Criticism mounts of New Zealand mosque shooting response

[webfact]

Criticism mounts of New Zealand mosque shooting response

By Charlotte Greenfield

 

FILE PHOTO: A policeman stands guard as members of the Muslim community visit Al-Noor mosque after it was reopened in Christchurch, New Zealand, March 23, 2019. REUTERS/Edgar Su/File Photo

 

CHRISTCHURCH, New Zealand (Reuters) - After a lone gunman killed 51 mosque worshippers in March, New Zealand's outpouring of collective grief and Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern's heartfelt support for the Muslim community won praise around the world.

 

But months after the attacks in two Christchurch mosques, criticism is mounting over the aftermath, including the prolonged legal process and the handling of a powerful government inquiry.

 

New Zealand is no stranger to natural disasters, but the unprecedented scale of violence targeting a minority has strained institutions designed to provide answers and deliver justice.

 

New Zealand is also less experienced in dealing with cultural needs of Muslims, who make up only about 1% of the population.

 

That has led to cultural blind spots, including scheduling hearings during important religious periods and failing to engage with Muslims in an appropriate way, members of the Muslim community, experts and advocates say.

 

"What's being done to manage the expectations of victims and how do they actually feel included and ensure they are not re-traumatised through it and re-victimised through that process?," said Pakeeza Rasheed, a lawyer and chairperson of New Zealand Muslim women's organisation, the Khadija Leadership Network.

 

From the beginning, delays and confusion confirming the identities of victims and releasing bodies upset relatives who were unable to bury their loved ones as soon as possible, as is customary in Islam.

 

Soon after the attack, many Muslims questioned whether security services took the risk of white supremacist violence seriously enough, and whether authorities were overly focused on the danger of Islamic extremism.

 

Ardern in May announced a wide-ranging inquiry, known as a Royal Commission, seeking answers to such questions.

 

INCLUSION, SUPPRESSION

But at least six human rights advocates and local Muslims contacted by Reuters have become sceptical of the process.

 

New Zealand's Chief Human Rights Commissioner Paul Hunt called on the Royal Commission to improve inclusion of the Muslim community and said the Commission's public suppression of information from various government agencies was too broad.

 

Former race relations commissioner Joris De Bres declined to give evidence to the commission last month, saying he too had concerns over undue secrecy and Muslims being sidelined.

 

"I…must regretfully decline to participate in the process until I am confident that it is transparent, places the families of the victims of the March 15 massacre, and their communities and organisations at its centre and that they have the ability…to question and challenge the information provided by government agencies under investigation," De Bres told the Commission in a letter he provided to Reuters.

 

The Commission said it needed to ask government agencies direct and probing questions and was working on the assumption that information gathered would be made public later, wherever possible.

 

Guled Mire, a Wellington-based Muslim community advocate, initially accepted an invitation to join a Muslim community reference group set up by the Commission, but pulled out in July after its first meeting, saying Muslims were not being listened to.

 

"They're perpetuating the same attitudes and behaviours that have led to March 15, essentially ignoring our lived experiences, not valuing what we have to say, really not willing to engage with us on our terms," Mire said. "The commission has instead undertaken what I would describe as tokenistic forms of engagement.”

 

Pakeeza Rasheed was also invited to join group but said she did not feel comfortable participating after the Commission did not respond to a number of questions she had about what the process would entail.

 

The Commission said the Muslim community reference group was only one way it was engaging with Muslim communities.

 

"We also continue to meet personally with groups and individuals and we’re in contact with many more by phone, email and whatever medium people prefer," a spokeswoman said in an emailed response to Reuters.

 

"We understand there may be some members of the Muslim Community Reference Group who may decide the process is not for them and that’s ok."

Others say they have been pleased with their interactions with the Commission.

 

Ambreen Naeem, whose husband Naeem and eldest son Talhawere killed at the Al Noor Mosque, contacted the commission by email and was visited by the head commissioner in July.

