse to Thailand, the foreign male has to apply for PR by himself, and you can read for yourself how tortuous that it.

 

Even the multiple discussions about marriage 'visa' are somewhat disingenuous.

 

Married or Retired you are still doing an extension to a Non Immigrant visa. The name should give you a clue.

 

At the end of the day, unlike when you take a spouse to the West as an immigrant, in Thailand you are never more than a long term tourist, who happens to be married to a Thai.

 

 

Edited August 2, 2019 by GinBoy2

[RoadWarrior371]

On 8/1/2019 at 2:14 AM, kuma said:

I miss the investing and compounding of the 800k but as I have set it up it is 800k one time, then I will top up at visa - 90 days. I live for the year off that 800k so only a portion is long term tied up, about 400-500k. I have had work visas then moved to a retirement visa here. I never did use the income letter system so I do not feel the sting as much as those who did. My one close friend that did was not bothered, he just deposited 800K and is done with it. The Thai perspective,  requiring short term residents to have adequate proven resources to manage a major health issue / requirement to repatriate, etc. - I can understand. But I also see the visa holders angst, 800k with a 6% return, for many that is at least a months day to day money so that loss of income generation can sting. Air quality would be the show stopper for me, so I am located where it is not an issue - if that were to change, then I would likely leave,

If the lost interest income on ~25k USD is going to change your lifestyle, you probably should not be retired anyway. 

 

 

 

[kuma]

12 hours ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

If the lost interest income on ~25k USD is going to change your lifestyle, you probably should not be retired anyway. 

 

 

 

If one gets a month of living off the proceeds of investing $25k then that is an 8.3% hit on income.

That, coupled with ongoing inflation, can be a significant hit for many.

Indeed likely more than 50% of people in NA could not retire now, here or anywhere.

So yes I think there would be a lot of people just on the bubble for whom an 8% hit to fixed income could be an issue - perhaps not fatal but again with inflation also eating at PP this would be yet another hit to absorb.

For those who had the discipline/foresight/luck etc to arrange for a comfortably funded retirement, kudos. But we are not in the majority to be sure.

[gearbox]

On 7/31/2019 at 3:42 PM, totally thaied up said:

Lol...  Yes,  if I told my wife I bought her to Australia I would get a thumping. When I wrote that post,  I had taken my nightly medication and was pretty zonked out. 

 

The AUD is just weak against the USD. Our Government wants a weak dollar; nothing to do with Thailand. Yes,  in many ways it is cheaper at home if you don't smoke or drink at the pub. Good wines are cheap. I just miss my beach the most but you cannot let the politics of Thailand bring you down as you are only making yourself feel bad. I read TV and don't get depressed. I know what I have signed up for and if it ever gets too tough, we just go home. As others have said, Thailand is set up for Thais, the Elites or the 1% of this world control most of what we see. Yes, we are just guests and I understand that. 

Our government doesn't want cheap dollar, the cheap dollar is a consequence of bad economic policies. 

 

I see Thailand still a way cheaper than home. A low quality by western standards 2 bedroom unit in Sydney's North Shore will set you back 3k AUD per month. I pay for better accommodation in Samui around 1/6 of that price.  The savings are more than enough to offset expensive wines, cheese, etc. Hell, it is even cheaper as my gf pays the rent ????

 

The only potential big expense which could be much cheaper in Australia is healthcare. I had a look and my Medibank insurance was covering a lot more for a lot less than the policies here. That would be the main ting to bring me back home if things are going to get bad health wise. And so far from my experience and the others around, the Aussie doctors are just better. 

[ThaiBunny]

8 minutes ago, gearbox said:

The only potential big expense which could be much cheaper in Australia is healthcare. I had a look and my Medibank insurance was covering a lot more for a lot less than the policies here.

That's because Australia's health insurance system is predicated on the Lifetime Health Cover loading https://www.moneysmart.gov.au/insurance/health-insurance. These days more and more people, especially the young, are abandoning health insurance and relying on the public system as they have assessed private health insurance as mostly benefiting the elderly

[marcusarelus]

The OP writes. " To all my fellow farangs – best of luck!  What’s that old saying?  If you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say anything?"  And then writes 400 bad words about Thailand.  Is this the kind of guy you would trust?