 

Ambreen said she had welcomed the chance to raise questions, including about how seriously threats of violence against Muslims were taken in the lead up to the attacks.

 

"Everyone makes mistakes, if they made mistakes we will understand, but we need to know," said Ambreen, who is trying to rebuild a life for herself and two surviving sons.

 

LONG COURT PROCESS

For Ambreen and others, the long and unfamiliar court process has been a source of stress and trauma.

 

In June, relatives and victims were told the trial of suspected white supremacist Brenton Tarrant, who has pleaded not guilty to 92 murder, attempted murder and terrorism charges, would not take place until May next year, coinciding with the holy Islamic month of Ramadan.

 

"I don’t know why they drag it that long," said Abdul Aziz, who fought the attacker with a credit card machine at Linwood Mosque. "Each time I come out of the court, what happens? All the memories come back."

 

Muslim Association of Canterbury President Shagaf Khan said they had asked authorities to change the trial date so it does not coincide with Ramadan.

A court official said the court was trying to have the case brought to trial as soon as possible but was open to reviewing the date.

 

A lawyer for Tarrant, Jonathan Hudson, said: "Our primary concern is ensuring that Mr Tarrant receives the fair trial that he is entitled to.”

 

A third preliminary High Court hearing is scheduled for Thursday.

 

Two earlier High Court hearings have been set on Fridays, the holiest day in the Islamic week, and the day the attacks happened.

 

The Ministry of Justice said it had received initial feedback gathered from victims at an earlier court hearing by a cultural adviser it had engaged and was “open to discussion about how we can do things better to support the victims and their families through the court process".

 

The Ministry said it had also arranged to have private rooms and a prayer room available to victims at the court.

 

While the court process would inevitably be painful for those involved, steps could be taken to mitigate trauma such as avoiding religiously important times for proceedings, acknowledging victims, and providing culturally informed psychological support processes for those attending, said Tayyab Rashid, a Pakistani-Canadian psychologist who ran support sessions at Al Noor Mosque.

 

"I think the court or legal system can find ways to support them because this is not the typical case, it is an atypical scenario and for atypical scenarios, you need atypical solutions."

 

(Reporting by Charlotte Greenfield. Editing by Lincoln Feast.)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-08-15

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[TopDeadSenter]

7 minutes ago, webfact said:

 

New Zealand is also less experienced in dealing with cultural needs of Muslims, who make up only about 1% of the population.

 

That has led to cultural blind spots, including scheduling hearings during important religious periods and failing to engage with Muslims in an appropriate way

Another PR disaster. As 1% of the population, the onus is on the muslims to make an effort to respect and integrate into their new host country, not the other way round. Forcing the 99% to change their cultures, customs and lives to suit the newcomers could lead to all sorts of trouble and resentment - as seen in some north European nations.

 

[SammyT]

"The long court process has become a source of stress and confusion" 

 

Yes, because in our country, people are afforded a number of rights to ensure a fair trial, no matter how much of a piece of shit they are. As opposed to many of their birth countries where they people would be publicly executed the following day in some barbaric manner. 

 

That said, the drawn out response is typical of the NZ labour government. Jacinda is clearly a warm and caring person and a great face for the tragedy, but when it comes to meaningful action shes hopeless and surrounded by idiots

[SammyT]

19 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Another PR disaster. As 1% of the population, the onus is on the muslims to make an effort to respect and integrate into their new host country, not the other way round. Forcing the 99% to change their cultures, customs and lives to suit the newcomers could lead to all sorts of trouble and resentment - as seen in some north European nations.

 

Agreed mate. I'm fairly relaxed in my views on immigration and integration, but they need to respect the identification and investigation process that the police need to do in the aftermath of a mass shooting and the fact that this would delay the return of their family members for burial. Particularly where there would have been some horrific injuries which would have made victim ID difficult 

[Emdog]

"...asked authorities to change the trial date so it does not coincide with Ramadan."

Seems that could be an ideal time: no need for water breaks, coffee breaks, lunch breaks.

I think all religions are man made and essentially borderline crazy.

All for allowing "people of faith" to practice their religion, but don't expect us to stop or alter secular processes just because it doesn't fit you calendar.

 

[ThaiBunny]

2 minutes ago, Emdog said:

"...asked authorities to change the trial date so it does not coincide with Ramadan."

Seems that could be an ideal time: no need for water breaks, coffee breaks, lunch breaks.

I think all religions are man made and essentially borderline crazy.

All for allowing "people of faith" to practice their religion, but don't expect us to stop or alter secular processes just because it doesn't fit you calendar.

I was hugely amused that the first action of the NZ prime minister, an unmarried mother and proud feminist, was to cover herself up, Moslem style, out of "respect".

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed. 

[Baerboxer]

8 hours ago, Emdog said:

"...asked authorities to change the trial date so it does not coincide with Ramadan."

Seems that could be an ideal time: no need for water breaks, coffee breaks, lunch breaks.

I think all religions are man made and essentially borderline crazy.

All for allowing "people of faith" to practice their religion, but don't expect us to stop or alter secular processes just because it doesn't fit you calendar.

 

 

One of the real issues is the way Muslims who have migrated to Western countries fully expect and demand those Western countries to change things to fit in with Islam and it's culture.

 

And yet they do not expect Muslim countries to tolerate anyone else's culture, views, or practices. 

 

Can you imagine telling a court in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran or even the UAE that holding hearings over Christmas or Easter, or Diwali would be insensitive and should be changed?

 

Islam is a political system as well as a religion so they can't grasp the idea of secularism nor how a country can be secular. 

 

This one sided - you must respect us but we only respect ourselves; and will act violently if you don't is what creates the resentment that gets exploited by the far right.

 

 

[Scott]

Off-topic, troll posts and reply removed.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, webfact said:

Muslim Association of Canterbury President Shagaf Khan said they had asked authorities to change the trial date so it does not coincide with Ramadan.

Why? In Saudi, everyone goes to work as usual during Ramadan ( I worked there so I know that ). So why can't they go to the commission hearings as in the normal course of events? Ramadan isn't a holiday when everyone stays home.

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, webfact said:

"They're perpetuating the same attitudes and behaviours that have led to March 15, essentially ignoring our lived experiences, not valuing what we have to say, really not willing to engage with us on our terms," Mire said. "The commission has instead undertaken what I would describe as tokenistic forms of engagement.”

I don't understand what she is saying, but it seems to asking to be treated differently from other people based on them being Muslims. NZ is a secular country, so that should not be done. They should receive the same treatment as anyone from any religious background in a governmental hearing. 

[Chomper Higgot]

14 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Why? In Saudi, everyone goes to work as usual during Ramadan ( I worked there so I know that ). So why can't they go to the commission hearings as in the normal course of events? Ramadan isn't a holiday when everyone stays home.

If you have worked there you know the claim you made here is at best a half truth, not much removed from hogwash.

 

And you’d also be are KSA is not NZ.

[Chomper Higgot]

How about this often heard question:

 

What about caring for the victims?

 

Making, what are in truth, minor changes to procedures and schedules of hearings to accommodate the victims of this horrendous terrorism attack is a positive step to enable their (the victims) fullest involvement in the inquiry and in doing so address this often heard question.

 

 

[Odisan]

22 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Why? In Saudi, everyone goes to work as usual during Ramadan ( I worked there so I know that ). So why can't they go to the commission hearings as in the normal course of events? Ramadan isn't a holiday when everyone stays home.

Shhhhh!

(Every little 'victory' or concession helps with achieving the next one and the one after that. "Well, you/your predecessors did it, why can't you?" That's the way 'it' works.)

[Chomper Higgot]

23 hours ago, SammyT said:

Agreed mate. I'm fairly relaxed in my views on immigration and integration, but they need to respect the identification and investigation process that the police need to do in the aftermath of a mass shooting and the fact that this would delay the return of their family members for burial. Particularly where there would have been some horrific injuries which would have made victim ID difficult 

Victim identification is a matter of course during an autopsy, horrific injuries are not an excuse for delay with DNA testing to hand.