[spidermike007]

I have a great life here too. So, I am staying. But, I get what Connda is saying. Alot of it is true. 

 

As I said in a related post: The "scary" reality for Thailand, is that the neighbors are making a real effort, improving, progressing, and creating a better environment for tourism and ex-pats both. While here in Thailand, the environment is one of stagnation, regression, a total lack of vision, xenophobia, fear of foreigners, confused and muddled visa policy, and a baht that is far stronger than it needs to be, should be, or deserves to be. No effort is being made to address tourist safety, or public safety in general. No effort is being made to address traffic safety and the horrendous amount of bus, mini-van, car, truck, and motorbike accidents on the roads, or to improve the highway patrol, or even get those incompetent clowns to patrol the highways, and pull people over for reckless driving. No effort is being made to address the understaffed immigration counters at DM or Swampy.

 

How about tackling corruption on the part of the RTP franchisees? Quite the opposite. They are being deliberately protected. 

 

No effort is being made to address the myriad of environmental issues Thailand faces, whether it be the water quality, the air quality, the burning by farmers, the plastic epidemic, the extreme lack of trash cans throughout the nation, and a vast host of other issues.

 

And lastly, no effort is being made to ensure the well being of ex-pats here. Just the opposite. The authorities are making our lives harder, giving us zero credit for what we bring to the table, which is alot, and allowing their racism, hatred and fear of outsiders, and insular nature to rule the day. Thailand is going to pay a very, very heavy price for it's mass ignorance, on the political side of things, sooner or later. 

 

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[brewsterbudgen]

Isn't that the crux of the issue?
 
You can read a ton of posts on the bureaucracy of taking a Thai wife to farangland, wherever it may be.
 
But at the end of the day, after you have crossed that hurdle your wife enters afore mentioned farangland with the same rights as a citizen of that country.
 
I can only speak as an American, but by law you are entitled to bring your spouse to the United States as a permanent resident.
It took 100 days from me filing paperwork in BKK to us being on a plane to Chicago  
 
In Asia, the reverse is true.
 
A Thai woman has no automatic right to bring her spouse to Thailand, the foreign male has to apply for PR by himself, and you can read for yourself how tortuous that it.
 
Even the multiple discussions about marriage 'visa' are somewhat disingenuous.
 
Married or Retired you are still doing an extension to a Non Immigrant visa. The name should give you a clue.
 
At the end of the day, unlike when you take a spouse to the West as an immigrant, in Thailand you are never more than a long term tourist, who happens to be married to a Thai.
 
 

It might be easy in the US but getting your wife to live permanently in the UK is far more difficult than getting a Marriage Extension in Thailand!

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[balo]

Maybe better to live in Thailand 3 months every year, and spend the rest of the time in a civilised country. 

[bwpage3]

On 7/29/2019 at 11:07 PM, Joe Mcseismic said:

So.....anyone that decides to leave first has to give an explanation why?

I think most other forum members couldn't give a toss why someone decides to leave. Leave they can, but spare us the long-winded explanations.

Don't worry, he'll be back. 95% of all flouncers just can't resist.

I disagree 100%.

 

With every explanation there is no knowledge to be gained.

 

 

[bwpage3]

On 7/30/2019 at 12:56 AM, madmen said:

Absolutely pathetic post from the OP, not a single nice thing to say about Thailand for the whole 10 years...what a sad <deleted>. 

As the old saying goes don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya !

Why do people have to say nice things if they don't feel that way?

 

I think he has contributed enough over the years and now he has made the decision to move on.

 

Accept it, nothing pathetic about it.

 

Your response is what is pathetic.

[bwpage3]

On 7/30/2019 at 7:43 AM, madmen said:

 

 

Taking an Asian wife or GF back to OZ I could never do. The racism is insane and wouldnt be fair on the girl, The guys consider Asian woman as the last thing you pick up in a nightclub at 3am if you did not find better and refer to them all as slopes. The Woman are worse and don't want them in the social circle because they are all prostitutes and will steal their husbands

 

That's the harsh reality 

Utter BS and your warped perceived reality.

[Joe Mcseismic]

3 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

I disagree 100%.

 

With every explanation there is no knowledge to be gained.

 

 

1. Up to you.

2. Utter BS.

[emptypockets]

On ‎7‎/‎31‎/‎2019 at 2:34 PM, drbeach said:

Not much different in most other countries in the region. Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, Myanmar, India, China. All definitely places that are set-up for locals and not so much for foreigners, though to it's credit Thailand is still fairly friendly towards foreigners just that it offers a lot more privileges to locals. The 1% elite own most of the wealth so your average working class Thai is not much better off than your average foreigner except that they have, in theory, the right to own land and can visit national parks for the local rate. And of course can stay without a visa and apply for any job without needing a work permit. But without the right skills, connections and experience, they really don't have much of a chance of making it here either.

 

Still, for foreigners Myanmar is far worse - passport checks in many parts of the country, foreign tourists not allowed to stay at hotels (what's that about?) About 20% of the country completely off-limits to all foreigners. All sorts of loans (other than credit cards) banned for foreigners irrespective of visa type or salary by central bank decree.

I regularly stay in hotels in Myanmar. Don't know where you got your information from, but it is wrong.

By the way I work in Myanmar, in the restricted zone. 

[emptypockets]

On ‎7‎/‎31‎/‎2019 at 3:13 PM, totally thaied up said:

 

I am filling out the forms for a 309 Visa now in Australia. The requirements are pretty straight forward and if you have been married long enough (and did a few trips back to OZ), it is not that hard. Just fill in the paperwork, translate what they want, do health checks, get the STAT DECS from friends and family and off you go after paying the fee. Might have bit of a wait but you can apply for a bridging visa if you wish. 

 

In all honesty, not that hard.

Totally agree. The wife now has PR (for 5 years , after that will need a re-entry permit to travel overseas for those that aren't aware of this) in OZ and will get citizenship in another year or so.

We went down the Prospective Spouse Visa route based on advice from an Immigration Agent i.e don't get married first. It seems to be the easier way for someone not living in Thailand with their wife.

If the guy is in Oz and the wife is in Thai it can be difficult to prove a genuine and ongoing relationship. That doesn't apply to the Prospective Spouse Visa.

 

Getting a bit off topic here. Sorry.

Edited August 5, 2019 by emptypockets

[emptypockets]

I agree with the OP on one point and that it is this forum is quite toxic. The never ending posts about how the Thais hate us etc etc, the onerous immigration policies, when in fact for anyone who has a bit of money will not be affected.

I've never had a problem with a Thai person, but I work in a different Asian country and perhaps have developed a better understanding of how to get along with people from different cultures.

I can imagine a retiree from, say, Manchester suddenly arriving in Thailand with no experience whatsoever of a totally different culture and struggling to fit in. He may see a perceived dislike of him simply through lack of understanding or possibly simply being pig headed. Put out bad vibes - expect bad vibes back.

 

I disagree on almost everything else. I think it is all just a rant to save face as he simply cannot afford to live here anymore and blames anything he can think of for his own shortcomings.

He is certainly not alone as evidenced by many other people who claim to be leaving Thailand for similar alleged reasons but are also in the position of simply not having the required funds. They will say how good The Philippines or Cambodia are. Why have they waited so long? They should have gone years ago if that was in fact true.

10 years of posting on this or any other forum is irrelevant.

Why can't people be truthful like Simon 43?

[Tagged]

I see it as a mutual exploitation, where I get a decent life for my money, and the family I now belong to get their benefits by me. I have been treated good by the family, and I really do not look at it as a national exploitation against me at all. 

 

Where else can I design a good and healthy lifestyle, own car, motorbikes, and also get a quite good life for very little money in my eyes. There is places in Thailand where there is less pollution, still can live quite low cost, be able to invest your excess money for future (not thail investment), and have a foot in more than one country at the same time. 