 

 

[pookondee]

Ohh what a terrible ordeal for them to go through!!

All the while living in a country that is tolerant, with sane laws,  and will actually let them stay and provide them with welfare.

Id expect the families of westerners and American soldiers who had their heads chopped off would not have much sympathy.

 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

24 minutes ago, pookondee said:

Ohh what a terrible ordeal for them to go through!!

All the while living in a country that is tolerant, with sane laws,  and will actually let them stay and provide them with welfare.

Id expect the families of westerners and American soldiers who had their heads chopped off would not have much sympathy.

 

 

 

I suspect being a victim of this vile White Supremacist Terrorist Attack was fairly high up the scale of ‘a terrible ordeal for them to go through’.

 

Do you grasp that or are you just trolling?

[SammyT]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Victim identification is a matter of course during an autopsy, horrific injuries are not an excuse for delay with DNA testing to hand.

 

 

That makes no sense at all. Presuming someone has had most of their head blown off by a shot at close range (which I understand many did), has no ID on them (because they're at their place of worship and probably aren't carrying a wallet) and no tattoos or other distinguishing features, it makes victim ID very difficult. DNA testing doesn't happen in the timeframes of the movies you watch. 51 dead bodies all needing it would put a tremendous strain on the resources.

 

Imagine the criticism if the wrong body was delivered to the wrong family. I'm sure you'd be the first to line the boot up. 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, SammyT said:

That makes no sense at all. Presuming someone has had most of their head blown off by a shot at close range (which I understand many did), has no ID on them (because they're at their place of worship and probably aren't carrying a wallet) and no tattoos or other distinguishing features, it makes victim ID very difficult. DNA testing doesn't happen in the timeframes of the movies you watch. 51 dead bodies all needing it would put a tremendous strain on the resources.

 

Imagine the criticism if the wrong body was delivered to the wrong family. I'm sure you'd be the first to line the boot up. 

Wot, like a victims body can’t be identified by DNA testing?

 

 

[StayinThailand2much]

On 8/15/2019 at 8:19 AM, TopDeadSenter said:

Another PR disaster. As 1% of the population, the onus is on the muslims to make an effort to respect and integrate into their new host country, not the other way round. Forcing the 99% to change their cultures, customs and lives to suit the newcomers could lead to all sorts of trouble and resentment - as seen in some north European nations.

 

New Zealand has been making a great effort following the shootings. I was there when it happened; the country was grieving, it was hotly debated in the news for weeks, the prime minister even wore a hijab while visiting Christchurch, many questions asked... Increased police presence in the capital; I couldn't visit the Beehive when I was there. And all this despite of Muslims being only a tiny minority, and the shooter a foreigner...

[SammyT]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Wot, like a victims body can’t be identified by DNA testing?

 

 

Again, you completely miss the point. They're lamenting the timeframe it took to get the bodies back to the family for traditional burial processes. The bodies absolutely can be identified through DNA testing, but that requires probably up to a week of turn around time from the time the body is received, DNA taken, comparison DNA found, or familial DNA taken, results taken to the lab and tested. 

 

That is the issue here. If you'd have read the article and had any background knowledge in DNA testing, you'd have known that. Rather, you've just decided to try to pick apart everyone elses comments on here.

[zaZa9]

On 8/16/2019 at 8:24 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

Victim identification is a matter of course during an autopsy, horrific injuries are not an excuse for delay with DNA testing to hand.

 

 

So are you suggesting those tasked with victim identification deliberately went on a go slow because they were dealing with Muslims?

Proper DNA testing isnt done on the spot you know , it takes numerous days .

Then DNA from the suggested family group must be gathered , tested and compared .Then the body cleared and delivered.

The last thing the authorities would want , is to hand over the Wrong body to a family - how well would that be received ??