 

I can understand you, and if you think you are better off somewhere else, go and get it. It is mostly up to each and one of us to form our thoughst and feelings about our life, and first started on the negative loop, it´s hard to stop, and maybe changes is the right thing to do. 

[lkv]

10 hours ago, balo said:

Maybe better to live in Thailand 3 months every year, and spend the rest of the time in a civilised country. 

Yes, and some should appreciate that civilisation costs money. That's why places that care about human rights, etc, where boats are not sinking because safety standards are being followed, taxi drivers are not after you to scam you etc, are developed economies. And they come at a price.

 

Corruption does exist, but at much higher and less visible levels.

 

People are trying to take a shortcut with Thailand, they want both cheap and their liberties respected.

 

That's not how it works.

 

It's like taking a low cost flight and expect to get Qatar Airways First Class treatment.

 

Trouble is, Thailand is not that cheap anymore. It's a bit like....taking a Thai Airways flight. Expensive and not that great. Lol.

 

Generally, people came to Thailand for a relaxed lifestyle at a much better price than in their home countries. 

 

This balance is slowly but surely changing.

 

As a matter of fact, some parts of Asia are so expensive, that there is an invasion of Asians into Europe, US, Canada, Australia.

 

So they are now doing what Westerners were doing a while ago. The only difference is the reason. Their reason is, they want to grow their children in a less opressive environment, and they seem to like human rights and freedom of speech.

 

Why did the Westerner come to Thailand a long time ago? For cheap beer and p#ssy basically.

Edited August 5, 2019 by lkv

[sunnyboy2018]

On 7/30/2019 at 2:37 AM, Boy Wonder said:

I'm happy for you. I hope you find solace wherever you go next. Don't let this situation turn you into a jaded old man, there is a lot to look forward to in life, inside or outside of Thailand.

 

Just to give you another perspective: I don't have any of the problems you discussed. I am not married, I have not received any violence towards me and I don't live in Chiang Mai. So it seems to me that your problems are just that -- yours. It doesn't really reflect the country as a whole, in my opinion.

 

But then again what do I know, I've only been in Thailand for a year.

Yep. A married man from CM. His problems not mine. I live in Pattaya. I really cant identify with his issues.

[sunnyboy2018]

5 hours ago, emptypockets said:

I regularly stay in hotels in Myanmar. Don't know where you got your information from, but it is wrong.

By the way I work in Myanmar, in the restricted zone. 

Restricted Zone?

[marcusarelus]

17 hours ago, balo said:

Maybe better to live in Thailand 3 months every year, and spend the rest of the time in a civilised country. 

You are not including the USA I assume?

[marcusarelus]

6 hours ago, lkv said:

Yes, and some should appreciate that civilisation costs money. That's why places that care about human rights, etc, where boats are not sinking because safety standards are being followed, taxi drivers are not after you to scam you etc, are developed economies. And they come at a price.

 

Corruption does exist, but at much higher and less visible levels.

 

People are trying to take a shortcut with Thailand, they want both cheap and their liberties respected.

 

That's not how it works.

 

It's like taking a low cost flight and expect to get Qatar Airways First Class treatment.

 

Trouble is, Thailand is not that cheap anymore. It's a bit like....taking a Thai Airways flight. Expensive and not that great. Lol.

 

Generally, people came to Thailand for a relaxed lifestyle at a much better price than in their home countries. 

 

This balance is slowly but surely changing.

 

As a matter of fact, some parts of Asia are so expensive, that there is an invasion of Asians into Europe, US, Canada, Australia.

 

So they are now doing what Westerners were doing a while ago. The only difference is the reason. Their reason is, they want to grow their children in a less opressive environment, and they seem to like human rights and freedom of speech.

 

Why did the Westerner come to Thailand a long time ago? For cheap beer and p#ssy basically.

EXPAT

Expat Investor Jim Rogers Loves Singapore And Doesn’t Miss the U.S.  Google.  Who you going to believe some itinerant poster on TV or Billionaire investor Jim Rogers?

[Tagged]

42 minutes ago, vinniekintana said:

Stereotypes exist for a reason.

How many asian brides are not prostitutes?

No more than 10% I reckon

First hand information ? Been there, done that, now ?